Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 32

Thread: finished lapping my Q6600 (with pics and results)

  1. #1
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636

    finished lapping my Q6600 (with pics and results)

    Well, after lapping my HS, I've had this nagging little voice in my head telling me to do the same from the CPU. I did the job with 800 grit sandpaper. Initially, I told myself I'd just buff what's there right now just to see if it's level. After about 30 laps in one direction and 30 in the other direction I discovered I had quite a concave IHS. So I just kept at it. Two 9x11 pieces of 800 grit later paper later I was left with a darn flat layer of copper looking back at me. I finished the job and put a mild shine on it with a sheet of 1000 grit I got from the local auto parts store just for the f*ck of it.

    Here are a few pics and the temp. results I got from lapping both my CPU and HS. I would recommend that anyone wanting the best $20 decrease in temps should consider lapping both the CPU and HS.

    Hardware details: Q6600 @ 9x333 and vcore of 1.2625V in the BIOS, P5B Deluxe (vdroop modded) cooled w/ an Ultra-120 Extreme (lapped) with Scythe/s-flex SFF21F 1600RPM fan, in a P182 case:

    Temp results:

    Each temp. point represents an average of data collected over approx. 1 h time period during the 2nd pass of a 2-pass x264 encode of a 720x480 DVD source using a high quality video profile. Data points were logged by Speedfan every 3-4 seconds over this time period. The average CPU usage was >99 % on all 4 cores throughout the experiments. Also room temp was between 20-22 °C.

    This is my preferred setup: 8x10 piece of glass on a flat counter top. You can see I cut the sandpaper into a thin strip (about 2-3x the width of the CPU) and attached it to the glass with some tape. The glass is in turn tapped down to the counter top to keep everything immobilized. You'll want to moisten the sandpaper with some mildly soapy water (like 1 drop of dish soap in 1 liter of water), then blot it until you have no pools of water. Remember, if you get water into your chip you're sunk. Then simple hold the chip and gently move it front-to-back. I don't recommend doing circles since they tend to give uneven results. The copper color on the sandpaper is material I just removed from the IHS on the chip.



    Remember, you're after a flat chip here so don't push down on it as you lap: let the weight of your hands do it without extra pressure and go slowly so you don't use uneven pressure. After about 30 laps front-to-back, I gently blotted off the chip with a moist paper towel to remove the metal particles I just sanded off, then rotated it 90 degrees and repeated 30 laps front-to-back. Then you'll want to clean off the sand paper (add more water, then blot it damp and repeat). I'd recommend changing the sand paper frequently since it's really doing the work for you. That's basically it. You can start with 400 grit or so and lap until you can't see variations in the surface of the chip (no silver color is often a good indication that you're flat), move up to 600 or 800, then finish off with 1000 or 1200. I did mine entirely with 800 and 1000, it just takes longer with finer grits. Remember, the key is FLAT, not shiny. I would recommend that you do NOT polish the chip with a metal polish since you'll leave behind a residue that will hurt your heat transfer.

    You can test the flatness at any point during the lapping process by carefully placing a razor blade across the surface of he chip and looking at the area where the razor meets the chip. Now position your eye so that you're level with the chip and pointing at a light source (a lamp will do nicely). Do you see any light coming though? If so, keep at it. Another test you can do is to take a black sharpie marker and make about 9 dots in a 3x3 grid on the surface of the IHS. Lap about 5 times, rotate, and do 5 more. Now look at the dots... did they wear off evenly? If not, keep at it. You can also simply draw an "X" from corner to corner on the chip and do this as well. Again, you'll looking for even wear.

    After about 5 minutes of lapping in each direction with 800 grit. You can see how the nickel plating has come off around the edges first which shows you just how concave this thing really was:


    After more lapping most of the nickel plating has been removed expect in the really low areas (the camera flash fired so close to the chip makes all the scratches show up much more so than they do under normal light):


    Switched to 1000 grit, here's the result:


    Another angle shows the nice dull reflection, still very so slightly concave at the extreme edges, but good enough for me:


    I would recommend that anyone wanting the best $20 decrease in temps should consider lapping both the CPU and HS.

    Oh, I also thought I'd mention that before I lapped the chip, I had a pretty big difference in core temps when loading with prime95 or 2x orthos: up to 6 degrees C (sorry I don't have a screenshot of this). Lapping the chip REALLY evened-them-out as you can see from the coretemp numbers after the IHS and base of the heatsink were lapped (stressed using prime95 v25.3):



    The table I showed above was not based on prime95 or orthos, it was based on x264.exe which is a video encoder. It is good at using all 4 cores, but not as efficient as prime95/orthos which explains the differences in temps from that table.
    Last edited by graysky; 11-29-2007 at 10:58 PM.

