Here's a little teaser....

[Periander6]

god, you're a tool. what you see is not what you'll get.

Someone is a tool here all right.

If AMD were so terminally stupid to send out performance crippled parts for review 3 days before launch to tier-1 review sites, any potential customer would have to be an even bigger moron to ever trust such a bunch of clowns with critical server applications.

Fortunately AMD is not a bunch of terminal morons like you claim, and you are just spreading FUD.

[dave_graham]

And that's really what counts in the long run.

definitely for revenue though i too would've preferred a little better intro.

Thanks Dave and S7 for still participating in the thread .The only reasons why majority of us are still reading this thread.

well, informal, i evidently can't tell my ass from my elbow according to some of these guys but, again, that's a challenge i'm seeking to overcome.

cheers,

dave

[PhilDoc]

trust me...had that same question today....and just a shake of the head, a meager grimace, and...nothing.

Marketing evidently doesn't understand the "best foot forward" principle.

*shrug*

what are you going to do? The customers who do need the BA's are getting them and they're not "broken"

Btw, Phildoc, the "you're a tool" comment was not directed at you. I seem to have a significant troll presence in AMD threads and yet, i don't seem to be crapping in theirs. I appreciate the questions you ask...I like trying to answer hard questions because in the process, i get to learn answers that aren't as cut 'n dry as they might appear.

cheers,

dave

I'm not sure why you're getting upset. You did direct the comment at me or at least part of it and my comment about why they sent the B1. I wasn't trying to be antagonistic just trying to understand. Actually, I'm for AMD and always have been, haven't had an Intel rig for years. Sorry if you took it the wrong way.

[dave_graham]

Someone is a tool here all right.

If AMD were so terminally stupid to send out performance crippled parts for review 3 days before launch to tier-1 review sites, any potential customer would have to be an even bigger moron to ever trust such a bunch of clowns with critical server applications.

Fortunately AMD is not a bunch of terminal morons like you claim, and you are just spreading FUD.

tier 1 review sites? are you kidding me? since when has HP, Dell, Sun, IBM, or any other manufacturer even considered Anandtech, Tech Report or any other pro-sumer site when evaluating a platform for development and integration? got a hint for you....NEVER.

i'm definitely not contesting that AMD marketing completely fscked this launch. i'm contesting people who seem (in the face of evidence to the contrary that I've accurately provided) to assume that these folks have the gospel message for Barcelona...which is patently false.

where have i claimed that AMD is a bunch of "terminal morons...."? you must be confusing me for one of the wide variety of pernicious trolls present in this thread.... i had lunch with a Sr AMD FAE today...you think that if i though he was a moron i'd even entertain that?

wow....they never prepared me for this type of response in my degree program. (yes that's a thinly-veiled joke about my education...)

cheers,

dave

[dave_graham]

I'm not sure why you're getting upset. You did direct the comment at me or at least part of it and my comment about why they sent the B1. I wasn't trying to be antagonistic just trying to understand. Actually, I'm for AMD and always have been, haven't had an Intel rig for years. Sorry if you took it the wrong way.

multi-quote doesn't work very well when re-quoting...what happened was your post contained a trace of 3 different responses to 3 separate people interspersed in there.

see the thread here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...&postcount=219


like i said, you're asking honest questions and for that, i'm grateful.

cheers,

[m411b]

hehehe....

again, not a big fan of the L1N in regards to that. additionally, no dual Ht and power planes.

dave

UMM, Yeah!!
That is NOT the L1N board there dude!! It's the Tyan...

[gone_fishin]

tier 1 review sites? are you kidding me? since when has HP, Dell, Sun, IBM, or any other manufacturer even considered Anandtech, Tech Report or any other pro-sumer site when evaluating a platform for development and integration? got a hint for you....NEVER.

i'm definitely not contesting that AMD marketing completely fscked this launch. i'm contesting people who seem (in the face of evidence to the contrary that I've accurately provided) to assume that these folks have the gospel message for Barcelona...which is patently false.

where have i claimed that AMD is a bunch of "terminal morons...."? you must be confusing me for one of the wide variety of pernicious trolls present in this thread.... i had lunch with a Sr AMD FAE today...you think that if i though he was a moron i'd even entertain that?

wow....they never prepared me for this type of response in my degree program. (yes that's a thinly-veiled joke about my education...)

cheers,

dave

So you lunch with SR AMD people.
You should have all the answers then.
If Anandtech and like sites are not in the loop, why did AMD bother to give them test samples? Especially considering your opinion (that is so easily read between the lines) that their input could only hurt AMD and not influence positively any real server based customers like IBM Dell etc.....? Does AMD have an entire PR department that is so incompetent?
On the other hand IF they did not hand out chips for sites like Anand, they surely knew that those sites would get their hands on them soon and do articles anyways. At least you can admit AMD tried to keep as much control of the situation as possible, that does not look incompetent to me.

