Japan quakes

[vodka3dg]

Satus of japanese nuclear plants at Fukushima
http://www.jaif.or.jp/english/news_i...300189582P.pdf

Unit nr. 2 seems to be in real bad shape. This info comes straight out of japan's atomic industrial forum (i'm not sure if this is an official site).

IAEA Director General's briefing on the current status of nuclear safety in Japan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZB8Br3T2Sk

[mattlef]

Edano just confirmed that #2 containment vessel has cracked, and this white smoke/gas is coming from that reactor.... could be radioactive steam... no way to confirm right now

[vodka3dg]

wasn't there smoke coming out from nr.4 (just heard on NHK World)?

[mattlef]

wasn't there smoke coming out from nr.4 (just heard on NHK World)?

they were speculating it was coming from 4.
Apparently (according to Edano) its coming from #2, and they believe right now its smoke/steam from #2, and could be coming directly from the containment vessel.


edit - NHK keeps on saying #3, but the translation of the press conference Edano said #2....

[vodka3dg]

they were speculating it was coming from 4.
Apparently (according to Edano) its coming from #2, and they believe right now its smoke/steam from #2, and could be coming directly from the containment vessel.


edit - NHK keeps on saying #3, but the translation of the press conference Edano said #2....

lets hope that it's just a "normal" pressure release.

[mattlef]

lets hope that it's just a "normal" pressure release.

I agree....

- CNN is reporting that all 50 remaining workers have been evacuated?
"CNN just said all 50-Plant workers left, if ?? this is true, who will keep water on the nuclear fule rods.??
comment by ron4498 at 10:49 PM" Via Routers.

Stating work has been suspended again due to radiation levels.... doesnt look good...

[pcwhisperer]

In fact I have the distinct feeling this event will go as first textbook example of catastrophic failure due to catastrophic overconfidence of mankinds technological domination over the sum of dynamics also called planet blue aka earth.

I disagree. We've had plenty of other catastrophic technological failures in the past. Katrina and levees shake loose any memories?

That whas local, the people that lived there where duped, not the whole globe. No matter how empatic people can be, it makes a different impression on the collective conscious.
Besides there is hardly a connection between leaking levees and leaking nuclear cores.

Tsjernobyl was sort of globaly threatening, but was easy to point fingers to russian caricatural incompetence and lack of care (at that time).

Today we consider Japan a very high tech , very disciplined and competent society that do seems to care very much, and are considered experts in dealing with quakes and their surrounding fenomena like tsunamis. But still the safety margins and standards where not high enough because something of this magnitude didden't happen in one honderd+ something years.


When playing with this kind of destructif power , you look at the real data of what can happen and make honest calculations, then you ad the safety margins, then you look at the pricetag and decide to go for it or not.

But if you gamble , i call it typical humans catastrophic overconfidence.

And all around the globe people are glued in awe to the news wondering and praying , not only for the direct victims off this horror, but also how it will affect them in the end.

Not locally, globally. Collective conscious.

I'm am pretty sure the negotiations are much more serious now with way more deeper arguments than they ever where. Hence the first.

EDIT: it is in no way my intention to put blame or shame on the Japanese people for this, i wisch them all the courage they need and will do my thing to help.

It is more an observation of the general human ways and where it leads to time and time again.

Out of respect for the people suffering now, i will not make any more responses in this thread about this to people that want to discuss this with me . But i strongly disagree with the semi-hidden pro-nuclear messages ive seen here. Thats what made me respond in the first place.

[Biker]

..a little history lesson regarding the nuclear industry...

A fairly good read with some valid points...

[vodka3dg]

hell.. life is a gamble!! you may want to consider going out of your house tomorrow because there is a x% chance you might get robbed/kidnapped/killed/hit by a truck or even a meteor (?).

the thing is, that you have to be "cost efficient" and try to live with those odd probabilities out of your mind or your mental sanity will be at risk.

same happens with security measures at fukushima and other nuclear plants in the world.

if you know what the tunguska event is you should also know that it could happen again, but still, i'm pretty sure you will dismiss that probability as being immediately threatening.

IMHO, japanese engineering prepared pretty well for the events that followed the quake/tsunami, and deserve to be praised for it; i really don't share your view about human over confidence, at least not in this particular case... that's why this is called a natural disaster and not a human error (mind u that a human error can be to negligently underestimate nature's destructive force... and i don't see any negligence in the fukushima incident).

[dctokyo]

I give it to those guys that are still in the facility trying stop a major catastrophe from occurring, with all the bad news coming out about these reactors.To me they are real hero's. They are putting themselves on the line to save hundreds of thousands.They have got to be getting bombarded by radiation.Whatever the outcome is, my hats and prayers are with them.

