The GT300/Fermi Thread

[saaya]

Also, I think the RSX, when it was announced, looked like overwhelmingly fast. Obviously, the G80 came before PS3 was released and smoked it, though

afaik rsx is slower than a 7800gtx, and xenos is slower than its desktop equivalent as well, the xbox1 gpu was a geforce 3.5 and at that time gf4 was already out too i think... nintendo64 was based on a tnt2 when we had geforce2 cards already... i think the xbox1 was actually the closest to desktop perf, gpu wise...

I know this is old news, but wasn't the release going to be November if A0 turned out with high enough yields and clocks. Also that was the same story with late December with A1. The current February to March time line is based on good A2 silicon. I always thought that hoping A0 turned out perfect was a REALLY long shot, but there was at least a little bit of hope for A1, but it didn't materialize.

Thinking about it, I think my silicon revision numbers are off by one, they should all be one higher.

your right about dates for the revisions i think, but theres already a3 now, and there might even be a4...
and sorry, if your in this business for as long as nvidia is, and then claim a0 silicon will be close to perfect and you will launch it... then thats not misjudging your "luck" or running into a problem at tsmc, thats a blatant lie...

its like an experienced car mechanic telling you he can change all 4 tires on your car in 20seconds... thats not a "whoops, i thought it could be done" or "how odd, i could have sworn i managed to do this before"

[Cybercat]

nintendo64 was based on a tnt2 when we had geforce2 cards already...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_64

[saaya]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_64

wow, weird... why did i think n64 was based on tnt2?
ahhhh i remember, i read somewhere that nvidia wanted them to use one of their chips but nintendo decided against it....

was it 240FPS input and output? or just output? how did they connect it to a PC?

no idea, they didnt speak english at all, lol... and it was all in black curtains... no idea how it was hooked up...

One word: bandwidth...

For 3D it doesn't work with predicted frames, would need 240Hz input and I don't expect to see any interface capable delivering this anytime soon. ^^

dvi dl can do 1920x1200@120hz... so couldnt you just use 2 dvi-dl connectors? kinda split the screen in 2 parts and each handles one part and then run them both at 240hz?

[Iconyu]

wow, weird... why did i think n64 was based on tnt2?
ahhhh i remember, i read somewhere that nvidia wanted them to use one of their chips but nintendo decided against it....

Nope it was Sega that was considering nvidia for the Dreamcast, but back then nvidia were considering quads instead of triangles which Sega didn't like because it gave them so much merde on the Saturn, so they made prototypes with 3DFx and PowerVR chips.

Look up the NV1 and NV2.

The only time I've really seen a positive link between nintendo and nvidia has been over their new handheld, which may use some form of Tegra part.

[saaya]

The only time I've really seen a positive link between nintendo and nvidia has been over their new handheld, which may use some form of Tegra part.

weeeell and that might just be a rumor...
nvidia needs good pr atm, and all the sudden there are rumors and public announcements that they have "lots of design wins" but no names mentioned

[cowie]

weeeell and that might just be a rumor...
nvidia needs good pr atm, and all the sudden there are rumors and public announcements that they have "lots of design wins" but no names mentioned

funny as fast as they come from nv or the company itself charlie claims they dont.... without anyproof.
then people post up his bs and wow nv bashers have something to spam about

[waway625]

funny as fast as they come from nv or the company itself charlie claims they dont.... without anyproof.
then people post up his bs and wow nv bashers have something to spam about

ive been lurking for a while and have generally found the news section interesting to read..but the attitude here towards nvidia lately just makes me wonder if this has turned into an ATI clubhouse

[saaya]

funny as fast as they come from nv or the company itself charlie claims they dont....

he did?

AMD is doing it's job, nVidia being asleep helps them, though.

amd as in amd doing its job... idk man... are they? where is their monster ipc 8core bulldozer? where is their ultra low power x86 chip? all they did in the past 5 years was deliver a terrible quadcore and then bit by bit fix it... and oh wow, they patched together a 6core chip, and they finally go mcm, but so what?

amd as in ati has been very active...
i dont think nvidia is sleeping though, they are working hard... very hard... they just made some bad decisions...

when insulting people try to use proper grammar. not everyone spends their time reading patents, whitepapers and what not nor do they know the trouble the rsx would have to go through to reach xdr. you cant really make any design changes when sony asks you to make a chip so close to launch of a console so hopefully we can all agree that at best this chip is ok.

nobody said rsx is a bad chip and nvidia screwed it up... several people just said that its slower than its desktop counterparts...
and i dont think he meant to insult you... not at all...
he didnt mention you, nor did he insult you or anybody else... he posted his opinion.

hes right in critizicing you, and actually me and others as well, for not doing a quick google search before posting something. i could have sworn nintendo64 used an nvidia chip... but i should have checked

[sholvaco]

afaik rsx is slower than a 7800gtx, and xenos is slower than its desktop equivalent as well, the xbox1 gpu was a geforce 3.5 and at that time gf4 was already out too i think... nintendo64 was based on a tnt2 when we had geforce2 cards already... i think the xbox1 was actually the closest to desktop perf, gpu wise...

I'm not 100% sure about raw computational power but architecture wise Xenos was ahead of the desktop parts at the time of it's launch; at the very least it was the first to feature unified shader architecture.

