pay to post sponsored builds?

[DarthBeavis]

Another forum which will not be named has decided to charge about 70-80 bucks for EACH thread that is a sponsored build. What do you all think about this? Anyone ever heard of a site doing this? Do you think this will be a trend?

[Jowy Atreides]

Another forum which will not be named has decided to charge about 70-80 bucks for EACH thread that is a sponsored build. What do you all think about this? Anyone ever heard of a site doing this? Do you think this will be a trend?

Hopefully not.

Just because builds are sponsored does not mean that they aren't brilliant pieces of work.

It's win/win/win, the builder gets some easing of parts cost, the manufacturers get a little promotion and bond with the community and the forum readers get to enjoy the fruits of someone elses talent whilst being able to take away new skills from the explanations.

[Mudgey]

How do these people get sponsored anyway? Sponsorship would ease the already large dent in my wallet! lol

[Vapor]

I don't think that's going to be a trend here...

If nothing else, sponsored builds tend to be great to ogle and I can't reasonably think we'd want to push that away

[tool_462]

How do these people get sponsored anyway? Sponsorship would ease the already large dent in my wallet! lol

Make pretty stuff and ask, or have a lot of visibility and make not-so-pretty stuff but be popular and ask.

[Starscream]

this forum that started charing for sponsored builds. Do they have ads on their forum?

If yes arent they already getting extra inc from the people looking at the custom build threads?

[Nickel020]

Charging to be allowed to post in this way is too much imho. I can understand that they want to do something against people posting for economical reasons. A better idea imho is to just require people who (effectively) get paid to post to state this in their signature, so that normal users who might not know the sponsored guys can easily tell them apart from normal users who have no economical interest for posting whatsoever.

[DarthBeavis]

Make pretty stuff and ask, or have a lot of visibility and make not-so-pretty stuff but be popular and ask.

so you say my stuff is not so pretty? LOL

[DarthBeavis]

this forum that started charing for sponsored builds. Do they have ads on their forum?

If yes arent they already getting extra inc from the people looking at the custom build threads?

yes there are ads

[H20Cooled]

so you say my stuff is not so pretty? LOL

I would say your new build is not so pretty, instead it is DAMN HOT!!!

[Gimmpy224]

Charging to be allowed to post in this way is too much imho. I can understand that they want to do something against people posting for economical reasons. A better idea imho is to just require people who (effectively) get paid to post to state this in their signature, so that normal users who might not know the sponsored guys can easily tell them apart from normal users who have no economical interest for posting whatsoever.

isnt an online forum supposed to be a community of people with the same interest SHARING ideas?

Not "Oh hey this guy has funding, I bet we could try to tap into that funding some by making him pay to show people who are very interested in whats hes doing that could potentially learn from it"

^^^^ sounds like an awesome way to kill a forum.

[NKrader]

haha darth!! you will have to spend money afterall!! heh all ur freebees :P

that sucks tho..

isnt an online forum supposed to be a community of people with the same interest SHARING ideas?

Not "Oh hey this guy has funding, I bet we could try to tap into that funding some by making him pay to show people who are very interested in whats hes doing that could potentially learn from it"

^^^^ sounds like an awesome way to kill a forum.

at the same time sponsored builds are kinda a busness..

just to play devils advocate for a min.

DB was that your face when you found out about this rule?

[[XC] Oj101]

Sponsorship is supposed to make it easier to do your build, not end up costing you double

[dualbrain]

I can understand the forum-owners, as the banners etc. you find within a worklog are a cheap solution for companies to get advertising into forums.

Usually they would need to pay the forum-owner for banner-placement etc.
By these extremely growing sponsoring-things in worklogs, the companies save money (hardware-parts - to the company - cost muuuuuch less than what you pay for) on "regular ads" and are also closer to the potential buyer AND adblockers have no chance. This makes the regular paying ad-clients feel like stupid. In Germany the two biggest forums already forbid these banners and big namings of sponsors in worklogs, because the "trademark-grab company from Germany" (yuck!) abused it sooooo much. They only allow to name the sponsor in text form at THE END of the first posting.

I fully understand it from the view of the forum owners and also from the perspective of many users who don't want to feel that our hobby is turning in to commercial uglyness where you don't know anymore if "good talking about a company / product" is because it's true, or just because the person needs to say it.

