120-240mm AIO/sealed, low cost, WC systems

[Aedubber]

^^^ Just what he said , you pay cheap and you get cheap and thats reality regardless. If you want low budget invest into good AIR setup. You can find GOOD used parts here in the forums that will perform better then these pre-built kits if you need to save money. Im moving onto my 3rd watercooled build and it hasnt even been 1 year lol and i have learned so much from people on the forums.. PLEASEE listen to the comments even tho they may seem harsh , i learned the hard way at start but now im the man!! LOL

[scook9]

I agree with the people recommending a custom loop in favor of a prebuilt. I originally got into water by purchasing an H50 for my desktop. As soon as I realized the other places I could put radiators in my case I returned the H50 and built my loop. Granted it ended up costing about $600 when I had originally planned on $250 to $300, but I have not felt bad about it one bit because I know I am going to get incredible mileage out of this loop and that it cools my system MUCH better.

All that being said though, I still have an Asetek 240mm LCLC in my HTPC and it works there just fine. I knew it would not work as well as a custom loop and never expected it too, it was purely a space consideration there as I could not fit a big air cooler. I also just saw the H70 for the first time and must say, it is indeed impressive.

[meanmoe]

You can find GOOD used parts here in the forums that will perform better then these pre-built kits if you need to save money. Im moving onto my 3rd watercooled build and it hasnt even been 1 year lol and i have learned so much from people on the forums.. PLEASEE listen to the comments even tho they may seem harsh , i learned the hard way at start but now im the man!! LOL

For the GOOD cheap part, just watch for when Aedubber rebuilds... I missed a hell of a buy on two pumps the other day...

*cough*upgrade*cough*again*cough*please*cough*

[jalyst]

Thanks guys for your thoughts, it is appreciated. As mentioned earlier in this thread...
I'm well aware of the advantages of custom loops and have in-fact experimented with them a lot in the past (admittedly that period was at least 5yr ago now)
However I'm not looking for optimal water cooling, but equal to or better than top-end air at similar pricing, & with less intrusion into the internal workspace.
Remember this if for a HTPC build....
For anyone who's actually used more than one of these newer AIO/sealed set-ups, I'd love to hear which you prefer!
Thanks again!

[Aedubber]

Lol thanks meanmoe

[Church]

Similar pricing to air? Forget about it. Except few lucky deals with getting good&cheap used LC parts set that would be just exception to rule, LC at that price range will perform same or worse then air. See Corsair H50/H70 for example - at similar pricing (or even little bit higher then top air coolers) you get cooler that cools a bit less then those top air coolers. Imho it makes sense to start LCing at price of 250$ for cpu-only loop. Only then you get those better and quieter cooling .. below - only those exceptionary good deals on used part set or same (or worse) performance then air with liquid cooling being only in name not in shown performance.

[jalyst]

From reviews/data I've seen....
A H70 with the right fan/shroud combo is just as good or even slightly better than the best air coolers with the same fan/shroud set-up.
Only just (and it fluctuates depending on cpu/vcore/oc), but it's usually constant if one's not an OCr or running at heavy load all the time.
And that's just the H70, which I'm less interested in...

[Biffa]

I've had the same experience with the H50 and overclocked i7-920, thermal cutout kicked, the cpu hit 100°C and the radiator wasn't even getting hot. I suspect a manufacturing fault or incompatability with the mobo (vanilla P6T) and yes I tried reseating it about 5 times, with new paste, two fans, different power connectors, you name it. It was fine at stock speeds.

Slapped some old w/c parts I had lying around (10/8mm compressions/tubing/RS240/etc), bought a new pump and whammo, 4.0 Ghz at expected temps running f@h 24/7 with no problems at all.

Now I have a H50 boxed and not sure if Corsair will RMA yet

[jalyst]

Any experience with the 240mm sealed/AIO's I mentioned? Thank-you.

[Church]

One should forget about H50/H70 as means to get better cooling then top air coolers like Noctua DH14/Cogage Silver Arrow. That doesn't mean it's worthless product - for example it has it's use in smaller&cramped cases where placing full size top air cooler is out of question. Also it's rad can be placed somewhere else where it can be cooled with cooler outside case. But let me repeat - don't expect miracle cooling from such systems just because those are LC. Their rad simply is too small to give substantially better cooling/quieter fans for same cooling as those top air coolers. Cooling would be better if there was bigger rad (like in those self assembled LC builds from components), but you'd loose ease of mounting / small size alongside, loosing it's mounting flexibility .. and then you'd be better off assembling yourself LC build from top components since the beginning anyway.

[Aedubber]

I don't understand here , there are people that have had these setups you are interested in saying not to get it but yet you still keep wondering ???!! Honestly now your just being stubborn , just go by the cheap set and then go do your own review . If users are telling you to stay away and your not listening then I dunno what else can help you . This thread will become worthless soon as most people have built their own loops etc .

[Philwong]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mq2UV...ayer_embedded#

Errr.. I'm sure even the original Apogee can beat the Eco hands down! Running one now cooling an Athlon X4 very nicely.

Phil

[jalyst]

I don't understand here , there are people that have had these setups you are interested in saying not to get it but yet you still keep wondering ???!! Honestly now your just being stubborn , just go by the cheap set and then go do your own review . If users are telling you to stay away and your not listening then I dunno what else can help you . This thread will become worthless soon as most people have built their own loops etc .

