AMD Cayman info (or rumor)

[h0bbes]

I do agree that in the cpu market, AMD is not doing great against Intel but in the gfx market, AMD (ATi) is competing pretty well against nvidia and there are lots of pre-built systems or laptops with ATi cards.

[safan80]

you mean as in 3x faster than we need? ^^

seriously, whoever NEEDS that performance is gaming at 2560x1600+ or 1920x1080+ 3D, and if you can afford a display for 500-1000$ then youd have a weird sense of value if you consider 550$ for a vga to feed that display too much...

lol I would not want to paid that price for performance close to the 5970 I want a lot more performance. I want to game at 200fps at 2560x1600 is that too much to ask for?

[saaya]

lol I would not want to paid that price for performance close to the 5970 I want a lot more performance. I want to game at 200fps at 2560x1600 is that too much to ask for?

well that almost IS 3x as much as anybody needs ^^

but yeah, after all the time of the 5970 being out, getting about the same perf for 25% less than the launch msrp of the 5970 isnt really amazing...

[safan80]

well that almost IS 3x as much as anybody needs ^^

but yeah, after all the time of the 5970 being out, getting about the same perf for 25% less than the launch msrp of the 5970 isnt really amazing...

I should add I want idle power usage from my graphics cards. I could care less about load but some of the Nvidia cards have insane idle usage. If they made a GTX 580 dual gpu card I would be interested. Sadly Nvidia releasing a real Fermi card a year after they promised it kinda of pisses me off.

[Jowy Atreides]

6950 is 1536sp @ 890 Mhz apparently.
1gb vram

[trinibwoy]

6950 is 1536sp @ 890 Mhz apparently.
1gb vram

[Flying duck]

AMD is trying to balance DP, Tesselation and keeping shaders fed is a priority due to the lack of efficiency on cypress.
AMD is lacking tesselation output and DP power for their professional setup.
Cayman will be a good balanced card with shader and geometry output.



Andy warhol once said, being famous is 15 minutes in the spotlight.

Nvidas Fermi beats AMD with tesslation which for people who dont understand it is the future of gaming on the PC, due to tesselation we can increase eyecandy while keeping fps high.
We are talking better than crysis 1 and 2 graphics here and better frames per second with tesselation than crysis 1 and 2.

Now, AMD or rather, Richard Huddy states, well our cards have enough tess (damage control) with image/fps quality.(not true)

A game developer thinks, Gee, tessselation allows me to build a cheaper set of textures, due to less time is needed to create the art assest, but they have to build for people who can run the game, which isnt the case with 4800 series from amd, not with their 5800 series and not their 6800 series.

Maybe the adress this in their 6900 series, but then its a 400+us cash game. For that you can buy both a xbox360 and a ps3 with motion gaming for the family.

Fermi is unbalanced card for the moment, the 580gtx shows how its done and it is still on 40nm, with 28nm they be rocking due to what they have learned from their implementation and yes, they still build big chips.
Faster dosnt allow small.

Its like guys and their e-penis, if its big and powerful they feel really good about themself, if its small and efficient they can fool themselves until they met a girl, who knows big and powerful when she see one.

In the technology you need money and resources, Intel got those in spades so does Nvidia.
AMD is still a low budget company with horrible marketing.

People dont buy that often with wellinformed decisions, they buy from benchmarks and just walking into the store buying a computer.
They buy what they know off and it isnt AMD.

Intel inside, the way it meant to be played with NVidia.
Now, where is AMD in that arena?
Nowhere....

Ummm Zero respect for this guy, he's pretty much demonstrated he has no forward thinking ability, and hasn't fully got a handle on the facts as it stands today...

[Flying duck]

^^^
Not to mention he's either high or insane...

[spursindonesia]

Hurt who? The release and price of the 4870 was a nightmare for Nvidia. ATI crashed NV party and worse, with quite the quantity of cards. AMD plans for a card really didn't change course. This if anything demonstrates how you can kill a launch with the right product.

If you mean didn't hurt AMD, of course it didn't. AMD plans were just reinforced by the outrageous pricing of the gtx 280. This is a different scenario for NV though as they have no cards to sell, just cards that can be used as marketing tools. Releasing a completely inferior product that can be used only for marketing at this point in time would be simply pointless.

