My "murder" project.

[Mankz_91]

Hey Mankz Great project you are running:
Powder = local shoppies.
Cutting = 98% local shoppies too.
His inhouse isn't big enough because of his fish-tanks - is it Charles?

I have local shoppies

[Antioch]

Phew! I just found this thread today, and I burned through the past several hours reading it all. Granted, it's nothing compared to the amount of time put into it, of course.

I must say, as many others have, that you've created something truly magnificent. I've been into water cooling since the days of aquarium pumps and heater cores gutted from old cars and have recently found my way back to the 'scene' as I contemplate my future build - and I'm incredibly astounded at what you (and the rest of the community) have managed to produce and how far you've moved water cooling forward in a few short years.

That being said, I have a few ideas I'd like to offer.

Back in 'my day' (I'm only in my early twenties, but I've been water cooling since I could mow a lawn and stash money away) we had to make use of ugly off-white steel cases and we hacked away at them with blunt instruments. One of the key advancements that has really helped the scene churn out incredible designs is modern manufacturing equipment. Not everyone can have the newest, most advanced power tools, or water-etching, CnC mills. Nor is a skilled, quality machinist to be found locally. Yes, you can order from a machine shop on the other side of the country, but as you've stated before, you never really know the quality put into a part until after you've got it back in your hands.

It is for this reason that I suggest you offer "M3" (or M-cubed) parts in addition to whatever fancy treats you have in store at your store. M3 standing for "minimal murderMod." What I imagine goes hand-in-hand with what another user has already asked you about (but I couldn't ask sooner because I wanted to read the entire thread first!) and that is getting our parts powder-coated by the quality craftsmen you've discovered and developed a relationship with. However, my idea picks up where this leaves off and suggests that you offer faceplates, backplates, topplates, etc. without any designs cut into them - or have users send you files with designs they would like to have etched (again, using the quality machinists you've taken the time and energy to search out). The idea being to offer the ability for those of us who do not have access to high-tech machines to be able to create the designs we've imagined. I think this would help your boost your business because, while MurderBox is a great machine, everyone has their own tweaks they'd like. Moreover, half the fun of modding and making your own machine is building it! Right?

You may have had this very idea in mind for your store, or you may not - but you're welcome to it.

I for one would have no problem paying a reasonable price to ship my parts to you to have them anodized or machined and think it would be well worth it.

Oh, I almost forgot! I've been looking at the pictures you've posted and have noticed that the faceplate does not quite match the rest of the frame. Perhaps the dye used in anodizing is a bit off, perhaps it isn't as deep of a black, or maybe it's the brushstrokes in the aluminum you use. Whatever the reason, I think it would be a great idea to solidify and unify the look by replacing the old 3.5" flip-down door with a piece of the aluminum used for the faceplate. Or at least offer it to those that want it - like me!

Either way, good luck with your business - I wish you much success!

PS - Again, you've done an excellent job and I look forward to seeing your pure|murderBox.

PPS - I would hope that the M3 TJ07s you offer on murderMod will have the silverstone logo and other white paint removed. This paint in the sole reason why I refused to use a TJ07 for my future build as it really detracts from the look of the case. However, seeing your builds with it removed entirely changes the look and feel of the front panel into something I very much want to use.

PPPS - Have you ever experimented or tossed around the idea of putting dual-loops into murderBox? I'm of the opinion that it's better to separate the CPU from the GPU's heat (especially with 2 GPUs) in order to keep the CPU as cool as possible. What do you think?

[Dangals]

That being said, I have a few ideas I'd like to offer.

However, my idea picks up where this leaves off and suggests that you offer faceplates, backplates, topplates, etc. without any designs cut into them - or have users send you files with designs they would like to have etched The idea being to offer the ability for those of us who do not have access to high-tech machines to be able to create the designs we've imagined. I think this would help your boost your business because, while MurderBox is a great machine, everyone has their own tweaks they'd like. Moreover, half the fun of modding and making your own machine is building it! Right?

My understanding of this and Charles you can correct me if I am wrong is that with the backplate there will be the solid version (like FC's version) and the version he showed pics of a few pages back with a cut similar to the top grill...however the recurring theme is that each piece will have the MurderMod name on it....

To me it would not make sense to offer a plain "piece" as the whole thing about buying a MurderMod part is having that branding on it otherwise it simply cannot be classified as being a MurderMod build. And that is what I like about it, I want to buy "MurderMod" parts and not some cheap knock off. You can see from the build that Charles is all about things like clean lines, simplicity and of course perfection It is about buying something that is of the utmost quality and it allows you to build your own MurderMod.

