Foxconn Quantum Force Black Ops X48 OC Guide (56k Warning)

[gmcg]

I'm no expert, but doesn't that last only for so long?

Yes, but it is recommended to replace liquid in water loops once per year anyhow. I assume once per two years will be fine as well in such a small loop. Don't forget that aluminum surfaces are painted, therefore you need to protect only non-covered small surfaces around the barbs and so on, therefore inhibitor will last significantly longer than in standard situation with a mixed metal loop.

[raptor1]

One of the reasons to buy BlackOps is it's 4in1 cooling solution. I see no point in replacing it with a Koolance kit paying additional money if you want to water-cool your board, it is VERY doubtful that the last one will performs better.
Please take in mind that either SB and MOSFETS don't dissipate a lot of power, only NB requires water-cooling if you want to apply 1.7V or something similar to it, therefore in theory BlackOps cooling solution for an engineer looks almost perfect.
This is why so many manufacturers use heatpipes to cool SB and MOSFETS.

The problem is an aluminum cover.
We had a long discussion with sayaa in private messages, arguing about possible galvanic corrosion.
Such as today almost everyone uses some kind of protective/lubricating fluid in their water-cooling loops against algae, the same fluid can be an anti-corrosion inhibitor, therefore the risk of damaging / fast corrosion is pretty low, I have to agree with sayaa regarding this matter.
I have noticed that the aluminum cover has BETTER idea of water flow technically than both planned copper and acrylic covers. Take a look:





As we can see, the previous Foxconn cooling solution had in reality only one point of forced contact between water and water-block in the middle, now the water flow has to go through all pins, which are thinner and have significantly more dissipating surface, design of latest WB (retail BlackOps) is quite similar to design of one of the best available CPU waterblocks - EK supreme:
http://us.st12.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.c..._2007_52657934
And:
http://www.aijaa.com/img/b/00917/2061853.jpg
Of course, there is no nozzle, but to cool NB is much easier task than to cool CPU.
Take a look at your WB cover, you will see that it's design doesn't allow water flow to go around the pins, it directs water to go through the pins.

I would recommend to use the existing water-block with let's say Primochill Liquid Utopia (with any dye color you prefer) and some inexpensive 1 12" fan rad + reservoir / pump combo.

At least I am going to do it. Don't worry about some foam while you apply Liquid Utopia, some people went seeing it, but it disappears pretty fast.

thanks for that - what size tubing do i need for the waterblock

if you are going down the route as above can you list the components that would be required

thanks
flanr

[Telo]

thanks for that - what size tubing do i need for the waterblock

if you are going down the route as above can you list the components that would be required

thanks
flanr

The board comes with fittings for 3/8 and 1/2 inch; you should get tubing with at least a 1/8 inch wall. As for components, that depends on the components you will be cooling with the loop[s]. Please give me a list of what you intend on cooling so that I can give you some points.

[saaya]

I'm no expert, but doesn't that last only for so long?

yes, but for how long... nobody really knows.
i talked to several watercool gear mfgs and they all said galvanic corrosion is WAY overhyped. even if you have alu and copper exposed directly and even without using an additive to slow down corrosion it will take several years if not decades until the blocks or the radiator would corrode enough to cause a leak.

at least thats what ive been told from people who work with this stuff all day and design and build the waterblocks, so... i rust them.
im really curious tho as to how bad the corrosion really is... since its so hyped and everybody is paranoid about it, yet i cant find a single website or person who actually tested it. so ill try to set up a test loop and see what happens

dont ask me why, but all the mfgs i talked to say they cant create copper tops casting them... they need to cnc them which is WAY more expensive...
if galvanic corrosion is really a problem, even with anodized alu, then we need to figure something out... if its not a problem we might still change it, simply cause the paranoia about it is so widespread and educating people about it would take a huge efort and a lot of time

No, but others here have and had no success.

could you please try it?
ive tried both a samsung and micron based 4gb kit and they worked fine... they need some tweaking but they did way better than 1066

3.6 stable but havent tried more than that. Slots 1 and 4.

what memory speed was the max you could reach, and what divider did you use?

