Sorry charlie but then is really no different than now. The sameOriginally Posted by charlie
went on back then. The only difference between now and then is people are actually aware of it now.
Sorry charlie but then is really no different than now. The same
heatware chew*
I've got no strings to hold me down.
To make me fret, or make me frown.
I had strings but now I'm free.
There are no strings on me
I never really understood the reason for contests and overclocking competitions..
I'm sure Charles must have taken it personally because he also participates in these competitions,
but I see XS as an informational forum..
shouldn't they just be banned from XS sponsored competitions, events, etc?
I'm sure those who are disappointed by this turn of events will just take any posts from these users along with a grain of salt.
"Red Dwarf", SFF gaming PC
Winner of the ASUS Xtreme Design Competition
Sponsors...ASUS, Swiftech, Intel, Samsung, G.Skill, Antec, Razer
Hardware..[Maximus III GENE, Core i7-860 @ 4.1Ghz, 4GB DDR3-2200, HD5870, 256GB SSD]
Water.......[Apogee XT CPU, MCW60-R2 GPU, 2x 240mm radiators, MCP350 pump]
I see the reason for the banning, but I don't think Andre Yang is a cheater as much as those that got the scores from him. He's probably the most hardcore out there. He buys crap loads of chips and test them and uses alot of non sponsored hardware. Out of the leader board on HWbot I remember someone saying, he spends as much as the whole top ten combined.
Andre Yang is still a skilled overclocker, when guys like shamino, george and vince respect him, he's completely legit. But the people that used his scores are definitely cheaters and didn't deserve to be in the place they were on the leader board.
This is way different than OPB who just wanted the fame and the free hardware associated with it. Andre already had the skills and the fame and the free hardware. This type of cheating didn't get him more hardware or more money or more fame. In a way, he was just giving his stuff to other people. He was giving others his work and letting them use it. Its sad and pathetic on both parts, but for some reason, from what George's has said because he met the guy, I think Andre is a very lonely man, who wanted some attention using the wrong ways.
Out of everyone, I think he's the most hardcore in regards to overclocking.
Last edited by tajoh111; 07-22-2010 at 01:09 PM.
Core i7 920@ 4.66ghz(H2O)
6gb OCZ platinum
4870x2 + 4890 in Trifire
2*640 WD Blacks
750GB Seagate.
Invent something that can be measured and people will start competing with each other, who has the bigger stamp collection, who has the better looking garden, who has the fastest car, who has the highest score in a benchmark, competing has been in human nature since the dawn of time.
Last edited by naokaji; 07-22-2010 at 01:18 PM.
I didn't see it til about 2004, 2005-ish. There was REALLY something magically innocent about those Athlon XP and P4 days....Sorry charlie but then is really no different than now. The same
I remember how back in the day... I saw a guy on ebay with an FX-51 before they were in stores. Maybe a week before they were in stores... so I drove down to Los Angeles to meet the guy at some Cafe to do the deal, lol... the benchies I posted were probably/close to the first FX-51/940 benchies on XS. Nowadays... anand, XS, et al... would have posted pre-production benchies a month before the public saw them.
And I remember the boards, lol... the SK8N and the SK8V from Asus. They were like IMPOSSIBLE to find. That was the good old days... when ANYONE could make a splash without corporate ties.
Last edited by charlie; 07-22-2010 at 01:14 PM.
Thanks Brian
Things don't stink without reason. And whatever it is, its definitely many times stronger now.
That's what happens when corporations stick their hands in anything, don't expect it to stay clean for long.
Corporations only understand one thing: can we get away with it?
Andre is probably innocent at the individual level. As innocent as any soldier doing his job.
I think the right decision was made @ XS, but the situation was not handled correctly. Don't yell "FIRE!" in a full theater...
People have reputations to protect and we don't want to be advocates of smearing campaigns.
Last edited by damha; 07-22-2010 at 01:35 PM.
They should also ban anyone who works for or is affiliated with HWbot if they are trying to clean it up.
They should ban anybody named Nick who works for company XXXX
Last time I checked, it wasn't a requirement to disclose who you work for. I have never promoted any product either while there are plenty of others here that have without disclosing.
