Philly Boys Golem

[Philly_Boy]

Was just thining Philly, you could throw the chiller onto a radiator and pull some nice a/c for the setup if you decide to dice or ln2 the gpu's or cpu at the event.

Or even cool my NB/SB/mosfets to sub zero temps.....muahahahaha

[INJViper]

Or even cool my NB/SB/mosfets to sub zero temps.....muahahahaha

Can you say overkill?

[Planet]

Or even cool my NB/SB/mosfets to sub zero temps.....muahahahaha

We already had one die...

Can you say overkill?

Can you say another dead board.

Pink? Looks orange to me?

Inside joke. It is orange but when you look through it top to bottom in a dark room or put it up to the sky and look through it shows up pink.

[Philly_Boy]

Gawd...I hate the voice of reason.....but you're right....the chiller will be the CPU cooling back up. I will prep it so it's ready to go. I'll get the insulation today and we'll fill it and add a block tomorrow.

[Nefilav]

Methanol+distilled water yields the best result Philly_Boy, but methanol is toxic so it should be stored in an airtight container, don't use it if the container isn't sealed.
Where is Epion and his methanol to ethanol freezing comparison chart??

Methanol also sucks plasticizer out of Masterkleer which makes that combination dangerous to use. Clearflex PVC doesn't get affected by methanol. Haven't tried Tygon or tested Masterkleer/ClearFlex PVC with ethanol or anti freeze. Soak whatever tubing you choose in your coolant of choice before setting anything up. The rubber O-ring on my Iwaki did get a bit more brittle (methanol replacing moisture) but it was fine for 3 months so a bench will be alright.

Anti freeze in any ratio to water is an inferior coolant because it slushes up and offers no benefit.

Edit: Found the chart!
http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5...ethanolmj2.jpg

[serialk11r]

Methanol+distilled water yields the best result Philly_Boy, but methanol is toxic so it should be stored in an airtight container, don't use it if the container isn't sealed.
Where is Epion and his methanol to ethanol freezing comparison chart??

Methanol also sucks plasticizer out of Masterkleer which makes that combination dangerous to use. Clearflex PVC doesn't get affected by methanol. Haven't tried Tygon or tested Masterkleer/ClearFlex PVC with ethanol or anti freeze. Soak whatever tubing you choose in your coolant of choice before setting anything up. The rubber O-ring on my Iwaki did get a bit more brittle (methanol replacing moisture) but it was fine for 3 months so a bench will be alright.

Anti freeze in any ratio to water is an inferior coolant because it slushes up and offers no benefit.

Edit: Found the chart!
http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5...ethanolmj2.jpg

Hold on a minute there, why would Masterkleer get its plasticizer sucked out but not Tygon or Clearflex? They're all PVC tubes...and PVC tubes are supposed to be resistant to alcohol.

[Philly_Boy]

Methanol+distilled water yields the best result Philly_Boy, but methanol is toxic so it should be stored in an airtight container, don't use it if the container isn't sealed.
Where is Epion and his methanol to ethanol freezing comparison chart??

Methanol also sucks plasticizer out of Masterkleer which makes that combination dangerous to use. Clearflex PVC doesn't get affected by methanol. Haven't tried Tygon or tested Masterkleer/ClearFlex PVC with ethanol or anti freeze. Soak whatever tubing you choose in your coolant of choice before setting anything up. The rubber O-ring on my Iwaki did get a bit more brittle (methanol replacing moisture) but it was fine for 3 months so a bench will be alright.

Anti freeze in any ratio to water is an inferior coolant because it slushes up and offers no benefit.

Edit: Found the chart!
http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/5...ethanolmj2.jpg

Thanks a bunch....I thought I remember reading that grain alcohol/water would produce the best results...

[Nefilav]

I've felt a lot safer using methanol as a lab burner fuel for years and 3 months in a chiller rather then needing a higher ratio of ethanol which makes the beer cooler a giant bomb. Kind of odd to read about people playing with high pressure flammable gas, electricity and water but methanol is dangerous and cannot be used!

It eats aluminum viciously but no serious WC loop has exposed alu or lack of corrosive inhibitors...doesn't even seem to clean the oxide off copper.

If you are worried someone might come in and drink it, bring Everclear as the counter to methanol poisoning is drunkeness, the body will metabolize the ethanol harmlessly. Methanol is metabolized into formaldehyde but it cannot happen if the body is metabolizing ethanol instead.

I had Zerex in my chiller but I am not sure it would make a noticable impact in temperatures, I had it for the corrosion inhibition. 3 months everything is okay and then suddenly the zinc anodized evaporator's steel components instantly rust up. You have a nice clean professional chiller, doesn't matter.

NOL is right about the TECs, it helps less in cold I've tried. The effect is still there at your planned temps so its a good idea for benching but obviously 24/7 be prepared for a hefty power bill.

[Philly_Boy]

I've felt a lot safer using methanol as a lab burner fuel for years and 3 months in a chiller rather then needing a higher ratio of ethanol which makes the beer cooler a giant bomb. Kind of odd to read about people playing with high pressure flammable gas, electricity and water but methanol is dangerous and cannot be used!