It would be better to spin and not release a card at all(just say a card is coming, like they did with the gtx 480) to hold back sales of cayman. They can't do this if gf110 is released already and people already know its performance.

Giving performance details when your card is not released yet and your competitors card are out with quantity is like showing your cards at the first turn on poker. Your just giving your competitors the advantage because people will know whether to wait for the cards or not. I think NV has confidence at this point on the performance of gf110 to pull such a movie.

If NV cards is 600 dollars and cayman xt is 500 and faster, NV would have just done AMD a favor. Worse yet, you didn't even sell any cards before the arrival of the cayman xt because you didn't have any. That just sounds like a notoriously dumb marketing move and would just help AMD.

One more thing that has lead me to believe NV is not completely screwed anymore is their stock.

http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2010/1...es-downgrades/

It has been upgraded from neutral to buy by analysts and the stock has risen 20% in the last month too.

If NV was completely screwed, I don't think this would be the case.

Sincerely, part of me hopes you're right regarding this, GTX 580 rocks & priced sensibly @US$ 549 at most (i'm quite confident it will, with the leaked info that i've got about it), and HD 6970 is somewhat inferior and costs @US$ 449 at most, fulfilling my pricing expectation & nullifying yours. Therefore, i don't have to part ways with this forum posting wise for the next 6 months.

OTOH, the other part of me is willing to take the punishment, as long we get another R300 coming our way. I'm just torn inside.

[trinibwoy]

6950 is 1536sp @ 890 Mhz apparently.
1gb vram

Forrest@B3D. Not sure if he's messing around or not.

Cayman is 4-VLIW arch. Pro has 22 SIMD and XT has 24. 32KB is the LDS size not L1 cache size.

I have the gpu!

[GoldenTiger]

Forrest@B3D. Not sure if he's messing around or not.

He also says:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forrest
Wavefront size is 64 so its still 16-way.
-------
(some other guy)
-------
So it's 1536sp/96TMUs for the XT and 1408sp/88TMUs for the PRO.

[bill_d]

you mean as in 3x faster than we need? ^^

seriously, whoever NEEDS that performance is gaming at 2560x1600+ or 1920x1080+ 3D, and if you can afford a display for 500-1000$ then youd have a weird sense of value if you consider 550$ for a vga to feed that display too much...

but only had to buy my 30" once but have had to buy two gpu's a year and yes it adds up, so about 350 per gpu is about right or the 700 i payed for a 5970

[generics_user]

AMD is trying to balance DP, Tesselation and keeping shaders fed is a priority due to the lack of efficiency on cypress.
AMD is lacking tesselation output and DP power for their professional setup.
Cayman will be a good balanced card with shader and geometry output.



Andy warhol once said, being famous is 15 minutes in the spotlight.

Nvidas Fermi beats AMD with tesslation which for people who dont understand it is the future of gaming on the PC, due to tesselation we can increase eyecandy while keeping fps high.
We are talking better than crysis 1 and 2 graphics here and better frames per second with tesselation than crysis 1 and 2.

Now, AMD or rather, Richard Huddy states, well our cards have enough tess (damage control) with image/fps quality.(not true)

A game developer thinks, Gee, tessselation allows me to build a cheaper set of textures, due to less time is needed to create the art assest, but they have to build for people who can run the game, which isnt the case with 4800 series from amd, not with their 5800 series and not their 6800 series.

Maybe the adress this in their 6900 series, but then its a 400+us cash game. For that you can buy both a xbox360 and a ps3 with motion gaming for the family.

Fermi is unbalanced card for the moment, the 580gtx shows how its done and it is still on 40nm, with 28nm they be rocking due to what they have learned from their implementation and yes, they still build big chips.
Faster dosnt allow small.

Its like guys and their e-penis, if its big and powerful they feel really good about themself, if its small and efficient they can fool themselves until they met a girl, who knows big and powerful when she see one.

In the technology you need money and resources, Intel got those in spades so does Nvidia.
AMD is still a low budget company with horrible marketing.

People dont buy that often with wellinformed decisions, they buy from benchmarks and just walking into the store buying a computer.
They buy what they know off and it isnt AMD.

Intel inside, the way it meant to be played with NVidia.
Now, where is AMD in that arena?
Nowhere....

way to troll...

[Aten-Ra]

4 Rasterizers with 2 tessellator unis.

2 Rasterizer with a Tessellation Unit per Ultra-Threaded Dispatch Processor (UTDP) and each UTDP has 12 SIMDs.

What do you think ??