[PhilDoc]

multi-quote doesn't work very well when re-quoting...what happened was your post contained a trace of 3 different responses to 3 separate people interspersed in there.

see the thread here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...&postcount=219


like i said, you're asking honest questions and for that, i'm grateful.

cheers,

Thanks and my mistake for reading the post wrong. I like many others here appreciate the knowledge and experience you bring to the forum. Like the vast majority of us, I'm just playing in your world. Its been way too long (25yrs) since I did this for a living to totally understand it. So if I ask some naive questions then you know why, lol. But hey, I'm trainable, lol

[mutambo]

AMD did a nice job of putting a presentation to stop -ve press on their site, wish they would have done it before.

At the same time, no where they mentioned using what hardware config they got those benches, it would have shut this whiny article "article"...aaah

[mutambo]

UMM, Yeah!!
That is NOT the L1N board there dude!! It's the Tyan...

[dave_graham]

So you lunch with SR AMD people.
You should have all the answers then.
If Anandtech and like sites are not in the loop, why did AMD bother to give them test samples? Especially considering your opinion (that is so easily read between the lines) that their input could only hurt AMD and not influence positively any real server based customers like IBM Dell etc.....? Does AMD have an entire PR department that is so incompetent?
On the other hand IF they did not hand out chips for sites like Anand, they surely knew that those sites would get their hands on them soon and do articles anyways. At least you can admit AMD tried to keep as much control of the situation as possible, that does not look incompetent to me.

well, let's work our way through this, then.

If Anandtech and like sites are not in the loop, why did AMD bother to give them test samples?

ever hear the quote "there's no such thing as bad marketing?" listen, one way or the other, they were going to start having to answer questions that they probably wanted to do on THEIR terms. there's a tipping point. FWIW, AMD basically embargoed the hell out of a LOT of documents that normally we'd have access to ahead of time. Not trying to apologize for them (as i've stated, it's a up in my opinion).

Especially considering your opinion (that is so easily read between the lines) that their input could only hurt AMD and not influence positively any real server based customers like IBM Dell etc.....?

just because you can read between the lines doesn't mean you're right.
I don't believe that AMD is "hurt" by enterprise regarding this early launch. Again, enterprise companies (like EMC, et al) rely on their own test/dev labs and dedicated FAE (field application engineers) that work one on one with them. Anand, et al. work with pro-sumers; folks that could spend the coin but won't really move beyond the (i'm being conservative here so give me some grace) occasional tray of processors. for example, one of my FDS clients is a small storage company that uses Opterons for their SP (storage processors). They've bought approximately 8 processors from me for test dev. in the past 4 months. That's the kind of target that AMD can aim at with these type of sites, not the big guys who are already receiving the direct attention they deserve. AMD doesn't achieve revenue from the enthusiast market at the same level they do at enterprise...then again, you probably read that between my lines as well.

Does AMD have an entire PR department that is so incompetent?

honestly, this launch doesn't actually impress me at all. it could've been MUCH better handled and done. so, for this launch, YES, they were highly incompetent. (honest enough for you?)

On the other hand IF they did not hand out chips for sites like Anand, they surely knew that those sites would get their hands on them soon and do articles anyways.

eventually, sure...but, there's always the carrot of "you obey the NDA, you get parts..." i went through this a long time ago with Damon, et al. Basically, if you have XXX amount of traffic (and a unique perspective), you'd get on the list for parts....I know for a fact that Anand holds his NDA status near and dear (we've chatted about this) and is loath to jeopardize this. So, there's an inevitable trust that has to be developed and maintained. and, for the record, coolater provides little/no threat to the AMD marketing machine.

At least you can admit AMD tried to keep as much control of the situation as possible, that does not look incompetent to me.

strangely enough, this is one of the most interesting launches i've been apart of. little to no access to power datasheets (embargoed even for those with NDAs), little to no whitepaper access, etc. so, control doesn't need to be a bad thing. (as evidence by those wonderful little "leaks" from Intel regarding Harperstown and Penryn on Anandtech... LOL) problem is, control is a two edged sword: you can control all you want but you do begin to develop a constituency that is somewhat suspicious of your motives...and that chances a big letdown on release...sound familiar?

anyhow, I hope my answers are somewhat helpful...a little less stressed right now so, i'm a little more composed.

dave

[dave_graham]

Thanks and my mistake for reading the post wrong. I like many others here appreciate the knowledge and experience you bring to the forum. Like the vast majority of us, I'm just playing in your world. Its been way too long (25yrs) since I did this for a living to totally understand it. So if I ask some naive questions then you know why, lol. But hey, I'm trainable, lol

i don't mind pissing people off...just want it to be the right people for the right reasons.

i'm a young buck; easily carried away by this.

dave

[metro.cl]

tier 1 review sites? are you kidding me? since when has HP, Dell, Sun, IBM, or any other manufacturer even considered Anandtech, Tech Report or any other pro-sumer site when evaluating a platform for development and integration? got a hint for you....NEVER.

i'm definitely not contesting that AMD marketing completely fscked this launch. i'm contesting people who seem (in the face of evidence to the contrary that I've accurately provided) to assume that these folks have the gospel message for Barcelona...which is patently false.

where have i claimed that AMD is a bunch of "terminal morons...."? you must be confusing me for one of the wide variety of pernicious trolls present in this thread.... i had lunch with a Sr AMD FAE today...you think that if i though he was a moron i'd even entertain that?

wow....they never prepared me for this type of response in my degree program. (yes that's a thinly-veiled joke about my education...)

cheers,

dave

That kind of diferentiation exists in hardware manufacturers i know about that.

