**Official e8400/e8500 Retail OC Thread

[Damien]

must have been a bios issue, because after updating to the latest on dfi's site, i'm now happily running OCCT on this:

1.312v on load

[Shoty]

must have been a bios issue, because after updating to the latest on dfi's site, i'm now happily running OCCT on this:

1.312v on load

please settings bios

[HeadOn]

must have been a bios issue, because after updating to the latest on dfi's site, i'm now happily running OCCT on this:

1.312v on load

Can you post all your bios voltage settings? Thanks!

[eshati]

I am thinking of buying a E8400, any good stepping you have to propose?

[dropglock]

I think mine just degraded. What use to be stable 1 hours OCCT:
1.35 vCore
1.9 vDimm
1.350 VTT FSB Voltage
1.425 NB Voltage
1.6 SB I/O Power
1.05 SB Core Power
failed OCCT in 30 minutes now.

I am gonna try stressing with higher volts in certain areas and see if it fails again.
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.

PS: I never went above 1.425 vCore while testing. All I want is a good stable 4005/4008 ghz 24/7 usage since I am new to ocing and did not want to risk anything.

[rge]

Does your FSB VTT need to be that high?

I have not read anyone degrading below 1.4...and plenty people priming long runs at 1.39 and below without issue.

Only ones between 1.4 and 1.44 had confounding issues, like running with high FSB 600, priming with 545 and ? corresponding high FSB VTT or without, and one Greek poster that degraded at 1.41...but turns out in another post he had benched with 1.825v bios few days prior.

But, if you are seeing degradation and not variability could it be your high FSB VTT and not vcore? Isnt 1.15 normal? I have my FSB at 1.15v. Edit..I think 1.10 is recommended for 45nm, where 1.20 recommended for 65nm. list of degradation post 1246.

[dropglock]

Does your FSB VTT need to be that high?

I have not read anyone degrading below 1.4...and plenty people priming long runs at 1.39 and below without issue.

Only ones between 1.4 and 1.44 had confounding issues, like running with high FSB 600, priming with 545 and ? corresponding high FSB VTT or without, and one Greek poster that degraded at 1.41...but turns out in another post he had benched with 1.825v bios few days prior.

But, if you are seeing degradation and not variability could it be your high FSB VTT and not vcore? Isnt 1.15 normal? I have my FSB at 1.15v. Edit..I think 1.10 is recommended for 45nm, where 1.20 recommended for 65nm. list of degradation post 1246.

Well currently I raised 3 settings in the bios. Here is what I raised:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.
and now it is 30 min stable for now. I still have 30 min to go to get 1 hour stable OCCT so we'll see. If this is stable I will lower the sb power and I/O power and stress again. But like I said my previous settings was stable 1 hour OCCT, then it failed in 30 min when I stressed again. I'll even stress with the settings that OCCT failed in 30 minutes again just to make sure.

EDIT: Just failed OCCT with 29 minutes to go at:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.

[rge]

Well currently I raised 3 settings in the bios. Here is what I raised:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.
and now it is 30 min stable for now. I still have 30 min to go to get 1 hour stable OCCT so we'll see. If this is stable I will lower the sb power and I/O power and stress again. But like I said my previous settings was stable 1 hour OCCT, then it failed in 30 min when I stressed again. I'll even stress with the settings that OCCT failed in 30 minutes again just to make sure.

EDIT: Just failed OCCT with 29 minutes to go at:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.

I guess what I meant was you are still in VID range of cpu vcore, but 25% above suggested VTT FSB. And ? if high VTT FSB is just as bad as high vcore, and ? of stress testing with high VTT FSB is especially bad.

Could you raise vcore a little, and drop VTT FSB to 1.25 or 1.2 and get stable. And then see if you get any further degradation.

