imo its intel being greedy making design decisions to monetize mainstream overclocking. id rather spend extra dough on better hsf than pay intel for the 'privilage'. especially when privilage happens to be limited multipliers. not everyone buys $1000 cpu and §700 motherboards.but looking at the performance and no competetion from AMD i'll hold my nose and buy oneOriginally Posted by Sam_oslo
Last edited by geo; 08-29-2010 at 09:35 AM.
Mainstream overclocking is a blip on their balance sheet.
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
Its funny how you still say the same thing over and over again, when its wrong.
You dont need to spend 1000$ to get a unlocked cpu, plus with unlocked multis you don't need expensive mobos, hell i bet with SB even the cheapest mobos gets the same exact oc as a highend SB 1155 board. The only thing that has to be up for the task is the power circuit.
I'm sure Intel will hold their nose when they take your money...imo its intel being greedy making design decisions to monetize mainstream overclocking. id rather spend extra dough on better hsf than pay intel for the 'privilage'. especially when privilage happens to be limited multipliers. not everyone buys $1000 cpu and §700 motherboards.but looking at the performance and no competetion from AMD i'll hold my nose and buy one
You've pretty good nailed it down.yeah ... however, if Intel serves up K skus for reasonable costs it will make up for their decision a little.
But I, like many, believe that for the enthusiast community this is a poor move. I can see both sides of the argument. Enthusiast want the option to void their warranty and push to the limits. They want the most performance for the least cost.
The other side of the argument is Intel wants to make money
AMD unlocked their skus as a nice bonus to attrack more enthusiast over clockers over while they worked on getting better products out to take on Intel's lead ... Intel released K skus to counter this, but imo, was more to make up for the eventual movement of the clock gen on package/die. It is actually quite amazing to me that Intel would even do that considering past behaviors.
Some ppl here somehow tend to forget who actually invited the idea to fine premium for an unlocked multipliers.
then why not unlock multipliers on all mainstream chips? they are obviously trying to monetize it trying to make even the blip count.
They are ... they are offering K skus with unlocked multi's ... a 2500K looks like it will go for about 200 bucks. I only buy unlocked multi CPUs anymore, both the 1000 and the cheapo (meaning low cost) AMD variety myself. More knobs to play with to figure out various impacts of various components of the system as a whole.
Last edited by JumpingJack; 08-29-2010 at 10:01 AM.
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
btw. anyone knows if turbo was enabled on the GPU?
I doubt it since it is controlled by the PCU and if its diabled for the CPU there is a high chance that it is also disabled for the GPU. So this numbers might even increase a bit, since the 2400 can turbo the gpu up to 1,1ghz.
i doubt quad channel mobo will be under$400 at the very least and cheapest quad under 350 . thats 400 extra for overclocking choices other than multipliers. quad channels dont mean much performancewise and 2011 quads wouldnt be that much performance increase over 1355 quads. so yeah 400extra for 2011 overclocking.
sure hex/octacore will be huge but they will be atleasst 600+ not mainstream..
Last edited by geo; 08-29-2010 at 10:15 AM.
I don't even want quad channel, much more risk of a RAM stick failure with 4 sticks compared to 2 (I've dealt with too much annoying slow-death micron DDR2 failures already) and overclocking 2 RAM sticks is easier than 4.Sure the performance won't be quite as good but I don't expect the huge extra cost LGA2011 setup will be worth it in practice for the more performance/cost ratio minded person. It sounds like it might even be a bit expensier at launch than X58 was. SB sounds exciting to me but AMD's offering also does and I'm no fanboy of any company (for CPU it stands 5 AMD vs 3 Intel CPUs used so far) so it'll be interesting times ahead.
Last edited by RPGWiZaRD; 08-29-2010 at 10:27 AM.
Intel? Core i5-4670K @ 4.3 GHz | ASRock Extreme6 Z87 | G.Skill Sniper 2x8GB @ DDR4-1866 CL9 | Gigabyte GTX 970 OC Windforce 3x | Super Flower Titanium 1000W | ViewSonic VX2268wm 120Hz LCD | Phanteks PH-TC14PE | Logitech MX-518 | Win 7 x64 Professional | Samsung 850 EVO & 840 Pro SSDs
If all people would share opinions in an objective manner, the world would be a friendlier place
well k series will cost more for one and all youll get is limited unlocked multipliers. if you want more overclocking choice well have to shell out atleast 400 more for 2011 setup compared to similarly performing 1355 setup
While also agree they wont be cheap, mobo makers have few choices to make em cheaper. Same as they did for S1336. Instead of 8 mem slots they just can put 4 on it. And other thing to save money.
Good mobos still will costs 300-400€ maybe even more, but I also think there will be S2011 boards the can break the sub 250€ range.
Again we don't know the SKUs intel will offer for S2011.
If you mean limited as in 57, which means 5,7ghz, then yes they are limited...
It's all relative, 200 bucks is more than what? It is certainly more than an 80 buck Celeron no doubt. So yeah, it will probably come with a 30 or 40 buck premium. An I7-870 goes for 289, a 875K for 329. People will need to make up their minds.
In terms of OCing, what choices do you want -- unlocked multipliers make it even easier. I don't really get what you mean by limited unlocked multipliers.
Certainly, AMD will exploit this with similarly prices CPUs on their own. AMD has always catered more to the enthusiast overclocking crowd as well.