[Movieman]

Gentlemen:
People like Steve and Dave come here and take the time to pass out information as a courtesy to us and in friendship and get what in return?
Sarcasm and essentially called liars?
If you disagree with these people thats your right but to attack them is not only wrong it's bad manners.
The next person I see do a personal attack on one of these people who take their valuable time to bring us this info I will ask in the admin section that they be banned from this site.
Your parents taught you manners, USE THEM!

[dave_graham]

That kind of diferentiation exists in hardware manufacturers i know about that.

sure, i can rate sites by traffic, etc. but unnecessarily elevating them to some golden status in the eyes of pro-sumers is a little...tiresome.

remember Alexa?

dave

[dave_graham]

Gentlemen:
People like Steve and Dave come here and take the time to pass out information as a courtesy to us and in friendship and get what in return?
Sarcasm and essentially called liars?
If you disagree with these people thats your right but to attack them is not only wrong it's bad manners.
The next person I see do a personal attack on one of these people who take their valuable time to bring us this info I will ask in the admin section that they be banned from this site.
Your parents taught you manners, USE THEM!

meh...this is fun, Dave...you know that.

now i've got to drive home and worry about my wife and kid(s)

dave

[Movieman]

meh...this is fun, Dave...you know that.

now i've got to drive home and worry about my wife and kid(s)

dave

It's supposed to be fun but some forget that.
Good manners never goes out of fashion and reading some of those comments to you got my Irish up.
People also forget that your in business and take time away from that to bring this info.

[PhilDoc]

i don't mind pissing people off...just want it to be the right people for the right reasons.

i'm a young buck; easily carried away by this.

dave

Well, I'm a little bit of an old dog, lol, and it still irritates me to no end all the tread crapping that goes on. But, what can you do? Just have to consider the source.

[wa77ss]

K. This thread got way to long and off topic for me to read every page.

Can someone please tell me if Barcelona is actually any good?

For example.....which is gonna get me more points in SETI. Barcelona...or the Woodcrests

[Kenetixx]

Yes these threads are getting out of hand, seems alot of ppl have no clue but think they know whats going on, Thanks Dave and Steve for there input. I work for IBM and from what i have seen yesterday on our server platforms AMD is looking pretty good to me, but no doubt im just making up aswell.

[Movieman]

Well, I'm a little bit of an old dog, lol, and it still irritates me to no end all the tread crapping that goes on. But, what can you do? Just have to consider the source.

Phil: What gets me constantly is the degree that people get all up in arms over these issues.
The " I gotta know every benchmark that exists at 12 seconds after launch."
The ones that when they do see numbers don't beleive them.
Then the just insane level that it all gets brought to.
Jeesus, I wish they'd keep a perspective on things.
They want something to look at that is important?
I've got 2 friends in the WCG section that lost their fathers this week.
Now if that doesn't put this back into perspective then nothing will.

[JohannesRS]

Thank God for someone to "clean the house" a bit.

Anyway: I'm really looking forward for more "trustable" benchies, from people that work all day on this kind of babies. Specially cause this people usually say that they "runned bench A, with compiler B, libraries C and compilation flags D, in an E processor with F memory configured in G way, over an H motherboard together with bios version I...".

Forgot something here? There is still half alfabet.

But, that's my point: that's the way opteron and xeon and whatever big processor shall be benched.

[EvlUndrWareNome]

hey Dave,

Ive been avidly reading the thread here. I want to thank you and steven for this great thread about Barcelona

Looking forward to benchmarks!

[PhilDoc]

Phil: What gets me constantly is the degree that people get all up in arms over these issues.
The " I gotta know every benchmark that exists at 12 seconds after launch."
The ones that when they do see numbers don't beleive them.
Then the just insane level that it all gets brought to.
Jeesus, I wish they'd keep a perspective on things.
They want something to look at that is important?
I've got 2 friends in the WCG section that lost their fathers this week.
Now if that doesn't put this back into perspective then nothing will.

Well, that should put things into perspective. My heart goes out to them. Certainly have seen enough of that in my day. If I contributed to the mayhem, I appologize. Thanks for stepping in an bringing some order to this thread.

[Movieman]

Well, that should put things into perspective. My heart goes out to them. Certainly have seen enough of that in my day. If I contributed to the mayhem, I appologize. Thanks for stepping in an bringing some order to this thread.

no, you didn't, you just happenned to post then and got caught in the message..No issue with you here..