I for one am really looking forward to getting my hands on some MurderMod pieces for my TJ07 as from the one or two brief emails I have received I can tell that Charles would not offer anything that is inferior in anyway. His way of doing things is get it right or dont bother.

PPPS - Have you ever experimented or tossed around the idea of putting dual-loops into murderBox? I'm of the opinion that it's better to separate the CPU from the GPU's heat (especially with 2 GPUs) in order to keep the CPU as cool as possible. What do you think?

I am going to be doing a dual loop with mine once the parts are available and you can be sure I will post pics on here when it happens

[Antioch]

Yes, that's my point - he would offer superior parts with assured quality I'm just saying people might like to cut their own patterns onto the plates. For example, maybe put a blow hole on the back plate or create a different type of grill-style opening on the front to allow more air to enter for an air-only cooling system which the current slits might interfere with aesthetically or otherwise. That's all

[Dangals]

Yes, that's my point - he would offer superior parts with assured quality I'm just saying people might like to cut their own patterns onto the plates. For example, maybe put a blow hole on the back plate or create a different type of grill-style opening on the front to allow more air to enter for an air-only cooling system which the current slits might interfere with aesthetically or otherwise. That's all

I am not sure that would work as getting businesses to do one off jobs that will no doubt get more and more intricate would be a nightmare....it is hard enough to get them to do a small quantity of the same design let alone different designs each time. I do not see that as being a viable option as the costs for a single part would go through the roof let alone the man hours to coordinate it all.

...but do not quote me on that, I am simply using my personal experience when dealing with business for one off jobs.

[.Logic]

Oh, I almost forgot! I've been looking at the pictures you've posted and have noticed that the faceplate does not quite match the rest of the frame. Perhaps the dye used in anodizing is a bit off, perhaps it isn't as deep of a black, or maybe it's the brushstrokes in the aluminum you use.

Spot on, I'm glad that someone else noticed it, I thought it was just me If that one thing could be changed it would just set the entire mod off, at least in my honest opinion.

Apart from that, I love this 'mod' in its entirety, everything from the paint to the sleeving is just perfect. If only the TJ07 had a bit more room (read PA120.3 in the top)

[Antioch]

Dangals - That's true. I don't know what sort of arrangements Charles has with his machinists, and really it's no more work that loading a pattern into a CNC -- that's the beauty of automation But you're right, only Charles really knows. He certainly has a lot on his plate at the moment, but in the future once things sttle into a rhythm I'm sure he'll have time for something. Anyways, it was a possible business idea that I wanted to pass on.

.Logic - Yea it looked just a little bit off. But then again, matching colors is always the trouble, isn't it? You could fit a PA120.2 in the top though. Just put it in the front part of the case where the drive bay is and it shouldn't interfere with the motherboard at all.

[charles_h]

What do you think?

I’ll tell you what I think; you’ve given me a lot to think about and I’ll do my best to respond.

I’d like to start by thanking you for your thoughtful and insightful contribution and most of all, your words of support. I know what we’re doing doesn’t appeal to everyone and that’s cool. At the end of the day this kind of stuff is totally subjective. That being said, I’ve been blown away by the enthusiasm and support for what we’re doing and quite frankly, there are days it’s made all the difference. Days when this has gone wrong or that didn’t work out the way I wanted. I won’t waver in my attention to detail but the support I get here both publicly and privately feels like having an army behind me. Having that feeling motivates me on those challenging days and really helps push me forward…

…and forward is where we’re going. Nils and I have big plans for murderbox and murderMod. We’re also fortunate in that being part of this Community gives us a direct connection to what fellow modders are interested in. Some of these things will fall into our area of ability and some won’t. Speaking for myself, I won’t attempt something I’m not confident I can successfully accomplish. With that in mind, I can say that at this time, we won’t be providing services other than to offer our own case mod designs.

Dangals is pretty much spot on with his observations but I’ll add my commentary none the less. As an example, one of the things I looked into a few months ago was offering custom lettering on the murderMod faceplate. After considerable research, it simply turned out to be cost prohibitive. Anything done in a one-off capacity comes at a premium, even if it’s just a small deviation or alteration to the baseline. In addition to cost, there’s always the unknown factor. One thing I’ve learned in the last year is that things never go as planned. It’s the prototyping and subsequent revision process that ultimately provides success. Additionally, most fabrication shops just aren’t structured for low volume except in the case of prototyping, and that comes at a very high price. It’s my feeling that one-off custom parts are just too expensive to make and therefore not commercially viable. It’s one thing to mod a computer for yourself but another thing entirely to offer parts or completely modded systems as a retail product. Expectations are obviously much higher when you lay down hard earned money for something. You may cut a corner here or there for your own build but will only accept perfect fit and finish from something you buy. At the end of the day, I just don’t see a viable business model that involves offering Customer designed modded parts as a service, at least not at this time.