  2. #2
    Xtreme Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    California, USA
    Posts
    207
    wow, impressive Thanks for posting such a nice comparision

  3. #3
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Always glad to contribute. I really hope my success story inspires others to lap their hardware and report back with favorable results too... are you inspired

  4. #4
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Posts
    517
    heres my guide that i created :

    http://forum.overclock3d.net/showthread.php?t=4735

    is for Pentium D 805 , but your IHS/Socket is similar so you will get the idea

  5. #5
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Hey, another person with a concave chip... I wonder if they are this way by design. I have read about others lapping chips that were convex, although I haven't seen the photographic proof to back up the claims. Anyway, nice job on the guide.

    Did you happen to collect some before/after temp data?

  6. #6
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Hastings, England
    Posts
    825
    Nice post graysky. Nice temps after too
    Quote Originally Posted by jayhall0315 View Post
    If you are really extreme, you never let informed facts or the scientific method hold you back from your journey to the wrong answer


  7. #7
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Thanks, jabski. How do you have your 6700 setup 10x?)? What kind of cooling are you using and what temps are you getting?

  8. #8
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    11-May: Updated the data table and added a few more pics.

  9. #9
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Richmond (GVA), BC, Canada
    Posts
    541
    Quote Originally Posted by graysky View Post
    11-May: Updated the data table and added a few more pics.
    Hey graysky:

    I'm seriously thinking of lapping my E6700 as it's running quite hot at 66c @ 3730mhz. (1.48v) Orthos small fft stress test. Other applications never actually brought up my temp over 60..

    My CPU heatsink is pre-lapped to a mirror finish from the factory (Zalman 9700NT)

    Where would you find detail step by step lapping IHS instruction guide here or elsewhere?

    Also, a quick question, do you lap the cpu with its cap on to protect from dust and possibly your finger print (as shown in your last few pix).

    How do you hold the cpu while you do the lapping? and how do I apply the force down evenly while I'm sanding away on top of a glass table w/ sandgrid paper in between?

    These are the questions I'm concern b4 I want to start lapping.
    Fortunately, I already have a large glass table in my room and I know the diff stage of sandpaper that we should use, starting from 400 and so on.

    TIA
    Last edited by XtremeTiramisu; 05-20-2007 at 09:00 PM.
    Xtreme Air-Cooled OC System:
    Mobo: Asus Rampage Formula (X38 Edition) Rev 1.03G (BIOS: 0803)
    CPU: C2Q Q6600 "G0" L723A765, VID 1.2625, 3720mhz, FSB 465*8, Vcore: 1.464, Idle/load temp: 31c/64c
    CPU Heatsink: Thermalright Ultra120 Xtreme lapped (2* Scythe S-Flex SFF21F S-FDB 120mm Push-Pull configuration)
    RAM: Kingston HyperX T1 2x2GB PC2-8500 (DDR2-1116)(5-5-5-15-3-52-6-3-8-3-5-4-6-4-6-14-5-1-5-5)(2.264 Vdimm)(Rated @ 2.3v default clock)
    HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black 640GB WD6401AALS-00L3B (AHCI)
    Video Card: XFX 8800GTS 320mb Xtreme, Core 612 Shader 1420 Mem 900 (Stock cooling)
    Sound Card: Auzentech Meridian 7.1 (8788 chipset)
    DVD: Pioneer 212D SATA DVD-RW
    PSU: Corsair HX620W Modular
    Xtreme Air Cooled Case: Antec 900 case | 3*120mm intake | 1*120mm & 1*200mm exhuast
    OS: Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 Build 6001

  10. #10
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Quote Originally Posted by XtremeTiramisu View Post
    Hey graysky:

    I'm seriously thinking of lapping my E6700 as it's running quite hot at 66c @ 3730mhz. (1.48v) Orthos small fft stress test. Other applications never actually brought up my temp over 60..

    My CPU heatsink is pre-lapped to a mirror finish from the factory (Zalman 9700NT)

    Where would you find detail step by step lapping IHS instruction guide here or elsewhere?

    Also, a quick question, do you lap the cpu with its cap on to protect from dust and possibly your finger print (as shown in your last few pix).

    How do you hold the cpu while you do the lapping? and how do I apply the force down evenly while I'm sanding away on top of a glass table w/ sandgrid paper in between?

    These are the questions I'm concern b4 I want to start lapping.
    Fortunately, I already have a large glass table in my room and I know the diff stage of sandpaper that we should use, starting from 400 and so on.

