AMD R790 Thermal Disipation

[Movieman]

Jesus Christ you're pathethic.

And you now have a 3 day vacation to think about your language.
People here aren't to be insulted.
You can feel privileged though.
You the first non spammer that I've given a vacation to.

[Mekrel]

I do hope I'm going to be proved wrong with the new AMD chipsets, my previous experiences were probably due to owning 3 nForce chipsets (nF2 Ultra, nF3 250GB and nF4 UltrA) which were all very robust chipsets.

Anyone know why SB600 only had two stripe sizes for raid 0? 64k and 128k were the only selectable raid array sizes

[Syn.]

15W TDP and all nice features like 2 CPU support, HT3, PCIe2.0 (2x16 or 4x8), etc... So you can't even compare it to X38! You need to look at power hungry Intel server chipset with half of that capabilities...

Intel's chipsets are done on 90nm ( X38/P35/P965 ) or 130nm ( 975 ).

Excuses, excuses...

AMD makes 90nm CPU's with IMC which you compare to Intel's 65nm CPU's withouth an IMC.

Now you are saying that Intel chipsets carry the extra weight of an MC and being produced on 90nm compared to AMD's RD790 which has no MC and you seem to belive is made on process smaller then 90nm. You are saying this comparison is not vaild yet everyone here uses that comparison when CPU's are involved.

RD790 is going to be a better chipset then X38 and it will run cooler so learn to deal with it because thats just the way things are.


DoubleZero, do your self a favour when you come from your "holiday" and add ShIntel to your ignore list it helps alot trust me.

[Movieman]

Excuses, excuses...

AMD makes 90nm CPU's with IMC which you compare to Intel's 65nm CPU's withouth an IMC.

Now you are saying that Intel chipsets carry the extra weight of an MC and being produced on 90nm compared to AMD's RD790 which has no MC and you seem to belive is made on process smaller then 90nm. You are saying this comparison is not vaild yet everyone here uses that comparison when CPU's are involved.

RD790 is going to be a better chipset then X38 and it will run cooler so learn to deal with it because thats just the way things are.

DoubleZero, do your self a favour when you come from your "holiday" and add ShIntel to your ignore list it helps alot trust me.

I sent DoubleZero on his "holiday" and if you don't change your tone you can join him. I've had enough of this getting emailed 60 times a day over reported posts because someone pissed in someones cheerios.

I highlighted the part of your post that you could have left out and still made your point.
Then the second you should have done by PM. To do it here constitutes and attack on Shintai..Deserved or not..
Get my point? Play nice please and leave out the personal stuff so my fingers don't get arthritis from typing these messages.
Thank you.

[Shintai]

I think one thing we can all agree on is, that the chipsets are getting down slowly after nVidia hit the roof (hopefully).

Secondly, you cant just calculate TDP using Icc max and the voltage. Alot, if not all of the time its for very short peaks only. The prime example is x975 vs P965.

It should also be pretty clear that this northbridge cooler cant remove 19W
http://usa.asus.com/prog_content/mid...spx?model=1595

In that case, we could just aswell run P-Ms with the same cooler. Or mobile C2D/Turion with alitte bigger passive too. To help compare, even VIA CPus tend to use an active cooler over 10-12W.

[NickS]

RD600 uses SB600, which is equal (slightly superior) to the current Intel and nVidia southbridges.

ROFL

SB600 is superior to NVIDIA's suckbridges, yes.. but saying it is superior to ICH7R, ICH8R or ICH9R makes me LOL. Ever compare SATA HDD performance? It's like night and day!

[nn_step]

I think one thing we can all agree on is, that the chipsets are getting down slowly after nVidia hit the roof (hopefully).

Secondly, you cant just calculate TDP using Icc max and the voltage. Alot, if not all of the time its for very short peaks only. The prime example is x975 vs P965.

It should also be pretty clear that this northbridge cooler cant remove 19W
http://usa.asus.com/prog_content/mid...spx?model=1595

In that case, we could just aswell run P-Ms with the same cooler. Or mobile C2D/Turion with alitte bigger passive too. To help compare, even VIA CPus tend to use an active cooler over 10-12W.