In a less stringent way, AMD will need to go a similar route anyway meaning offer up mainstream/consumer oriented skus and also support higher-end platforms. Integrating the GPU on to the CPU has it's advantages and disadvanges, BD will not have the GPU and will cater to a different socket for high end DTs -- you can bet it will be cheaper though.
But it is all relative, AMD or Intel will feature out CPUs into the market it is up to what performance, features, things people are willing to pay or not pay for. It really makes no difference.
Last edited by JumpingJack; 08-29-2010 at 10:56 AM.
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
Just because it's 4 channel does not mean you need to run it 4 channel.
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
Well why pay extra for 4 channel then if you're only gonna use 2 sticks anyway. Yes there will be other differences but still.
Intel? Core i5-4670K @ 4.3 GHz | ASRock Extreme6 Z87 | G.Skill Sniper 2x8GB @ DDR4-1866 CL9 | Gigabyte GTX 970 OC Windforce 3x | Super Flower Titanium 1000W | ViewSonic VX2268wm 120Hz LCD | Phanteks PH-TC14PE | Logitech MX-518 | Win 7 x64 Professional | Samsung 850 EVO & 840 Pro SSDs
If all people would share opinions in an objective manner, the world would be a friendlier place
Good point, just don't get a 2011 at all and you should be happy. But for that matter, why do you pay for 2 dual channels (4 dimms) -- why pay the extra, you should demand that AMD and Intel remove that extra channel that you don't want to pay for.
Last edited by JumpingJack; 08-29-2010 at 11:05 AM.
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
How long will this new socket last?
I don't want to buy a SB if they're going to nerf out in 1 years time to another three sockets.
At least till haswell is coming. (H1 2013, maybe even later)
Seems like it might be worth forgoing BD straight to SB.
Your opinion, huh? Imagine that : a corporation intent on becoming ever more wealthy. What a concept.
Well looks about the right time for my first post here.
What's with the 1355 socket mentioned in the last few posts? I've heard something about it in the past but thought that intel got rid of it and only lga1155 and lga2011 were to made it. What's it gonna bring to the table?
Anyone have any idea what the actual "core name" is gonna be for initial 1155 sandy? I mean like what bloomfield is to nehalem or gulftown to westmere for instance.
I'm totally for sandy compared to the current i7 bloomfield lineup(9xx included) as far as you didn't already own one. I'm gonna play the waiting game here with sandy hope it's the right choice. Just the rumored prices need to end up real. The only thing I kind of dislike is the limited PCI-e lines and the dual channel memory( 6 gigs seemed more in the right spot for me than either 4 or 8 gigs available now). And I hope that bulldozer is a nice leap for AMD too. It's only gonna bring better cpus in the future for everyone.
Well it could be more down to the architecture than anything else that sets the limits rather than Intel deliberately trying to cut down on users taking advantage of overclocking low budget CPUs to extreme variants or above, I doubt Intel takes overclocking capabilities into account when designing a new architecture (ofc clock frequency scaling is an important part but hey they can do it using higher multis so). We might just have been lucky with Core 2 - Core i7. What I'm saying is the FSB overclocking as we're used to might just have been a coincidence and that this time it won't happen as easily. Now you could even look like it from this perspective, what if Intel was kind enough to please enthusiasts to be able to overclock further with the K variants. You then might say well why not provide unlocked multis for all parts? Well overclocking community is just too small. But i7-2500K will be cheap at least, for majority of people the K variants won't make any sense.
Makes me remind of emulator community and the common view about "speed hacks", it was just a coincidence it works, they don't code the emulator in order to be able to support them. :p
Last edited by RPGWiZaRD; 08-29-2010 at 12:07 PM.
Intel? Core i5-4670K @ 4.3 GHz | ASRock Extreme6 Z87 | G.Skill Sniper 2x8GB @ DDR4-1866 CL9 | Gigabyte GTX 970 OC Windforce 3x | Super Flower Titanium 1000W | ViewSonic VX2268wm 120Hz LCD | Phanteks PH-TC14PE | Logitech MX-518 | Win 7 x64 Professional | Samsung 850 EVO & 840 Pro SSDs
If all people would share opinions in an objective manner, the world would be a friendlier place
Well, look at it from another point of view: At least now there will be cheap multi-unlocked CPUs, so BCLK won't be a concern until you try LN2 since 57x105 seems about the maximum obtainable frequency. Still plenty of room for easy OC on air and water. OC is never guaranteed and never will be. Intel's only concern is to provide a chip that is guaranteed to work at stock settings. The rest is a bonus you may or may not get. For examle, the i7-875K is very attractive currently, as it easily goes to 4 GHz with half-decent cooling regardless of the max BCLK your board can manage.
Last edited by rado992; 08-29-2010 at 12:52 PM.
Let's put things into perspective: the i7 920 was released in November 2008 for $284. This new SB i7 2600K will be released roughly 2 years after the i7 920, costing around the same price point, but will it perform 2x-3x faster according to moore's law? NO
Ever since the Core2Duo architecture, all processors are incremental upgrades with diminishing returns. Frankly I'm disappointed at Intel but when going up against the laws of physics, you're always going to lose, especially when AMD has its head up its own ass.
What is your understanding of Moore's Law?Let's put things into perspective: the i7 920 was released in November 2008 for $284. This new SB i7 2600K will be released roughly 2 years after the i7 920, costing around the same price point, but will it perform 2x-3x faster according to moore's law? NO
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
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