Another problem is that I would drive my fab shops, anodizers and powder coaters crazy and they would surely kick me to the curb. I won’t tell you how many shops I’ve gone through in the last year to find these guys and I don’t want to do anything to risk losing them. In fact, I actually treat them like my customers because of how important they are to me. Finding people and companies with similar standards for quality was a monumental task and came only after massive effort, grief, blood loss, etc.

I’m going to try to wrap this up because I do have a tendency to ramble. I will re-read your post after a night’s sleep to see if I’ve missed anything and comment further if need be. As for the perceived faceplate “mismatch”; its actually designed to match the side panels and provide textural contrast to the “U” frame. I could have easily matched the faceplate to the frame but I felt the contrast was needed, especially on an all black case like the TJ07. As for the little wee door; I have to admit it’s not my favorite part of the case – I did a faceplate prototype that included that area but it actually looked worse so I scrapped it. The pure|murderbox build will solve for the door – at least on one case. The murderMod TJ07’s will have the Silverstone logos removed; thanks to a full respirator mask.

Cheers.

[Antioch]

That being said, I’ve been blown away by the enthusiasm and support for what we’re doing and quite frankly, there are days it’s made all the difference. Days when this has gone wrong or that didn’t work out the way I wanted. I won’t waver in my attention to detail but the support I get here both publicly and privately feels like having an army behind me. Having that feeling motivates me on those challenging days and really helps push me forward…

I understand where you're coming from and I'm actually happy to hear it. I'm a bit of a perfectionist myself and I usually don't stop until I get something just right - far past the point of "it's good enough" that onlookers reach. That being said, I can appreciate the work you put into your design and whatever you have got going on behind the curtain right now and I'm glad that our words of support help push you through the tough times.

I suppose it's better that we give you time to finish murderMod before we onslaught you with more ideas, huh?

I could have easily matched the faceplate to the frame but I felt the contrast was needed, especially on an all black case like the TJ07.

Oh really? What did you change to have it "mismatch" the front of the case, if you don't mind me asking. Or, to put it another way, how would you change it from the way it is to make it match? I'm just curious as while I know the science of anodization, I've never done a job myself - it's not really worth the price of chemicals to do it once.

The murderMod TJ07’s will have the Silverstone logos removed; thanks to a full respirator mask.

Well that's certainly great news. But be careful! We wouldn't want anything happening in.. a certain area.. that would make your wife come down on us here at XS Haha

[charles_h]

Cheers Antioch.

Essentially, the frame is a rather unique type of anodizing that can best be described as textured - not brushed; while the side panels are brushed. This textured finish reflects light totally differently than brushed anodizing. IMHO, the contrast between the textured frame and the brushed faceplate works really nicely together - something photos don't quite do justice to. It's something that you just have to see in person.

I'll be careful with the green toxic goo. I'm just glad evil98 asked me to look into it - he may have saved my fool life!


.Logic, thank you for your comments.

[Antioch]

Charles - You're probably absolutely right. After all, after Fried Chicken received his murderBox that the pictures don't do it justice.

[.Logic]

.Logic - Yea it looked just a little bit off. But then again, matching colors is always the trouble, isn't it? You could fit a PA120.2 in the top though. Just put it in the front part of the case where the drive bay is and it shouldn't interfere with the motherboard at all.

Yes, it is true, matching colours is an absolute nightmare. What we need is a real life colour dropper

[higgins]

you guys are going to make me buy a tj07 damnit! seriously though, keep the great work up, you're doing a helluva job. can't wait for the site to pop up cheers

[The[R]eaper]

Great work charles and nils Cant wait for the shop to be up to get some MurderMod goodies for my TJ07

i have a question about the faceplate. will there be a version that says "MurderBox" instead of MurderMod"?

Thanks Guys

[hiiyah777]

Great work charles and nils Cant wait for the shop to be up to get some MurderMod goodies for my TJ07

i have a question about the faceplate. will there be a version that says "MurderBox" instead of MurderMod"?

Thanks Guys

I can answer that question:

There is a distinct difference between the two. A Murderbox is a fully modded complete computer system built by Charles himself. It is only offered locally and Charles offers complete support and at-home delivery. That is what this thread is, Friedchicken's Murderbox. A murderMod, however, is just the case and it's components, and they will be available worldwide once the official site is up and running. So, to answer your question, it's a distinguished brand name, if you will, between the two.