[.OCX]

3 Hour Screenshot
2 Hour Screenshot

400 STRAP
[BIOS SETTING]

Ratio CMOS Setting : 9
FSB Frequency : 444
FSB Strap to North Bridge : 400
PCI-E Frequency: 100
DRAM Frequency: DDR2-1186
DRAM Command Rate : 2T
DRAM Timing Control: Manual 
5-5-5-15
DRAM Static Read Control: DISABLED
Ai Clock Twister : STRONG
Transaction Booster : ENABLED
Boost: 0
Performance Level: 7

CPU Voltage : 1.28125v
CPU PLL Voltage : 1.5v*
North Bridge Voltage :1.59v 
DRAM Voltage : 2.34v
FSB Termination Voltage :  1.20v*
South Bridge Voltage : 1.05v*
Loadline Calibration : ENABLED
CPU GTL Reference : .61
North Bridge GTL Reference : .63
DDR2 Channel A REF Voltage : DDR2
DDR2 Channel B REF Voltage : DDR2
DDR2 Controller REF Voltage : DDR2
SB 1.5V Voltage : 1.5v*

*Lowest Bios Setting Available in 0907

-Added High CFM Fan directly to DRAM.
-Changed DDR2 Channel A & B REF Voltage to "DDR2"
-This increased the DRAM REF Voltage in Hardware Monitor from (Auto@1.184v) to (DDR2@1.23v)
-DRAM installed in White Slots to get around DETDRAM issues when Overclocking, helps overall DRAM Stability.
-Limited on 400 Strap due to RAM

-1.28125v VCORE is the Exact Same Setting I use for my 333 Strap Stable@ddr2-1068 that is also currently in use for this 400Strap Stable@ddr2-1186.

[PhilDoc]

Well currently I raised 3 settings in the bios. Here is what I raised:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.
and now it is 30 min stable for now. I still have 30 min to go to get 1 hour stable OCCT so we'll see. If this is stable I will lower the sb power and I/O power and stress again. But like I said my previous settings was stable 1 hour OCCT, then it failed in 30 min when I stressed again. I'll even stress with the settings that OCCT failed in 30 minutes again just to make sure.

EDIT: Just failed OCCT with 29 minutes to go at:
1.375 VTT FSB Voltage
1.15 SB Core Power
1.7 I/O Power.

Maybe I missed something, but are you sure you have degradation. There's not much difference between getting an hour vs 30min. Maybe the ambient is a little higher this time. I can run Orthos for an hour at 4.3G at 1.35v vcore, but if I have the heater running in the room, it fails after 30min. Turn off the heater and let the room cool down and its back to an hour.

[dropglock]

Maybe I missed something, but are you sure you have degradation. There's not much difference between getting an hour vs 30min. Maybe the ambient is a little higher this time. I can run Orthos for an hour at 4.3G at 1.35v vcore, but if I have the heater running in the room, it fails after 30min. Turn off the heater and let the room cool down and its back to an hour.

On load it was running at 72-77 degrees when it failed. When it passed It was around the same thing. But a post by unclewebb say that temperature's are least of the worries. Also isn't 1 hour of OCCT more stress than Prime or Orthos at 1 hour? I've read a couple of posts saying that. One even in this thread saying that 1 hour of OCCT can find errors better than running orthos for 6+ hours.

I guess what I meant was you are still in VID range of cpu vcore, but 25% above suggested VTT FSB. And ? if high VTT FSB is just as bad as high vcore, and ? of stress testing with high VTT FSB is especially bad.

Could you raise vcore a little, and drop VTT FSB to 1.25 or 1.2 and get stable. And then see if you get any further degradation.

Anyways I increased the NB voltage to 1.450 and its 1 hour OCCT stable now. Before it was...
1.425 NB Voltage

Now to try increasing vCore and lowering VTT FSB voltage.

EDIT: Failed orthos in less than 5 minutes when increasing the vCore from 1.35-1.4 with VTT FSB of 1.225

[ArCElM]

Due to all the unknown issues I decided to drop my clocks and voltage to 4.1Ghz, which is acceptable, it does 4.1 on 1.32v Load, nothing special but its solid, gone just over 6 hours prime stable so far, which is PLENTY stable for me.

[nzbleach]

ok guys , be careful with voltage. My E8200 4G Stable at 1.5Vcore is no longer prime stable. Just a warning to all you guys running higher than 1.45... dont!

