Phenom 9500 w/ MSI K9A2 Platinum

[KTE]

Your lockups could be anything. Instability also causes lockups.

You can only run whatever is your max stable like this with the patch as far as I or anyone experienced. It doesn't increase your MHz or oc stability.

You get very bad perf, worse than stock. You're talking 30-50% of where it should be. That's what I was getting, extremely bad perf.

It'll only help you in cases where you have lockups at stock. If you don't get lockups at stock, the bug is not affecting you. AMD doesn't cover oc problems since its outside warranty and it's the users problem.

[Emperor]

Your lockups could be anything. Instability also causes lockups.

You can only run whatever is your max stable like this with the patch as far as I or anyone experienced. It doesn't increase your MHz or oc stability.

You get very bad perf, worse than stock. You're talking 30-50% of where it should be. That's what I was getting, extremely bad perf.

It'll only help you in cases where you have lockups at stock. If you don't get lockups at stock, the bug is not affecting you. AMD doesn't cover oc problems since its outside warranty and it's the users problem.

but errata is something that hits at 2.4Ghz and full load on 4cores isnt it ?

so if i apply this patch at 235x11 it would be worse than 220x11 without patch right ?



does MSI have an option to switch on and off the patch?

[KTE]

Why would AMD cover 2.4GHz errata when that's outside their 2.2GHz/2.3GHz warranty and never guranteed by them?

The errata is present in the silicon. It will never manifest itself at normal loads or usage. When you run a certain application with very unusually high loads, you will experience it. If yuo run those sort of apps, then you need the patch -> or else, no.

I'm running WCG 24/7 since 2-3 days at 2.42GHz and 1.98GHz on NB & HT. No problems whatsoever, no errata. The lockups are because these retail chips simply seem to have a speed limit.

That mainly, or, less likely, the BIOS is very bad yet.

[Emperor]

Why would AMD cover 2.4GHz errata when that's outside their 2.2GHz/2.3GHz warranty and never guranteed by them?

The errata is present in the silicon. It will never manifest itself at normal loads or usage. When you run a certain application with very unusually high loads, you will experience it. If yuo run those sort of apps, then you need the patch -> or else, no.

I'm running WCG 24/7 since 2-3 days at 2.42GHz and 1.98GHz on NB & HT. No problems whatsoever, no errata. The lockups are because these retail chips simply seem to have a speed limit.

That mainly, or, less likely, the BIOS is very bad yet.

so my unstable 235x11 is due to factors other than the errata when simply running FF ?

[KTE]

Yep.

Either or a combination of board/BIOS/CPU/NB/RAM.

Pretty sure Sami mentioned this on this board before too.

I can replicate that behavior right now. All I need to do is oc it to 2.55GHz and that's exactly what'll happen.

[Swanie]

Well i need your help. Took the MSI for myself ,build it over push power button but ......nothing. I got the first screen about three times but now nothing. It shows a screen that it is busy scanning the drives and then after a while tells me i have a hardware problem.? Running a phenom and Mushkin 1066. Silverstone 1kw PSU. Did BIOS resets as told by MSI site but nothing.

[Thesavage]

Remove any extra pci cards and test again also try upping the dim voltage to 2 volts.

[Emperor]

Well i need your help. Took the MSI for myself ,build it over push power button but ......nothing. I got the first screen about three times but now nothing. It shows a screen that it is busy scanning the drives and then after a while tells me i have a hardware problem.? Running a phenom and Mushkin 1066. Silverstone 1kw PSU. Did BIOS resets as told by MSI site but nothing.

if u selected 1:2.33 ram dividers, it wont work.

at least for my motherboard...

[Swanie]

well got it to boot, got into windows but now here something weird. Cannot run dual channel, thus cannot run in green and orange together ... also updated bios to 113 but now every time i start it says Cmos bad checksum and i must press either f or f2, i cannot save my settings.

[Emperor]

well got it to boot, got into windows but now here something weird. Cannot run dual channel, thus cannot run in green and orange together ... also updated bios to 113 but now every time i start it says Cmos bad checksum and i must press either f or f2, i cannot save my settings.

how did u do that ?

[Swanie]

Used a USB stick with the HP booter , new bios, etc. Also after flashing bios how to i safely reboot, etc...clear cmos..how..

[KTE]

well got it to boot, got into windows but now here something weird. Cannot run dual channel, thus cannot run in green and orange together ... also updated bios to 113 but now every time i start it says Cmos bad checksum and i must press either f or f2, i cannot save my settings.

Are you running in unganged mode?
What RAM divider did you choose? (put it to 1:2 and see if that works fine)
Bad checksum is if it has an error starting and you haven't set the correct date/time (do this). Check your HT ref. speed is stock and make sure your VDIMM is as high as it should be.

[muzz]

Nah don't bother with him.

Low-k allows more power savings than high-k.

Really?