[T.Goat]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpuLlIrUYsI

Doesn't seem all that bad at the start, but by about half way...

[Glow9]

hell.. life is a gamble!! you may want to consider going out of your house tomorrow because there is a x% chance you might get robbed/kidnapped/killed/hit by a truck or even a meteor (?).

the thing is, that you have to be "cost efficient" and try to live with those odd probabilities out of your mind or your mental sanity will be at risk.

same happens with security measures at fukushima and other nuclear plants in the world.

if you know what the tunguska event is you should also know that it could happen again, but still, i'm pretty sure you will dismiss that probability as being immediately threatening.

IMHO, japanese engineering prepared pretty well for the events that followed the quake/tsunami, and deserve to be praised for it; i really don't share your view about human over confidence, at least not in this particular case... that's why this is called a natural disaster and not a human error (mind u that a human error can be to negligently underestimate nature's destructive force... and i don't see any negligence in the fukushima incident).

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...72E5MV20110315
http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bes...ar.reactor.cnn
I think this guy in the article along with the insurance industry have a much different view of how things really are. Your argument is essentially saying that all risk with power plants is a static risk. But it isn't when heads are running the show. Last year oil, this year nuclear, we have 1000s of earthquakes every year, they don't cause nuclear disasters idiots do.

[highoctane]

Natural disasters are part of life on earth wherever you live, whether its earthquakes, hurricanes, tornados, sinkholes, giant hail, lightning, wild fires, floods, blizzards, volcanoes etc. No matter how much planning is done when a big enough disaster hits nobody/country can be totally prepared or predict the outcome.

It's a tragedy and human reality of living on earth whats going on in japan. If there where no nuclear plant disaster thousands of people are still missing period and thousands of people are currently suffering in the aftermath of the quake and tsunami.

You simply can't prepare for every possible outcome from a natural disaster. Around the world it happens and we pick ourselves back up, rebuild and keep living.

At the end of the day we are just insignificant ants on a mound and every now and then mother earth kicks the mound sending us scrambling, there's nothing we can do about it.

I simply can't fathom how many families have been turned upside down as a result of these kinds of disasters, something I hope to never have to find out personally.

[saaya]

hello guys
im OK,my area was not affected by earthquake .....
not affected??
im lying...everyone in Japan(why not the entire world?) was affected....

we lost friends there..the victms needs food,water,clothes ..its winter and now the fukushima power plant will collapse sometime soon..
they(we) need help and hurry..
and we are doing everything we can do to help them

Great to hear your alright junior!

Weather is on our side, winds will blow straight onto the pacific ocean from fukushima.
At least for today... Looks like it "may" ultimately reach Hawaii and the us. Should be dispersed by then... let's hope.

Latest news: radioactivity dropped and engineers returned to the plant.

BTW, I'm disgusted by pro nuclear lobbyists and experts in the media..
Instead of admitting that reactors aren't perfect right now and that we have to tighten security, they claim all is fine and there is simply nothing we can do... this only increases public demand to drop nuclear altogether...

Germany is shutting down all pre 1980 reactors NOW and reviewing security of ALL German reactors! Great news... I don't get why nobody else is doing this...
Govs and the nuclear industry have to show that they take this seriously!

[l0ud_sil3nc3]

it is true they have evacuated everybody due to extremely high radiation levels, it looks as though a full meltdown will probably occur

[dctokyo]

Status of quake-stricken reactors at Fukushima nuclear power plants


The following is the known status as of Wednesday afternoon of each of the six reactors at the Fukushima No. 1 nuclear power plant and the four reactors at the Fukushima No. 2 plant, both in Fukushima Prefecture, which were crippled by Friday’s magnitude 9.0 earthquake and the ensuing tsunami.

Fukushima No. 1 plant

—Reactor No. 1 - Cooling failure, partial melting of core, vapor vented, building damaged Saturday by hydrogen explosion, seawater being pumped in.

—Reactor No. 2 - Cooling failure, seawater being pumped in, fuel rods fully exposed temporarily, vapor vented, building damaged Monday by blast at Reactor No. 3, damage to containment vessel on Tuesday, potential meltdown feared.

—Reactor No. 3 - Cooling failure, partial melting of core feared, vapor vented, seawater being pumped in, building damaged Monday by hydrogen explosion, high-level radiation measured nearby on Tuesday, plume of smoke observed Wednesday, damage to containment vessel likely.

—Reactor No. 4 - Under maintenance when quake struck, fire Tuesday possibly caused by hydrogen explosion at pool holding spent fuel rods, pool water level not observed, fire observed Wednesday at building housing reactor, no water poured in to cool pool.

—Reactor No. 5, No. 6 - Under maintenance when quake struck, temperature slightly rising in spent fuel pool.