[user1234]

new rig, new sig

[unclewebb]

Just finished some very interesting testing tonight with the IR thermometer and I think I've uncovered the core temp mystery with these chips.

Absolute Temperature = TjMax - DTS

The value of TjMax is not publicly documented for any of the Intel desktop processors and there is no magic bit that any software can read to determine this value. That's why whenever a new chip comes out, CoreTemp takes a guess and some times gets it wrong. DTS is the value put out by the on chip digital thermal sensors and shows you how far the chip is from the throttling point.

The programmer of CoreTemp bumped TjMax up to 105C for the E8x00 desktop processors. TjMax=105C is fully documented by Intel for the mobile processors but I don't believe it applies to the desktop 45nm core duo processors. After numerous runs up to the throttling point, I'm convinced that TjMax=95C for the E8x00 desktop series. The maximum Tcase temperature has been bumped by approximately 10C between the early Conroe processors and the E8x00 so it makes sense that TjMax was also bumped from the original 85C to 95C but not to 105C.

The DTS in my E6400 provided very accurate absolute temperature readings based on TjMax=85C over a 35 degree range from 50C to 85C. The same is true for my E8400 but the 35 degree range is now from 60C to 95C. Below that range the actual temperature vs the DTS based temperature diverge by approximately 5C so at a DTS temp of 40C the actual was only about 35C. The E6400 would also diverge by about 5C at very low idle temps but it ended up reporting temps that were too low. I'm not sure if Intel has made a correction for the E8x00 or if the DTS is simply not accurate at low idle temps and has a margin of error of approximately +/- 5C at idle for all core processors.

You can't adjust TjMax using CoreTemp but the latest beta version of SpeedFan 4.34b38 is reading the 8x00 processors. It assumes that TjMax=100C so you have to go into Configure->Advanced and set the Temperature 1&2 offset to -5 and check the "remember it" box for both cores. This sets TjMax=95C. You will finally have some very accurate core temperature readings from 60C to the throttling point at 95C. These sensors were not designed or calibrated for reporting idle temps so some inaccuracy down low should be expected.

dropglock: If you are running at default MHz then an E8x00 will run stable well past 70C. If you are overclocking and are getting near the maximum then you will probably need to leave yourself at least 25C of headroom before the throttling point to maintain stability. Temperatures are only unimportant if you are Prime stable.

[rge]

Just finished some very interesting testing tonight with the IR thermometer and I think I've uncovered the core temp mystery with these chips.

Absolute Temperature = TjMax - DTS

The value of TjMax is not publicly documented for any of the Intel desktop processors and there is no magic bit that any software can read to determine this value. That's why whenever a new chip comes out, CoreTemp takes a guess and some times gets it wrong. DTS is the value put out by the on chip digital thermal sensors and shows you how far the chip is from the throttling point.

The programmer of CoreTemp bumped TjMax up to 105C for the E8x00 desktop processors. TjMax=105C is fully documented by Intel for the mobile processors but I don't believe it applies to the desktop 45nm core duo processors. After numerous runs up to the throttling point, I'm convinced that TjMax=95C for the E8x00 desktop series. The maximum Tcase temperature has been bumped by approximately 10C between the early Conroe processors and the E8x00 so it makes sense that TjMax was also bumped from the original 85C to 95C but not to 105C.

The DTS in my E6400 provided very accurate absolute temperature readings based on TjMax=85C over a 35 degree range from 50C to 85C. The same is true for my E8400 but the 35 degree range is now from 60C to 95C. Below that range the actual temperature vs the DTS based temperature diverge by approximately 5C so at a DTS temp of 40C the actual was only about 35C. The E6400 would also diverge by about 5C at very low idle temps but it ended up reporting temps that were too low. I'm not sure if Intel has made a correction for the E8x00 or if the DTS is simply not accurate at low idle temps and has a margin of error of approximately +/- 5C at idle for all core processors.