NB 1.5v, tried all the dividers and nothing. 1.844v all the way up to 2v for memory

hmmmm since your watercooling, you can go higher on the nb voltage without worrying.
please set it to 1.7v

thanks for posting these details, and sorry for arguing with you
i know it can be very frustrating to have this kind of problems with a config... maybe you can understand that its just as frustrating for me trying to help and then get a bucket of rants emptied over their head

its past midnight over here in tai pei, on a friday night and shamino and me are hanging out on xs trying to help you guys with problems, if that doesnt show you we care about our customers then i dont know what will
ill try to get back to the office tomorrow and see if i can get the samsung kit into my blackops test station and try to figure out what the problem could be.

i got invited to a karaoke sing-off from a bunch of coworkers in the office tho plus a friend promised to introduce me to some nice girls tomorrow hehehe
so i cant promise ill make it to the office, but ill try

hope you can accept my apologies and we can burry this ranting and poking

[raptor1]

The board comes with fittings for 3/8 and 1/2 inch; you should get tubing with at least a 1/8 inch wall. As for components, that depends on the components you will be cooling with the loop[s]. Please give me a list of what you intend on cooling so that I can give you some points.

the nb and the cpu and maybe in the future my 9800 gx2 when i get one

flanr

[spikerules]

could you please try it?
ive tried both a samsung and micron based 4gb kit and they worked fine... they need some tweaking but they did way better than 1066

I am unwilling to reduce my memory size just to get this board working at default voltages and speeds... surely you understand this?

what memory speed was the max you could reach, and what divider did you use?

1066 is the max... i've explained this and the divider is 1.2:665 If i recall. 9x multiplier at 400MHz

hmmmm since your watercooling, you can go higher on the nb voltage without worrying.
please set it to 1.7v

I will try to set it to 1.7, but I am sure I have tried this before with no results. I will try again. Update: tried and still no luck.

thanks for posting these details, and sorry for arguing with you
i know it can be very frustrating to have this kind of problems with a config... maybe you can understand that its just as frustrating for me trying to help and then get a bucket of rants emptied over their head

No worries, I just hope you can fix the problem now you have admitted there is one.

[LardArse]

hey Saaya or Gmcg

i have decided in the end, that to cool my system properly i will need to get water cooling

i am looking for some advice on watercooling my system - just to change the current subject and ing thats going on at the moment

i am looking at getting a koolance system with south bridge, north bridge, cpu cooling and mosfett cooling blocks

1. if i remove the coolers that come with the board will i void my warranty and do you have a procedure for removing them without causing damage

2. will the mounting holes be compatible with the koolance cooling blocks

thanks in advance
best regards
flanr

just take note that the digital mosfets are fragile so be careful not to chip or crush them in whatever you do.

[Tony]

OCZ memory users, I have some news for you and spd that may fix a lot of the issues you may be seeing.

I will start a new thread for this so we can focus away from other dram issues end users are seeing.

[spikerules]

OCZ memory users, I have some new for you and spd that may fix a lot of the issues you may be seeing.

I will start a new thread for this so we can focus away from other dram issues end users are seeing.

Nice one Tony, please let us know when the topic has been created!

[Tony]

Its up, and you can all stop moaning about OCZ ram now 400MHZ gain with 1333EB here going from 1600ish to 2000 ish with limited testing and 2GB 1333 reaper is chugging along at 4GB 1700MHZ 8-8-8-22 quite easy.

[Xello]

yes, but for how long... nobody really knows.
i talked to several watercool gear mfgs and they all said galvanic corrosion is WAY overhyped. even if you have alu and copper exposed directly and even without using an additive to slow down corrosion it will take several years if not decades until the blocks or the radiator would corrode enough to cause a leak.

at least thats what ive been told from people who work with this stuff all day and design and build the waterblocks, so... i rust them.
im really curious tho as to how bad the corrosion really is... since its so hyped and everybody is paranoid about it, yet i cant find a single website or person who actually tested it. so ill try to set up a test loop and see what happens

dont ask me why, but all the mfgs i talked to say they cant create copper tops casting them... they need to cnc them which is WAY more expensive...
if galvanic corrosion is really a problem, even with anodized alu, then we need to figure something out... if its not a problem we might still change it, simply cause the paranoia about it is so widespread and educating people about it would take a huge efort and a lot of time

Yeah, just from what a colleague tells me their company won't even consider shipping a system where this is a risk due to hassle in the past.

