AMD cuts to the core with 'Bulldozer' Opterons

[saaya]

The dies are based on the same architecture, but each has different features added. It is not a "grounds up" design, they are based on the same thing. But you can't put an istanbul in an AM3 and call it thuban because there are different features.

if you have the tools and access codes to re-fuse the die, i bet you could

all departments that are going to sell the part under one name or another will throw in what features they want/need and the final design will be a compromise between all of that, and then each team will fuse things on or off and bin according to what they need want to create a product out of that molten chunk of sand somebody sneezed hazardous metals on

different features, yes, different silicon, no...
i refuse to believe amd is wasting rnd resources on such a useless effort... you dont create a new set of multi million us$ lito masks because less than 1% of the silicon is slightly different... and if you do, then your either making lots of money with it (not the case last time i checked, no offense!) or your really REALLY bad at managing your rnd and mfc budget :P

As to whether someone has an actual bulldozer running, let me just propose this thought: The guy who would know a.) there were silicon available and b.) if any of that silicon was outside of our walls, is saying that someone can't have silicon in their hands.

I obviously can't comment on specifics, but, if someone was wondering whether there was actually silicon outside of AMD's walls, they might want to put slightly more faith on the person who has access to the master schedules, no?

Everyone can believe whatever they want. It's not the laws of intellectual property that are at debate here, it's the laws of time and physics.

hey, im not saying your lying to us! ive read quite some of your posts and seen some interviews and you seem like a very honest and nice guy

but i dont trust that you were informed about everything that goes on... again, no offense... but telling you about something you dont need to know, especially SINCE you are a honest and straightforward guy, would be risky, or at least according to some top guys at amd i guess it could be considered risky.

and correct me if im wrong, but didnt you say something along the lines of "i cant comment on anything past the next xxx months cause thats all i need to know and thus thats all my superiors let me know" during an interview some time ago?

please dont take any offense by what i wrote, i hope i dont sound rude or harsh... and thanks for being so straight forward and honest and sticking around here... it helps to improve amds image as a company that is aware of what is going on around it and listens to the market and customers... something that was lost during the reign of senor ruin errrrr i mean ruiz

[Nedjo]

Maybe he is talking about Magny Cours, that is in production now and lots of people have them in their hands....

well the thing about someones reputation is based on the facts that he knows exactly what does he talking about, and w0mbat certainly doesn't have reputation of being n00b

Screenshots can be faked. Instead, post a picture of the bulldozer processor itself. Every processor we have has the markings on the top.

Again there's certain trust that someone is posting true pictures. eg. people know that say... chew* or Sampsa, or saaya... and bunch of other people would never post faked pictures... and w0mbat is in that trustworthy group...

Pre-production parts have a special model number that, unless you actually had one in your hands, you probably couldn't guess.

I know I had some Agenas - they've end-up being bellowed gifts, after polishing and photo engraving

The old barcelona I have sitting on my desk at work isn't an "OS23xxxxxxx" model number, IIRC it is something like "ZVX140xxxxx"
So, pictures please. Or, if you are not comfortable posting pictures, give me the OPN on the lid.
I can guarantee, with very high accuracy, that you will not have that number.

No one who has access to the any type of NDA samples will not post picture with OPN

So, point of my quoting is that we have brilliant situation where trustworthy member is in the position of losing hard earned credibility 'cos other member with equal level of reliability is daring him to prove its trustworthiness... this has huge potential in terms of forum communities importance in contemporary marketing and PR strategies.

excuse me, but if amd really created a seperate die for desktop 6core chips they are plain stupid... sorry, but seriously...
with the limited rnd money they have i HIGHLY doubt they use different silicon for server and desktop 6core chips... it makes no sense at all as the differences in silicon are tiny :P

don't think you've understud JF correctly! He was speaking about silicon features, not the separate MASK that is used to create Server/Desktop part!

Mask is the same, but production recipe and Enabled/Disabled features ARE different (eg. desktop part doesn't need snoop filter part of the L3)!

As to whether someone has an actual bulldozer running, let me just propose this thought: The guy who would know a.) there were silicon available and b.) if any of that silicon was outside of our walls, is saying that someone can't have silicon in their hands.
I obviously can't comment on specifics, but, if someone was wondering whether there was actually silicon outside of AMD's walls, they might want to put slightly more faith on the person who has access to the master schedules, no?

