Phenom 9500 w/ MSI K9A2 Platinum

[KTE]

Sorry to tell you guys.
I was busy earlier but tested two Phenom 9600 "Black Edition" this morning. Both were CAAZB 0743. Never brought them home, tested them there and then to see if they were actually BE as they were unopened. I tried everything, both were not BE, they had multipliers locked at 11.5x although they were sold as BE.
So I just left them there and uncle will see to it instead. Quick photos with my phone are too messy to show. Saved 1 or 2 very quick screenshots and validations inside 5-10 minutes.

Stock 2.3GHz: http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=288978
2.6GHz: http://valid.x86-secret.com/show_oc.php?id=288979


Max was 2.67GHz within the 5 mins before it froze. First one had HT wall at 213MHz and 2nd one did what you see in pics. Didn't bother with another boot.

I don't know who supplied my uncles firm with them but other suppliers may also be doing this saying they are Black Edition and that your BIOS is just not supporting them yet. This is bogus. You can check through P-States manually even if box says whatever.

Also Phenom shut down temperature is 75℃. Tried it.
Temps in BIOS are accurate just like digital thermistor.

Reading off that German MSI site I gather that this new Bios has the TLB temp fix. Choking the system a bit... 15%

I have a Phenom 9500 running with Bios 1.1 which I believe does not have the TLB fix. Correct???

Yep.

The system run flawlessly on stock settings. Never a crash. That's running Crysis, Call Of Duty 4, Red Baron3d, Autocad, Battlefront 2, Battlefield2, Winxp64 sp2

So when will this TLB bug bite?? Besides the rough fix patch????? Only when overclocking it seems.

Not when oc'ing. If it ocurs it'll occur at stock. Try VMWare and you might see it. Virtualization, i.e. heavy frame-page cache entries is when you are most likely to see it IF your chip is affected.

Or maybe some chips are worse then others??

So hopefully this bios will fix more then it may break.

Ignore this new BIOS. Seems to only degrade things for the worse unnecessarily.

interesting. haven't compared the 2 bios's as far as performance goes. Any suggestion on an app to try?

WinRAR, POV-Ray, Cinebench 10, wPrime and so on.

I just installed 1.22 this morning. Dunno why, really was no reason to, it didn't do anything for me. still can't run my 1066mhz ram @1066.

Anyone know why frequency is grayed out in AOD for memory? I'm guessing the divider isn't changeable on the fly.

Yep.

It's set 1:1 right now. I've got the HT up to something fairly low atm. Last I checked I think my CPU is running around 2.4ghz. HT @ 218 or so. So the ram is running around 436. I know it can go faster than the HT/CPU. just wish I could up it

It'll be running 1:2 divider then.

I'm linking BIOSes P0C, 112 & 113 below. 113 is best so far according to my experience without the TLB errata fix.
http://www.yourfilehost.com/media.ph...le=MS_7376.zip

[Daveburt714]

I have a noobish type question for you folks...

I just built a new K9A2/9600 system and I didn't bother to install a floppy drive in the machine....

My question is... Can I boot into safe/command prompt mode and flash the bios from a USB jump drive, or just flash it from a DOS prompt inside windows?

[Brains1]

So

I have two systems

Both MSI K9A2 Platinum

One has a Black Edition 5000 X2

The other has a Phenom 9500

They both are running the same Cosair ram TWIN2x2048-8500CD G.

Both machines could not run with 2 stick of ram. Wouldnt even post. With the bios update the Black Edition 5000 x2 could see the other stick. The phenom system could not.

So I have the 1.22 the phenom now and can not get these ram sticks to work. Tried increasing voltage and what not. Nothing. The black edition x2 will run them no problem.


Ok as for the No Floppy Drive.....

I ran in to that problem. You need to make a boot cd.
I used Hiren's BootCD 9.3. I could not get my cd-rom to work with it.

But I did get my USB thumb to work. So I selected USB support with Himem. Then select 1 for mass storage. Also old system which is USB 1.1 was how my USB stick got detected. It will then assign your thumb the C: prompt. So just stick the files on the thumb.

Probably a better way. But this junky/clunky system wouldnt work any other way for me.
Good Luck

One stick of ram and now a useless TLB fix on my phenom. Gonna shoot the board. Maybe RMA... Or take the time to put a x2 in to this board and see if the ram works with that.

Gotta have 2gbs to play games now days.

[Swanie]

That is not good news. How will we know if they are BE's or not when we order them .At least you were in the position to check them first .KTE were these part numbers indicated on these:
OEM Tray = HD960ZWCJ4BGD /
PIB = HD960ZWCGDBOX

[KTE]

My question is... Can I boot into safe/command prompt mode and flash the bios from a USB jump drive, or just flash it from a DOS prompt inside windows?

Try it, usually it works. You can use MSI Live Update 3 and you can get v1.1 flashed within Windows without anything other if that fails. I use a FDD always, never tried the USB method with this board. Too much of a headache and FDD method is very easy.