Last edited by resident1509; 07-22-2010 at 01:50 PM.
sorry but what a load of crap
this just proves what little you know
No he was giving his friends the advantage , taking away hard work from other people that tried.
Totally disagree there are many others given the opportunity and money andre had would be alot more skilled.
Funny stuff, all over silly little 3dmarks?
You know I have yet to see a competition where nobody cheats. I am not saying it is right but motive is there to win and sometimes at all cost. Even myself when I competed in bodybuilding contests I used various...'cheats' to get in the top 3 all the time. Mind you if I was to get caught I would get trashed and it's not because of the cheats I used but for being stupid enough to get caught. Cheating is wrong but as I said when there is motive like new parts and a trip then yeah I am surprised only a few got caught. I will not look down on these people as I am sure they learned their lesson and cannot wait for them to come back. Especially Skinnee because he has tests to finish up for the LC section that I am interested in.
maybe silly to you, but there are million dollar business built around the overclocking community and these competitions keep the community together and moving forward. a LOT of people take this seriously because it's their livelyhood, anyone caught cheeting MULTIPLE TIMES should be banned. permenantly.
No, it's about Honor my friend, not a benchmark..
Crunch with us, the XS WCG team
The XS WCG team needs your support.
A good project with good goals.
Come join us,get that warm fuzzy feeling that you've done something good for mankind.
People should be given a second chance imo, at least non-repetitive offenders. Glad that the ban isn't permanent for everyone.
Everything from 1 month to 1 year sounds justified to me.
They might realise their mistakes after a while.
Donate to XS forums
I come from a background of competitive sports (say, 12+ years of world cup level, top 3 best in my country at what I did). Let me tell you this: live overclocking events have got NOTHING on well established sports live events. Sure, my gear could break or fail and it would cost me a win, but for OC, you're 100% dependant on gear. Many MANY posters here have commented that corporations feed top 1% binned chips and cards to their top OC champions. How is that more fair than say, AndreYang picking his binned chip and giving away the result to someone else? It isn't.1* Ok, there is no skills involved, especially not in live events
Cmon, you are kidding no one.... Luck, overclocking, optimizing/tweaking, and scheduling time all required for live contests
This is the internet. We use online profiles that don't always correspond with who we are in meatspace. I'm not placed to judge anyone about what's an acceptable lifestyle but I will allow myself this comment: if you get so pissed off at some person that you've never even seen face to face over some magic numbers that he may or may not even have created himself, then you need to rethink your "lifestyle". Last I checked, those guys did OC as a sideline, not as a main income source. The associated online reputation means nothing. Tomorrow morning a dude named "AndrewLang" might show up with top10 results and he'd have a following in a matter of hours. Don't overestimate reputations of anyone on the internet.2* You underestimate the value of a clean reputation... Its obviously more then a hobby for some; a lifestyle, a path... Any idea how much time it takes to make as many benchmarks as these guys do?
Technical limits isnt the problem, rather the goal is unacheivable if the rest of us wont like it....
Are you saying that he got a leg up because he had top 1% binned stuff at his disposal? Thank you for agreeing with me that this whole "live OC contest" thing is basically BS because of this.3* Screening is a massive problem.... Now this is only hypotherical; but, what if AndreYang actually had an industry selling results? making money on cheating... I dont know, I honestly dont think so.... But do you consider it luck when buying 200 pieces of all hardware and testing all of it? Have you ever heard about "statistic"????
Because I don't care about what Joe Schmoe did in his basement with some LN2 and a couple of hours of free time?4* Congratulations, you just informed everyone that you are on the wrong forum
I appreciate the effort put into this by enthusiasts around the globe. I appreciate the input I get when I need information regarding "xtreme systems". I don't appreciate it that my hobby is turning into yet another corporate pissing contest, with all associated problems.
Whatever, in the end, I still believe nobody will give a flying poop about this situation for more than a week.
No sarcasm meant but you've missed the whole point of why people are upset.
It is the loss of trust and seeing someone that people admired and respected betray that trust.
All the rest is smoke.
Crunch with us, the XS WCG team
The XS WCG team needs your support.
A good project with good goals.
Come join us,get that warm fuzzy feeling that you've done something good for mankind.
Overclocking DOES take talent, however overclocking also means you have lots of $$$$. Without the $$$$ you are nothing.
