Who said PhysX was limited to looks.Acceleration of the calculation of my suspension has nothing to do with looks or are you being funny.Force feedback relies on data sent from the game to simulate the feel of the road,the data will be calculated by the ppu and sent to the steering wheel to simulate data given.
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-20-2010 at 02:54 AM.
If you have more fun thinking PhysX works to alter game play then why care what other thinks? Why does one side works hard to put it down whilst the other tries to justify its existence? This is like Killer NIC all over again...
Originally Posted by creidiki
They have no proof of argument just talk,I'm stating what has been shown to be possible with the Api can change the way the game feels.We will see this in one form or another might not be with this API.They are acting like its not possible to change game play with this api but claim a mod can change game play.THEY ALSO SAID THE WORLD WAS FLAT
The owner of the api doesn't matter its what it can do that matters.You want to kill it before it really gets utilized.
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-20-2010 at 03:11 AM.
Tyre/brakes temperature altering the car behaviour has been around since the first Grand Prix game from the mid 90's, iirc. It's nothing new, very far from it. If you consider some other calculations like non-suspended mass and tyre modelling (the holy grail of race sim; there are books written about this subject!), tyre, brake and track temperatures are one of "simplest" things going on.
I'm a veteran race simmer and I know gMotor 1 and 2 engines from inside out. I can asure you that PhysX does nothing to change the game physics in Shift because it's impossible, really.
You don't have to believe in me but I ask you to go to some race-sim forums and ask some gMotor gurus/modders/developers and they'll tell you exactly what I'm trying to explain.
Sure, PhysX support for actual car/suspension/tyre behaviour and track dynamics is very much possible, all I'm saying it's not possible for that in gMotor2, the engine powering Shift.
Edit/PS: I have nothing against PhysX and if it's possible for it to improve race sims, I'm all for it. After all, the only thing that comes to a real simmer when drinving on a virtual track is physics, physics, physics and to hell with everything else.
Last edited by Caparroz; 05-20-2010 at 02:11 PM.
Murray Walker: "And there are flames coming from the back of Prost's McLaren as he enters the Swimming Pool."
James Hunt: "Well, that should put them out then."
I'm a veteran race simmer and I know gMotor 1 and 2 engines from inside out. I can asure you that PhysX does nothing to change the game physics in Shift because it's impossible, really.
Sure, PhysX support for actual car/suspension/tyre behaviour and track dynamics is very much possible, all I'm saying it's not possible for that in gMotor2, the engine powering Shift.
Physics @ 100% accuracy is what I want when racing.No need for a mod if its accurate,If the engine has been modded to use PhysX then there is more potential in shift than gtr2 @ least to me.
I would like to race you in gtr2 or something else if you like.I have nothing against PhysX and if it's possible for it to improve race sims, I'm all for it. After all, the only thing that comes to a real simmer when drinving on a virtual track is physics, physics, physics and to hell with everything else.
Physics in Shift is 100% gMotor2. That's why all the physics mods available for Shift comes directly from parameters found in GTR2 and rFactor, iirc.Physics @ 100% accuracy is what I want when racing.No need for a mod if its accurate,If the engine has been modded to use PhysX then there is more potential in shift than gtr2 @ least to me.
I would like to race you in gtr2 or something else if you like.
I wish that would be different, but a 100% accurate game or mod is impossible.
I don't race in GTR2 anymore. iRacing is all I have time for now. You should try it. It's miles ahead anything else on the market today.
Murray Walker: "And there are flames coming from the back of Prost's McLaren as he enters the Swimming Pool."
James Hunt: "Well, that should put them out then."
Car list is limited.
This might be nice though
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-20-2010 at 03:51 PM.
Same guy who felt the difference with a 'gaming' NIC feels the difference with PhysX driving.
Just saying.
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If you never used it how can you say anything about the product.Can we just talk about what physx can offer a sim racer and not this eye candy talk.
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-20-2010 at 03:58 PM.
Sure we can.
If properly designed for it, a sim racer could see huge benefits with a PPU.
Unfortunately, this is not such a game.
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Quote from YodaStar @ nogripracing.com
quote from East @ nogripracing.com @ same thread"Live HDVehicle trace enable" traces car handling or such and outputs it to a log file in the game folder.
The "<prop name="Disable PhysX switching" type="Bool" />" is just the ID for the engine to understand the command. It just defines the type of value boolean, float etc.
For the "<prop name="Disable PhysX switching" data="true" />" you could check for perfomance impact when colliding with cars or track objects. Disable vsync, set graphic settings to low aswell as resolution and check framerate with for example FRAPs.
Looks like I spoke to soon. Changing it to false I do notice a slight increase in overall frame rates. I went back and forth a few times and it's noticeable to me. I don't see any difference in IQ. Can someone else try it?
