Laing DDC (Swiftech MCP350/355) Names & Info

[fgw]

hey does anyone have a direct comparison between the Laing DDC2 and DDC1?? How loud are they??

from looking at your sig i can see you already use a laing ddc1. here is a link to a howto to modify a ddc1 to a ddc2:
http://forum.effizienzgurus.de/f23/h...id=29#overview
this can be done on a certain revision of ddc's. you have to verify if you have the correct one. looks like laing manufactures just one ddc and use a bridge to decide if it is a ddc1 or ddc2. just open up your ddc and solder in this bridge. now you can easy compare the two.
i did this mod and soldered a switch to my ddc. i can now switch between ddc1 and ddc2 modes. the difference is 3900rpm vs. 4500rpm and in my loop about 1.8liter/minute vs 2.25liter/minute which is a 25% increase in flowrate.
running at 4500rpm the ddc is noticeably louder but it's not that bad at all.
on the other hand, the increased flowrate does not much to my cooling performance. think i'm on the lower end of flowrate anyway. may be there would be a difference in cooling performance if i could up my flowrate to 4liters/minute ...
as there is no need for more cooling at the moment, i stick to the ddc1 mode for now.

[perfection]

my Laing DDC is the black impeller, which is different to the blue one. I pulled it apart and the wires are different so I can't mod it.

and if I buy a Laing DDC2, I can still change it back to the Laing DDC1 mode right? I'm about to get one of the Laing DDC2 with the OCLabs Plexy top, because it just looks sexy
And its got the blue impeller which was the used in that guide.

[Petra]

and if I buy a Laing DDC2, I can still change it back to the Laing DDC1 mode right? I'm about to get one of the Laing DDC2 with the OCLabs Plexy top, because it just looks sexy
And its got the blue impeller which was the used in that guide.

If it has the blue impeller, then it's gonna be either a DDC-3.1 (9W) or DDC-3.2 (18W). These are the pumps that you can easliy modify to jump back and forth between 9W and 18W spec. However, you should keep in mind that the DDC-2 (18W) is substantially more powerful than the DDC-3.2 (18W).

[ubi]

i did this mod and soldered a switch to my ddc. i can now switch between ddc1 and ddc2 modes. the difference is 3900rpm vs. 4500rpm and in my loop about 1.8liter/minute vs 2.25liter/minute which is a 25% increase in flowrate.
running at 4500rpm the ddc is noticeably louder but it's not that bad at all.
on the other hand, the increased flowrate does not much to my cooling performance.

What is the difference between the watertemps?

[jinsean]

i did this mod and soldered a switch to my ddc. i can now switch between ddc1 and ddc2 modes. the difference is 3900rpm vs. 4500rpm and in my loop about 1.8liter/minute vs 2.25liter/minute which is a 25% increase in flowrate.
running at 4500rpm the ddc is noticeably louder but it's not that bad at all.
on the other hand, the increased flowrate does not much to my cooling performance. think i'm on the lower end of flowrate anyway. may be there would be a difference in cooling performance if i could up my flowrate to 4liters/minute ...

1) How'd you know the exact RPM between the 9w & 18w settings?

2a) Do you have some damper / gel pad / decoupling system in place for your pump?

2b) Would you say the DDC2 setting is still quieter than a 900-1000rpm 120mm fan? Or if you can't reference the noise level to a fan, then maybe with some other component in your system (e.g. what's louder or quieter than the DDC2 setting).

3) Could you fill me in on how to create a switch for the DDC? It's probably really simple, but never took an electronics class in high school =/

Thanks.

[fgw]

What is the difference between the watertemps?

there is NO DIFFERENCE at all! let my system idle for some time to stabilize temps a bit. fans on the radiator were running at 700rpm during both tests.

• first i run the pump in ddc1 mode (3900rpm) for 10 minutes. core temp reads 29c for both cores. watertemp was 26.9c.
• next i switched to ddc2 mode (4500rpm) for 10 minutes again. coretemp and watertemp stayed the same.

as said before, i have a very low flowrate and the change from 1.8liter/minute to 2.25liter/minute does not make any difference. may be if you are using a less restrictive loop and your flowrate would change form 3l/m up to about 4l/m you could see a difference.
in my environment, the limited change in flowrate has no effect on temps!
also, did this test during idle, because during orhtos, temps are fluctuating by some degrees which would give misleading results. if i see no difference during idle i doubt there would be any difference during load conditions at all.

the impact of fanspeed is far higher than the impact of flowrate:
running the pump in ddc1 mode again, i switched the fans on my radiator from 700rpm to 900rpm. i could watch temps going down: starting from coretemp readings of 29c and a watertemp of 26.8c, temps dropped to 28c in coretemp and 26.1c for water after 10 minutes. after witching back to a fanspeed of 700rpm, watertemp started rising slowly again ...

