AMD Cayman info (or rumor)

[madcho]

no 5870 have this cooling, this is just an old sticker.

[BababooeyHTJ]

The important question is: Can a GTX580 beat a 5970?

Have you seen benchmarks of a 5970 overclocked vs a GTX480 overclocked? I don't think that GTX580 will have any problems against 5970. How it will perform against Antilles is the more important question.

[nascasho]

Thank god, I'm happy it'll be packing a backplate.

[RPGWiZaRD]

How it will perform against Cayman XT is the more important question.

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699 which will quite soon drop to $649)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

[cold2010]

HD 6970

HD6970 is a DDR5 2G memory core frequency of confidentiality do not speak other temporary 860mHZ

[kadozer]

That's 1 huge brick. Now bench a couple games and leak them pls.

[Jowy Atreides]

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

You're aiming too low. The question should be - how much does the 6970 beat the 580?
Also, how much does the 6950 beat the 580?

They both will, even if it's marginal for the 6950.

[BababooeyHTJ]

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

Yeah, no speculation there at all.

Where are you getting those numbers?

[Flying duck]

That's 1 huge brick. Now bench a couple games and leak them pls.

+1, If they got the card you'd think they'd be benchmarking it by now...

[RPGWiZaRD]

You're aiming too low. The question should be - how much does the 6970 beat the 580?
Also, how much does the 6950 beat the 580?

They both will, even if it's marginal for the 6950.

Your expectations don't make sense, then 6950 would have to cost at least 549~$599 and HD6970 with whatever advantage it have perhaps $699 and Antilles would be only available to rich bastards for $899 and then that would be rather aggressive pricing vs performance for the competitor. You think the market would accept such prices? Another point would be power consumption/efficiency? AMD would sure have some wizard engineers to be able to create such performance increase yet on 40nm node not to mention the limited development time. xD

Yeah, no speculation there at all.

Where are you getting those numbers?

From my head using logical guesses based on historical pattern, trends, current manufacturing process node status, how much spareroom for improvement does it look to be there still on current gen, "what I had aimed for being in charge of the company", what feels right etc, like I said, speculation. ^^ Some speculations are more logical than others though.

[Aten-Ra]

860MHz for Cayman XT or Pro ??

Never mind, just saw it says HD6970

[Flying duck]

Your expectations don't make sense, then 6950 would have to cost at least 549~$599 and HD6970 with whatever advantage it have perhaps $699 and Antilles would be only available to rich bastards for $899 and then that would be rather aggressive pricing vs performance for the competitor. You think the market would accept such prices? Another point would be power consumption/efficiency? AMD would sure have some wizard engineers to be able to create such performance increase yet on 40nm node not to mention the limited development time. xD

Actually your reply doesn't make sense.
Where did he mention prices, and who says AMD will necessarily price their product higher than Nvidia even if they perform better?

[Jowy Atreides]

Your expectations don't make sense, then 6950 would have to cost at least 549~$599 and HD6970 with whatever advantage it have perhaps $699 and Antilles would be only available to rich bastards for $899 and then that would be rather aggressive pricing vs performance for the competitor. You think the market would accept such prices? Another point would be power consumption/efficiency? AMD would sure have some wizard engineers to be able to create such performance increase yet on 40nm node not to mention the limited development time. xD

Your logic doesn't make sense.
AMD will undercut nvidia at around $450 for the 6970, steal their sales.

A repeat of the 4870 v 280.

My expectations are fine. Think of the advantages of the 6970 vs the 6870. Now look at the efficiency of avg fps / watt.


Alone, at the very least, you have to admit the 2gb frame buffer will win AMD all the 2560+AA benches. Then you have the fact the cards will be faster.

[Mechanical Man]

...

No, its you who are not making any sense, why would AMD need to price them same way as nVidia? There is nothing to stop AMD pricing them to 300-500 range if they can make profit from it, also when Barts is already around 200, what would fill the cap? Leave it to competitor? no that would be stupid. So price your cards accordingly, if it gives more power than competitor at lower price, so what? You absolutely dominate market after that..