I'm stuck with a bum CPU and it does not go further. I can't even keep up with similar CPU's.
Smile
Geeze, you mean people actually sell overclocks?!?!?!?
What the hell do you have to gain from that?
PII 965BE @ 3.8Ghz /|\ TRUE 120 w/ Scythe Gentle Typhoon 120mm fan /|\ XFX HD 5870 /|\ 4GB G.Skill 1600mhz DDR3 /|\ Gigabyte 790GPT-UD3H /|\ Two lovely 24" monitors (1920x1200) /|\ and a nice leather chair.
Last response to this dialog from my side; wont spend more time defending the obvious that some of us actually do care about overclocking, about benchmarking, and about fairplay.
And as Movieman fine put it; trust and honour..... Also what I would describe as mutual respect.
If you can convince yourself about that, then I dont even bother arguing.
Completely none sense.... You have no respect for the passion nor level that it has become.... Alot of people meet at events, this being overclocking events, IT-exhibitions etc.... Again; you are missing the point... AndreYang CANT just make up a new name, because he acheived something, something motivated him, gave him a drive... And likely that was also a social part of it, and it is just a matter of time before getting exposed if using false identity...
Online and live ISNT same thing...
Well you dont, but ALOT of people on this forum does.... And clearly you have little respect for what we are doing....
We are many that cares what as you so fine put it someone does with LN2 in the basement...
Did you read the three letters "OPB" in this thread? I know I did..... Do you have any idea how many weeks ago that was?
Competition ranking;
2005; Netbyte, Karise/Denmark #1 @ PiFast
2008; AOCM II, Minfeld/Germany #2 @ 01SE/AM3/8M (w. Oliver)
2009; AMD-OC, Viborg/Denmark #2 @ max freq Gigabyte TweaKING, Paris/France #4 @ 32M/01SE (w. Vanovich)
2010: Gigabyte P55, Hamburg/Germany #6 @ wprime 1024/SPI 1M (w. THC) AOCM III, Minfeld/Germany #6 @ 01SE/AM3/1M/8M (w. NeoForce)
Spectating;
2010; GOOC 2010 Many thanks to Gigabyte!
In this hobby like all others there are "levels"
The top guys with money and sponsorships bench at the top.
People like you and me bench to what we have or we sit back and learn from the guys at the top..
Have fun with what you own.
Crunch with us, the XS WCG team
The XS WCG team needs your support.
A good project with good goals.
Come join us,get that warm fuzzy feeling that you've done something good for mankind.
I have to back Fugger entirely on the bans. There should be a zero tolerance cheating policy. If Fugger did not ban everyone involved, XtremeSystems would lose any and all legitimacy as an overclocking website.
I'm a bit sad to hear some of the cheaters (regardless of that fact that they may be contributing members of the community) won't be getting longer bans. Permanent may be excessive, but if it's just a couple months, that's not enough time, in my opinion.
Unrelated: Charlie, is that a hidden Apple of Eden in your avatar?
I still think these guys should be given a chance address this criticism personally (if they choose to do so). Maybe some hacker stole the results and emailed to the others, maybe a band of pink fairies forced Andre's hands to share results, maybe they are victims of international Overclock Mafia (suspected leader: Movieman)
Kidding aside, I really don't feel comfortable to see this pages of bashing without them being able to respond. Don't take me wrong, I would be the first person to call them AS*HOLES! but I'd like to say this to their faces rather than , you know, from behind.
I agree, everyone is entitled to defend themself.I still think these guys should be given a chance address this criticism personally (if they choose to do so). Maybe some hacker stole the results and emailed to the others, maybe a band of pink fairies forced Andre's hands to share results, maybe they are victims of international Overclock Mafia (suspected leader: Movieman)
Kidding aside, I really don't feel comfortable to see this pages of bashing without them being able to respond. Don't take me wrong, I would be the first person to call them AS*HOLES! but I'd like to say this to their faces rather than , you know, from behind.
The issue here is that skinnee posted and said what happenned,
Crunch with us, the XS WCG team
The XS WCG team needs your support.
A good project with good goals.
Come join us,get that warm fuzzy feeling that you've done something good for mankind.
Bookmarks