ATI Radeon HD 4000 Series discussion

[whocaresbg]

The real count is 999M of transitors.

Source ?

[mascaras]

[zerazax]

Good to see but most of those we already knew....

Need some real figures!

[Seraphiel]

*snip*

Ignoring GDDR5, isn't that all true of the 3??? series

[STaRGaZeR]

Ignoring GDDR5, isn't that all true of the 3??? series

That and UVD2.

[Seraphiel]

That and UVD2.

I stand corrected then

[LordEC911]

96 complex shaders need additional transistor count of ~200 M, which that means a total number will be more than 890-900 M .

Unless you actually work for AMD/ATi and are an engineer, then you have NO IDEA. There is NO WAY to estimate, anywhere close to accurate, without some very detailed classified info.
The best we can do is assume that 800SPs isn't out of the question, looking back at R520->R580.
Unlikely, yes. Impossible, no.

[AliG]

Source ?

he probably took 666 and multiplied it by 1.5, which isn't a realistic number

[STaRGaZeR]

I stand corrected then

I wonder what they did to add that 2 to the name. The problem of DXVA is that you can only use it with certain video streams and with certain combination of filters and renderers. Flexibility = 0. I hope to see some enhancements here.

[AliG]

Unless you actually work for AMD/ATi and are an engineer, then you have NO IDEA. There is NO WAY to estimate, anywhere close to accurate, without some very detailed classified info.
The best we can do is assume that 800SPs isn't out of the question, looking back at R520->R580.
Unlikely, yes. Impossible, no.

I suppose that it is possible as you said, because the r580 had 3x the pipelines the r520 had. But the way I see it, the rv670 was a stepping stone towards getting the process right for fusion, and then the rv770 will bring some big performance to make a profit, and then the r8xx whatever fusion is will be a perfected form of the r600 design, whatever that may be. So I predict a very noticeable increase, but a 150% increase in shaders? With how little the dize size is changing, I find that hard to believe


Come to think about it, the r600 could be looked at like the r520. It lost to nvidia's high end, but isn't wasn't made to win, it was made more so as a test to pave the way for the next big bomb they drop on the market. Although not the best marketing strategy, when funding is low, that's what you have to do, and I actually wouldn't be surprised if the rv770 wows us more than we predict

[Eastcoasthandle]

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.

...I already have performance figures on both the rv770 (faster then the 8800 gtx/ultra by around 15&#37 and gt200 (125% faster the the gtx and ultra). You won't be the first one I did this to, it will be fun.

In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

[003]

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible and he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.


In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

If that is correct, the 4870 is going to suck?

[Eastcoasthandle]

If that is correct, the 4870 is going to suck?

IMO not at all. 15% faster then an Ultra/GTX is pretty good, late but still good for a midrange card. As was suggested, they need to get the X2 out the door ASAP. If it's just CF on a card it's not going to be very competitive. ATI can't be going back to "works well in this game, not in that game" scenarios. If it's dual GPU hybrid or a shared memory CF card then it might be something of interest as a high end card. But hey, hard to say one way or another.

If this info. is true I have to wonder if it's using 480SP or 800SP. If 480SP that's freaking efficient (among other techinical advances we are unaware of right now).


Edit: If it's true that the 4870 has 480 stream processing units that's actually 96 Superscalar Shader Processors (someone correct me if I am wrong). Beating video cards with as many as 128 Shader Processor units. Even though it doesn't "hand GX2 a new one" that's pretty impressive if true. But this is still all speculation...

[drjunk]

I know im jumping the gun a little bit, but when can we expect 45nm rv770?

[LordEC911]

I know im jumping the gun a little bit, but when can we expect 45nm rv770?

Most likely Q4. It will either be 45nm or 40nm since both will be ready, roughly, at the same time.

[Atal]

...gt200 (125% faster the the gtx and ultra). You won't be the first one I did this to, it will be fun.

omg if this can be true well the 4870 will compete against the 8800 GTS 512 which is 15% faster than the ultra

[zerazax]

The 8800 GTS 512 is not faster than the Ultra.

[NH|Delph1]

Most likely Q4. It will either be 45nm or 40nm since both will be ready, roughly, at the same time.

40nm is not ready for actual mass production until next year, sampling will start in late 2008.

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible and he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.


In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

Cards haven't been sent to partners yet, there are some indications of the performance cards floating around, but they are vastly different.

Remember, this is a mid-range chip. If it actually beats G80/G92 by a margin it surpasses the performance of previous mid-range chips, comparing generation to generation.
The dual-chip is the high-end. And I don't like his phrasing, because he seems to leave this part out. RV770 is mid-range, it never was anything else, while 4870X2 is high-end.

//Andreas

[whocaresbg]

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.


In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

In this casе HD4870X2 will not have any chances to beat GT200 .

[Nedjo]

In this casе HD4870X2 will not have any chances to beat GT200 .

The way I see it if RV770 is truly faster then 8800Ultra, it'll KILL nvidia's complete offering in range of 199-399 USD! Effectively sending 8800GT & 8800GTS, as well as 9800GT/GTS to premature retirement! That'll cut of NVIDIA's biggest source of income - mainstream market! I don't see that Highend, megalomaniac 575 mm^2 big GT200 will make satisfactory income flow substitution!

[Calmatory]

In this casе HD4870X2 will not have any chances to beat GT200 .

So what? Like 10000 people buy the very high end anyway.

[Macadamia]

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.


In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

Monkeys can make predictions too.

[whocaresbg]

So what? Like 10000 people buy the very high end anyway.

Ultra high-end plays more PR role . Most people in the world don't make a difference between Nvidia and ATI .

[biohead]

This guy appears to have access to "some" insider info (grain of salt applies here). I've never seen this person post info like this unless he was sure of it. But anything is possible he could be just blowing wind. Time will tell. Hold your breath and take it with a pinch of salt.


In a later post he admits he's not sure if it was the pro or XT. Again take it with a grain of salt...

"Performance figures." How enlightening.

[Eastcoasthandle]

Monkeys can make predictions too.

By that definition posts like this would also apply. As stated in that post all is taken with a grain of salt. I believe you have forgotten that most information in this thread has been speculation.

...
Cards haven't been sent to partners yet, there are some indications of the performance cards floating around, but they are vastly different.

Remember, this is a mid-range chip. If it actually beats G80/G92 by a margin it surpasses the performance of previous mid-range chips, comparing generation to generation.
The dual-chip is the high-end. And I don't like his phrasing, because he seems to leave this part out. RV770 is mid-range, it never was anything else, while 4870X2 is high-end.

//Andreas

From what I've read/understood they have (although it was speculation). That's part of the reason why I posted it.

In this casе HD4870X2 will not have any chances to beat GT200 .

I wouldn't be so sure of that just yet. Lets look at this from another point of view. Is it really necessary to beat the card if frame rates in nearly all games (at higher resolutions) are above playable at a lower price point? IMO, if a situation like that exists then it shouldn't matter.