ASUS Maximus Formula SE

[crazyea]

Other way around.

EIST is automatically disabled when overclocking.
C1E can be left on if you wish for your multi to drop when idle. most leave it disabled to avoid possible issues with low voltage when resuming load.

As for TM some leave it on, some leave it off. It really is a matter of choice.

[Century Phoenix]

I have a temp issue and I don't know why ?

All at stock Q6600 I have on speed fan 51-47-43-39 at idle ... I cannot lauch 3d06 because I think It raise the temp and boot me out ???

What is your Cpu cooler?

Are the frequences and Vcore default?

I have this core temperature with my Q6600 @ 3.28GHz (VCore: 1.216 V) with a Noctua NH-U 12.

EIST is automatically disabled when overclocking.

Are you Sure?
Only if you change the multiplier, no?

[crazyea]

What is your Cpu cooler?

Are the frequences and Vcore default?

I have this core temperature with my Q6600 @ 3.28GHz (VCore: 1.216 V) with a Noctua NH-U 12.

Are you Sure?
Only if you change the multiplier, no?

I am using the stock multiplier of 9, and poof it is gone as an option from my bios. and remember, what I am stating here may not apply to all mobos, just the maximus as it is the one i am using.

[jonny_ftm]

Other way around.

EIST is automatically disabled when overclocking.
C1E can be left on if you wish for your multi to drop when idle. most leave it disabled to avoid possible issues with low voltage when resuming load.

As for TM some leave it on, some leave it off. It really is a matter of choice.

Sorry, you're wrong
EIST: adjusts multiplier, lowering it to 6x on idle, it is active when you overclock if your multiplier is left to Auto/default

C1E: once you increase your vcore manually, it will no longer kick in to lower your vcore on idle

As for TM: some leave it off, but silly decision. If your CPU cooler fails, your CPU won't go in protection mode and will fry

Attached is an image with ESIT kicking in at my 3.51GHz overclock, multiplier is 6x at idle

[Century Phoenix]

Ok. What is the difference between C1E and EIST?

Ok, thanks for the answer jonny

[ElEctric_EyE]

Hi guys, I have my CPU up to 3.9GHz and ran through 3dMark2k6 with no prob. However, when I run Bioshock (game) for about 15mins, sometimes it will lock up, but Vista is still running fine and can recover. My question is where should I be focusing my efforts? CPU volts, or NB volts, ram volts, or ram timing? I think I can make this system stable and I will be very happy with 3.9GHz! TIA

[jonny_ftm]

Ok. What is the difference between C1E and EIST?

Ok, thanks for the answer jonny

C1e: lowers the vcore on idle while EIST lowers the CPU multiplier

[Century Phoenix]

ElEctric_EyE => What is your Northbridge Voltage?

[jonny_ftm]

Hi guys, I have my CPU up to 3.9GHz and ran through 3dMark2k6 with no prob. However, when I run Bioshock (game) for about 15mins, sometimes it will lock up, but Vista is still running fine and can recover. My question is where should I be focusing my efforts? CPU volts, or NB volts, ram volts, or ram timing? I think I can make this system stable and I will be very happy with 3.9GHz! TIA

You should use some dedicated software to adjust your OC rather than a game. A game is ok for benching, but not for finding your stable OC

Use Prime95 small FFT to check your vcore is ok or no, and OCCT RAM to see if your NB and RAM are way too stressed. Small FFT or OCCT CPU mode first, once your vcore found, set it a notch or two above the limit found, get OCCT RAM stable, than maybe begin lowering your vcore vPLL to find the real lowest stable value

Good luck, you'll be the first to get a stable 3.9GHz Q6600

[Century Phoenix]

C1e: lowers the vcore on idle while EIST lowers the CPU multiplier

Ok.
But I don't understand one thing:
I disable the EIST in my Bios (multiplier: 8, FSB 410MHz), I keep enable the C1E.
When my cpu is idle, the multiplier is 6 and the VCore 1.248Volt, when the system is busy (with Boinc), the multiplier is 8 and the Vcore 1.216Volt ...

Normal?

[Century Phoenix]

Good luck, you'll be the first to get a stable 3.9GHz Q6600

With my Q6600 I reach 4.12GHz, not stable, but Super PI 1Mega passed. I think, I be able to stabilize the CPU @ 3.9 / 4GHz ... If the Noctua can keep the Cpu cool.