Its up, and you can all stop moaning about OCZ ram now 400MHZ gain with 1333EB here going from 1600ish to 2000 ish with limited testing and 2GB 1333 reaper is chugging along at 4GB 1700MHZ 8-8-8-22 quite easy.

Thanks for this i'll pass the info along.

[tinus]

Hi

To saaya
Please bee fair, do not talk about 'paranoia' when its af fact that corrosion always will ocour when you have two differnt metals and some moisture.
Please read this:
Corrosion Process...http://www.roymech.co.uk/Useful_Tabl.../Cor_basic.htm

Corrosion is a chemical process resulting the progressive destruction of a metal by the interaction of the local environment. The process results in the eventual failure of the metal with resultant high additional lifetime costs.

In the actual case the Foxconn alluminium NB-top will soner or later suffer corrosion and becomme a risk for leaks

Best regard
tinus

[gmcg]

dont ask me why, but all the mfgs i talked to say they cant create copper tops casting them... they need to cnc them which is WAY more expensive...
if galvanic corrosion is really a problem, even with anodized alu, then we need to figure something out... if its not a problem we might still change it, simply cause the paranoia about it is so widespread and educating people about it would take a huge efort and a lot of time

Use delrin, it should be close in cost to anodized aluminum and everyone will be happy

the nb and the cpu and maybe in the future my 9800 gx2 when i get one
flanr

Let me finish my setup, I have a good loop for 9800GX2 and CPU, but haven't consider yet the setup for NB water cooling.

Hi

To saaya
Please bee fair, do not talk about 'paranoia' when its af fact that corrosion always will ocour when you have two differnt metals and some moisture.
Please read this:
Corrosion Process...http://www.roymech.co.uk/Useful_Tabl.../Cor_basic.htm

Corrosion is a chemical process resulting the progressive destruction of a metal by the interaction of the local environment. The process results in the eventual failure of the metal with resultant high additional lifetime costs.

In the actual case the Foxconn alluminium NB-top will soner or later suffer corrosion and becomme a risk for leaks

Best regard
tinus

LOL, you can't imagine how many links I have provided to sayaa in our PM conversation regarding galvanic corrosion, even scientific publications ... but he needs a scientific experiment to confirm corrosion's speed in the current environment
"Sooner or later" can be months, years or centuries Just use a corrosion inhibitor, and it should be fine for a lifetime of the motherboard, I assume.

[systemviper]

HI, I sent my Blackops Northbridge Tub/waterblock TOP to IANDH
He is going to make me a few acrylic tops for my system, I would do it
even if it was copper since i LIKE mine to be Clear because i like UV liquids,

He has started a thread to find out the amount of interest, So anyone interested in
Galvanic cor, or just want a clear or coppertop should give him a shout in the link....

Go IANDH And foxconn, i have high hopes for that Blackopps
crossfire 4870's

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=191482

I will be starting my blackops build in a few weeks, i hope that things have matured by then.....
When will the Dreadknought and the Destroyer be for sale in the USA? Any Ideas?

[Telo]

the nb and the cpu and maybe in the future my 9800 gx2 when i get one

flanr

The king of radiators is the Thermochill PA series; I'd say get largest size your case can hold. Tubing, you should use the 3/8 size tubing. For a pump, I personally use the Swiftech MCP350; you will need a reservoir for it as well, I use the Bits Power top/reservoir for the MCP350. For a CPU block you should consider either the Fuzions [v1 and v2] or the EK Supreme. Finally, for your future 9800, you should research what is the best block for it, usually EK makes really good blocks.

