Nvidia misses GTX470/480 launch targets

[STEvil]

grey screen ati issue is mostly due to clock/voltage profiles I think.

i dont see 480's being percentage overclockable equal to 5870's? But honestly I havent watched too closely just yet, my 4870x2 is keeping me happy lately.

[Heinz68]

Can i just say something; EAT THAT ATI FANBOY !!!!!!!. Yeah i know , i have my ticket for the hell bus.

Is there really a need for such flaming post after GoldenTiger mini review. Like his selective review proves anything.
There are at least 100 hundred complete reviews showing that the HD 5870 is faster than GTX 470, I guess we should ignore all the reviews because some NVIDIA enthusiast give us better and more accurate review.

Nice results tiger. Have to keep telling myself that it's a 470. Seems like these cards may just take time to shine, just as ATI's 4870 did.

The HD 4870/50 did shine from day one, no paper launch and great price. If it wasn't the case NVIDIA didn't have to reduce the price for the GTX 260/280 big time. Remember the HD 4870 $299 , GTX 280 $650.

Anyway congrats to everybody who got the GTX 470/480 it is nice upgrade for some and no wonder you're so happy after such long wait.

I'm glad that I didn't wait. All the prediction from NVIDIA shills about the GTX 480 going to be 60% or more faster than the HD 5870 didn't come true, same goes about prediction that ATI will have to reduce the price after NVIDIA launch.
So I'm glad I got my HD 5970 in November last year, and it is still the fastest gaming graphic card on the market.

Basically I'm glad I did listen to Charlie some of you like to call an idiot, his semi accurate rumors proved to be more accurate than the info provided by the friendly NVIDIA sites.

[eric66]

Except the ATI card was either using ancient drivers, or was an OC vs. non-OC comparison still not using the latest drivers which brought a big performance boost to one of the games (even with that OC--basically not quite a GTX 480--a stock 5870 wins in BC2 when using 10.3)

I wasn't going to say anything, but your post changed my mind :P

bf results are bs at least ati is superior in that game there is no way even with oc 470 can make that much difference though it can be drivers like you said its flawed comparison to say at least but its nice to see 470 reach 480 clock level nice card

[tajoh111]

Is there really a need for such flaming post after GoldenTiger mini review. Like his selective review proves anything.
There are at least 100 hundred complete reviews showing that the HD 5870 is faster than GTX 470, I guess we should ignore all the reviews because some NVIDIA enthusiast give us better and more accurate review.


The HD 4870/50 did shine from day one, no paper launch and great price. If it wasn't the case NVIDIA didn't have to reduce the price for the GTX 260/280 big time. Remember the HD 4870 $299 , GTX 280 $650.

Anyway congrats to everybody who got the GTX 470/480 it is nice upgrade for some and no wonder you're so happy after such long wait.

I'm glad that I didn't wait. All the prediction from NVIDIA shills about the GTX 480 going to be 60% or more faster than the HD 5870 didn't come true, same goes about prediction that ATI will have to reduce the price after NVIDIA launch.
So I'm glad I got my HD 5970 in November last year, and it is still the fastest gaming graphic card on the market.

Basically I'm glad I did listen to Charlie some of you like to call an idiot, his semi accurate rumors proved to be more accurate than the info provided by the friendly NVIDIA sites.

I don't think anyone was predicting a 60 percent performance difference or more compared to the 5870. I don't anyone was really shilling for the performance of the gtx 480 as almost no information was known about its performance.

The most I ever heard was gtx 280 or gtx 285 SLI performance which in some instances it does match.

[snoro]

Is there really a need for such flaming post after GoldenTiger mini review. Like his selective review proves anything.
There are at least 100 hundred complete reviews showing that the HD 5870 is faster than GTX 470, I guess we should ignore all the reviews because some NVIDIA enthusiast give us better and more accurate review.

Sorry if you found me a bit irritating but i am just tired of people saying Fermi is a epic fail while from what i have seen even in the review( made with rushed review sample) the gtx 470 and 480 did beat their ati sibling. And now with result we are seeing from normal people who are lucky to already got a retail one and generously take time to do some benchmarks to show us what kind of performance they get. And that performance is better than ati counterparts. Or maybe i just see some Ati fanboy who cant accept that they made a bad choice buying a hd5870 today while the gtx480 is a better choice and flame Nvidia.Now for people who bought their 5870 and 5850 or are still still on older high end gpu like you you made a good choice and I would also have bought a 5870 at launch with its 399$ launch price if i had the money but not now. Not with its 430$ normal price and seeing the gtx480 is a much better card for 70$ more buck.And all this is comming from a guy with a hd5770 in his rig and is very happy about his purchase.