    TIA
    I'm sure you'll be happy with the results of lapping the IHS. You should test your HS to be sure it's flat. Try the razorblade test or the magic marker test with some high grit paper so you won't damage it... if it has a shine, you'll need to test it with 1500 or 2000 you'll have to get from an auto parts store.

    You can google around for terms like '6600 lapping' or 'ihs lapping conroe' etc. I deleted the sites I found from my bookmarks since I finished it on my own.

    Here is a reply to your question about how I wrote over at hardforum.com. Read it (and the whole thread) and let me know if you still have questions.

    BTW, I'd start with 600 or 800 on your IHS, not 400. Should take you about 1 h of careful lapping if yours was as bad as mine was.

  11. #11
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Richmond (GVA), BC, Canada
    Posts
    541
    wow thanks for the detail reply at this hour!
    much appreciated.
    Thanks a lot for cueing me in for 600 grid instead of 400...lol..400 should probably be starting point for the HS.
    I'll post the b4 and after result of the work in a few days...
    Xtreme Air-Cooled OC System:
    Mobo: Asus Rampage Formula (X38 Edition) Rev 1.03G (BIOS: 0803)
    CPU: C2Q Q6600 "G0" L723A765, VID 1.2625, 3720mhz, FSB 465*8, Vcore: 1.464, Idle/load temp: 31c/64c
    CPU Heatsink: Thermalright Ultra120 Xtreme lapped (2* Scythe S-Flex SFF21F S-FDB 120mm Push-Pull configuration)
    RAM: Kingston HyperX T1 2x2GB PC2-8500 (DDR2-1116)(5-5-5-15-3-52-6-3-8-3-5-4-6-4-6-14-5-1-5-5)(2.264 Vdimm)(Rated @ 2.3v default clock)
    HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black 640GB WD6401AALS-00L3B (AHCI)
    Video Card: XFX 8800GTS 320mb Xtreme, Core 612 Shader 1420 Mem 900 (Stock cooling)
    Sound Card: Auzentech Meridian 7.1 (8788 chipset)
    DVD: Pioneer 212D SATA DVD-RW
    PSU: Corsair HX620W Modular
    Xtreme Air Cooled Case: Antec 900 case | 3*120mm intake | 1*120mm & 1*200mm exhuast
    OS: Vista Ultimate x64 SP1 Build 6001

  12. #12
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Cool man, let us know how it goes... be sure you collect some before temps and make sure you know to the nearest °F what room temp is since room temp can affect your core temps pretty dramatically.

  13. #13
    Xtreme Cruncher
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    England
    Posts
    3,554
    Quote Originally Posted by |3ourne View Post
    heres my guide that i created :

    http://forum.overclock3d.net/showthread.php?t=4735

    is for Pentium D 805 , but your IHS/Socket is similar so you will get the idea
    thanks for that dude, ill use that guide when i the thermalright ifx-14 is released to get some more cooling out of my C2d6600

    My Free-DC Stats
    You use IRC and Crunch in Xs WCG team? Join #xs.wcg @ Quakenet

  14. #14
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    21-May Update: Re-ran the benchmark since it's been about 300 hours after the heatsink was seated on the AS5. You can see the temps have dropped by another 2-3 °C from when I initially seated it, so I guess the "break in" period is real.

  15. #15
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    674
    I'm really thinking about lapping my new E6600 now
    ....

  16. #16
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    You won't be sorry

  17. #17
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    @ender17: It's been a while, what did you end-up doing?

  18. #18
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    675
    Wow, nice results.
    Core2Duo E6600 @ 3.0 - Load @ 32c°| Gigabyte P35 DS3P | 2gb Crucial Ballistix Pc2-8500| eVGA 8800GTX| X-fi Fatal1ty | OCZ GameXStream 600w | Custom Watercooled | Custom-built Case


    Dtek Fuzion | DD Maze4 Acetal | Swiftech MCR-320 | DD D5


    3dMark01 3dMark05 3dMark06 Aq3 SuperPi


    Quote Originally Posted by Movieman View Post
    I don't beleive in passive cooling.

  19. #19
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    I just edited/updated the first post of the thread with a few more pics and a brief description of how I lapped the chip for anyone interested.

  20. #20
    Xtreme Enthusiast
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    636
    Just curious... if anyone was "inspired" to try this on their chip after reading my guide?

