AMD Cayman info (or rumor)

[cegras]

With no good Cayman's leaks, perhaps a lot of Cayman's FUD

http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/ite...2nd-nov-launch

No final bios, cards, partners grumpy
Sources on a small island that doesn’t get along well with red China are informing us that Cayman has little chance to make the scheduled November 22nd launch.

The situation doesn’t look good as the final chip never made it to partners and the final boards are not ready yet. Partners do have early samples, but our sources assured us that there is no final bios and that drivers are not ready.

Just to assure you that this is not Nvidia talking, these guys are all unhappy as they were supposed to get some good sales numbers over the holiday season, as quite a few of people are excited about Cayman.

As of today, November 5th, at least some of the mayor players have no cards, no final bios and no drivers. They are saying the way things worked in the past they would have a small miracle to have full availability at launch.

We are sure that many will burn the messenger, but there is nothing we can do about it. We can only hope that we will see some Cayman cards selling in December.

OBR, that you?

[Olivon]

Hope that's not true ...

[Picao84]

OBR, that you?

IF true, it might "justify" nVIDIA aparent insanity by pricing GTX580 so high..

[safan80]

IF true, it might "justify" nVIDIA aparent insanity by pricing GTX580 so high..

The important question is: Can a GTX580 beat a 5970?

[Olivon]

The important question is: Can a GTX580 beat a 5970?

I don't think so ... Very near maybe ...

[Picao84]

The important question is: Can a GTX580 beat a 5970?

Does it matter if a 5970 is more expensive?

[Sn0wm@n]

Does it matter if a 5970 is more expensive?

antilles's release soon .. so its price is likely to fall ....

[Lanek]

antilles's release soon .. so its price is likely to fall ....

Or will be EOL at this time (using the last in stocks for RMA )...

But let's imagine the 6970 have +- the perf of the 5970, what will you buy ? a dualgpu who have 14months, or a fresh new 6970?

[BababooeyHTJ]

The important question is: Can a GTX580 beat a 5970?

Have you seen benchmarks of a 5970 overclocked vs a GTX480 overclocked? I don't think that GTX580 will have any problems against 5970. How it will perform against Antilles is the more important question.

[RPGWiZaRD]

How it will perform against Cayman XT is the more important question.

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699 which will quite soon drop to $649)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

[Jowy Atreides]

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

You're aiming too low. The question should be - how much does the 6970 beat the 580?
Also, how much does the 6950 beat the 580?

They both will, even if it's marginal for the 6950.

[BababooeyHTJ]

There, fixed for you.

(I wouldn't be suprised if Cayman XT will be 5% or so behind GTX 580 in avg if GTX 580 is like 20% in avg faster than GTX 480 and I expect Cayman XT to bring GTX 580 prices down with around $50 at least cuz a $599 GTX 580 would look rather expensive compared to a $449 Cayman XT. I know it's pure speculation but I have a feeling this will be quite close to truth. However Cayman XT might well become priced up to $499 if it performs good enough and nvidia sticks to 550-$599 range, anyway I say 449-$499 for Cayman XT and 549-$599 for GTX 580 with very small performance difference between the two and Antilles will still be significantly faster than GTX 580 by at least GTX 480 vs 5970 margin but cost will be the what seems to have become the accepted upper-limit cost for a highend GPU; $699)

EDIT: There fixed it for those who don't like reading BS speculation. ^^

Yeah, no speculation there at all.

Where are you getting those numbers?

[RPGWiZaRD]

You're aiming too low. The question should be - how much does the 6970 beat the 580?
Also, how much does the 6950 beat the 580?

They both will, even if it's marginal for the 6950.

Your expectations don't make sense, then 6950 would have to cost at least 549~$599 and HD6970 with whatever advantage it have perhaps $699 and Antilles would be only available to rich bastards for $899 and then that would be rather aggressive pricing vs performance for the competitor. You think the market would accept such prices? Another point would be power consumption/efficiency? AMD would sure have some wizard engineers to be able to create such performance increase yet on 40nm node not to mention the limited development time. xD

Yeah, no speculation there at all.

Where are you getting those numbers?

From my head using logical guesses based on historical pattern, trends, current manufacturing process node status, how much spareroom for improvement does it look to be there still on current gen, "what I had aimed for being in charge of the company", what feels right etc, like I said, speculation. ^^ Some speculations are more logical than others though.

[safan80]

Have you seen benchmarks of a 5970 overclocked vs a GTX480 overclocked? I don't think that GTX580 will have any problems against 5970. How it will perform against Antilles is the more important question.

Since the new rumor is antilles might not make it out this year, First the GTX 580 has to beat 5970 and then it has to be Antilles The price of the GTX 580 is too high for me to consider unless the performance is mind blowing.

[saaya]

The price of the GTX 580 is too high for me to consider unless the performance is mind blowing.

you mean as in 3x faster than we need? ^^

seriously, whoever NEEDS that performance is gaming at 2560x1600+ or 1920x1080+ 3D, and if you can afford a display for 500-1000$ then youd have a weird sense of value if you consider 550$ for a vga to feed that display too much...

i think the real dealbreaker for both nvidia and ati right now is the lack of killer apps, ie games, plus the high cost of 24"+ displays... if displays were cheaper AND/OR there would be at least 2 kick 4ss games that NEED a highend gpu to be maxed out, highend would actually sell some actual volume and not be a corporate e-peen contest

Whew, didn't mean to rile people up with my response, but usually most reviews I've seen show a 25+% gap between 5870 and 480 @ 2560x1600

what reviews?

normalized there is a 10% difference on average according to tpu
http://tpucdn.com/reviews/Zotac/GeFo...rfrel_2560.gif

anandtech 2560x1600 max:

0% difference in BFBC2
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33205.png

~5% difference in Wolfenstein
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33236.png

~10% difference in crysis warhead
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33215.png

~10% difference in metro2033
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33230.png

~15% difference in dirt2
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33221.png

~20% difference in hawx
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33224.png

~20% difference in ME2
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33227.png

~30% difference in civ5 (no driver tweaking yet from ati i think)
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33212.png

~30% difference in Stalker CoP
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33233.png
(unplayable on either one, at playable settings the difference is only ~20%)
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33232.png

~30% difference in battleforge (why is it in dx10 and not 11?)
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph3987/33209.png

thats 16-17% difference between the 5870 and the 480 on average according to anandtech, which i think chose a very good selection of games...

the 480 has MUCH better min fps than the 5870 and 68xx... but av fps is in no way 25% faster on average, and 25%+ on average, thats just ridiculous man, i wanna see those reviews
n-zone? ^^

[safan80]

you mean as in 3x faster than we need? ^^

seriously, whoever NEEDS that performance is gaming at 2560x1600+ or 1920x1080+ 3D, and if you can afford a display for 500-1000$ then youd have a weird sense of value if you consider 550$ for a vga to feed that display too much...

lol I would not want to paid that price for performance close to the 5970 I want a lot more performance. I want to game at 200fps at 2560x1600 is that too much to ask for?

[bill_d]

you mean as in 3x faster than we need? ^^

seriously, whoever NEEDS that performance is gaming at 2560x1600+ or 1920x1080+ 3D, and if you can afford a display for 500-1000$ then youd have a weird sense of value if you consider 550$ for a vga to feed that display too much...

but only had to buy my 30" once but have had to buy two gpu's a year and yes it adds up, so about 350 per gpu is about right or the 700 i payed for a 5970