Hi, thanks for adding your thoughts again.
Who are these people you speak of that have used the Eco C240 or Asetek 550/570LC?
I'd like to get some perspective on how it's played out for their intended use.

As explained I'm not looking for a set-up that will enable hard-core OC's or extra cool temps on high loads.
So long as it compares fairly well to the best air, I'm happy

Thanks again!

[jalyst]

One should forget about H50/H70 as means to get better cooling then top air coolers like Noctua DH14/Cogage Silver Arrow. That doesn't mean it's worthless product - for example it has it's use in smaller&cramped cases where placing full size top air cooler is out of question. Also it's rad can be placed somewhere else where it can be cooled with cooler outside case. But let me repeat - don't expect miracle cooling from such systems just because those are LC. Their rad simply is too small to give substantially better cooling/quieter fans for same cooling as those top air coolers. Cooling would be better if there was bigger rad (like in those self assembled LC builds from components), but you'd loose ease of mounting / small size alongside, loosing it's mounting flexibility .. and then you'd be better off assembling yourself LC build from top components since the beginning anyway.

Oh yeah,
I totally realise they're not comparable to custom loops for a range of factors, not just limited to rad.
The reasons you mention are predominantly why I'm interested in them.

Thanks!

[Philwong]

So what exactly are you trying to find out here?

H50 vs. Eco?

Or 120mm vs 240mm pre assembled kit?

More importantly, what chip are you trying to cool in your HTPC?

Phil

[Aedubber]

Well if your not trying to cool better then AIR, why dont you just stay with air? You can find some good fans that run very silently and push a good amount of air and use some really good thermal paste for your parts as well.

[jalyst]

So what exactly are you trying to find out here?

H50 vs. Eco?

Or 120mm vs 240mm pre assembled kit?

More importantly, what chip are you trying to cool in your HTPC?

Phil

Thanks Phil, best line of questioning yet, my original question...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...6&postcount=73
We're only talking about a Core i3-530, although I may eventually upgrade to an i5.
There will be the occasional serious OC, but for the most part I will be @stock or underclocked.

[jalyst]

Well if your not trying to cool better then AIR, why dont you just stay with air? You can find some good fans that run very silently and push a good amount of air and use some really good thermal paste for your parts as well.

I have space constraints, I intend to mod my case and mount the rad externally or at least partially.

[Philwong]

There will be the occasional serious OC, but for the most part I will be @stock or underclocked.

It doesn't matter if you push your system to its limit just once because these pre assembled kits will fail miserably. That's the bottom line everyone is trying to convince you.

I personally tried Thermaltake's Big Water (time to take cover from Waterlogged) and it is "honestly decent" in my humble opinion. But then, my priority back then was a relatively quiet system more than sheer cooling power.

You need to get your requirements right and if you're just looking for a WC solution to match high-end air cooling, a H50 should serve you pretty well.

Phil

[jalyst]

It doesn't matter if you push your system to its limit just once because these pre assembled kits will fail miserably. That's the bottom line everyone is trying to convince you.

I personally tried Thermaltake's Big Water (time to take cover from Waterlogged) and it is "honestly decent" in my humble opinion. But then, my priority back then was a relatively quiet system more than sheer cooling power.

You need to get your requirements right and if you're just looking for a WC solution to match high-end air cooling, a H50 should serve you pretty well.

Phil

Thanks Phil, my main priority is stock or UC...
Any idea how the other systems I've mentioned compare to the H50?*
Any solid basis for comparison you can reference?

Thanks again!

*From what I've read the H70 is a fairly minuscule improvement over the h50...
But it improves areas not directly related to performance + brings a few probs of it's own.

[Philwong]

Thanks Phil, my main priority is stock or UC...
Any idea how the other systems I've mentioned compare to the H50?
(from what I've read the h70 is fairly negligible improvement over the h50, but improves other areas not directly related to performance)
Any solid basis for comparison you can reference?

Thanks again!

You seriously don't need anything more than a H50 or Eco to cool an i3 at stock speed and voltage. Likewise for a stock i5.

Someone even managed to cool a 4GHz i7 with a H50, albeit at 91c.

http://forums.vr-zone.com/project-lo...ml#post7989105

Phil

[jalyst]

You seriously don't need anything more than a H50 or Eco to cool an i3 at stock speed and voltage. Likewise for a stock i5.l

I know that, but I'm interested in what improvement I could get with the other AIO's...
That headroom may come in handy for the times I wish to dabble with a little light OC'ing.
I gather you don't know much about them?

Someone even managed to cool a 4GHz i7 with a H50, albeit at 91c.

http://forums.vr-zone.com/project-lo...ml#post7989105

Yikes!

[Aedubber]

First u say stock or underclocked then serious then a little OC? Lol make up you mind already, if you wanna see this and that just buy the unit rather then asking people over and over the same thing. Either u watercool the right way or you don't .. :/

[meanmoe]

I could see using an h70 for stock/UC and silent. Other than that though, and your on your own...

[jalyst]

I could see using an h70 for stock/UC and silent. Other than that though, and your on your own...

Okay so no idea how the other three items compare...
Fair enough, I'll endeavour to find out elsewhere, thanks!