You can't adjust TjMax using CoreTemp but the latest beta version of SpeedFan 4.34b38 is reading the 8x00 processors. It assumes that TjMax=100C so you have to go into Configure->Advanced and set the Temperature 1&2 offset to -5 and check the "remember it" box for both cores. This sets TjMax=95C. You will finally have some very accurate core temperature readings from 60C to the throttling point at 95C. These sensors were not designed or calibrated for reporting idle temps so some inaccuracy down low should be expected.

dropglock: If you are running at default MHz then an E8x00 will run stable well past 70C. If you are overclocking and are getting near the maximum then you will probably need to leave yourself at least 25C of headroom before the throttling point to maintain stability. Temperatures are only unimportant if you are Prime stable.

Interesting, thanks for the research...btw there is a discussion between the author of coretemp and intel engineer on this very subject, here...

http://softwarecommunity.intel.com/i.../30244450.aspx

[Infa]

Just finished some very interesting testing tonight with the IR thermometer and I think I've uncovered the core temp mystery with these chips.

Absolute Temperature = TjMax - DTS

The value of TjMax is not publicly documented for any of the Intel desktop processors and there is no magic bit that any software can read to determine this value. That's why whenever a new chip comes out, CoreTemp takes a guess and some times gets it wrong. DTS is the value put out by the on chip digital thermal sensors and shows you how far the chip is from the throttling point.

The programmer of CoreTemp bumped TjMax up to 105C for the E8x00 desktop processors. TjMax=105C is fully documented by Intel for the mobile processors but I don't believe it applies to the desktop 45nm core duo processors. After numerous runs up to the throttling point, I'm convinced that TjMax=95C for the E8x00 desktop series. The maximum Tcase temperature has been bumped by approximately 10C between the early Conroe processors and the E8x00 so it makes sense that TjMax was also bumped from the original 85C to 95C but not to 105C.

The DTS in my E6400 provided very accurate absolute temperature readings based on TjMax=85C over a 35 degree range from 50C to 85C. The same is true for my E8400 but the 35 degree range is now from 60C to 95C. Below that range the actual temperature vs the DTS based temperature diverge by approximately 5C so at a DTS temp of 40C the actual was only about 35C. The E6400 would also diverge by about 5C at very low idle temps but it ended up reporting temps that were too low. I'm not sure if Intel has made a correction for the E8x00 or if the DTS is simply not accurate at low idle temps and has a margin of error of approximately +/- 5C at idle for all core processors.

You can't adjust TjMax using CoreTemp but the latest beta version of SpeedFan 4.34b38 is reading the 8x00 processors. It assumes that TjMax=100C so you have to go into Configure->Advanced and set the Temperature 1&2 offset to -5 and check the "remember it" box for both cores. This sets TjMax=95C. You will finally have some very accurate core temperature readings from 60C to the throttling point at 95C. These sensors were not designed or calibrated for reporting idle temps so some inaccuracy down low should be expected.

dropglock: If you are running at default MHz then an E8x00 will run stable well past 70C. If you are overclocking and are getting near the maximum then you will probably need to leave yourself at least 25C of headroom before the throttling point to maintain stability. Temperatures are only unimportant if you are Prime stable.

Is this a fact that i can count on? how sure are you on this?
it do make sense though.. and i like that my temps are 10c lower, now it as i said, makes sense is this a value that we "people" should go after from now on? or what do you say, nice find anyway

regards.

[unclewebb]

Is this a fact that i can count on? how sure are you on this?
it do make sense though.. and i like that my temps are 10c lower, now it as i said, makes sense is this a value that we "people" should go after from now on? or what do you say, nice find anyway

I'm 100% sure that TjMax=95C for my e8400 and that value is very likely used across all 45nm E8x00 desktop dual core processors. I ran the exact same test on my Conroe E6400 last summer and it showed 85C on the IR thermometer just as the processor would start throttling. Now for the same test with the E8400 it shows 95C. At 60C actual, CoreTemp shows 35C away from the throttling point, at 70C actual it shows 25C to TjMax and at 80C it shows 15C to TjMax. CoreTemp has always been very accurate at reading the DTS temperature information in MSR 0x19C but not always accurate at guessing what TjMax is. Setting TjMax=95C will result in reported absolute core temperatures exactly equal to the actual core temperature from 60C to 95C.