Except the ATI card was either using ancient drivers, or was an OC vs. non-OC comparison still not using the latest drivers which brought a big performance boost to one of the games (even with that OC--basically not quite a GTX 480--a stock 5870 wins in BC2 when using 10.3)

As other said please reread goldentiger post, this is not a overclocked gtx480 beating a hd5870 but GTX470 overclocked beating a hd5870 alot in min fps and a bit in avg fps.

[kazuyakun]

Sorry if you found me a bit irritating but i am just tired of people saying Fermi is a epic fail while from what i have seen even in the review( made with rushed review sample) the gtx 470 and 480 did beat their ati sibling. And now with result we are seeing from normal people who are lucky to already got a retail one and generously take time to do some benchmarks to show us what kind of performance they get. And that performance is better than ati counterparts. Or maybe i just see some Ati fanboy who cant accept that they made a bad choice buying a hd5870 today while the gtx480 is a better choice and flame Nvidia.Now for people who bought their 5870 and 5850 or are still still on older high end gpu like you you made a good choice and I would also have bought a 5870 at launch with its 399$ launch price if i had the money but not now. Not with its 430$ normal price and seeing the gtx480 is a much better card for 70$ more buck.And all this is comming from a guy with a hd5770 in his rig and is very happy about his purchase.

As other said please reread goldentiger post, this is not a overclocked gtx480 beating a hd5870 but GTX470 overclocked beating a hd5870 alot in min fps and a bit in avg fps.

Purchasing the 5870 isn't a bad choice at all, given their price points and the fact that 4xx series use so much power and have poor idle would make all the difference someone needs to choose ATI over NVIDIA. Also, you may have noticed that there are very few stores, that have the 4xx in stock.

Also, how can you use one overclocked card vs a stock card justifying in anything. From what I've seen, 58xx have a lot more overclocking headroom than the 4xx.

[tifosi]

As other said please reread goldentiger post, this is not a overclocked gtx480 beating a hd5870 but GTX470 overclocked beating a hd5870 alot in min fps and a bit in avg fps.

No need to call each other names (fanboy/ girl)... As far as i see, ATI products (5850 and 5870) are available by and large everywhere and for less. ATI products do run cooler. ATI products feature bit-streaming 7.1 24-bit audio via hdmi, which Nvidia's products don't. Yes, Nvidia's products feature more v-ram, hence they are good at low and avg. frame rates. Yes, Nvidia's products feature physx. Then again, it is not just the cost of buying a GTX 470/ 480, but also the cost of running one. The power draw of 470 is still within reason, but many reviews have put the power-draw of a single 480 at more than 300... I'm sure i'll not be the only one here who believes them to be true with their figures! It is the users choice to make, to buy which suits his needs more.

However, oc'ing one card versus another at stock is a questionable move at best. I'm sure if you oc 5870 enough and perhaps try benchmarking at 1920x1080/1200 resolution (just as questionable), you'll be hard-pressed to think of reasons why to buy a GTX 480 after all, which costs about $70-100 more...

Here's Jensen seconding that the supply is less than ideal... Think it's been posted before but what the hell...

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/fer...480,10159.html

[iTravis]

The fact that GoldenTiger tested with an OC GTX 470 vs a stock HD5870 with old driver isn't that fair IMO, yet some conclude "OMG, the GTX 470 even beats the HD5870" is even more absurd LOL. According to all the reviews, we all know that the GTX 470 manages to match or outperform the HD5870 in some games but it doesn't mean it totally beats the HD5870 like the GTX 480. I would rather wait for another review from other users with a deeper look at those 2 cards.

[GoldenTiger]

I only read the last page just now, but the BFBC2 results were with ATI's 10.2 drivers. I was shocked too at the minimums being so much better, but it just isn't dipping down during firefights . I'll read through the thread later when I have more time and answer other questions. As far as OC'ing vs. stock, my Asus 5870 wouldn't run stable/artifact-free for extended gaming sessions at anything but stock... so that's the data I have/had from before. The GTX 470 I have is running stable for hour+ gaming sessions at this overclock, so that's what I'm comparing with: what I can actually run them at. It's *not* meant to be a comprehensive, rigorous review, just a quick impressions post... take it as you want. Some sites did achieve similar results though not as good, that I've seen... I'm chalking it up to the new drivers possibly.

