Anandtech wrong on on not including SSD in Performance Midrange recommendations?

[Computurd]

nice pics, i prefer submissions though, sorry if i insist.....

but you did say :

Thats about all there is to say about this "story", and anyone that follow my adwised settings for Vantage with similar drives and ICH, scores about the same, every time....

so should be bunches of these guys in top ten of vantage, right? i mean why would someone not submit it if it was top ten?

[Ourasi]

I'll post an ORB Link later on, the Vantage edition I use is not mine, I only use it for personal/educational use. But, I need an advanced edition, so I'll buy a key, since I'm tired of searching thru 100's of screens everytime I need the results

However the pics will have to due for now atleast

[Computurd]

meh

[Ourasi]

I see... oh well...

[Computurd]

i will be sure to keep this one bookmarked though, so that i can see the outcome...
i just find it extrememly hard to believe that guys are setting top ten records, and not taking the time to submit the results. all you do is click the button. by god the top ten should be full of guys with 2RO x-25e's.
and yet there isnt one......

[Computurd]

wow you have the most spartan desktop for 24/7 usage i have ever seen btw...not one program on the desktop or taskbar. wow must like things neat
if that result is really on a 24/7 OS with no tweaks, you could be in the top 5 easily.

[Ourasi]

Yeah, I don't like clutter, I have everything where I think it should be, and thats not on the desktop....



When it comes to top ten, I have no idea where I could end up with a 2-400mhz extra added on the CPU and a tweaked to the limit system, but I'll see if I care enough to give it a shot.. Anyway, the common adwise to get good scores is to get an 980x, and if thats needed to get somewhere on that list, I'm out, I need to eat aswell

[Soulburner]

After using my 80GB Intel X25-M for a short while, I can say that there is hardly a better $225 you can spend on your computer.

It's gotten to a point where I'd want to make sure it was a priority piece of hardware central to most new computers now.

There are still a few cases though where I can't justify one, such as my Mom who does email, word processing and internet. A 40GB X25-V may be the ticket in some cases.

[Soulburner]

I see we have come to a heated topic here, but it seems all norwegians agree 30-40GB is enough for Windows 7 64Bit (any edition) with core apps (needed for "general usage" of the machine). And spinning disk storage on the side for stuff that don't fit or have priority.
I've also specified 80GB would be adviced for a more complete application suite for heavy duty work, while still having other storage for VMs or other big files/projects.

The key to keeping Windows vista/7 from running out of controll with space use is in:
*Pagefile (static but takes up much space, typically 5-10GB)
*Hibernation (=RAM capacity)
*System restore (will increase every time something is installed, updated or uninstalled if not limited)
*Temp files (will grow linearly easily to multiple GBs if not cleared regularly)
*Moving user folders to other drives/partitions if possible

I agree completely. For me, 80GB SSD for OS+Apps+Games, plus I do all of these things, see my sig for details

On the "Location" tab in the properties for My Documents, Music, Video, etc, move them to a HDD. Temp files are hard to control, if not impossible for most programs. You can turn your disk cache off in your browser though, and use only RAM cache. This is not only faster but silent as well. The only drawback is it isn't permanently saved, having to re-load the same pages rather than bring them up from the cache the next time you visit them after your browser was closed.

[Ourasi]

nice pics, i prefer submissions though, sorry if i insist.....

but you did say :



so should be bunches of these guys in top ten of vantage, right? i mean why would someone not submit it if it was top ten?

PCMark Vantage Suite (nr. 11 on the ORB) :
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?pcmv=319538

PCMark Vantage all suits:
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?pcmv=319549

Lost a small amount on the "all Suits" run, since I had to do it all over again with the latest version making it 3 runs, but not alot lost though, just over 1k on the HDD score.. My tiny E's have done their fair share of benching tonight.... 1 full run with HDD@88.5k followed by a default suite and another full suite with HDD@87.2k, is not to bad for a pair of E's in one evening after all, me thinks

[Anvil]

so should be bunches of these guys in top ten of vantage, right? i mean why would someone not submit it if it was top ten?

I see you've pushed Ourasi to post a quick run

We have a sort of a competition at the norwegian forum and it's only about storage, thats why we haven't bothered submitting any scores.
The pcmv hdd test scores is just one of many tests we compete in.
All tests are performed on bootable drives.

I'll be upgrading my gpu and cpu so you might spot a few runs from me as well within a few days or weeks at the most.

[Tiltevros]

@ Ourasi.
I didnt tag the Norway community Cheaters... Its not fair to put words on my mouth that i didnt said...
now as long for ur score 110k+ yes its difficult to belive that a Raid0 config with 2 drives with out any tweaks or tricks can go faster than 2 or 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 C300's on ICHxR.

[Anvil]

Tiltevros,

One can read between the lines, but don't sweat it, it not an issue for me.
However, the runs we do at the forum are all clean, no dirty tricks unless explicitly stated and those scores are never recorded.

But, why don't you try it for yourself, the ICH is very good, extremely good in fact.

My Development VM's are running faster using ICH on my 2R0 Vertex LEs than the Intels are using my 9260, I'm just as surprised as you are.
For stabily and scaling I still prefer the 9260, but that's another story.

[Tiltevros]

its not about my scores belive me. i posted my scores with 92xx series and i have proven what i can do with them.
But belive me its very difficult to belive that 2 intels can score on ICHxR more than C300's on the same controller...
Mr. mbreslin with C300's on ICHxR with a 24/7 pc with a recently fresh pc cant even touch that score. how do u comment that?? and Ourasi scores 110k with only 2 drives...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=251675 s

[Anvil]

Tiltevros,

The tests we do are focusing on HDD scores, the runs in our thread are for the most part performed on drives without the OS.
This makes a difference but not that much it appears.