The problem has always been that using the DTS to report absolute idle temperatures has never been accurate and still isn't. This confuses the issue and TjMax sometimes gets adjusted by programmers to try and make the idle temperatures "look right" but that only screws up the reported full load temperatures. The problem now is that many users full load temperatures never get up to 60C so using DTS based temperature monitoring software will never be 100% accurate for them in the temperature range that they operate at.

Adjusting TjMax to 95C for E8x00 also gives you much more comparable load temperatures to the previous Conroe dual core E6x00 series.

I'm not here to twist anyone's arm so use whatever value you're comfortable with. I'll be using TjMax=95C. Don't wait for Intel to confirm this number because they've never publicly admitted to what TjMax is for any of their desktop processors. They also don't support programs like CoreTemp that try to calculate the core temperature by reading DTS values directly.

[BooStFeD]

E8400
FPO/Batch = Q746A489
Pack Date = 1/09/08

MB P5B Deluxe Bios 1226
Pencil VDroop Mod

Testing 470 * 9
Bios Vcore = 1.3875v
Idle Vcore = 1.3760v
Load Vcore = 1.3760v

CPU is on water with old DD TDX WB

4 Hours Prime Stable. Working on 4.3GHz now.

[Capt Proton]

You can't adjust TjMax using CoreTemp but the latest beta version of SpeedFan 4.34b38 is reading the 8x00 processors.

Not it isn't, at least not in my rig. Only one temp, temp 2, changes as it should when a load is put on or taken off the CPU. It's only reporting 5 temps. 2 belong to the Graphica card, and one is just wrong (Temp 3 is -2). As I said, temp one does not scale with temp 2, and it isn't a case of a bad mount and only one core is being cooled properly.

[unclewebb]

Not it isn't, at least not in my rig.

You have to register to download SpeedFan version 4.34b38 but it has no problem reading the on chip digital thermal sensors in the E8x00 processors. If you have the problem where the temperature on one or both of the cores is not changing between idle and full load then the problem is that the sensors in your processor are stuck which is common. Not great quality control by Intel but as long as the DTS sensors start moving before your processor reaches TjMax then they're doing the job that they're designed to do.

[RedBull78]

Why is Core Temp reading 61C on both cores when the heat sink is very cool to the touch. In bios it reads 32C but in windows it reads 61C and while priming it only goes up to 64C?

Is it the sensor from the CPU or core temp isn't reading it accurately?

[Capt Proton]

You have to register to download SpeedFan version 4.34b38 but it has no problem reading the on chip digital thermal sensors in the E8x00 processors. If you have the problem where the temperature on one or both of the cores is not changing between idle and full load then the problem is that the sensors in your processor are stuck which is common. Not great quality control by Intel but as long as the DTS sensors start moving before your processor reaches TjMax then they're doing the job that they're designed to do.

This is simply not the case. With Coretemp, both sensors do not go below 37C. Both temps do scale logically above that when I run Prime or OCCT, so, my sensors are not "stuck".
With V4.34 B38, Temp one registers @24C, and only goes up about 2C under load. Temp 2 scales properly. Temp 3 is Bogus, and the last 2 are for the video card.
I know you have to register to download the Betas.
I have found that, with computers, there is little that applies to all, 100%. Once you realize that, life becomes much easier. Seldom is one person 100% correct and anyone that disagrees 100% wrong.

[unclewebb]

This is simply not the case. With Coretemp, both sensors do not go below 37C.

Most of the stuck sensors get stuck on the way down but when you go to full load, sooner or later they start to work properly. It is possible to have a sticking sensor on both cores. The one on Core0 of my E8400 gets stuck at 38C as reported by CoreTemp.

Your problem sounds unique. If you can PM me two CPUz register dumps, one at idle and one at full load and also send me two side by side screen shots of CoreTemp and SpeedFan at the same idle and full load temperatures then I might be able to figure out what's wrong.

[Damien]

This isn't really processor related so I apologize, but i'm trying the 333/800 divider which would make the ram 600mhz and it's working fine at 2.35v, but super-pi isn't any faster. am i really running 600mhz or is it a bug? it's d9 so maybe :o