[Cumulonimbus]

Ok.
But I don't understand one thing:
I disable the EIST in my Bios (multiplier: 8, FSB 410MHz), I keep enable the C1E.
When my cpu is idle, the multiplier is 6 and the VCore 1.248Volt, when the system is busy (with Boinc), the multiplier is 8 and the Vcore 1.216Volt ...

Normal?

C1E = Lowering the Voltage when system idle AND lowering multiplier from 9 to 6
EIST= Only lowering multiplier -> no signification result in power save

[jonny_ftm]

Ok.
But I don't understand one thing:
I disable the EIST in my Bios (multiplier: 8, FSB 410MHz), I keep enable the C1E.
When my cpu is idle, the multiplier is 6 and the VCore 1.248Volt, when the system is busy (with Boinc), the multiplier is 8 and the Vcore 1.216Volt ...

Normal?

Yep, I should have precise it like cumulonimbus said. In your case, on load vcore is lower, is called vdroop.
When you OC, C1E is useless as you see, the vcore won't decrease, and C1E acts as EIST alone

[jonny_ftm]

With my Q6600 I reach 4.12GHz, not stable, but Super PI 1Mega passed. I think, I be able to stabilize the CPU @ 3.9 / 4GHz ... If the Noctua can keep the Cpu cool.

wanna see an OCCT RAM stable when you do it. For now, you're 3.28GHz

[ElEctric_EyE]

ElEctric_EyE => What is your Northbridge Voltage?

I kept the NB Volts on auto because I think on OC (crazy) it is regulating at 2.21V. And for SOME reason this version (0701)of BIOS will only let you go up to 1.85V on manual adjust

Sorry, NB Volts n OC(crazy) is at 1.62V... Gonna retry tests on manual 1.85V.

[crazyea]

Sorry, you're wrong
EIST: adjusts multiplier, lowering it to 6x on idle, it is active when you overclock if your multiplier is left to Auto/default

C1E: once you increase your vcore manually, it will no longer kick in to lower your vcore on idle

As for TM: some leave it off, but silly decision. If your CPU cooler fails, your CPU won't go in protection mode and will fry

I don't believe so, but before this thread provides anymore false information:

C1E - Enhanced Halt State

"Whenever the OS executes the halt instruction, the CPU enters what is known as the halt state. Architecturally, what's going on in a halt state is the clock signal is shut off to the CPU for some period of time. With no clock signal, none of the logic in the chip will do anything and thus power consumption is reduced. Performance is also significantly reduced; however, the halt instruction isn't usually called during application usage, so the performance aspects of the halt state aren't very important.

The problem with the halt state is that it does nothing to reduce voltage, only current draw by stopping clocks from going to the CPU. Since Power varies linearly with both current and voltage (P = I * V), you're effectively only addressing half of the problem. The Enhanced Halt State, as Intel calls it, does two things: it reduces the clock speed of the CPU by decreasing the clock multiplier down to its minimum value (on the EE 965 series, that's 14x, or 2.8GHz), then reducing the voltage. The clock speed is reduced and then the voltage is dropped, to maintain stability.

Intel insists that the enhanced halt state is a significantly lower power state than the conventional halt state, thanks to the reduction in voltage in addition to the reduction in clock speed. While the standard halt state causes a linear reduction in power, Intel's enhanced halt state causes an exponential decrease in power, potentially offering better power savings than the standard halt state. The real world impact obviously depends on how idle your system happens to be."

EIST:

"What EIST does is very similar to AMD's Cool'n'Quiet. It is demand based reduction in CPU clock speed and voltage. Using the same mechanism of adjusting clock speed and voltage, based on the application demand, the processor will dynamically increase/decrease its clock speed between its minimum clock and its normal operating frequency, as well as voltage, in order to optimize for power consumption.

Because of the way EIST (and AMD's Cool'n'Quiet) works, there's inherently a drop in performance. The idea is this: if you're performing a task that's not using 100% of the CPU, the CPU will operate at a slightly reduced frequency in order to conserve power. So, while some tasks will require that the system run at full speed, others will run at lower speeds. "

Automatic thermal monitoring mechanism #1 (TM1)

* Operation: on overheating (when temperature reaches the sensor threshold, specified at the CPU production stage)
* Performance control: CPU clock modulation
* Voltage control: not available
* Behaviour: priority of the CPU temperature over its performance
* Additional characteristics: duty cycle reduction of the processor up to 46% (3.4 GHz Prescott, 3.4 GHz Nocona).