I am sure I've read somwhere by MSI that you need to first get into DOS environment by having the few necessary files on the USB/CD. Then type the relevant commands to flash using the flash utility as long as USB detection is enabled and your board can see it as a drive.

More info might be on the MSI site although I couldn't find it with a quick look.

One stick of ram and now a useless TLB fix on my phenom. Gonna shoot the board. Maybe RMA... Or take the time to put a x2 in to this board and see if the ram works with that.

Flash v1.1 from MSI site as above. You don't need 1.22, it's literally crap.

Are you placing memory in DIMM slot 1 and 2?
Are you setting voltage to 2.2V or 2.3V?
Are you choosing dividers below 1:2?
Are you changing RAM timings manually to the rated spec?

You have to do this before you know if its compatible. So far based on what you've said the Phenom compatibility is the issue and not the board since the memory controller is within Phenom. Also if your RAM is not specified as compatible (tested) the it isn't MSI's fault. I learnt that too.

[KTE]

That is not good news. How will we know if they are BE's or not when we order them .At least you were in the position to check them first .KTE were these part numbers indicated on these:
OEM Tray = HD960ZWCJ4BGD /
PIB = HD960ZWCGDBOX

They were retail so it should be the second. I don't recall off memory but I don't think they were those P/N. I think the 'Z' was replaced by a '0' which IIRC is the standard 9600, i.e HD9600WCGDBOX

I'll checkup again. But I now know who the distributor is and have been in touch and they still insist it's the Black Edition.

Me thinks they're playing games since they had promised delivery of 30 PCS of 9600 BE by 23rd and maybe never had them so sent common 9600 instead. I've even seen the dispatch note and invoice, they state 9600 Black Edtion.

[MR.Q]

That is truely a shame. I had such high hopes when you mentioned a possible Phenom BE test. Lets hope this situation can be resolved quickly.

[blargman]

USB method is pretty easy get HP format utility from bootdisk.com and a dos bootdisk image. extract the image with winimage. format the usb key. copy over the flasher and bios. reboot

Flash v1.1 from MSI site as above. You don't need 1.22, it's literally crap.
(seems like i remember reading on the german forum from what I could tell its' supposed to have some sort of fix for memory and voltages?, so it might not be total crap, just speculation. my german isn't that good)

Are you placing memory in DIMM slot 1 and 2?
Are you setting voltage to 2.2V or 2.3V? ( You do this manually? I've always set mine to auto.)
Are you choosing dividers below 1:2? (same here, auto :s )
Are you changing RAM timings manually to the rated spec? (how would one know what these are?)

You have to do this before you know if its compatible. So far based on what you've said the Phenom compatibility is the issue and not the board since the memory controller is within Phenom. Also if your RAM is not specified as compatible (tested) the it isn't MSI's fault. I learnt that too.

[KTE]

USB method is pretty easy get HP format utility from bootdisk.com and a dos bootdisk image. extract the image with winimage. format the usb key. copy over the flasher and bios. reboot

That's the method but are you sure the USB drive is picked up on this board?

[gareth170]

That's the method but are you sure the USB drive is picked up on this board?

yes it does..

[blargman]

yes it does..

ya both my usb hd and flash drive are.

umm, i hid some questions in that quote on accident. haha, if u missed them kte

[KTE]

Thanks gareth170. I've not tried USB flash on this board, some boards allow it and others have problems with USB detection in DOS environment especially new boards.

umm, i hid some questions in that quote on accident. haha, if u missed them kte

LOL! I did

I'm normally rushing you see

Flash v1.1 from MSI site as above. You don't need 1.22, it's literally crap.
(seems like i remember reading on the german forum from what I could tell its' supposed to have some sort of fix for memory and voltages?, so it might not be total crap, just speculation. my german isn't that good)

Yep they did. But it doesn't resolve anything I've seen yet, certainly not the 1066 issues.

Are you setting voltage to 2.2V or 2.3V? ( You do this manually? I've always set mine to auto.)

Yes manually. Auto normally sets VDIMM to 1.8 or 1.9V which is too low for many RAMs especially 2x2GB.

Are you choosing dividers below 1:2? (same here, auto :s )

Auto will choose 1:2 divider. You can choose it manually to 1:2 or anything lower, should work fine. Higher than that usually errors unless you have JEDEC approved 1.8V 1066 RAM which is hardly anyone.

Are you changing RAM timings manually to the rated spec? (how would one know what these are?)

Check your SPD/EPP info with CPU-Z under the SPD tab. That should list the values you need from CAS to tRC and tRFC. You can check the rest in AOD memeory to see what they are at bootup and play about until you find the RAM upper and lower limit. Keep testing stability though.

[blargman]

hrmm, interesting. i'll definitely play around with it when i get home....ermm, i mean the memory that is ... thanks KTE

[KTE]

**If any of ya can contact MSI then request them for a BIOS option to control CPU NB Voltage. It's doable and it's one of the main options we need.**

As for me, MSI doesn't seem to like me too much nowadays.

