Small home made reusable refrigerant tank

[wdrzal]

r22 is classified as a very high pressure refrigerant.iirc

[Starkiller42]

Very nice find, NOL! I may just snag one of those instead of spending money on tools, or bidding on shady-looking ones from ebay .

[n00b 0f l337]

I buy my refrigerants there, fairly decent deals all including shipping price.

[Athanatos]

Not DOT approved and way aginst the law as far as EPA regulations! (sect - 608)

big $$$$ fines involved, so id say watch out for the men in suits,


very nice $ saver if every thing works out

EPA is a US governing body ><

[Xeon th MG Pony]

Sweet deal on the Proper recovery cylinders! Though for some reason I doubt shipping is free to Canada lol.

[Ssilencer]

The cheaper recovery tank here, similar to the one you linked, costs U$S330

[ruffus]

hey xeon do i need a recovory system to use this recovory tank

[mytekcontrols]

Quote:
Originally Posted by V2-V3 View Post

making these units is not a violation of any law.

wdrzal responded... Yes it is every unit must be certified by epa and dated...

Hmm... I would think that if a person has EPA certification for working with refrigerants, does proper recovery/disposal of said refrigerants, and is building a system for his or hers own use only (not to sell), then it would not require EPA, UL, CE or anyone elses stamp of approval on your design.

wdrzal since you made the strong statement that I quoted above, can you provide better clarification and/or a link to an official document or source to back it up?

If there is a requirement as you stated, would there be exceptions below a certain size (e.g.; less then a given horsepower or CFM).

It would be most appreciated by myself, and I'm sure others as well.

Thank you

[ruffus]

can any one tell me if this tank is all i need to recover r134a or do i need a recovery unit and the tank

[Exahertz]

you will need something to "pump" the charge into the containment cylinder and pull a low vacuum on the unit. a simple rotary compressor should work.

[ruffus]

exahertz do you know where i can get one now i have a vac pump but that won't work right

[wdrzal]

It been a long time since I took a EPA test,was in the 1000 nationwide but I'm 100&#37; positive that
"only approved recovery equipment is permitted" in fact there is a grand father clause if your equipment is older than dec 1995(don't quote me on that date) you can get a way with pulling only 10hg vacuum.
all my equipment is newer than 2002 shop & personal
on the back of every unit is month and year produced. you wear able to get certified before necessary & recovery equipment was available but it was a pain since it was all hermetic, you should know that if working for polycold as each technician must have his own license.

[Exahertz]

exahertz do you know where i can get one now i have a vac pump but that won't work right

no. Oil Cross-Contamination will occur and you absolutly can not connect a vacuum pump's linet to a pressurized system (Damage WILL occur).
I was talking about a rottary compressor for refridegeration units, or a hermetic compressor. almost any compressor will work but the question is how long you have to spend waiting for it to move the charge. in this case you will need a LBP/MBP compressor (and larger is better )

[ruffus]

exahertz so can i just use the compressor that is in the system sorry if i am asking some dumb qusetions i just want to get it right

[Exahertz]

exahertz so can i just use the compressor that is in the system sorry if i am asking some dumb qusetions i just want to get it right

[ruffus]

hey exahertz can i use this http://cgi.ebay.ca/Hot-Shot-Spooter-...QQcmdZViewItem

[Exahertz]

It looks like it would work fine. just might be a little more physical effort then most technicians are willing to do. check to see if it can pump liquid, otherwise, if its only vapor then these singel valve recovery cylinders would be a bad idea as it would take you forever to move all of the refrigerant as vapor. again if it can only pump vapor you would need a dual valve recovery cylinder so as to use the "push pull method" for refridgerant recovery.

I think this is how its set up, i made this drawing (anybody, PLEASE correct me if im wrong!!!)
Liquid recovery method:

[wdrzal]

There are several methods, you will mostly being recovering vapor . there also a push pull method for large amounts of liquid. that wrong ,but itdoes depend on pump some pumps have as many as 4 ports most modern have 2 a inlet from system and outlet to tank.


mytekcontrols, just because you either took a open book on line EPA type1,as many here did, or have a UNIVERSAL EPA cert, that a long long way from being a engineer to design recovery equipment.

that just supposed to mean you have the technical knowledge to operate the equipment as required.

[mytekcontrols]

wdrzal stated... wdrzal stated... mytekcontrols, just because you either took a open book on line EPA type1,as many here did, or have a UNIVERSAL EPA cert, that a long long way from being a engineer to design recovery equipment.

Actually I took a real test, not open book, and not online, but one that the company (Polycold) paid for all it's technicians to take (including cryo-tek with whom I worked with). And yes I was certified to UNIVERSAL by the ESCO Institute.

At first I was a little perplexed at the comment about designing recovery equipment, because that was not really what I had meant by my original question (stupid me). In my attempt to catch up on what has been going on around here lately (I was off-line for a couple months), I have been skimming the various posts, and I guess I skimmed this one too fast and misunderstood your earlier statement about the legalities of making what I though were refrigeration units, not recovery units. Sorry

I totally agree and see your point on recovery machines and related equipment (recovery cylinders). And I although I do admire Xeon th MG Pony's very creative approach on re-using a propane cylinder as he has shown us. I can clearly see why it would not be legal (or safe) to sell these to others.

At the place I do contract work for, we frown on the re-use of disposable cylinders, and not just because of the possibility of water getting into them (which wouldn't be true for our situation), but also because of the thin wall nature of these tanks. Imagine for every time you filled and then empty the cylinder, you are expanding and contracting it's thin wall. Over time this will cause metal fatigue that could very well cause a rupture. Remember the original design only assumes one filling, and one emptying of a disposable cylinder.

But none-the-less, still a very creative approach.

[Xeon th MG Pony]

thats why I make it clear it is a stop gap to buy time to get proper equipment, not as a final solution. it should last safely for some one to do two or more builds (Probably much longer if they take good care of it) and either by then they'll be don building or hope fully invest in proper equipment.

[n00b 0f l337]

You could also make a basic rupture protection sleeve for this, be it wire of some sort, or a PVC sleeve rated for a much higher pressure. If its snug, it will help protect.

[Exahertz]

wrap it in carbon fiber, that should hold it.

[mytekcontrols]

wrap it in carbon fiber, that should hold it

Wow! World's most expensive DIY recovery tank
But it certainly would make it stronger.

thats why I make it clear it is a stop gap to buy time to get proper equipment, not as a final solution. it should last safely for some one to do two or more builds (Probably much longer if they take good care of it) and either by then they'll be don building or hope fully invest in proper equipment.

I totally agree, and you haven't tried to sell the idea any other way

Now I also know that some guys are using these tanks for phase separators in autocascades (another rather novel idea). But due to the nature of this application, I really don't think it is a very safe way to go. Even though the cylinders are painted on the outside, I wouldn't trust this to completely stop rust caused by the inevitably moisture that gets past the armaflex insulation (a rather popular way of insulating). In fact the moisture problem is many times worse then a tank being used in a free air recovery situation. Once moisture gets past the insulation, it stays there for an indefinite period, continuing to work its way through the paint where ever it can. Add to this the fact that the "propane cylinder-phase separator" under goes a major change in pressure each and every time the system is either started or shut down, and you have a recipe for disaster.

[n00b 0f l337]

Yep, I agree with that and have taken the precuation of buying a box of temprite 304a's to use instead. Though your bullet strainer to phase sep idea is very very well. I think modifing a small receiver would work as well.

[ruffus]

that 1/2 UNF tap is it just 1/2 UNF or does it have a number after UNF