Did I miss anything, Charles?

[jimmyxxx]

Charles you should have a name for your company, like murderTeam or something like that

[elite.ire]

hay, just wondering will cable sleveing stuff, lights, fans, tubing ect... be available to buy on murdermod ??, and any ideas when the site is being launched, i cant wait, and love the work m8, keep it up

[hiiyah777]

Charles you should have a name for your company, like murderTeam or something like that

I've suggested Murder, Inc.

Imagine that in a phone book. People calling to get someone knocked off. Charles could eventually end up in an undercover news investigation where they're trying to figure out what he does behind closed doors. I can see it now:

"Here we are standing in front of this supposed 'custom computer shop', where now-infamous alleged assasin Charles H. is inside. We're going to go inside and act like we want a computer built. And once we've gained his trust, we're going to tell him we need someone 'taken care of'...."

I would TiVo that and show the grandkids one day.

[dualbrain]

I can answer some questions:

Murderbox:
hiiyah777 is right PLUS there will also be the option for Murderbox'es in Munich and maaaaaaybe the cities close by. As we want to be in a real-world (eye to eye) contact with our Murderbox-clients and don't want to just ship such a "bloody-handed" machine out, that's why we limit these special builts to out "neighbourhood" ... at least for now.

Murdermod-Accessoires (I hope I spelled it right ... Murdermod Krimskrams in German):
This will most propably be a part of what's available. Most propably there will be different "sets" of items that consist of materials we fell in love with ... or that simply make sense

Murdermod-Website:
Just a handful of things to do. Charles or me will update you when the next milestone is reached.

Btw. thanks for all your support that we get via email and of course here in Charles' thread

[theToX]

cant wait til its up and running. i will most definitely be ordering from you guys.

with my new job in the works and more money on the way...i see myself getting a TJ07 in the future

[GrossmeisterB]

I can answer some questions:



Murdermod-Accessoires (I hope I spelled it right ... Murdermod Krimskrams in German):
This will most propably be a part of what's available. Most propably there will be different "sets" of items that consist of materials we fell in love with ... or that simply make sense

And these will include some of the parts you told me about? The parts I need urgently??

[Tremeloes]

hi charles,

just want to say what a great job this mod is. i´m impressed of the details. i thought nils a crazy guy till i saw this. you two will be a great team and rule the (pc)world someday

hope the shop will be finished soon. saw some pics from steffen´s worklog and his murdermod so i hardly can wait to see all the parts.

go on like this...

Tremeloes

[dualbrain]

Thank you SO much from my side already! May I introduce: Tremeloes ... leading hardware-photo-artist, beautiful-system-builder and very nice online-friend Don't turn red

[charles_h]

Thanks for the comments Guys.

i have a question about the faceplate. will there be a version that says "MurderBox" instead of MurderMod"?

Thanks Guys

I think hiiyah777 and Nils answered this question perfectly.

Did I miss anything, Charles?

No, Cheers Brother.

Charles you should have a name for your company, like murderTeam or something like that

There is a name for the company, it's at the bottom of the website. As for murderTeam - I'm already getting looks like you can't imagine from vendors and suppliers when I say murderbox... Some days I could kick myself for choosing that name!

hay, just wondering will cable sleveing stuff, lights, fans, tubing ect... be available to buy on murdermod ??, and any ideas when the site is being launched, i cant wait, and love the work m8, keep it up

Cheers elite.ire.

We'll start with the basics and add more products as we go. As for the launch, I'm sorry it's taking so long - There's tons of stuff going on behind the scenes but we'll get there. We just want things to be done right. I hate waiting too. Trust me when I say the delays are unavoidable. Thanks for your patience.

I've suggested Murder, Inc.

That's all I need! I get enough trouble with the name murderbox!

i thought nils a crazy guy till i saw this. you two will be a great team and rule the (pc)world someday

Nils is crazy... that's why he's my partner. He's a very unique guy with tons of creative talent and a huge heart - oh, and two brains...

Thank you for your kind words of support Tremeloes. I have to say that your photos are breathtaking! All your work is fantastic and I can't wait to see the result of your recent project.

[Steffen]

Charles and Nils will change the worldwide case market. Their impact is much greater than a few may think.
Million-Dollar-PC as example. I know some guys who just bought themselfes new cases etc. to get on this page.
An Murderbox is an example of awesome craftsmanship. You can feel the passion that Charles and Nils put in this case.
Also your work has changed a lot of peoples minds in look and design. Oh my, i have to focuse or else i am going to cry