ATI News Thread

[DilTech]

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33826885

1. Late September Launch Date Set for Three R500 Desktop Discrete Chips (R520, RV530, and RV515): Addressing the rampant rumours surrounding the R520 launch date, ATI stated its plan of record is to launch all three 90nm R500 desktop discrete chips (the enthusiast R520, the performance RV530, and the value RV515) in late September. The shipment dates will likely be staggered for the three chips, based on the delivery cycles from TSMC, with one likely shipping at launch date and the other two within the first half of October. The R520 was originally planned for a June launch, while the RV530 and RV515 launch times are only a few weeks delayed from their original schedule. The R520 had been sampling since Dec/04, and although the architecture and 90nm process were not a problem, ATI was not able to run the clock fast enough due to a “soft ground� issue that was discovered in late July after debugging with several re-spins. Specifically, the R520 and RV530 had functional yields, but could not run at high speeds, while the RV515 and the C1 (the 90nm Xbox graphics chip) did not have any issues. ATI concedes it has lost the OEM designs (primarily Dell) to NVIDIA’s GeForce 7800 GTX for enthusiast desktop PCs for both the back-to-school and holiday season, but believes the retail and channel (add-in-board) markets for the R520 chip remain available (representing over 2/3rds of the enthusiast market). Both ATI and NVIDIA did not refresh their back-to-school product stack for the performance/mainstream/value segments, with ATI indicating it has kept a significant share of design wins awarded in the March to May timeframe, based on its ATI X700, X600, X550, and X300 (competing against NVIDIA’s GeForce 6200 and 6600). In terms of performance, ATI believes the R520 should exceed the GeForce 7800 GTX in benchmark tests if it can get the proper clock speed, but recognizes that NVIDIA has some headroom to overclock the GeForce 7800 clock speeds. We do not expect ATI to launch its R580 (speculated to have 32 pixel pipelines) in C2005 (ATI does not want to stall the channel for the R520), and expect a refresh of the R500 family beginning in spring 2006 with RV560, followed by RV540 and RV505. We expect the R600 (DirectX 10, targeting Microsoft Vista operating system and WGF 2.0, the next generation graphics library) in Q4/F06 or Q1/F07.

No R580 until spring/summer, meaning NO 32 piped cards until next year... ATi also admits that if NVidia crank up the 7800 clockspeeds, that ATi are in trouble, as their big problem with the R520 has been not being able to get it's clockspeeds up high enough to compete with NVidia this round. Also, of note, the R600 is expected end of the year 2006/beginning of 2007.

To sum it up, ATi isn't so sure that the R520 is a real match for the G71/7800ultra/7900gtx/whatever nvidia wants to call it, and ATi has NO plans on releasing the R580 to counter NVidia's refresher card as they cannot afford to steal their own sales away from the R520, which is going to be a VERY expensive card, rumored to weigh in with a $700 price tag.... With ATi being worried, this pretty much means we won't see anything TOO fancy(i.e. probably no 512bit memory bus) or they'd seem a little more sure of themselves here, which they are not. Also, we also have a CONFIRMATION of a paper launch...

[[XC] leviathan18]

that is bad news

[DilTech]

Also, thought I'd mention before the ATi fanboys start running their mouths about "Ati just covering up so NVidia don't know what they have"... You lie to investors, you get sued, and in alot of cases major jail time... The SEC doesn't play around, you can't give false info, wether it be good OR bad, at an investors meeting, so don't even start it.

This is VERY bad news for ATi...

[Cybercat]

This doesn't tell me that ATI did bad this year, this just tells me that NVIDIA did exceptionally good this year. They're in such a flexible position right now it's not even funny.

[Tim]

Seems like nVidia is gonna release a 32-Pipe card the day after ATI's R520 launch....

http://www.gdhardware.com/events/idf/fall_2005/003.htm

We've met with several industry insiders who claim that the R520 is nothing more than a 16 pixel pipeline GPU that'll be clocked at 700MHz and that NVIDIA has a 32-pipe solution it's waiting to pull the trigger on the day after ATI's announcement. Either way, we sure hope neither company gets caught up into a paper-launch.