[fgw]

1) How'd you know the exact RPM between the 9w & 18w settings?

ddc gives a rpm signal as fans do. just connect it to a motherboard fan header and monitor rpms in any monitoring software.

2a) Do you have some damper / gel pad / decoupling system in place for your pump?

just used the standard mounting hardware that came with my pump. will add a picture later.

2b) Would you say the DDC2 setting is still quieter than a 900-1000rpm 120mm fan? Or if you can't reference the noise level to a fan, then maybe with some other component in your system (e.g. what's louder or quieter than the DDC2 setting).

this is very hard to tell and very, very subjective. but i wll try: usually i run my six s-flex sff21e (1200rpm) fans at 700 rpm. at this speed, although i'm using six fans(!) they are almost inaudible. if listening very close, the pump could be identified when in ddc1 mode. when in ddc2 mode, the fan needs to rev up to about 1000rpm to be as loud as the pump. at 1200rpm the fans are definitely louder than the pump in ddc2 mode.
as i said, this is very subjective and i'm using six fans together on my rad.
and don't forget the harddisk. if my seagate barracuda kicks in, you don't have to care about the pump or the fans ...
in general, i would say this pump is almost inaudible in ddc1 mode and still very quiet in ddc2 mode!

3) Could you fill me in on how to create a switch for the DDC? It's probably really simple, but never took an electronics class in high school =/

Thanks.

as the pump is checking the status of this connection during startup, you have to switch the pump off and on after connecting the wire to mod the pump from one mode to the other. i use a three position switch with two switched contacts. in the center position the pump is off. in the other positions its either in ddc1 or in ddc2 mode. a two position switch would do here. just ignore the center position and connect everything the same. i prefer to be able to switch the pump off. this helps during refill and test.

* ignore the typo near the blue connections. it should read 12V instead 12C!

• the red connections are coming from the psu 12v rail. which is usually the yellow cable on any 4 pin peripheral connector.
• the blue connections are going to the pump 12V supply, which again should be the yellow cable on the pump connector.
• the green connections are routed to the soldering point as described in the how to
  here
  the only difference is, that you are NOT connecting this soldering point to the adjacent soldering point.
  instead you route a wire outside and connect it to the switch like the green wire above
• the black wire from the pump connector runs to the black ground connection on the 4 pin peripheral connector as before

[Petra]

in my environment, the limited change in flowrate has no effect on temps!
also, did this test during idle, because during orhtos, temps are fluctuating by some degrees which would give misleading results. if i see no difference during idle i doubt there would be any difference during load conditions at all.

There is a difference, it just may not be detectable with onboard temperature sensors (lack of resolution). That said, the difference would become more pronounced (and possibly detectable with onboard sensors) at full CPU load because you're putting more heat into the system (i.e. a tiny change in thermal resistance due to increased flow can become a very large change in CPU temperature, provided that you're applying enough heat).

A simple explanation for the small difference in flowrate, however, would be the DDC-3's abysmal max head pressure (thus, making the difference between the DDC-3.1 and DDC-3.2 pretty small...especially when used in a restrictive loop).

[pss75]

According to the user manual posted a while back, this pump must not pump downwards! Could anyone explain y this is as i am building a case with these pumps facing down!? I presume it may have something to do with the original top and that a modded top should allow the pump to pump downwards?!? (not upside down!) Cheeers

[perfection]

just wondering, this is the OClabs top here but all tops are very similar is design.

wouldn't it make more sense if outlet was on the right hand side as it looks like impeller spins clockwise. wouldn't it be better with the outlet on the other side??

[serialk11r]

just wondering, this is the OClabs top here but all tops are very similar is design.

wouldn't it make more sense if outlet was on the right hand side as it looks like impeller spins clockwise. wouldn't it be better with the outlet on the other side??

I think it gets a lot less pressure that way.

[brinox]

hey guys, ive been doing some research on these DDC pumps by laing. I myself have a koolance PC3-700 case with the upgraded pump/tank (specifically the TNK-400-NX2SL).

i am fairly certain that this '18w' pump is the same as the DDC+ or DDC2 pump you all are talking about here. can anyone confirm that at all? im just wondering because my pump is not quiet at full speed (i have the pump speed controller from koolance as well, nifty little gadget to have when i sleep!).\

i know koolance is highly NOT recommended but it was a gift to me last year and i dont have the option to make a new system (yet), so please just bear with me here!

take a look here or here for the pump/res im talking about. the 2nd link's 'more pictures' show a good view of the orange impeller already mentioned in this thread, just FYI.

[Kayin]

Well, this is awesome info. I'm currently testing my own design in my PC, and though it's really noisy in the prototype, I'm hoping to get the noise out and get it to where I can replicate it easily, at which point I'd be more than glad to send one to Petra and nikhsub1 to test so I can get better at this...

People here would be interested in more choices, right?