Fukushima No. 2 plant

—Reactor No. 1, No. 2, No. 4 - Cooling failure, then cold shutdown.

—Reactor No. 3 - Cold shutdown.

[AceBaran]

This is serious

Sent from my E10i using Tapatalk

[saaya]

What does cold shutdown mean?
Thanks a lot dctokyo
Any news when they will add water to the spent rod pool?
It's being discussed as the highest risk of a release of lots of radioactive material as its relatively poorly protected and contains looooots of material
any news where the huge radioactivity came from and why its lower now?

[Erklat]

Germany is shutting down all pre 1980 reactors NOW and reviewing security of ALL German reactors! Great news...

They are shutting them down for the next three months for inspection, they are probably going to bring most of them back to use afterwards.
But you can forget about this in Japan since the Germany is not couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific with the highest population per square kilometer on the planet, with next to no non-renewable power sources. They have no other means to support their industry, windmills and solar will not cut it here so us here probably won't live to see they(or anyone else) abandon nuclear power sources. happens, Japanese are clever and hardworking people and they probably wouldn't build nuclear powerplants on the quake infested islands which are sitting on the junction between four tectonic plates with highest seismic activity on the planet. They had/have no choice.
They were struck before, and sadly will be struck again, but every time they didn't fail to show the rest of the mankind the results of the hard work and dedication when they built the devastated again only to be bigger and better.
In two years from now you won't be able to tell anything happened there part from the monument to all the victims. I wish my people were as hardworking and diligent.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

[dctokyo]

What does cold shutdown mean?
Thanks a lot dctokyo
Any news when they will add water to the spent rod pool?
It's being discussed as the highest risk of a release of lots of radioactive material as its relatively poorly protected and contains looooots of material
any news where the huge radioactivity came from and why its lower now?

Your Welcome saaya
A reactor is in cold shutdown when, in addition, its coolant system is at atmospheric pressure and at a temperature below 200 degrees Fahrenheit (approx. 95 degrees Celsius).[1] This temperature is low enough that the water cooling the fuel in a light water reactor does not boil even when the reactor coolant system is de-pressurized.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutdown_(nuclear_reactor)

[generics_user]

They are shutting them down for the next three months for inspection, they are probably going to bring most of them back to use afterwards.
But you can forget about this in Japan since the Germany is not couple of islands in the middle of the Pacific with the highest population per square kilometer on the planet, with next to no non-renewable power sources. They have no other means to support their industry, windmills and solar will not cut it here so us here probably won't live to see they(or anyone else) abandon nuclear power sources. happens, Japanese are clever and hardworking people and they probably wouldn't build nuclear powerplants on the quake infested islands which are sitting on the junction between four tectonic plates with highest seismic activity on the planet. They had/have no choice.
They were struck before, and sadly will be struck again, but every time they didn't fail to show the rest of the mankind the results of the hard work and dedication when they built the devastated again only to be bigger and better.
In two years from now you won't be able to tell anything happened there part from the monument to all the victims. I wish my people were as hardworking and diligent.

Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk

i wish i had your confidence; in 2 years there will be no one living within a 30-40km radius of that plant if things keep going that way; exposure of the spent fuel pool might cause even higher contamination than a complete meltdown inside of one of the reactors

i still don't get it how it's even possible that these hydrogen explosions happened and why there is no way to vent the hydrogen directly into the open air instead of the turbine housing which would've caused far less damage to the enviroment

BTW: attempts to fill the spent fuel pool with helicopters failed so far due to strong winds and high radiation surrounding the site according to kyodo news, additionally Japan is running out of boric acid and has to waitf or resupply from s. korea

[p2501]

Cold shutdown means all reactors are shutdown and cooling of residual heat is stable. Sounds good to me.

BTW: Japanese Red Cross donation site posted in NHK live stream.

[Nomadsoul]

Very scary. Japan is 3rd biggest economy in world. But country like Pakistan (pretty much surviving on US aid) has begun work on a fourth plutonium-producing reactor at Kushab for Pakistan's nuclear arsenal (It already has such large stockpile). NOT FOR ELECTRICITY PURPOSE. Pakistan comes under Level 6 & 7 Earthquake zones, and there are floods/Tsunami. This country is worst hit from Natural disasters in last 15-20yrs.

I don't understand why USA provide aid to such country, who spends only on arms, education budget is 0.6% of GDP. Before starting arms race with arch-rival India, They should reallize Pakistan's GDP is less than city of Mumbai alone. India spends just 3% of GDP on defence.

[Johnny87au]

wow this has to end soon, to much pain has been suffered!! God bless all!

[WaterFlex]

Russian nuclear experts have arrived. They will save us.