Quote:
" Using high-k/metal gate IBM and its Alliance Partners have been able to successfully shrink the size of a chip by up to 50 percent as compared to the previous technology generation while improving a number of other performance specifications. For example, high-k metal gate chips save about 45 percent total power, an increasingly critical metric in all electronics applications. "

http://www.physorg.com/news116860211.html

I guess there are some differeing opinions on that, but before you 2 guys blast me, I read stuff like that and the new Intel Process, which as you know- is HK/MG.

If I was wrong, that's fine..
JAP- no need to talk to me like that either.

[Swanie]

Well KTE thanks for the reply. I am getting frustated here. Over at MSI HQ they assited but said i must not use 113 but here they say it more stable but no matter. Flashed bios correctly, got rid of boot error ,can get into Vista ...all fine but tried to run Dual channel and now pc don't boot. I have not set anything. all default. I am sure my memory was not on 1:2 divider and was running in ungaged mode. What are the Vdimm supposed to be, running a Phenom 9500.

[KTE]

Really?

http://www.physorg.com/news116860211.html

I guess there are some differeing opinions on that, but before you 2 guys blast me, I read stuff like that and the new Intel Process, which as you know- is HK/MG.

If I was wrong, that's fine..

That's all true. I don't see where you or anyone is wrong. But this is what I was talking about:
http://www.physorg.com/news85247225.html
http://nepp.nasa.gov/index_nasa.cfm/934/
http://www.fabtech.org/content/view/2079/74/

This "ultra low-k" was too difficult for AMD/IBM to implement yet but was better than the hafnium based high-k we know for power savings.

JAP- no need to talk to me like that either.

JAP?

[KTE]

What are the Vdimm supposed to be, running a Phenom 9500.

Which RAM do you have (part number would be good)?

[Swanie]

Mushkin HP2-8500 : 996578 ( the 2 x1 gig kit)
Rated : 5-5-5-18 and 2.2-2.35V

[Periander6]

Lower fab node means a smaller manufacturing process i.e., 65nm to 45nm, or 45nm to 32nm, etc.
High-k allows lower power saving, larger leakage but higher frequnecies.
Low-k allows large power savings, much less leakage but lower frequnecies.

Huh? Low-k and High-k are used in different parts of the chip. They are not exclusive, far from it, you want both of them. You want a process that uses both high and low k.

Low-k has been around for a while. You want to use a low-k material between the interconnects and between transistors to lower crosstalk and parasitic capacitance. Everybody uses some form of low-k these days, there are a number of off-the-shelf solutions available.

High-k and the associated metal gate are something entirely new. High-k is used for the gate dielectric in order to reduce gate leakage and increase gate capacitance. Everyone is working on it, but only Intel has it in production with its 45nm process.

Some useful reading:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-K
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-k_Dielectric
http://www.spectrum.ieee.org/oct07/5553/1

[muzz]

That's all true. I don't see where you or anyone is wrong. But this is what I was talking about:
http://www.physorg.com/news85247225.html
http://nepp.nasa.gov/index_nasa.cfm/934/
http://www.fabtech.org/content/view/2079/74/

This "ultra low-k" was too difficult for AMD/IBM to implement yet but was better than the hafnium based high-k we know for power savings.


JAP?

I read that, and others like it regarding that collaboration... in other words it's useless for <65nm.

Everything I've read to date states HK/MG is the way to go for reduced leakage/power consumption, which is what I stated in my earlier post that was rebuffed(which is fine- we are on the net!! heheheh).

Isn't leakage what caused the P4 to run so hot?

JAP= justapost
If someone doesn't agree with ya, and feels ya made a mistake that's fine.

OK, sorry about the OT.

[Swanie]

Well i set my divider to 1:2 -still no boot and also upped volts to 2 ,no luck either

[KTE]

Mushkin HP2-8500 : 996578 ( the 2 x1 gig kit)
Rated : 5-5-5-18 and 2.2-2.35V

See if this helps: http://forums.mushkin.com/phpbb2/vie...f191f5754df3d4

[sdsdv10]

Really?

JAP- no need to talk to me like that either.

JAP?

I believe JAP means user "justapost", who posted a reply near the top of the page.

[Blacklash]

Well my Canine A2 replacement just arrived. I hope this one works. I'll report back later...

[KTE]

Huh? Low-k and High-k are used in different parts of the chip. They are not exclusive, far from it, you want both of them. You want a process that uses both high and low k.

I know. Intel uses both for 45nm too. But thanks anyway.

muzz: YHPM

[Blacklash]

Pfft acts like a brick like the other one. Seems dead. I am guessing it hates my G. Skill and Mushkin ram. I've tried one stick of each separately with no dice. The G Skill is a 2GB DDR 2 800 stick rated to work with 1.85-1.9v.

I tried it with an Agena 9600 and then with a Orleans 3000+. I've connected it to; Fortron 700 GLN, PC P&C 510 SLi and Seasonic 650 HT. I've tried a single X800XL and a single HD 3850.

I tried it in the case and on the box it came in. I've tried it with the case power switch and a jumper on the power pins.

I am not buying more ram just to toy with this 99usd mobo. Perhaps I'll try Gigabyte. Guess my AMD adventure is over for a while. I am putting my HD 3850s back in BX2 rig. F this, I don't need the headache.