TM1 is an interesting and useful technology that prevents CPU overheating in emergency cases (for example, when a fan on the CPU cooler fails). Of course, nothing stops this technology to work in standard situations – for example, with a low-quality cooling system. To our mind, this technology has one serious drawback in this connection: TM1 effect is absolutely transparent for the operating system as well as to inexperienced users and typical sysinfo software. Why? Because an operating system as well as popular utilities like CPU-Z or WCPUID will tell users that the CPU clock in their systems is still 3.4 GHz (it's an example) and the CPU load is 100% (at full load). But in fact the CPU may be actively "throttling", that is operating at its minimum 46% and shock a user with its performance.

Automatic thermal monitoring mechanism #2 (TM2)

* Operation: on CPU overheating
* Performance control: CPU clock modulation
* Voltage control: available
* Behaviour: priority of CPU temperature over performance (nevertheless, performance is less reduced compared to TM1 due to the simultaneous voltage reduction)
* Additional characteristics: reduction of the CPU duly cycle to the level corresponding to the minimum to standard multiplier ratio (14/17 = 82% for the 3.4 GHz Xeon Nocona).

TM2 is a very similar (because it is actually based on the same principle – clock modulation), but still improved version of the TM1 technology. The key improvement consists in reducing voltage when TM2 snaps into action (that is when a CPU is overheated). It's useful both from the point of view of extending the CPU service life as well as its performance (which drops to a lesser extent in TM2 than in TM1). An heir to TM1, TM2 is not without the same drawback – its complete transparency to users.



So it seems to me that EIST/C1E have pretty much the same function, While TM1/2 offers protection in the case of overheating.

Anyway. my recommendations as to disabling these items came from none other than: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=114824

A Beginners Guide to Intel Overclocking. Features and Problems Explained.

EIST. that stands for Enhanced Intel SpeedStep Technology.
EIST is a feature, that adjusts your Multiplier, depending on the level of activity of the CPU.
if all your CPU is doing is browsing the internet or typing, then it will default to the lowest available multiplier, since its basically doing nothing.

this is to do many things, save on CPU power, save on actual power used, and to save on heat put out by the CPU.
theres no reason to have a CPU at full speed... if your only doing little mundane things like listening to a MP3, or browsing the net...

theres also... C1E.

C1E is a feature, then when it first came out, drove me absolutly nuts, cause no where was it explained what the feature was or even what CPU had it, for awhile after it started being used in processors.
so I'd be overclocking, run super PI, and get some great run... then C1E would kick in, and my voltage would drop from 1.5 volts, to 1.2 and my OC would stay the same... and this would always lead to instant CPU freezes.
this one single feature drove me so nuts trying to figure out what was going on, when about a year ago it started being used, and my Abit AS8 had no option to disable it, and I had no idea what it was...
I got to the point where I almost took the board outside, and smashed it from being screaming mad.
had I done that, I would have killed a perfectly fine board... cause this is a CPU feature.
a realllyyyyyyyyyy annoying CPU feature.

what C1E does, is lower the Voltage of the Processor, when at Idle, to save on heat output.
remember, a CPU is meant to only be run at stock.
Intel designs these CPU's to be stable at thier stock speed, with C1E active.

however, C1E for a overclocker, can leave you going nuts if you dot know what it is.
especially if you have a older LGA processor, that doesnt have EIST on it, but does have C1E.

C1E. if used with EIST, is actually a handy feature to have, if you want to keep your CPU temps low while at idle.
but if you choose to disable EIST, I strongly suggest you disable C1E at the same time, otherwise, this feature may drive you bonkers too, just like it did with me.

and then theres TM1/TM2.

I know what these are, Thermal Monitors.
however, I am still confused as to how these are different from C1E and EIST.

but, in my Gigabyte board here, in the bios, the description it gives is... TM1 lowers the CPU Voltage and MHz, when the CPU is at Idle.

to me, that just sounds like EIST and C1E... so I dont know how thats any different. but either of these 3 features, can and will alter your voltage readings in windows.

which is why, when you set say 1.5 volts in bios, you only see 1.2 volts, when you actually get into windows, cause EIST or C1E are active... or TM1/2.

disabling these, in bios, should obviously force the CPU to run at whatever voltage you select... assuming you keep in mind, you still have a voltage droop to deal with

Johnny must be getting some info from there as well. It is a little outdated as evidenced by the info i posted earlier and the exact functions of these items. Anyway, I will continue to disable C1E/EIST, as for TM, I may have to rethink that. So for now, that is my last word on this.