Well one of the nice features of thermal dynamics is that you can just make a bigger heatsink and it'll keep quiet and cool but you'll get the rollercoaster style of heatsinks that have now become popular on Intel boards. I'd also light to note that under 5w doesn't require any heatsink (unless you want to overclock it) I do however believe that 15w is going to be the high end, since a good many of their CPUs are spec'd for 65w and perform with much less power.

ROFL

SB600 is superior to NVIDIA's suckbridges, yes.. but saying it is superior to ICH7R, ICH8R or ICH9R makes me LOL. Ever compare SATA HDD performance? It's like night and day!

http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2891&p=6
I know for a fact that the SB600 outperforms Intel ICH7R

[Mekrel]

This is exactly what I'm on about with reviews, nice to see they conveniently left out SB600 RAID in that test. It really does suffer in a RAID setup. I'm sure it's down to the array size like I said earlier.

Fuggers 4*150GB raptor raid array was probably fast because of this reason, where as my 2*150GB raptor raid array is slow. Tried with both 64 and 128k.

[Shintai]

Well one of the nice features of thermal dynamics is that you can just make a bigger heatsink and it'll keep quiet and cool but you'll get the rollercoaster style of heatsinks that have now become popular on Intel boards. I'd also light to note that under 5w doesn't require any heatsink (unless you want to overclock it) I do however believe that 15w is going to be the high end, since a good many of their CPUs are spec'd for 65w and perform with much less power.


http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2891&p=6
I know for a fact that the SB600 outperforms Intel ICH7R

Uhm,...you do know its everyone that uses alot of copper?
And you do know Intel boards also comes in the "copper light editions"? Just like the P5B Plus I showed you.

Is this a rollercoaster board?
http://us.dfi.com.tw/Upload/Product_...Y%20975X-G.jpg

And what would you call this?
http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/5...US_M3A_MVP.jpg

5W, no heatsink? Wrong again. In that case no southbridge would have it. And the VIA CPus stillawith a heatsink wouldn´t need it.

[AbelJemka]

1. P5B Plus heat like hell as soon you overclock.
2. 975X not very hot for sure.
3. Come on its Asus, they put ton of copper everywhere

[nn_step]

Uhm,...you do know its everyone that uses alot of copper?
And you do know Intel boards also comes in the "copper light editions"? Just like the P5B Plus I showed you.

Is this a rollercoaster board?
http://us.dfi.com.tw/Upload/Product_...Y%20975X-G.jpg

And what would you call this?
http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/5...US_M3A_MVP.jpg

5W, no heatsink? Wrong again. In that case no southbridge would have it. And the VIA CPus stillawith a heatsink wouldn´t need it.

The second board is an example of rollercoaster heatsink, the first isn't.
Take a Via 890 and remove the heatsink and It'll run just fine in 70f temps

[Shintai]

The second board is an example of rollercoaster heatsink, the first isn't.
Take a Via 890 and remove the heatsink and It'll run just fine in 70f temps

So in that case the AMD board is the rollercoster and the Intel aint? So small things to change the perception.

[nn_step]

So in that case the AMD board is the rollercoster and the Intel aint? So small things to change the perception.

nope, to show one example of an AMD rollercoaster board and one example of one Intel nonrollercoaster board doesn't prove a point.
look 144 AMD boards that aren't rollercoaster (14 that are) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...nufactory=1521
and look 96 Intel board that are rollercoaster
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...d&Order=PRICED

[Shintai]

nope, to show one example of an AMD rollercoaster board and one example of one Intel nonrollercoaster board doesn't prove a point.
look 144 AMD boards that aren't rollercoaster (14 that are) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...nufactory=1521
and look 96 Intel board that are rollercoaster
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...d&Order=PRICED

You make a mood point. fact is we can show about an equal number of each with the same rollercoaster heatsinks. not because they need them as such. but because people buy blink. Rigth now its abit more with Intel, but thats because Intel got the performance crowd and enthutiast boards are targetted at that. 96 got, 238 doesnt. So again, whats the point in terms of TDP?