[damha]

I only read the last page just now, but the BFBC2 results were with ATI's 10.2 drivers. I was shocked too at the minimums being so much better, but it just isn't dipping down during firefights . I'll read through the thread later when I have more time and answer other questions. As far as OC'ing vs. stock, my Asus 5870 wouldn't run stable/artifact-free for extended gaming sessions at anything but stock... so that's the data I have/had from before. The GTX 470 I have is running stable for hour+ gaming sessions at this overclock, so that's what I'm comparing with: what I can actually run them at. It's *not* meant to be a comprehensive, rigorous review, just a quick impressions post... take it as you want. Some sites did achieve similar results though not as good, that I've seen... I'm chalking it up to the new drivers possibly.

There is a reason I enjoyed the xbitlabs review, they included all kinds of data. Your data isn't particularly reliable for the fact that you did not minimize the variables, therefore your review is meaningless. No offense, just an observation

For example, what were your CCC settings vs your nv panel settings? AI/Texture Quality/AA/AF/Adapative AA etc. Did you run a quick CPU bench before testing to make sure your running a level playing field? Was it a clean build now or before, or never?

I have more questions, but since you don't have that 5870 I'll wait for another member's review Also you made comments about the fan, the cooler on the GTX470 isn't the beast on the 480. 470 runs much cooler afaik.

[ElSel10]

The fact that GoldenTiger tested with an OC GTX 470 vs a stock HD5870 with old driver isn't that fair IMO, yet some conclude "OMG, the GTX 470 even beats the HD5870" is even more absurd LOL. According to all the reviews, we all know that the GTX 470 manages to match or outperform the HD5870 in some games but it doesn't mean it totally beats the HD5870 like the GTX 480. I would rather wait for another review from other users with a deeper look at those 2 cards.

What drivers did he use for ATI? Because on TPU it was found that going from 9.12 to 10.3 only had an average boost of 2%.

[Eastcoasthandle]

There is a reason I enjoyed the xbitlabs review, they included all kinds of data. Your data isn't particularly reliable for the fact that you did not minimize the variables, therefore your review is meaningless. No offense, just an observation

For example, what were your CCC settings vs your nv panel settings? AI/Texture Quality/AA/AF/Adapative AA etc. Did you run a quick CPU bench before testing to make sure your running a level playing field? Was it a clean build now or before, or never?

I have more questions, but since you don't have that 5870 I'll wait for another member's review Also you made comments about the fan, the cooler on the GTX470 isn't the beast on the 480. 470 runs much cooler afaik.

Good Obersvation

What drivers did he use for ATI? Because on TPU it was found that going from 9.12 to 10.3 only had an average boost of 2%.

This is meaningless, you forget that reviewers used 10.3a. From my experience 10.3a yielded a better experience from 10.3.

[Mungri]

UK availability has been pushed back to the 16th. Still none available.

It looks like there were fewer than 200 available worldwide on the 12th, so Charlie was indeed wrong.

[saaya]

Sayaa the only way to get one right now it to pre-order it and pay in advance using credit card and be approved prior to shipping.

Regards

oh... and how long do you have to wait to get it?
a week? what if the shop cant get more cards in for a month or more? then your screwed?

i think the 480s will oc even higher thn 5870s percentage wise as soon as voltage control works... it still doesnt, right? and shaders are still locked to core clocks, which are holding the cards back i think... shaders have always been able to clock higher than corex2 in the past...

again, ive said it before... if you ask me, neither the 480 nor the 5870 are worth their money and the power they consume...
a 5850 is more than enough, and so is a 470...

[Mungri]

The fact that GoldenTiger tested with an OC GTX 470 vs a stock HD5870 with old driver isn't that fair IMO, yet some conclude "OMG, the GTX 470 even beats the HD5870" is even more absurd LOL. According to all the reviews, we all know that the GTX 470 manages to match or outperform the HD5870 in some games but it doesn't mean it totally beats the HD5870 like the GTX 480. I would rather wait for another review from other users with a deeper look at those 2 cards.

This says enough about Nvidia's fan mentality. The 10.3 catalyst drivers bought significant performance boosts across many games, and out of both the 5800 and GTX 400 range the 5800s are the better overclockers (1500 Mhz on LN2, around 1050 Mhz possible on air, 1100 Mhz+ on water), yet all of these things are ignored while the Nvidia card is overclocked, and all of a sudden the GTX 470 is somehow better than a 5870.

Then the same people run around calling anyone that doesnt praise or admire the fermi an ATI fanboy.

As it currently stands, Charlie also overestimated the number of these cards that would be available on the 12th, seriously I cant believe that 8000 of them have actually been available to buy in the last 4 days.