[Daveburt714]

Just so you all know I managed to get the Bios flashed...
I found an old floppy drive with 98 on it that loaded the CD drivers, unfortunatly there wasn't enough room on the floppy, so I just burned a Cd with the flasher and the BIN file on it... Kinda cheesy I know, but Hey it worked

Looks like I hit a wall for the night... 228 HT stable 2.6 Ghz, the only redeeming factor was I didn't have to bump any V's except my Mem to 2.0 which is within it's specs (2.0-2.1)....

This is more of a PITA than I had expected! Guess I thought I was special or something...

[Swanie]

Well here the link to the MSI Tool to update your BIOS on a MSI mobo. It works like a charm- for a USB stick/device ( the one KTE was refering to)
http://forum.msi.com.tw/index.php?topic=113295.0

[MR.Q]

**If any of ya can contact MSI then request them for a BIOS option to control CPU NB Voltage. It's doable and it's one of the main options we need.**

NB multi control is required also.

[Brains1]

You have to do this before you know if its compatible. So far based on what you've said the Phenom compatibility is the issue and not the board since the memory controller is within Phenom. Also if your RAM is not specified as compatible (tested) the it isn't MSI's fault. I learnt that too.

That would be why the X2 Black Edition system works with the 2 rams sticks.
Because of the memory controller is in the processor.

Ugh.

Will try to enter all the specs. AGAIN. You know my ram says 2.15v But the board only does it in tenths. So I have 2.1 then 2.2.

Also. Has anybody gotten the ram at 1066mhz? With on stick I played around with the divider. I got a half post with a logo screen colors all messed up.

Right now I'm just looking for a post at any speed with two sticks

Good news my X2 Black runs two sticks with a 4-4-4-12 but 743mhz. I have not pushed it yet. I have enough computer headaches with this phenom and another intel system.

[KTE]

Thanks Swanie.

Yep, that too Mr.Q. But I doubt IMC multi is changeable on the fly. A hardware limitation me thinks.

Brains1: yep that's another thing they need to allow, finer voltage adjustements. Going up in 0.1V is a massive jump for memory and near enough any component.

No one has 1066 working on MSI/DFI/ASUS boards which is not 1066 1.8V SPD rated. Only Gigabyte boards that I've seen yet doing 1066 at 200HT ref.

[EvilBellyLint]

**If any of ya can contact MSI then request them for a BIOS option to control CPU NB Voltage. It's doable and it's one of the main options we need.**

As for me, MSI doesn't seem to like me too much nowadays.

Will do it right now.


EBL


Follow-up: K, just sent online Tech Support a rather impassioned
PLEA to give us CPU NB Voltage adjustment option in the
next BIOS update

I'll report back when I get a response

[KTE]

Thanks EBL

It'll let us test the NB speeds and to see it's limits and bugs with voltage.

[Daveburt714]

You guys have no idea how much help this thread has been! Thanks KTE...et all!!
Here's a screeny of what I consider decent...



Check out the NB Speed though!! It almost seems to be tied to the HT link speed... Whats even stranger is I can't change the HT Multi in AOD either (not sure about bios)...

My NB FID=2 in p-states, that should be 9x right? Am I missing something?

[Lightman]

@Daveburt714
If your NB multi is at 6x then max HTT multi will be 6x because HTT can't be faster than NB....

My Phenom was benchable @240HTT, but that was far from stable....
With time I'm finding that only below 2.38GHz system is fully stable under x64 OS...
What's funny is that even if I boot @2.53GHz or 2.6GHz I can run Orthos, Prime and AOD tester for hours with no errors. Only when gaming my system is hanging up. Best test so far - Crysis in CF. If that game runs, then anything runs.
For example @2.5GHz I had freezes after just 3-120seconds of playtime
@2.43GHz I could play max. 3-15 minutes
@2.4GHz Crashed within 1h
@2.38GHz NEVER crashed!

to Crytek for developing very good stability tester

I simply need new CPU

[KTE]

You're very welcome.

Yep, Processor Performance State NB FID 02 = 6x multiplier (240x6=1440)
As I mentioned earlier, HT speed can only be equal or below NB speed.

If you want to oc, throw CPU Voltage in BIOS up to ~1.45V.
For some reason, Phenom deosn't seem to scale with voltage. Around 1.35V seems to be the limit I'm seeing with most people and it gets you around 2.47GHz stable. I'm sure this is linked to the VID. We need higher VIDs.
A very good (doable for all I reckon) setting to try 24/7 is 220x11 @ 1.33V and keep NB FID 06, HT Link 1800MHz and RAM at 1:2.

Keep an eye on AOD CPU VDDC so that it stays ≥1.33V.

[MR.Q]

Did some more testing last night KTE, and NB seems to stay stable considerably higher if I use GANGED memory mode. Perhaps relieves stress on controller or NB?

CPU @ 2706Mhz | NB @ 2200Mhz | HT @ 1000Mhz | Mem 410Mhz (820mhz) 5,5,5,18,2T

Passed '06 no probs

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=4449632