Remember?

Well one of the nice features of thermal dynamics is that you can just make a bigger heatsink and it'll keep quiet and cool but you'll get the rollercoaster style of heatsinks that have now become popular on Intel boards

Also your southbridge note:

I'd also light to note that under 5w doesn't require any heatsink (unless you want to overclock it)

So wrong wrong wrong wrong. You think even the lowend boards with a small northbridge heatsink would have a heatsink on the southbridge if it wasn´t required with razor thin margins?

[Gambit_2K]

It has nothing to do with tweaking, people have reported the same. Sending boards back, getting RMA replacements which can't do the same settings as the board they sent back. It's completely random.

Running sync (which was faster) took so much voltage, thats why it took me 1.7 pretty much to get that sort of FSB out of it.

ICFX was a nice tweaking board, but RD600 is the worst chipset out of 965/975/680i/P35. Slowest clock for clock because of the dual bus design to give full unlinkable memory, poor raid performance, seemed very fragile with the amount of dead boards.

I think your confusing what DFI and what Ati does with this board. How can Ati make the board fragile? And the raid performance is still ahead of nVidia so the board is between intel and nVidia in that area. http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/02/...lls/page9.html

It's still a cooler board then what both intel and nvidia has to offer. If you crank up the voltage to say around 2V on the RD600 and then on the 680 and and we use the same cooler, the 680 would be the hotter running chipset. http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/02/...ls/page11.html

And yes the chipset is slower clock for clock but it's still faster in 3dgames.

Btw you have en insanely bad board if it takes you 1.7V to get 450+ FSB. I've returned boards for less.

[dexman]

And what would you call this?
http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/5...US_M3A_MVP.jpg

I call it Asus slowly realizing how to properly cool motherboards components. It seems to me that NB is not connected to the power circuitry at all which absolutely makes sense. Only thing I don't like and don't get are the heatpipes on the right side of NB ending between rams.(sandwich heater for rams? )

Don't make judgment based on one board. If I had to make an opinion on P35 by looking at DQ6 I would had to called it a power hog, which is not a case. See DS3 heatsink.

5W, no heatsink? Wrong again. In that case no southbridge would have it. And the VIA CPus stillawith a heatsink wouldn´t need it.

You don' necassary need heatsink for 4-5W SB. There are boards that don't have one. I think they use them just in case, they´re cheap anyway and might help with stability when non-stock voltages are applied.

[BrowncoatGR]

I wouldnt use RAID without a seperate controller, although these are hard to find for pcie or too expensive.

[Shintai]

I call it Asus slowly realizing how to properly cool motherboards components. It seems to me that NB is not connected to the power circuitry at all which absolutely makes sense. Only thing I don't like and don't get are the heatpipes on the right side of NB ending between rams.(sandwich heater for rams? )

Don't make judgment based on one board. If I had to make an opinion on P35 by looking at DQ6 I would had to called it a power hog, which is not a case. See DS3 heatsink.

You don' necassary need heatsink for 4-5W SB. There are boards that don't have one. I think they use them just in case, they´re cheap anyway and might help with stability when non-stock voltages are applied.

I dont make any judgement on that. nn_step does.

The NB is connected to the power heatsink btw.

Can you show me boards that are in the 3-4W TDP range on the southbridge that dont have a heatsink on it? Even cheap aint cheap enough if it aint needed on the lowend boards.

[Mekrel]

I think your confusing what DFI and what Ati does with this board. How can Ati make the board fragile? And the raid performance is still ahead of nVidia so the board is between intel and nVidia in that area. http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/02/...lls/page9.html

It's still a cooler board then what both intel and nvidia has to offer. If you crank up the voltage to say around 2V on the RD600 and then on the 680 and and we use the same cooler, the 680 would be the hotter running chipset. http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/02/...ls/page11.html

And yes the chipset is slower clock for clock but it's still faster in 3dgames.

Btw you have en insanely bad board if it takes you 1.7V to get 450+ FSB. I've returned boards for less.

I'm on a bout the chipset, not the board itself. A low voltage of 1.5v being specified as the safe max with any time of cooling makes it very fragile. Proof is in the pudding as they say, and the RMA rate of the board is high.