Testing storage without the OS (or finding performance spots if you'd like) is done more quickly without the OS, the performance gains are the same wheter running the OS or not. To get the best scores one also need to perform the tests on "clean" drives. (HDDerased for the most part, sometimes a format will do)

I believe the scores mbreslins posted aren't the best ones, he only posted using 64KB stripe size and that is by far the optimal stripe size.

Iv'e done a few tests lately running the drives as OS and you'd be surprised at the scores, well, I'll post a few of them when I get my other parts installed.
I just don't bother submitting results that end up at page 2.
(eventually they'll end up there but hopefully they'll stay on page 1 for a while )

[mbreslin]

110k shocked me but 89k doesn't. Without using a small stripe that pcmv likes I was still able to get near the same score with 3 drives on ich as I get with 8 drives on the 9260. Everyone knows those intel slc's are crazy fast, and I didn't know just how good ich was until recently but I sure know now. So I'm not really surprised at all. Like computurd I'm not sure why if you get a 100K+ hdd score you don't go ahead and do a full run and be in the top 10. Even if you do other tests and it's all about storage, you already have the 600mb program downloaded, might as well use it at least once. And I can get in the top 10 pretty comfortably with my 920, a 980x isn't mandatory (though I'm not installing it just to prove it).

[Anvil]

mbreslin,

I've just not taken interest in the full suite, just the storage part. (I'm not into gaming, I use my computers for work, at least most of the time )
Most of the time I don't even bother to run the pcmv hdd tests, I mainly focus on iometer + real life performance.

But things have changed, my results will be submitted when my new setup is done, it might take a week or 2, I've yet to order a decent gpu and I might need better cooling.

[Tiltevros]

i cant understand this... im getting 94k+ on my boot drives with OS and everything on it.. You r saying that i can get much more if i will HDDerase and let them clean as a D drive?
this benchmark i belive is for testing booting systems and not secondary drives or whatever that why is difficult to belive them. i have done soo many "tricks" on them as D: drives that i can score from 1mb to few GB but those will be unrealistic. now as far as for the 1rst page on ORB doesnt mean anything to me. TOP 10 or even TOP 5 can be easyly defeat it by using Cache and u know it.. u said that u r using virtual mashines. Try running PCmV on a virtual machine with some ramdrive i bet u can score a lot. We all can. But for me is not the real procedure of running the test.

[Anvil]

Why should I perform a test in my VM's?

I'm testing for optimal performance on the drives I use for my VM's.
I use other drives for booting (currently X25-Es), my VM's are used on other drives using the best possible stripe sizes one finds while running benchmarks.

Of course you get better performance from clean drives, SSDs degrade as you know

[Tiltevros]

i know about degradation. now for Vm as you know its not only the stripe size that matters there several tweaks especial on windows 2003 that u can use and give allmost 30% boost like queue depth leveling sets Multipaths and and and.
thats why i told u to give a try on Vm with PCmarkV to see that TOP 10 or 5 can easyly powned. If u desire to get on top 10 or 5 u dont have to upgrade.
and just to give u an eg. to understand why top10 or top5 is not for real. Everyone here knows that Areca has a Cap Limit on 800Mb/s how can they score more than 1Gb?? Cache.
Thats why i use a non Cache controller.. to See the real boost from my drives. Thats why i cant belive 110K score with only 2 drives...
For me Its very easy to make an image file with windows make a RAID 01 ( one SSD and one RamDrive and if search the google u will find many ways how u can do it).
Now u said real application performance. Okay whitch ones?? Borland - Oracle DB benchmark?? how many explorers can u open onsight
(solution for 1000 applications : get 8GB ram and set the registry buffer to 4096 and u r done ) ? Whitch ones?? Because i am a member here for 1 year and some mounths and everyone is talking about real applications and i havent seen any???
Everyone here have an Ace in their pocket. Everyone here knows about hard drives even the last stupid guy like me.

[Tiltevros]

It's a bench, and to get the best scores you do what you need to achive them, right (not even hard, if you know what settings Vantage HDD likes)?

but in the end im staying with that line who says all.

[Anvil]

Tiltevros,

With all due respect, this is getting silly.
We all configure our systems differently, if you like to produce great scores using cheats then do it, I won't.

Out of all my scores the pcmv hdd test is the least important one and that's why I seldom do runs.

I run quite a few VM's and some of them require a VD of their own, some VM's run quite smoothly sharing a VD.

It's your prerogative using a controller without caching, but why?
(caching is used on most servers in real life, I just don't get it)

End of discussion for me, I've made my points.

[Tiltevros]

i think that i was the one who was asking to post the test files for all to eliminate the possibility of cheating.
i using one controller without cache to show that performance can be made without using any cache.
As i said before im not telling that the norway community is cheating. I only said that its unrealistic to see 180MB gaining from Overclock.
i dont see why u r so fireup with what im saying??Do u see that possible? Now for VM's we can open a thread and we can discuss tweaking technics and tricks.
We r here to discuss to argue and then be cool again. Everyone here have the passion for storage and love for what we do.
Now if u made ur point for what i was asking Ok.

[Anvil]

Tiltevros,

I'm not fired up , I'm just tired of repeating.

I do see your point but it's been repeated to the extremes.

As I said, we all work differently and that requires different setups.

I'll be happy to share my thoughs and findings with you and others in a separate thread.
I don't have to many hopes on such a thread though, we all operate differently but something good might come out of it.

Go on and create that thread and we'll see how it goes

[BenchZowner]

And now the internet has realized that people can fight over a stupid HDD benchmark in PC Mark Vantage...