[MotF Bane]

Where are the voltage measure points on the board, such as for VDIMM? I can't find any results by searching the forums.

[Crazystang01]

Anyone happen to be using Super Talent W1600UX4G7 ram on this. I have an unopened set here to go in my Black Ops once I start my build. Just waiting on finishing up my case and ATI's 4870x2's.

[StellaNor]

steffi, thanks a lot!!!
thats some eally nice feedback, thanks!

You very welcome

yes, we are aware of the divider problems, but we focussed on getting 1:4 working well first, since thats what most people will use to bench with dualcores.

As a bencher myself I agree with you and at current state it performs very well on the extreme side. From the side of a author and editor I would have to disagree, since I see the Blackops not just for enthusiast. Somewhere inbetween enthusiast and mainstream there sure is many people interested into it aswell. You cannot expect them to read the extreme forums to receive advice on howto setup FSB and memory clocks to get their RAM working. They just believe what they read in reviews and if they read that 3 out of 4 different memory kits are not working like they should...I will ask Foxconn Germany to let me have the media sample for at least 1 or 2 weeks more to write objectively correct. A german speaking is "Gut Ding braucht Weile" which means something like "Rome wasnt build in one day"

so basically to summarize your testing:
1. auto divider seems to have issues, but surprisingly works with the corsair kit
2. 1:3 and 1:3.2 dont work at all
3. 1:4 200 and 266 strap dont work at all
4. 1:4 400 fsb strap doesnt work

1:4 strap 400 and auto seems to work with memory which is able to run at 1T - at least thats my experiance.

you also mentioned something about command rate 2t causing problems?
what exactly is the problem there?

I wish I knew it. For me it looks like 2t-RAM does not perform really well with the Blackops yet, at least none of the mentioned memory modules (3 out of 4 kits) doing really well and stable like they do on other mobos (790i, P35). With extreme tweaking (DRAM DLL ec, you cannot expect all people aware of howto do it) I am able to run cl6 2t 580fsb at 1:2 dividers, no way to make those RAM working at cl5. The Corsair is easy working at cl5 1t with same settings.

id say 1. is the first we should set our bios engs to work on, im sure its easy to fix as well. then what would you rather prefer as second priority? getting the 1:3 dividers working, or getting the tight straps for 1:4 working?

I know your engs working hard on it. 2nd priority should be 1:3 dividers and 1:4
As said, there is a wide range of customers. Foxconn will be wrong if they believe there is just enthusiast interested into the Blackops. I dont expect 100 percent of different brands of RAM working on the motherboard, but a more wider range will be nice.

[Telo]

Use delrin, it should be close in cost to anodized aluminum and everyone will be happy


Let me finish my setup, I have a good loop for 9800GX2 and CPU, but haven't consider yet the setup for NB water cooling.



LOL, you can't imagine how many links I have provided to sayaa in our PM conversation regarding galvanic corrosion, even scientific publications ... but he needs a scientific experiment to confirm corrosion's speed in the current environment
"Sooner or later" can be months, years or centuries Just use a corrosion inhibitor, and it should be fine for a lifetime of the motherboard, I assume.

Back 2 or 3 months ago, I did an experiment of my own; 4 items in two containers each, one aluminum, one copper, one steel, and one brass. One container had just distilled water and the other had the mixture I use for my watercooling loop. After 1 week you could see corrosion starting to set in on the water only container, the mixture one however did not have any signs. I then check them up at 1 month of being placed, and the corrosion was all over the steel, aluminum, and copper items, but the brass one had hardly any. The container with the watercooling mixture still had no corrosion at all. The experiment would have been on going [because that is what I wanted it to be], but my GF went into the attic and started throwing crap around, needless to say she nailed my little experiment and all the items went their seperate ways.

The point to this story is, corrosion does happen, and fast IF you DO NOT use protection against it. I for one, use copper and aluminum parts in my loop, and quite frankly I have no fears for corrosion or worries about performance going down. People just need to be on top of the maintenance; I plan on changing my mixture every 6 months or so.