Raid performance is slow, seriously - why are people arguing this?
There is a few posts where people such as OldGuy and a few other members in the RD600 thread by Tony where ATi Raid results are shocking. 680i raid isn't brilliant, being as it took a few bios releases to even make it useable but you can at least tweak it through drivers, such as turning off command queuing etc. Something you can't do on RD600.

I have the product, and I'm slating it because it's the poorest implementation of RAID I have ever used. Still, I'll ask for a third time - why do you only have the choice of 64k and 128k for ATi Raid? Is it really that untweakable?

Well my board is bad, it has never ran right from the start. It has a broken dimm slot and doesn't apply voltages right.

[dexman]

I dont make any judgement on that. nn_step does.

re-read you first post of this thread. you were implying that RD790 can't be that cool with all that copper, based on one board showing.

Can you show me boards that are in the 3-4W TDP range on the southbridge that dont have a heatsink on it? Even cheap aint cheap enough if it aint needed on the lowend boards.

it's not needed for most of the times but there are situations when it may come handy and saves some RMAs - hot countries, poor airflow in the case... you get the picture. those tiny heatsinks aren't being a great help anyway.

http://www.asus.com.tw/products4.asp...97&modelmenu=2
http://www.intel.com/products/mother...GCCR/index.htm
http://www.asus.com/products4.aspx?m...3&l2=11&l3=473

[krille]

At first I thought it really was a vpu @ 15w before I noticed the chart said RD790. Anyway, 15w for a chipset is really nice too.

Will there be an Intel CPU compatible equivalent? (I guess not...)

[2good4you]

I'll believe it when I see it.

This is basically a ATi chipset with AMD's name on it (being as AMD never had their own chipset out for sockets 754/939).

Past chipsets such as RD580/RD600 were supposed to have low TDP and run amazingly cool, but neither did.

As |3ourne said before. The RD580 chipset is NOT hot and has low TDP.

My evidence on that is that I know, I have played with 3 RD580 boards, many sites has proved that so is and the SB600 is also very good with low TDP and has excellent USB/SATA performance. Shortly said, a very good chipset that also seems to be compatible with the upcoming Phenom processors like other AM2 boards should be.

[zanzabar]

the severs have socket p, aka 2x socket f, or socket l single is the same as socket f they have to many names for the same socket

and the nihilem will have the same integrated style memory controller so well so who gets the win there

[Fairydust]

Looking forward to the RS790, hopefully a worthy successor to the 690G.

[xlink]

Damn my 49 in Spanish II...

i slept in class in spanish 2 didn't try etc. did none fo the homework etc. relied off my tests and quizes()don't even know my 2nd semester grade, I had senioritis. I understood every word on there. They are mostly cognates.

AMD is quickly coming up with their RD790, high end chipset for their AMD64 processors. I have secured that el sitio with much info on the new generation of AMD chipsets.

History:

confidential ATi info
Lots of info on RD790
Roadmap AMD-Chipsets
AMD RD790 Codename: Wahoo
Update AMD CHipset Roadmap
Gigabyte RD790 Quad Crossfire


Resume:

* RD790 is AMD's highend chipset
* RD790 is made @ 65nm and operates at 1.1v
* has demensions of 27x27mm
* Supports HT3
* Socket F 1207 with 2P support
* PCI-Express 2.0 with 2x16x or 4x8x
* date of launch is H2 2007

now the novelty:

Max Tcase: Max temp recomended 105ºC
Tj MAx: Max temp that it can support with damage to the chipset
min Temperature of operation: 0ºC


These solutions arise from the possible scenario AMD presented.it is the following:

Running 3dmark01 ot 3dmark06 at a min resolusion of 1600x1200 with an ambient temp of 45ºC, maintaining the system's fans at minimal RPMs.




with such a TDP with small, low RPM chipset coolers , are recommended by AMD for this chipset.

it's a rough translation but the meaning is all there. Someone correct me if otherwise. para soy gringo y no hablo espanol con frequencia. Tambien no sabo como insertar acentos