[Lightman]

Forrest@B3D. Not sure if he's messing around or not.

He's most certainly not. Only thing is that he might have the cards factory disabled by AMD with usual pre-launch crippled BIOS but I doubt that's the case so close to launch.

You should remember his post from last year and first pics of Juniper he posted on B3D.

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread...65#post1341265

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.p...postcount=3994

[hurrdurr]

The card has 8 plus 6 pin power (which makes 300W) so I think it'll be around 250W, which is consistent with what we have heard until now.

If AMD has managed to keep performance/watt the same as 6800 (5770's perf/watt is around the same as 5870's, for example), we could be looking at a card that's 65% faster than HD6870, which would make it:

- 50-55 percent faster than HD5870.
- 15 percent faster than HD5970.
- 12-14 percent faster than the GTX 580 which according to rumors should be around 15 to 20 percent faster than GTX 480.

[Solus Corvus]

Also we must consider that a new core configuration will have a variable improvement in various applications. Real world code typically lets a 5th shader idle in evergreen. But benchmarks and tuned code can utilize the 5th shader more effectively. So we may have a situation where synthetic tests don't show as much of an improvement in cayman as in real world tests. A different % performance improvement depending on how effectively code utilized the old architecture.

[spursindonesia]

The card has 8 plus 6 pin power (which makes 300W) so I think it'll be around 250W, which is consistent with what we have heard until now.

If AMD has managed to keep performance/watt the same as 6800 (5770's perf/watt is around the same as 5870's, for example), we could be looking at a card that's 65% faster than HD6870, which would make it:

- 50-55 percent faster than HD5870.
- 15 percent faster than HD5970.
- 12-14 percent faster than the GTX 580 which according to rumors should be around 15 to 20 percent faster than GTX 480.

While i don't think the situation will be that simple & your numbers are correct (i don't think AMD will make their own version of baconator), i do think your thought brought another interesting question.

Will AMD improve their performance/watt in this mArch ? Stay the same ? or regress ? Because it seems nVidia has succesfully increased their efficiency in this metric, no matter how small it might be perceived.

Well, to be fair, nVidia's predecessor product wasn't exactly an efficient built in the first place, it would be much easier going from horrible to acceptable than improving on a quite efficient design like Cypress boards.

[Flying duck]

While i don't think the situation will be that simple & your numbers are correct (i don't think AMD will make their own version of baconator), i do think your thought brought another interesting question.

Will AMD improve their performance/watt in this mArch ? Stay the same ? or regress ? Because it seems nVidia has succesfully increased their efficiency in this metric, no matter how small it might be perceived.

Well, to be fair, nVidia's predecessor product wasn't exactly an efficient built in the first place, it would be much easier going from horrible to acceptable than improving on a quite efficient design like Cypress boards.

I don't think performance/watt will be much better than cypress if at all, hence the FUD rumours that it's a hot chip even if it's not quite Grill-Force.
As for performance, Charlie said the 6970 will beat the 580, which is good enough for me...

[Sn0wm@n]

6950 is 1536sp @ 890 Mhz apparently.
1gb vram

how much did the 5870 had ?????

[slaveondope]

how much did the 5870 had ?????

1600sp 850/1200 1gb

[Jowy Atreides]

how much did the 5870 had ?????

* 2.15 billion 40nm transistors
* TeraScale 2 Unified Processing Architecture
o 1600 Stream Processing Units
o 80 Texture Units
o 128 Z/Stencil ROP Units
o 32 Color ROP Units
* GDDR5 interface with 153.6 GB/sec of memory bandwidth
* Engine clock speed: 850 MHz
* Maximum board power: 188 Watt

[Sn0wm@n]

so better shader utilisation ... with about the same amount of shaders should give us a good enough boost


... please amd give us antilles allready

[BababooeyHTJ]

well that almost IS 3x as much as anybody needs ^^

but yeah, after all the time of the 5970 being out, getting about the same perf for 25% less than the launch msrp of the 5970 isnt really amazing...

On a single gpu it would be. Heck has 5970 ever sold at msrp?

[kuroikenshi]

I do not thin such info is worth dedicatinga thread, so here
http://news.softpedia.com/news/AMD-S...t-164938.shtml