Can anyone else say "placebo effect"?
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Quote from Jonpo1 @ nogripracing.com
Testing is the only way to see and testing is what we are doing not just talking about it,this is not aimed @ anyone.I decided to create a hybrid physX setup on my machine using my old 9800GT card as a PhysX hardware accelerator. Yes, I know that NFS Shift is reported as using the CPU for PhysX, but my testing results say otherwise, at least if you are running a Radeon card with an Nvidia card just for PhysX.
Anyway, after noticing a subjective improvement in the frame rate tanking whenever any of the visual physics effects came into play, I decided to check with FRAPS, just in case this was a placebo effect.
Well, according to FRAPS, it wasn't - the game was actually running better.
In a test I did at London, for example, I took the frame rate with vsync off when I was in thepit at the back of the grid awaiting the race start. All the game settings were at medium, except for textures which were high. Antialiasing and anisotropic filtering were both set to 8x (box mode for antialiasing). The race was setup with 5 opponents and I of course was at the back of the grid. I also measured the lowest frame rate during the one lap race.
So here are the results:
Radeon 5870 only:
FPS at back of grid awaiting start: 91
Lowest FPS recorded: 28
Radeon 5870 plus 9800GT for PhysX processing:
FPS at back of grid awaiting start: 104
Lowest FPS recorded: 38
I repeated these tests about 10 times and the results were consistent - the above are averages, though there was little variation between averages.
Gee, sounds like PERFORMANCE enhancements to me, which no one here is doubting.
I can't believe I'm even "arguing" about this.
FPS didn't change but the driving is totally different.Tire's and damage are accelerated w/ the AGEIA ppu.EDIT a bit off topic,I feel the tire grip as if they were connected to me,when cornering this is crucial.
but this is all saying I can pop in my 8800gt to use as a PPU, even though my primary adapter is ATI?
Does it heat up the GPU much? Everything else is liquid cooled, I'd hate to buy another block, but stocker on low fan would be fine if it could keep up...
Last edited by AndrewZorn; 05-20-2010 at 07:15 PM.
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Majestouch 87 Blue -- Choc Mini Brown -- Poker Red -- MX11900 -- G9
@ first everyone was saying its cpu only now we can say that's not true and also find out what else is happening,I'm not arguing I'm talking about hardware accelerated physics and the effect it can have on sim racing.
Exactly: it can affect the graphics, FPS, and little stuff, which no one here doubts (yes, thank you for the news, it doesn't sound well known). But no, adding a PPU is not going to change the "feel" of the tires, make the [non-visual] engine damage more realistic, etc... all that is just absurd.I'm talking about hardware accelerated physics and the effect it can have on sim racing.
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Majestouch 87 Blue -- Choc Mini Brown -- Poker Red -- MX11900 -- G9
But it can we haven't tried yet.It seems to me you would not use gpu @ 100% all of the race so heat should not be a problem but that is single slot so I'm not sure sorry.
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-20-2010 at 07:36 PM.
I think we all agree that PhysX CAN change the driving physics, but only IF the game engine is designed to and allows it. Caparroz seems to be a veteran when it comes to the gMotor2 game engine, and he noted that PhysX cannot modified the game engine.
Yes, collision dmg, debris, etc, can/may be accelerated with PhysX in the game, but improving/making the game engine (ie driving physics) is impossible in Shift.
Some quick searching also turn up this thread:
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?s...dpost&p=938354
Need for Speed Shift is also using PhysX. But it only uses it on the CPU
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Have you played GRID or Dirt 2? I used to share your sentiment not finding any good PC racing games since NFS Porsche until I discovered the Codemasters games.
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@ thephenom I quoted some people @ nogripracing.com that say they have activated hardware acceleration.
Wizzard can you include this in your PhysX benchmarks.
*reads thread*
PS: Seriously though. If PhysX were actually DOING something here that even comes close to what you are saying.
NVIDIA WOULD BE ALL OVER IT.
Nvidia does not control what the devs do,The api is there but the instruction calls for what we want might not be.Writing instructions to call for what we want will not be like making the game.
I'm not sure why this is in the news section. From the previous examination of this before and after the update clearly show no GPU physx "enhancments" for the game.*reads thread*
PS: Seriously though. If PhysX were actually DOING something here that even comes close to what you are saying.
NVIDIA WOULD BE ALL OVER IT.
Last edited by Eastcoasthandle; 05-21-2010 at 10:35 AM.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Did you see the first post buddy there's no denying what that chart says hardware DMA is being used and the ppu lights up.Stop talking a show real proof as I did.
Last edited by Hell Hound; 05-21-2010 at 10:47 AM.
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