  21. #21
    Xtreme Guru
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Vancouver, Canada
    Posts
    3,858
    Around 10 degrees is a pretty good drop, but that's quite a lot of work as well. And you void your warranty. I wouldn't do it personally.
    i5 750 4.20GHz @ NH-D14 | 8GB | P7P55DLE | 8800U | Indilinx SSD + Samsung F3 | HAF922 + CM750W
    Past: Q6600 @ 3.60 E6400 @ 3.60 | E6300 @ 3.40 | O165 @ 2.90 | X2 4400+ @ 2.80 | X2 3800+ @ 2.70 | VE 3200+ @ 2.80 | WI 3200+ @ 2.75 | WI 3000+ no IHS @ 2.72 | TBB 1700+ @ 2.60 | XP-M 2500+ @ 2.63 | NC 2800+ @ 2.40 | AB 1.60GHz @ 2.60
    Quote Originally Posted by CompGeek
    The US is the only country that doesn't use [nuclear weapons] to terrorize other countries. The US is based on Christian values, unlike any other country in the world. Granted we are straying from our Christian heritage, but we still have a freedom aimed diplomatic stance.

  22. #22
    Xtreme Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Victoria, Australia
    Posts
    301
    Just an observation... core #0 #1 are still +5 deg C higher than core #2 #3
    Is it just the nature of how quad core architecture loads?
    Asus A8N-E, x2 3800+ 2.7Ghz@1.488v RmClk, TT Big Typhoon lapped, Zalman NB-47J, XFX 9500gt, Corsair 2Gb, Sony DVD, Samsung 1TB, Coolermaster Cavalier, Enermax 620w, Benq G2400WD, Logitech X-230, WIN7 64.

    There is a cure.... it's called Prevention. .. And remember - the story being told is not always the one that best reflects reality….

  23. #23
    Xtreme Mentor
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,977
    You inspired me to give it a GO Graysky....

    My GO L726B397 to be exact!

    Before:


    After:


    I used one of thoes lapping kits. It could have been a bit bigger, but I got by using it OK.

    It did have a nice assortment of sandpaper.



    Thanks for the tips.
    Last edited by Talonman; 10-28-2007 at 08:04 PM.
    Asus Maximus SE X38 / Lapped Q6600 G0 @ 3.8GHz (L726B397 stock VID=1.224) / 7 Ultimate x64 /EVGA GTX 295 C=650 S=1512 M=1188 (Graphics)/ EVGA GTX 280 C=756 S=1512 M=1296 (PhysX)/ G.SKILL 8GB (4 x 2GB) SDRAM DDR2 1000 (PC2 8000) / Gateway FPD2485W (1920 x 1200 res) / Toughpower 1,000-Watt modular PSU / SilverStone TJ-09 BW / (2) 150 GB Raptor's RAID-0 / (1) Western Digital Caviar 750 GB / LG GGC-H20L (CD, DVD, HD-DVD, and BlueRay Drive) / WaterKegIII Xtreme / D-TEK FuZion CPU, EVGA Hydro Copper 16 GPU, and EK NB S-MAX Acetal Waterblocks / Enzotech Forged Copper CNB-S1L (South Bridge heat sink)

  24. #24
    Xtreme Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    327
    Any results Talonman ?
    Q6600@3.6 GHz / GA-X48-DQ6
    2x2GB Kingston HyperX DDR2-800
    Asus HD 5870
    Corsair TX-850
    WD Velociraptor 150GB / WD Green power 500GB
    Water Cooling: EK res 250 > Swiftec MCP655 > Swiftec MCR320 > EK-FC5870 > HeatKiller 3.0 LT

  25. #25
    Xtreme Mentor
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    2,977
    No, I am still shopping a GPU, and WaterKeg on order. It has never been powered on yet.

    I did this on blind faith, and a good graph shown above.
    Last edited by Talonman; 10-28-2007 at 09:06 PM.
    Asus Maximus SE X38 / Lapped Q6600 G0 @ 3.8GHz (L726B397 stock VID=1.224) / 7 Ultimate x64 /EVGA GTX 295 C=650 S=1512 M=1188 (Graphics)/ EVGA GTX 280 C=756 S=1512 M=1296 (PhysX)/ G.SKILL 8GB (4 x 2GB) SDRAM DDR2 1000 (PC2 8000) / Gateway FPD2485W (1920 x 1200 res) / Toughpower 1,000-Watt modular PSU / SilverStone TJ-09 BW / (2) 150 GB Raptor's RAID-0 / (1) Western Digital Caviar 750 GB / LG GGC-H20L (CD, DVD, HD-DVD, and BlueRay Drive) / WaterKegIII Xtreme / D-TEK FuZion CPU, EVGA Hydro Copper 16 GPU, and EK NB S-MAX Acetal Waterblocks / Enzotech Forged Copper CNB-S1L (South Bridge heat sink)

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •