The R580 News Thread

[DilTech]

http://www.guru3d.com/newsitem.php?id=2882

So, the G80 is ALREADY COMPLETE and awaiting the R580??? NVidia really IS ready for war!

So basically, NVidia has their next 2 cards done, and are just waiting for ATi to drop one so they can trump it, make ati throw out their next so they can trump it yet again???? Jeez, I guess the 9700pro vs. fx5800 really DID teach NVidia a lesson....

[Cybercat]

Yes, and so did the 9800 Pro vs FX5900, and the 3DMark03 scandel.

Not bad, not bad at all.

[perkam]

Relax...Nothing new. The R580 wont be battling the G80, the R600 will be. The R580 will the 32 Pipe versions of the R520, nothing else....and will be battling the G71.

The G80 is the desktop version of the NV's gfx chip in the PS3 afaik. The R600 will be based on the R500 xenon chip, which had been completed and taped out months ago at 500Mhz core with 10MB of integrated memory and unified shaders and what not - just not for the desktop yet, which is what the R600 is all about.

Btw, this is all at least 1.5 years away....knowing how Nvidia and ATi can stretch a gfx chip platform ... so its too early for us to get excited.

Hell, Intel has had insanely clocked pressies and northwoods prototypes in their labs when ppl were playing with 0.18nm architecture. Just because its done doesnt mean its coming to your comp any time soon

Perkam

[turtle]

Yeah...I would think G71 will compete against R580. High clocks vs. more pipes and ALUs.

G80 will probably be out before R600, but yeah I would think they'd be each others competition because of the unified shaders. They'd truely kill the life of G71 if they put out G80 so soon.

[DilTech]

R520 will be battling the G71 if you remember right. 7800ultra ring a bell?

The site VR-Zone came to know that the future is actually pretty near where NVIDIA G80 design is based on unified shader architecture slated to appear in 2006.

R580 will be battling the g80 according to this article, they're saying 2k6, which isn't 1.5 years away, this is what we'll likely be looking at next spring.

G80 design is completed and waiting for ATI R580 when the time comes.

When has guru3d EVER written a false story?... The G70 was just to make ATi show it's hand and to rake in cash while ATi had nothing to show, the G71 is set to try and take down the R520, and the G80 is the card to slap ATi when they pull out the R580... Makes perfect sense to me. Currently, ATi is caught with their pants down, and apparently they weren't wearing any underwear either.

[STEvil]

Relax...Nothing new. The R580 wont be battling the G80, the R600 will be. The R580 will the 32 Pipe versions of the R520, nothing else....and will be battling the G71.

Could be right on this, or close.

The G80 is the desktop version of the NV's gfx chip in the PS3 afaik. The R600 will be based on the R500 xenon chip, which had been completed and taped out months ago at 500Mhz core with 10MB of integrated memory and unified shaders and what not - just not for the desktop yet, which is what the R600 is all about.

Aside from the glaring error of calling the G80 equivalent to whats in the PS3, this is probably close to correct.

Btw, this is all at least 1.5 years away....knowing how Nvidia and ATi can stretch a gfx chip platform ... so its too early for us to get excited.

refreshes are boring :/

Hell, Intel has had insanely clocked pressies and northwoods prototypes in their labs when ppl were playing with 0.18nm architecture. Just because its done doesnt mean its coming to your comp any time soon

Perkam

They told us they did and showed 10ghz ALU's... better than what a lot of others do I guess.

[Geforce4ti4200]

wow I dont believe Nvidia could get something 2 years ahead of its time taped out. I however do believe the g71 has taped. From what I hear, it could be clocked up to 800MHz with 24 pipes. I have a hard time believing 800MHz, maybe with 90nm and watercooling. Yes Nvidia did catch ati but I hear ati's gonna release their r520 in a month.

[turtle]

7800U and G71 are not the same thing. 7800U would be a higher clocked gtx (110nm). G71 (90nm) would be a new product, most likely with a different name, like 7850gtx or something crazy like that, a refresh part. I imagine a 7800U will be released if R520 is better than gtx and nvidia hasn't gotten far enough in the production process of G71. It seems they have, so you probably won't see a 7800U. You'll see the Nvidia refresh soon enough after R520 (prolly Nov/Dec, no more than a couple months) and then they'll regain the crown again with those nuts clocks (800mhz or whatever.) Of course, then eventually R580 will come to play not long after that....then probably a little break....then G80, and then R600 in the fall/winter (probably in that order) 2006.

Well, something to that effect. That's my guesstimate. It's going to be a battle back and forth, unless R520 could somehow beat a high-clocked 90nm G71, in which ATi would own the top until G80.

If G80 comes out not long after R580, and way before R600, yes...Nvidia would straight up lay the smack down on ATi. They both would be 32pp, prolly both higher clocks, prolly both doing massive multi-threading, but I imagine the unified architecture of G80 will kick much ass.

Somehow though, I don't think that matters to a lot of peeps. I bet peeps are going to be looking for that "good deal" in the high-end, like 7800gt looks to be. Hopefully ATi have something good planned for that market...and the 7600gt market...because all of those look to be good value products, bang-for-the-buck if you will. That's what i'm going to be looking for the next time I upgrade.

[DZVlad]

as nVidia's and ATI's release periods are not synchronised it will always be nVidia on the first place and then for a couple of months ATI. It's like on cycling tracks as in "follow-the-leader" races. You never know who will win until the finish

[Cybercat]

The G80 is the desktop version of the NV's gfx chip in the PS3 afaik.

The RSX in the PS3 doesn't use a unified shader architecture.