I stand by my previous statement. Take it or leave it, LOL

What's the reason for disable TM2-Function?

C1E/TM/EIST all adjust voltages and/or clock multiplier based on load and/or temperature. Its best to have these disabled while overclocking.

[ElEctric_EyE]

Very nice research. Thanks for that crazyea!

[DeViTTo]

Most stable I have found for general use is with Vcore @1.5V and ram @ 2.19V in windows everything else set to default using bios 602

450 * 8 = 3.6GHZ 1800 FSB ram @ 600Mhz 5,5,5,15

Anything else temps go to high and I'm watercooled, I can go higher but OCCT doesnt like it and im happy 24/7. BFG GTX card OC with Riva to 650Mhz Core and 1050 Memory (effective 2100)

3D Mark06 14500 I would like to know though whats 2 ATI cards in crossfire getting with this board?

[ElEctric_EyE]

Most stable I have found for general use is with Vcore @1.5V and ram @ 2.19V in windows everything else set to default using bios 602

450 * 8 = 3.6GHZ 1800 FSB ram @ 600Mhz 5,5,5,15

Anything else temps go to high and I'm watercooled, I can go higher but OCCT doesnt like it and im happy 24/7. BFG GTX card OC with Riva to 650Mhz Core and 1050 Memory (effective 2100)

3D Mark06 14500 I would like to know though whats 2 ATI cards in crossfire getting with this board?

With BIOS (0602) what is the NB Voltage Upper limit?

[crazyea]

Very nice research. Thanks for that crazyea!

NP

[loften]

anyone try this yet? http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=162537

[Warboy]

These is with the 0701 bios

[safan80]

WB please list your bios settings.

[Nuckin_Futs]

Good job Crazyea on the basics of the thermal monitoring.

I just wanna add a few notes.

C1/C1E does do as described but only if used with TM/TM1/TM2 It is like EIST but works in a different manner. EIST is the Intel "branded" halt state that is working between CPU and mobo NB chipset and is controlled by chipset in supported BIOS. This method of switching between modes is thus slower and actually uses system bus resorces so user will feel the drag i overclocked systems, even cuasing instability at medium overclocks. This may be 1 reason ASUS and most, fix it so it is not even available under higher FSB OC's.

C1E+TM2 s the on die (CPU) based P state that does its swiching right on the CPU so it is of corse much faster and you usually dont even notice it happening. It gets its "halt" commands from the OS though but s needs to see and use the CPU clock and vcore table ratios (for each CPU supporting) so it can relate to and adjust multi and vocore together. Now this how it is supposed to happen if at normal speeds, but a lot of mobo maker loose full use when you take vcore out of ato cause many CPU's cannot respond to such a vcore drop in idle and would just crash. I saw this a lot w/ my early E6600. So, for example, like w/ ASUS or Gigabyte, even if vcore is in auto but you move FSB too high, TM2 mode is lost, reverting to TM1 only but working w/ C1E still allows us to get reduced multi at low halt state of a % of usually 3 - 10% usage of combined 2 cores. Before, in C1 (non E) both cores would need to reach a 1 - 3% usage in order to reduce Multi.

Interestingly enough, My Abit's as IP-35 Pro and even budget IP-35-E, and AW9D MAX all supported full C+P state in a mild OC to 400FSB with Abit utilizing full ACPI control for S1/3/4/5. And when it works like it should, the vcore and ratio/multi are called for as any interupt in halt state so you get the full high multi and upper vcore as used by the C/P ratio tables of TM mode on CPU. The newer E6x50's are better at scaling this upwards as opposed to the older E6x00's

So, since C1E & EIST are alike, you should avoid ever having them on together. One or the other. For OC, TM2+C1E is fine, but just know it's normal for some reason for ASUS to revert to TM/TM1+C1E when taking ratio, FSB and vcore out of "Auto". So you will only get reduced multi but will cut down on heat anyways.

There's way more to it but this is just an addition to the earlier post

[binormalkilla]

Has anyone been successful in lowering their CPU fan speed using the Afan settings in the BIOS or ASUS AI Suite? I can't seem to get them to change the speed.....my fan is freaking loud. I have two 120mms set up for push/pull so I've met a point of diminishing returns on CFM....