[Capt Proton]

i am fairly certain that this '18w' pump is the same as the DDC+ or DDC2 pump you all are talking about here. can anyone confirm that at all? im just wondering because my pump is not quiet at full speed (i have the pump speed controller from koolance as well, nifty little gadget to have when i sleep!).\

Yes, it is a Laing DD2-2. By mistake, I ordered just the pump once, and it had the actual Laing spec label. I have the Exos upgrade version, and, its a little noisy at full tilt, so I bought the same controller. I found that if you set it too low, the pump may not start.
Furthermore, for the doubting Thomas' out there, when it is mounted on a reservoir, the intake is on the top, just like the modded tops out there.

[masocr79]

I got a DDC from sharka a couple of weeks ago.

They sell two different DDCs, both with the alphacool top -

Alphacool Modified Laing DDC PLUS - 159GPH $96.95
Alphacool Modified Laing DDC - 111GPH $66.95

I ordered the model advertised as 111GPH since I was concerned about the 159GPH model being too loud. Yet, the pump they sent me does have the orange impeller and on the label it says

" ... DDC-1plusT ... 18W .. "

Not sure if they sent me the 159GPH model by mistake. If not, which DDC version would you guess is the 159GPH? The new revision with the blue impeler?

So far, noise is not an issue. And the pump is tiny. I was really shocked at how small this thing is.

[Hellemyr]

I got some questions about this pump..

1.
I have seen alot of posts of liang pumps dying, looks like a bad shipment, if i buy a pump now, is there a possibility that it will just die?

2.
I have been looking on that 9-18w mod, can all liang pump do this? Or it is just a special version that i can use this mod on?

3.
Trim top?
I will get better performance by adding a new top on the pump. It doesnt looks that hard to make a home make top, anyone tried this?

Thats all

[fgw]

I got some questions about this pump..

1.
I have seen alot of posts of liang pumps dying, looks like a bad shipment, if i buy a pump now, is there a possibility that it will just die?

from what i have seen, it looks like reports of dead ddc pumps are coming from customers overseas. there are some reports from the us and also canada. may be i'm wrong, but there might have been a bad batch or revision out in the us market.
i'm using a ddc pump for some month now without problems. although i have to mention, this pump gets fairly hot. during testing i had on lying on my bench when i touched the bottom side of the pump. it war not warm it was hot! i installed the pump in my case and use a fan to let some air flow over and even more important below the pump. thus the pump keeps cool or at worst warm but by far not hot as it was before! this not only keeps the pump cool but also helps to keep watertemps low, as heat produced by the pump gets transported directly into the water ...

2.
I have been looking on that 9-18w mod, can all liang pump do this? Or it is just a special version that i can use this mod on?

the conversion can be made to a certain revision of the pump. you have to open the pump and check the pcb. see here for details.

3.
Trim top?
I will get better performance by adding a new top on the pump. It doesnt looks that hard to make a home make top, anyone tried this?

Thats all

i would not go through this and try to make my own top. you can order a ddc at watercool with the top you want. it does not cost that much more and saves you a lot of work, but it's up to you ...

[Hellemyr]

I think ill be making my own top.

But, on moust of the tops, the inlet is on the top and on the stock top the inlet is next to the outlet. Any reasons for that? I wound prefer to have the inlet and outlet at the same posission at the stock top.

[Hellemyr]

I have been looking at pumps now, and trying to find one that i can mod to 18W.

But how do i konw what pumps can be modded?

Im looking at those from newegg, they look alike, but are they, and can they be modded to 18W?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835108081

[Petra]

But how do i konw what pumps can be modded?

Im looking at those from newegg, they look alike, but are they, and can they be modded to 18W?

Since those are both 9W DDC-1's, they can't be modded using the method shown on that German site. You'd need to track down either a DDC-3.1 (9W, blue impeller) or DDC-3.2 (18W, blue impeller). They are most easily had in Europe right now, but neither of them can match the head pressure of the 18W DDC-2.

[Maviryk]

According to the user manual posted a while back, this pump must not pump downwards! Could anyone explain y this is as i am building a case with these pumps facing down!? I presume it may have something to do with the original top and that a modded top should allow the pump to pump downwards?!? (not upside down!) Cheeers

As with all water pumps, you must first PRIME the pump with water in order for it to work properly, otherwise you will burn out the motor.

However, once it is primed with water, you can mount it anyway you want to, unlike most significant others.

[Hellemyr]

I seen to fint any DDC 3,1 or 3,2. They are all just called DDc 350 or 355, can anyone link to a shop where i cant find i DDC 3.1, please?

[malik22]

How do you hook up those Laing DDC pumps I mean where do the wires go to the psu?

[Borgod]

I received my replacement MCP355 yesterday that has the exact same problem as the first.

It sounds like there is sand inside the pump. It works fine and there is plenty of pressure, but honestly it's like I put a handful of sand inside the motor.

Two MCP355, same problem, different retailer.

Not ing happy.

[Hellemyr]

Do you have problems whit the new model of the pump whit blue impreller?