[Telo]

Where are the voltage measure points on the board, such as for VDIMM? I can't find any results by searching the forums.

LardArse has posted this. Try looking for it on this thread or the retail version thread for this board.

[raptor1]

The king of radiators is the Thermochill PA series; I'd say get largest size your case can hold. Tubing, you should use the 3/8 size tubing. For a pump, I personally use the Swiftech MCP350; you will need a reservoir for it as well, I use the Bits Power top/reservoir for the MCP350. For a CPU block you should consider either the Fuzions [v1 and v2] or the EK Supreme. Finally, for your future 9800, you should research what is the best block for it, usually EK makes really good blocks.

Thanks for that - checking specs as i am writing this

flanr

[Telo]

CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E8500 3.16Ghz Q812A232 1.225v Pack Date 05/06/08 (Running At 4 Ghz 8 x 500 1:4 CPU 333 1.3625v*)
flanr

Are your serious? You need 1.3625v to get a mere 4Ghz? I know all CPUs are different, but I can do 4Ghz [9.5 x 421; 8 x 500] with 1.20v set on the BIOS. You should really try to bring the voltage down.

[MotF Bane]

LardArse has posted this. Try looking for it on this thread or the retail version thread for this board.

Thanks for the name, it was in his posts list. It looks like he just gave VTT and PLL, nothing for DIMM.

[GTFouts]

I have flashed all my 1600 modules with the new SPD files Tony made and still cant get it to work at 1600, been trying for 12 hours straight. Just isn't fun anymore. It works perfectly at 1333 with the new flash, I will say that. Boots right up with ratio set to AUTO and timings set to BY SPD. Hell, I have it running right now at 4.3GHz 13x333 with those set to auto. So, I'll just wait for a few more bios upgrades, hopefully that will straighten it out some.

I do have a note of strangness for you SAAYA. The RATIO +0.5 Enable doesnt seem to be working right, on my MB anyway. If it is set to DISABLE, then CPUz & OCCT show what its set too and SuperPi runs at the speeds it should for a 1M calculation. But if I set 0.5 to ENABLE then the CPU sets itself to 9x333 as per CPUz & OCCT and SuperPi 1M runs at 9x333 speed, which on my MB is 15 sec. Check out these screenies for the different bios settings. Maybe should be looked at?
(Edit - this is the G27 Bios)

(Edit - Its not settings the FSB back to 333, it stays where its set too, it's just reverting the multiplier back to 9x when you enable the 0.5 Ratio, in windows. Posting screen shows it set to the .5 and the speed also)

Top Left Pic - Bios set to 12x333, Ratio Disabled

Top Right Pic - Bios set to 12x333, Ratio Enabled

Bottom Left Pic - Bios set to 13x333, Ratio Disabled

Bottom Right Pic - Bios set to 13x333, Ratio Enabled

[sashin]

I have a major problem guys. I have been reading through this thread for several weeks and just tring to solve my problems myself with the advice that is given in this thread by various people BUT i have come to my limits here. I had OCZ Platinum DDR3 1600 ram with this Blackops BUT after reading through this thread i purchased the CellShock 1866 ram with the Blue heatsink!!
I have quad core 9650 and i have the P04 bios. with this bios i was able to boot with Anandtech memory settings at 1600 (400fsb) and multi 10 for 4.0Ghz. I nstalled my ativirus software and all was well for a while then i started having intermittent periods where the system would just not respond in Windows Vista 32bit....i would have to wait several minutes after even clicking on the start button!! I thought it was the antivirus software so i tried to uninstall it BUT the system kept hanging...so i decided to reinstall WIndows Vista Ultimate Edition to start fresh. Now when i try to reinstall windows the whole thing just hangs during the initial setup screen.all this at default 3.0 setting with my Cellshock at 1333 or 1066....1600 is just out of the question.
I would just like to install windows with my quad core and cellshock at stock first then slowly crank up the system to 4.0. I am watercooling the processor at present. Anyone in this forum with quadcore 9650 and cellshock with this mobo ...please give some advice on how to get this machine of mine booting with vista installed. Thanks again