[toledo]

This doesn't tell me that ATI did bad this year, this just tells me that NVIDIA did exceptionally good this year. They're in such a flexible position right now it's not even funny.

I don`t think they are doing well .... the shareholders are no happy

http://www.forbes.com/markets/2005/0...ketscan10.html

[Tim]

I don`t think they are doing well .... the shareholders are no happy

http://www.forbes.com/markets/2005/0...ketscan10.html

*ouch

[Ugly n Grey]

Keep in mind they are trying to transition their major business to integrated graphics solutions. Discrete video logic chips make up a small portion of the market. For example, Intel sells more graphics solutions than Nvidia and ATI combined. Just not for enthusiast markets, which Intel could care less about. ATI has stated in the past they are moving towards making more integrated products...doing this removes engineers and teams from the discrete chip business. I for one think they are making the correct business move. I have much more interest in the sales of IGP's from an investor standpoint (I'm a shareholder) than I have for R520 which makes up a tiny percentage of sales when released...

Business performance in this segment is not about how many mad ocer's buy the top line video cards....it's about sales in the mid range segment and the performance of chipset sales.....What having the best card on the planet does is attract attention to the other solutions, but Nvidia survived fine when ATI whooped them for over a year and the same will be true in reverse...

It's all perspective...

[metro.cl]

if ati does a paper launch, r520 isnt a good card and ocs , i'll go nvidias way.

shame on ati

[Entity_Razer]

nownow people. as said before it's not because its a 16 piped product it will suck

16 pipes @ 700MHZ core will stick rock And knowing ATI I don't doubt for a moment that the card won't be OC-able. because ATI is not stupid and they DO know that if they don't deliver, the're boned


BTW tim, thats again speculation. It could be BS, it could be legit. Lets just wait and find out? Just a month more to go

[n00b 0f l337]

Frankly I said that I won't say a thing really till I have touched/oc'd/held/carressed/made sweet love to the card before I dictate what is better. It may be a plunge, but we also dont know if 1) how high it will clock with more voltage, 2) how well crossfire is off for improvements between the 2 cards over SLI.... For all you know 2x r520 will cream nvidia's next card because xfire works better, or hell it may suck....

Frankly, I cant afford either, so I still go ATI as my x800pro's and x800 series are still in my finacial areas.

[rick_fx]

At 700$, I dont see many people buying the card right away. Especially if it's of equal or lower performance than the 7800gtx.

Just my

[Cooper]

Late September Launch Date Set for Three R500 Desktop Discrete Chips (R520, RV530, and RV515)

And many more. Just follow the link below

Source

[Tim]

BTW tim, thats again speculation. It could be BS, it could be legit. Lets just wait and find out? Just a month more to go

I wasn't saying that it was fact, I think I just constructed the sentence wrong...

It would be good news though...would really rock

Let's just wait...I hope DFI will get their new NF4 board out around the same time...

[One_Hertz]

oh man ati doesnt look very well. I can only hope that at least Nvidia will come up with a fast card.

[Entity_Razer]

I would hope that , incase ati screws up, Nvidia will just rehash their product right now instead of getting out a faster newer tech. Why? because then Nvidia's market position stays where it is and ATI can strike back. Competition is ALWAYS a good thing. Competition = new technologies and lower prizes

[perkam]

Cooper's thread on the same subject

--Threads Merged--

Perkam

[Revv23]

seems to me like ati got a bit too spread out devolping two seperate high end graphics cards, and a chipset, and crossfire..

lets not forget the huge amount of card sales that partnering with microsoft is going to bring them, ati is not dieing, far from it...

honestly, i would prefer ati to cancel r520, get crossfire out, move all of thier engineers onto the next project, make r520 thier next gen midrange card with a solid non-paper launch, and compete in the mid range market until they have something high end worth buying.

[EvlUndrWareNome]

nownow people. as said before it's not because its a 16 piped product it will suck

16 pipes @ 700MHZ core will stick rock And knowing ATI I don't doubt for a moment that the card won't be OC-able. because ATI is not stupid and they DO know that if they don't deliver, the're boned


BTW tim, thats again speculation. It could be BS, it could be legit. Lets just wait and find out? Just a month more to go

ooooh a super clocked xtpe....
Not thrilled..