[DZVlad]

The G80 is a completely new chip, unlike the G70 so there is no point comparing it to other chips that nVidia is making

[krille]

I don't really see why you linked to Guru3D, this was VR-Zone's story, you know, not Guru3D - the Guru3D is just a copy and paste of the VR-Zone article. But VR-Zone can very often right too (and that's where a lot of the 7800U/G71 speculations are coming from), but not always tbh (a little like Inq...just tons of more bloggy speculations there).

Moreover nVidia "winning" for once wouldn't seem too distant to me, afterall they should have more money to put in R&D etc (afaik nVidia is a much bigger company). But, even though ATI's been very late with R520 (still is!), how do we know R580 and R600 will be as late? It's not impossible ATI has a few aces up their sleeve too. I think it's too early to rule out either, however in the long run nVidia should have the better conditions. And, AFAIK, R600 will be WGF2.0 compliant too (an upgraded R500, and R500 is WGF1.0 compliant with iirc unified shaders in some sense).

[Afterburner]

Looks like good news is to come after all for ATI fans. Accordin to the Inquirer, the R580 has been taped out sucessfully a few weeks ago by a team workin independantly from the R520 team. Details and yields are not known at this time.

Source

[perkam]

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...89#post1019589

Pls do check the most current related threads before posting Thx.

--Thread Closed--

[Shadowmage]

As the title says. Proof:

http://www.beyond3d.com/reviews/ati/r520/index.php?p=07

Regular participants of our forums may well have been aware of some reasonably obscure numbering schemes for many months that were used to describe parts of the performance characteristics, such as 16-1-1-1 for R520, 4-1-3-2 for RV530 and 4-1-1-1 for RV515, but until now the exact meaning of these weren't known. With the specifications for each of the chips we can now derive that the first number equates to the number of ROP's, the second the number of texture units per ROP, the third the number of "shader pipes" per ROP, and finally the Z/Stencil multiplier per ROP - with these figures in mind, we'll let you consider the ramifications for parts in the R5xx series that are still to come...

R580 was said to be 16-1-3-1 from the start (aka when the 16-1-1-1, 4-1-3-2 and 4-1-1-1 info was released). Since the third number is "the number of shader pipes per ROP", this means that the shader bandwidth will triple in R580, letting ATI gain its usual shader performance lead over NVIDIA. Remember that R520's weakest area atm is shader performance (as proved by XBitLabs).

This info is most likely true, since the rest of the info (16-1-1-1, etc) was true.

ATI will probably capitalize on this by saying that R580 has 48 pipelines (16x3), but this of course, isn't really true, just like G70 doesn't really have 24 pipelines. However, the 3x shader pipes will most definately improve performance considerably and remove R520's main weakness.

I would say that it would be a good idea to wait for R580, since R520 prices aren't doing so well anyways atm.

[n00b 0f l337]

So if your saying g70 doesnt actually have 24, what does it have? And what does r580 really have?

[Cybercat]

The R580 isn't til a long time coming. Waiting would be hard

So if your saying g70 doesnt actually have 24, what does it have? And what does r580 really have?

I think they mean that since the 7800GTX doesn't have 24 ROPs, it doesn't really have 24 full pixel pipes.

[n00b 0f l337]

So whats it got then. And I can see r580 coming out in lets say, once I start saving up my money and selling bits of my soul, r580 will come out just when I'm $100 short of its price.

[Shadowmage]

In truth, "pipeline" terminology is outdated, with advent of G70. You can consider G70 to have 16 "fat" pipelines.

Waiting is always hard. Currently, in terms of price/performance ratio, NVIDIA wins at ultra-high-end with 7800 series. However, price/perf ratio makes no sense in the ultra-high-end anyways (consider $1000 NVIDIA 6800U 512MB), which is a pretty good attempt to justify X1800XT purchases. As for X1800XL, we need to wait for X1800XL OC results.

[DilTech]

BFG was the reason behind the 6800ultra 512mb card, considering they were the SOLE maker of the card. NVidia had nothing to do with that one, note the fact that there was no 6800ultra 512mb reference card.


Eh, as for the R580, it'll be nice if it's true... As for me, when it comes to either company, I'll believe it when I see it, especially considering they had enough problems bringing the R520 to the table.

[Cybercat]

BFG was the reason behind the 6800ultra 512mb card, considering they were the SOLE maker of the card. NVidia had nothing to do with that one, note the fact that there was no 6800ultra 512mb reference card.

The 512MB 6800 Ultra was definitely an official card, and there was definitely more than just BFG making them. The official announcement.

I think it would be more fitting to refer to the "pipelines" as they once were, to shader processors now, especially since rasterization and texturing functions are starting to be separated from them.

[perkam]

we need to wait for X1800XL OC results.

lol They're here, pls check x3d section.

Shadowmage, pls provide link to where it says R580 will be 16-1-3-1.

Perkam

[DilTech]

Ah, my mistake... I meant to say originally.

There was a press-release by BFG when it was originally released. NVidia made it official afterwards.

[Shadowmage]

X1800XL OC results were limited by ATI CCC, I heard.

---

It's hard to find the exact post, it's in one of the huge R520 mega-threads (aka 40+ pages). B3D forum search isn't very convenient. It points to the thread but it won't point you to the page...

Here are some references to it tho:

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showth...light=16-1-1-1


EDIT:

Google FTW!

http://www.google.com/search?as_q=16...om&safe=images

[DilTech]

Shadow, forum posts aren't news..

Nice find, but it's not exactly "proof" just yet, currently it's just a theory.

It'll be great if true, but we need more than a forum theory to make it news.