Also, if you are not aware, evergreen 5VLIW is very inefficient desing, why would not 4VLIW improve on it very much. Btw, im sure you are not in place to say anything about what performance can be extracted from 40nm node.

[Aten-Ra]

My expectation

DX-9/10

HD6970 = +25% from 5870
HD6950 = +10% from 5870

DX-11 Tessellation ????

[bamtan2]

HD 6970

http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1037/57330977.jpg

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/2003/33206684.jpg

http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/7273/22433506.jpg

mama

[Dimitriman]

My expectation

DX-9/10

HD6970 = +25% from 5870
HD6950 = +10% from 5870

DX-11 Tessellation ????

wow so you expect a complete and utter failure of 6970 then...
25% over 5870 barely beats a 480 do you really think AMD would go through all that trouble to release such a wimpy card or are you just hoping it will be slower than 580 cause that one is only 10 to 15 % faster than the 480 as leaks have been showing?

[Jowy Atreides]

My expectation

DX-9/10

HD6970 = +25% from 5870
HD6950 = +10% from 5870

DX-11 Tessellation ????

Average:

HD6970 = +80% from 5870
HD6950 = +65% from 5870

[Rai]

Average:

HD6970 = +80% from 5870
HD6950 = +65% from 5870

I really hope those numbers are accurate.

[Pantsu]

Evergreen pulled about 60% extra performance, and that is what Cayman would have to do if a 6950 were to stand against a GTX 580. While I suppose it's possible with increasing the die size and efficiency of the architecture I don't think it's going to end up that powerful. My guess would be that Cayman is only slightly larger, and if it can keep the efficiency gained in Barts it might end up something like 40% faster, which is still enough for a 6970 to beat a GTX 580.

[Jowy Atreides]

I really hope those numbers are accurate.

From 1120 5d in barts to 1920 4d vliw tweaked in cayman alone is a 71% increase.
Factor in the ipc improvement, the much larger framebuffer, the new offload tesselation engine and you have a very feasible 80% bump in speed.

Edit: Don't forget the clockspeed being 860Mhz compared to the 725Mhz of Barts xt.

Think about the logical evidence of the architectural changes shown above and you'll most likely conclude like myself, that the 580 is NOT going to be serious competition.

[Dimitriman]

I believe 6950 will slightly beat gx 480 by 5% and cost 300 - 350$. 6970 i would say 20-25% faster than 480 @ 400 - 450$.
thats my guess.

[Aten-Ra]

If cayman has 1920 Shaders then I don’t see how it will have more than 20-30% performance than HD5870.
The 4D architecture will only enable them to keep the die size smaller than 400mm2 but shaders are shaders and 1920 is only 20% more than 1600 that HD5870 has.

[Dimitriman]

From 1120 5d in barts to 1920 4d vliw tweaked in cayman alone is a 71% increase.
Factor in the ipc improvement, the much larger framebuffer, the new offload tesselation engine and you have a very feasible 80% bump in speed.

Edit: Don't forget the clockspeed being 860Mhz compared to the 725Mhz of Barts xt.

Think about the logical evidence of the architectural changes shown above and you'll most likely conclude like myself, that the 580 is NOT going to be serious competition.

nah barts xt is 900mhz barts pro is 785 i think.

[Mechanical Man]

If cayman has 1920 Shaders then I don’t see how it will have more than 20-30% performance than HD5870.
The 4D architecture will only enable them to keep the die size smaller than 400mm2 buts shaders are shader and 1920 is only 20% more than 1600 that HD5870 has.

There you go wrong, 5D is rarely utilised fully, its easier to utilize 4D fully. So, that will bring lot of improvement.

1600/5 = 320 and 1920/4 = 480, thats 50% increase alone. Now say that Cayman SP is little underpowered compared to 5D SP of evergreen. So say there alon 40% improvement. Ofc it will eat more power if there is no improvements on that side too. Put in there tesselation improvement that will be >150% compared to evergreen. Maybe not 80% more power, but 50-60% more is very realistic approximation.