*buys GTX*

[metro.cl]

nownow people. as said before it's not because its a 16 piped product it will suck

16 pipes @ 700MHZ core will stick rock And knowing ATI I don't doubt for a moment that the card won't be OC-able. because ATI is not stupid and they DO know that if they don't deliver, the're boned


BTW tim, thats again speculation. It could be BS, it could be legit. Lets just wait and find out? Just a month more to go

im not sure about these but if ati is insecure that they car reach high enough clocks to catch the 7800gtx (say 700mhz is enough) what makes you think you could oc the core much further?? whats the limit from 110 to 90mn?? are there any other improovements that would let oc higher?
if you look at amd shrink from 130mn to 90mn you didnt get that much mhz, and the change included much better things than just getting a smaller process

[perkam]

http://theinquirer.net/?article=25802

I remember the same thing about r520 almost year ago Hoping it won't take 12 months till there are r580 cards in retail

We dont need a new thread every time unofficial info comes up on ATI's roadmap/product line.

--Threads Merged--

I'm Also making this the OFFICIAL ATI news info thread. All unofficial news, rumours and quotes go here. If you have verifiable info like a new picture or official launch info, then you can make a new thread, otherwise pls post here.

Perkam

[Afterburner]

Roger dat......

[turtle]

THG (Yes, yes...I know...) saying R520 will be 700mhz stock and "outperform the 7800gtx in any scenario" (Yes that sounds PR-like):

http://www.tomshardware.com/hardnews...30_205000.html

DB saying the R580 tapeout rumour is bogus:

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23092 (post #16)

Take them for whatever they're worth. My apologies if this craps' already been posted.

About the 700mhz thinger:

It makes sense... 16pp/700mhz. Surely nothing is known about ALUs, TMUs, Vertex Shaders (although I assume 8), this, that and the other thing...But looking at fill rate, they'd be close in that theoretical situation. I know i'm not taking into account the different clocks G70 has, but then again R520's architecture is unknown, so those are variables that could lead to the vague quote Orton gave about R520 comparing to 7800gtx.

stock GTX: 430x24 = 10320
avg oc GTX: 500x24 = 12000
*rumored approx R520 clock*: 700x16 = 11200
avg overclock needed to compare in fillrate after oc: 750x16 = 12000

While I know the Inq is shoddy for cred, they did say a long while back (amongst other things of course) that ATi was getting 700+ mhz yields for R520, and could even be clocked slightly higher "towards 800mhz." Assuming they have the same number of vs (8), and fairly similar mem speed, it could just come down to which architecture is more effiecient, ie if ATi uses fatter pipes, more alus per pipe, or something else they could be better, or if nvidia's multiple clocks/mini-alu/more pipes-less clock is more efficient, they would be better...Or it could be a complete mish-mash. I just hope peeps don't look at ATi's part as inferior because of the pipes, if 16 is true as for what it looks like now it could be very well or equal or better, we just don't know because we don't know ATi's arch yet.

As for the G71 rumors, here is what i've heard most frequent:

Nvidia cancelled the ultra (faster g70), and has been working on a (90nm?) 32pp G70 which has been delayed a few months, most likely to appear in-between R520 and R580...assumingly right before Christmas. I think they're hoping that product will compete well enough with R580 to postphone G80 until they need it, and gain more revenue off of the GF7 series w/o retiring it too early. Sounds like a good idea to me. This should lead to some super-fast refreshes, much more of a advance than we're used to for semi-cycle parts.

[n00b 0f l337]

Isnt that assuming the 16 pipes are normal? And not expanded? Do the math if the pipes are 1.33 times what normal pipes are.

[n00b 0f l337]

Erm I dun think your too well versed in the latest news Loe. The pipes supposedly there working with will provide a 33% increase hopefully in use-full-ness... They also have a ton of stock of there other few new cards because there waiting for there flagship. I'm also curious on the r580 but wierder things have happened and maybe 32 is easier...? 32 = 16 x 2? Who knows, pipes are a strange thing... Its also been said there trying not to do any bit of a paper launch. ATI's also clocked so high becuase of the new architecture and the move to (90nm is it?)....