It eats aluminum viciously but no serious WC loop has exposed alu or lack of corrosive inhibitors...doesn't even seem to clean the oxide off copper.

If you are worried someone might come in and drink it, bring Everclear as the counter to methanol poisoning is drunkeness, the body will metabolize the ethanol harmlessly. Methanol is metabolized into formaldehyde but it cannot happen if the body is metabolizing ethanol instead.

I had Zerex in my chiller but I am not sure it would make a noticable impact in temperatures, I had it for the corrosion inhibition. 3 months everything is okay and then suddenly the zinc anodized evaporator's steel components instantly rust up. You have a nice clean professional chiller, doesn't matter.

NOL is right about the TECs, it helps less in cold I've tried. The effect is still there at your planned temps so its a good idea for benching but obviously 24/7 be prepared for a hefty power bill.

Thanks much for your words of wisdom....obviously this is my first experience at chilled water. I do remember reading back in the day (sheesh I've been around here too darn long) that a guy ran either Stoli or Grey Goose vodka in his chiller and swore by it. Talked about loaded temps like -35c. Well we have bigger heat loads to dissapate these days, but I will get a bottle of Everclear this afternoon and try a 50/50 mix with distilled water with a little Prestone thrown in as a 'whatever' inhibitor. I don't think the loop will hold 20-25 ounces...how much antifreeze should I add?

I will be running either a D-Tek Fusion or an Apogee GTX as the block for the chiller....now officially named "The Philly Water Ice Chiller"

[Nefilav]

I don't really post unless I have relevant knowledge to help someone else out and Epion hasn't shown up yet.


Vodka is certainly viable to use, however thats good booze that can be drank instead, use that chart to figure out how much you "need" and once it stops freezing, add 5% more to account for the alcohol's rapid evaporation. use 5% Prestone if this is just a test and find some Zerex or Pentosin for later they don't slush. If the loop is all copper the methanol won't do anything, The steel in my ghetto chiller was the evaporator's "clamps" that held the copper tubing together and allowed it to be secured to the chassis. Just regular steel anodized, cheap as possible disaster waiting to happen.

Wood alcohol, methyl hydrate, methanol is...well methanol. Grain alcohol is ethanol with 5-10% methanol+bitterants to make it undrinkable, still poisonous. Everclear would be grain alcohol minus the poison to make it drinkable and thus taxable.

The danger here with ethanol is adding enough to make the whole mixture flammable, methanol will not reach that point and give you much better carrying capacity as far as heat dump goes because there is more water around, methanol itself is a terrible coolant.

Using a D-tek Fuzion or Apogee GTX is cause for concern due to the Delrin used. I snapped a Swiftech Storm (delrin) barb with my hands as a test after having it sit in my -30 beer cooler. My hands apply much less force then mounting mechanisms, thermal expansion/contraction. The GTX also has anodized aluminum which is an unknown variable. It may pull through for benching but you may end up with a lot of dead expensive hardware if its left for 24/7. I used a Swiftech MCW6002 and a Silverprop Fusion SL (with a low temperature rated) O-ring in my chiller, zero problems.

Having 2 seperate materials tightly clamped to each other and frozen/heated constantly doesn't work well. If you want this chiller for 24/7 try finding a Swiftech MCW6002, its only 1 degree worse then a Fuzion I'm guessing from the posts I've seen. A Silverprop waterblock might be harder to find but not impossible. I cannot say for sure what the performance of the FusionSL is but it gives me a 7 degree delta between ambient/load on my 7900GTX at 750 core stock volts (this card's die is huge) so it is not a shoddy block.

[n00b 0f l337]

Switching to something alchohol based. Tested it today with prestone mixed with water, and that stuff is de-icer not anti-freeze (my bad), HX froze up and flow dropped. Possibly the MD-15 is just too weak
We'll get this sorted though, temps were already below 0 though.

[Nefilav]

There is a Prestone brand anti freeze but it is most likely glycol based therefore unsuitable due to slushing. MD-15 will be fine, I used an MD20RLZ with methanol+water, just changed the O-ring out for a low temp rated kind since it was long term use. Modzilla's chiller build had all the O-rings replaced with Devcon 250 industrial epoxy thats a more permament solution.

[boshuter]

I have ran windshield washer fluid straight in a chiller and it works fine to about -35c, but it does have some detergents in it that some people say is not good; I didn't see any probems with it though. In my last chiller the WW fluid was slushing up because the temps were below -40c unloaded, I got a bottle of RV water system anti-freeze and it works great, no detergents, not thick like car anti-freeze, and you don't need to mix it with anything. It's good to -50c.

[n00b 0f l337]

It might be better to pump into the HX, might swap it around this afternoon.

[p8ntslinger676]

or you could get some 99% pure isopropyl at the store, at the store down the street form me the stuff is dirt cheap, like $1 a bottle and 2 or 3 bottles would fill a decent sized loop. plus its not viscous so it would flow real well, and you wouldnt have to worry about slush occuring