So there IS silicon INSIDE walls? j/k

Everyone can believe whatever they want. It's not the laws of intellectual property that are at debate here, it's the laws of time and physics.

I'll personally believe ONLY when Dirk say what there is and what there's not!

different features, yes, different silicon, no...
i refuse to believe amd is wasting rnd resources on such a useless effort... you dont create a new set of multi million us$ lito masks because less than 1% of the silicon is slightly different... and if you do, then your either making lots of money with it (not the case last time i checked, no offense!) or your really REALLY bad at managing your rnd and mfc budget :P

Behind this statement I expect knowledge of:
a) leading the manufacturing process of highly integratet x86 processing units
b) economics management of the "a"

So saaya any backgrounds on these departments in your CV?

but i dont trust that you were informed about everything that goes on... again, no offense... but telling you about something you don't need to know, especially SINCE you are a honest and straightforward guy, would be risky, or at least according to some top guys at amd i guess it could be considered risky.

I'd say that JF has extensife knowledge of what he knows, can knows, does say and can say... it's not like he's with in the company for the same time as being member of this forum

and correct me if im wrong, but didnt you say something along the lines of "i cant comment on anything past the next xxx months cause thats all i need to know and thus thats all my superiors let me know" during an interview some time ago?

so now you've busted his neat excuse not to use boring "no comment"

please dont take any offense by what i wrote, i hope i dont sound rude or harsh... and thanks for being so straight forward and honest and sticking around here... it helps to improve amds image as a company that is aware of what is going on around it and listens to the market and customers... something that was lost during the reign of senor ruin errrrr i mean ruiz

I think that JF has figured out that this is the forum with the best crew that really appreciate his posts and the fact that he is so proactive, although we don't hassle with server parts here


Oh and I just recollected one person name who was proactive in spreading Iranian freedom movement, on some other social community service... but the problem is he's not in India

BTW
I don't believe that w0mbat will post any pictures

[saaya]

don't think you've understud JF correctly! He was speaking about silicon features, not the separate MASK that is used to create Server/Desktop part!

Mask is the same, but production recipe and Enabled/Disabled features ARE different (eg. desktop part doesn't need snoop filter part of the L3)!

well he didnt clearly say it
and fusing doesnt make it a different chip, it makes it a different SKU or part or bin... but a lot of articles and pr talk mentioned the two 6 cores as different chips...

[Shadov]

well he didnt clearly say it
and fusing doesnt make it a different chip, it makes it a different SKU or part or bin... but a lot of articles and pr talk mentioned the two 6 cores as different chips...

JF was talking about different functions from the start, additonally Lisbon (-> Thuban) is supposed to be different from Istanbul.

Though you always see what you want in order to support your interpretation.

[JF-AMD]

JF was talking about different functions from the start, additonally Lisbon (-> Thuban) is supposed to be different from Istanbul.

Though you always see what you want in order to support your interpretation.

So Lisbon and Thuban are different. I am not aware if this is a different mask or a fusing option. My gut would tell me a mask difference because they don't want HT Assist (it's really not of value for single processors).

We will all use the same cores and memory controllers, but there are distinct difference. Based on the feature sets, that would lead me to guess that they are different masks. But I don't work in development so I can't say for sure.

[qcmadness]

So Lisbon and Thuban are different. I am not aware if this is a different mask or a fusing option. My gut would tell me a mask difference because they don't want HT Assist (it's really not of value for single processors).

We will all use the same cores and memory controllers, but there are distinct difference. Based on the feature sets, that would lead me to guess that they are different masks. But I don't work in development so I can't say for sure.

HT Assist, as I recalled somewhere, can be turned on or off by BIOS.
So no big deal.

Using different mask will be a huge waste.
Even Intel does the same thing (server / mobile / desktop - 1 mask for all).

[JF-AMD]

HT Assist, as I recalled somewhere, can be turned on or off by BIOS.
So no big deal.

Using different mask will be a huge waste.
Even Intel does the same thing (server / mobile / desktop - 1 mask for all).

Yes it can be turned off in BIOS, but by not laying out the circuitry and reducing the paths, what if you can get to higher clocks?

There is enough variance that I know you can't take a lisbon and make it a thuban, and vice versa. That is all I can say.