[eric66]

oh... and how long do you have to wait to get it?
a week? what if the shop cant get more cards in for a month or more? then your screwed?

i think the 480s will oc even higher thn 5870s percentage wise as soon as voltage control works... it still doesnt, right? and shaders are still locked to core clocks, which are holding the cards back i think... shaders have always been able to clock higher than corex2 in the past...

again, ive said it before... if you ask me, neither the 480 nor the 5870 are worth their money and the power they consume...
a 5850 is more than enough, and so is a 470...

from now on nvidias new shaders are bound to gpu clock so there won't be separate clocking

[annihilat0r]

again, ive said it before... if you ask me, neither the 480 nor the 5870 are worth their money and the power they consume...
a 5850 is more than enough, and so is a 470...

that was what I had been saying all along, even a 5870 is overkill at anything but 2560+ resolution and 5970 definitely needed 3 Eyefinity monitors.

But I am playing Just Cause 2 and am seeing serious slowdowns on my rig. Also: Metro 2033 (which seems to be a terribly coded game, though).

All in all I think it looks like a GTX 480 might not be an overkill.

[Eastcoasthandle]

from now on nvidias new shaders are bound to gpu clock so there won't be separate clocking

Really? I don't recall that ever being mentioned before until now. Good info. So now starting with the 400 series you can no longer do that.

[tajoh111]

from now on nvidias new shaders are bound to gpu clock so there won't be separate clocking

I am not sure whether to be stunned or angry, its a move on nvidia part, but its even more move to seem to be happy about it. We should want any hardware to be as fast as possible regardless of who makes it.

Hey Giant Tiger, can you please bench with with the new drivers 198.45. There supposedly some gains up to 30 percent according to NV. The games are hawx, crysis warhead and left4 dead 2. If these cards get 15% with drivers, I might consider getting the gtx 480 in the future since they are kind of hard to find at the moment.

[ElSel10]

I am not sure whether to be stunned or angry, its a move on nvidia part, but its even more move to seem to be happy about it. We should want any hardware to be as fast as possible regardless of who makes it.

Hey Giant Tiger, can you please bench with with the new drivers 198.45. There supposedly some gains up to 30 percent according to NV. The games are hawx, crysis warhead and left4 dead 2. If these cards get 15% with drivers, I might consider getting the gtx 480 in the future since they are kind of hard to find at the moment.

I don't think those drivers support Fermi. Latest that support Fermi is 197.44 which also includes OpenGL 4.0 support. You can get them here:
http://developer.nvidia.com/object/opengl_driver.html

[Sn@ke:~]

oh... and how long do you have to wait to get it?
a week? what if the shop cant get more cards in for a month or more? then your screwed?

Well i don't know for te other, but i ordered it the 11 Apr and just got a confirm shiping tracking number around 48 hour later. I live in ottawa, canada and took canada post i should get it within 2 to 6 days.

mine is lfetime warranty

Regards

Edit

This is some bench against 5870 OC

http://www.nordichardware.com/en/com....html?start=12

And the 480gtx beats it at stock with no optimized driver and the result seen above is pretty much in line with this review. Idon't want to hear about the new 10.3 which as a glitch and that is one of their last driver update performance as the gtx 480 didn't got a single one yet.

[InCredible]

@ snake..u call that OC? a stock xfx oc of 25mhz? knowing these cards can do 1000+....

[Chumbucket843]

I am not sure whether to be stunned or angry, its a move on nvidia part, but its even more move to seem to be happy about it. We should want any hardware to be as fast as possible regardless of who makes it.

Hey Giant Tiger, can you please bench with with the new drivers 198.45. There supposedly some gains up to 30 percent according to NV. The games are hawx, crysis warhead and left4 dead 2. If these cards get 15% with drivers, I might consider getting the gtx 480 in the future since they are kind of hard to find at the moment.

it will probably be unlocked in a later driver. that happened before iirc.the clock domains are fully capable of running at any ratio of 2 or more. i dont think anyone here knows much about driver development but i would assume that they are trying to get higher priority tasks done first.

[iddqd]

grey screen ati issue is mostly due to clock/voltage profiles I think.

i dont see 480's being percentage overclockable equal to 5870's? But honestly I havent watched too closely just yet, my 4870x2 is keeping me happy lately.

just plain unstable GPUs. i just rma'd a 5870 that was only stable at 740mhz

[initialised]

All the working cards are with the press!

I was expecting to get one yesterday but this happened: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fx3NK...=channel]Fermi Unboxing[/url]