N64 came out before the first 3dfx Voodoo (summer of 96) and consequently had zero to do with any PC parts. It ran a custom SGI solution developed by the very guys that later provided ATi with the R300 pimp glove. Although the IQ may have been worse due to the limited framebuffer (most games were 320x240, higher res came later via an expansion pack) it still ran circles around contemporary PC accelerators when it came to effects.

Basically until PlayStation 3 came out consoles (at launch) always had a technological advantage over desktop parts however brief it may have been. OTOH even the PS3 "fiasco" was mainly the result of a last minute solution; (the planned dual) cell went over the cost and under-delivered on the graphical performance. Being caught with their pants down Sony had no choice but to go to one of the major GPU houses and ask for the best available part that could have been jury rigged to interface with cell in a timely manner (and since ATi was already in employ of both of it's competitors) therefore a memory interface gimped 7800GTX.

Since consoles are being developed with a certain longevity to their life cycle in mind their hardware dev houses buy exclusivity in whatever they consider is going to be cutting edge at the time of their launch to provide some temporal buffer against competing platforms (including PCs, although the gap has been closing over the generations) and since they've positioned themselves as providers of high def/high fidelity entertainment I'm fairly certain both MS and Sony are carefully arranging their respective entrances into the next gen to up the ante (launching halfway through a GPU refresh cycle with next gen GPU parts, especially amidst all the delays brought on by the current economic conditions doesn't seem outside the realm of possibility).

[annihilat0r]

afaik rsx is slower than a 7800gtx, and xenos is slower than its desktop equivalent as well, the xbox1 gpu was a geforce 3.5 and at that time gf4 was already out too i think... nintendo64 was based on a tnt2 when we had geforce2 cards already... i think the xbox1 was actually the closest to desktop perf, gpu wise...

RSX is not only faster than 7800GTX, Xenos is even faster than RSX plus it was released a lot earlier. This means that the first time the next generation consoles arrive, their GPU technology will / has to be just as fast as their PC counterparts.

[fellix_bg]

RSX is not only faster than 7800GTX, ...

The PS3 RSX chip is essentially a 128-bit version of NV's G70 architecture, with half the ROP count and half the memory bus width. How is that faster than the original implementation?

[570091D]

The PS3 RSX chip is essentially a 128-bit version of NV's G70 architecture, with half the ROP count and half the memory bus width. How is that faster than the original implementation?

it uses rambus xdr ram, much MUCH more bandwidth than the original. from what i hear, the RSX chip is about 3 times faster than a 7800gtx. but are we really discussing weather a 7800gtx can play gta4 in the fermi thread?

[annihilat0r]

it uses rambus xdr ram, much MUCH more bandwidth than the original. from what i hear, the RSX chip is about 3 times faster than a 7800gtx. but are we really discussing weather a 7800gtx can play gta4 in the fermi thread?

AFAIK a 8800GTX is considerably faster than a RSX, which means that RSX can't be 3 times as fast as 7800GTX. From what I heard, RSX is about 2 times fast as an 6800 Ultra, which would make it faster than 7800GTX and probably 7900GTX.

[fellix_bg]

it uses rambus xdr ram, much MUCH more bandwidth than the original. from what i hear, the RSX chip is about 3 times faster than a 7800gtx.

I'm simply amazed by the level of ignorance in this matter here!

XDR memory is attached to the Cell processor, not the RSX -- it uses a set of dirt cheap GDDR3 chips.
The full spec's of the RSX are available, as well as those for G70/71, Xenos, or any other GPU architecture you can think of - go and read what's about and then do some reasonable conclusions. Geez...

[Chumbucket843]

I'm simply amazed by the level of ignorance in this matter here!

XDR memory is attached to the Cell processor, not the RSX -- it uses a set of dirt cheap GDDR3 chips.
The full spec's of the RSX are available, as well as those for G70/71, Xenos, or any other GPU architecture you can think of - go and read what's about and then do some reasonable conclusions. Geez...

when insulting people try to use proper grammar. not everyone spends their time reading patents, whitepapers and what not nor do they know the trouble the rsx would have to go through to reach xdr. you cant really make any design changes when sony asks you to make a chip so close to launch of a console so hopefully we can all agree that at best this chip is ok.

[Macadamia]

when insulting people try to use proper grammar. not everyone spends their time reading patents, whitepapers and what not nor do they know the trouble the rsx would have to go through to reach xdr. you cant really make any design changes when sony asks you to make a chip so close to launch of a console so hopefully we can all agree that at best this chip is ok.

Unbelievable.

Let's go back to the post again.

from what i hear, the RSX chip is about 3 times faster than a 7800gtx.

So from now on, let's discard factual assessments for hearsay k, since the truth isn't important (since you can always QFT a certain somebody and pretend to be always right) but emotions and pretending to be a gentlemen is.

[fellix_bg]

nor do they know the trouble the rsx would have to go through to reach xdr.

Strangely, I thought that Cell is in trouble of reaching RSX local memory (reads), not the other way around.

[570091D]

^looks to me like it's just an 'element' case with green lights and an nvidia badge on the front... usually that's the only change made to make a case "nv-edition". i very much doubt that gf100 will require a special case.

XDR memory is attached to the Cell processor, not the RSX -- it uses a set of dirt cheap GDDR3 chips.

mb, should have spend 5 seconds on google before posting...