I see it like this:
Forum-owners earn less and less money with the growing "ad-placement" in worklogs. If the forum-owner doesn't earn enough money anymore, he can't run the forum - and you lose a home. This of course only applies to forums where the owner is not Robin Hood. People who take something should sometimes give something back.

Just my three cent and personal view on the topic.

[Nickel020]

isnt an online forum supposed to be a community of people with the same interest SHARING ideas?

Not "Oh hey this guy has funding, I bet we could try to tap into that funding some by making him pay to show people who are very interested in whats hes doing that could potentially learn from it"

^^^^ sounds like an awesome way to kill a forum.

Please read my post again... I did say charging sponsored people was a bad idea imho.

[meanmoe]

Please read my post again... I did say charging sponsored people was a bad idea imho.

wow... I agree with you, but I almost changed my mind as your avatar stared at me.

Although I don't like the idea, I believe in the end it's completely up to the forum owner though. If you don't want to pay... don't post there.

DB, I'll still ogle your worklogs, regardless of where they are.

[Orangey]

All people need to do is state their sponsors. It also helps avoid confusion about costing. I used to wonder how so many people could justify a full complement of BP fittings.

[Alexandr0s]

People who take something should sometimes give something back.

However, this giving back should not be forced upon someone.

[meanmoe]

However, this giving back should not be forced upon someone.

Philosophically, I agree with you.

In this context, what's being forced?

[DarthBeavis]

I can understand the forum-owners, as the banners etc. you find within a worklog are a cheap solution for companies to get advertising into forums.

Usually they would need to pay the forum-owner for banner-placement etc.
By these extremely growing sponsoring-things in worklogs, the companies save money (hardware-parts - to the company - cost muuuuuch less than what you pay for) on "regular ads" and are also closer to the potential buyer AND adblockers have no chance. This makes the regular paying ad-clients feel like stupid. In Germany the two biggest forums already forbid these banners and big namings of sponsors in worklogs, because the "trademark-grab company from Germany" (yuck!) abused it sooooo much. They only allow to name the sponsor in text form at THE END of the first posting.

I fully understand it from the view of the forum owners and also from the perspective of many users who don't want to feel that our hobby is turning in to commercial uglyness where you don't know anymore if "good talking about a company / product" is because it's true, or just because the person needs to say it.

I see it like this:
Forum-owners earn less and less money with the growing "ad-placement" in worklogs. If the forum-owner doesn't earn enough money anymore, he can't run the forum - and you lose a home. This of course only applies to forums where the owner is not Robin Hood. People who take something should sometimes give something back.

Just my three cent and personal view on the topic.

however, if you have ads on your site you get paid on traffic which results in ad clicks. having sponsored modders on your forums generates hits.

[dualbrain]

however, if you have ads on your site you get paid on traffic which results in ad clicks.

DB, I fully understand you and maybe you even know - I'm a fan of yours



Just to think about the possible view of the ad-client who pays the forum-owner:

What will the ad-client think, if he sees other companies ad-banners on the page where he has to pay for the placement ... and they don't have to pay for it?
Yes, he might feel stupid to pay for it.

What's the solution for him?
To give up paid ad-placment on the specific website.
Maybe he even thinks "hey I'm clever, I don't pay the forum guy XXX$ per month for the Ad anymore, I better invest only 50$ to give it to a guy who then bombs his worklog with ad-banners for my company".

Who get's something in the whole process if it happens like this?
Everyone except the person who runs the forum.
Therefore it makes sense to me that a solution is needed where the forum-owner is not the stupid one at the end.


Of course it's a dream if a forum-owner doesn't need any money because he is able to run the forum completely independent, but even someone like this would not like to have these ads in his project.

[DarthBeavis]

DB, I fully understand you and maybe you even know - I'm a fan of yours



Just to think about the possible view of the ad-client who pays the forum-owner:

What will the ad-client think, if he sees other companies ad-banners on the page where he has to pay for the placement ... and they don't have to pay for it?
Yes, he might feel stupid to pay for it.

What's the solution for him?
To give up paid ad-placment on the specific website.
Maybe he even thinks "hey I'm clever, I don't pay the forum guy XXX$ per month for the Ad anymore, I better invest only 50$ to give it to a guy who then bombs his worklog with ad-banners for my company".

Who get's something in the whole process if it happens like this?
Everyone except the person who runs the forum.
Therefore it makes sense to me that a solution is needed where the forum-owner is not the stupid one at the end.


Of course it's a dream if a forum-owner doesn't need any money because he is able to run the forum completely independent, but even someone like this would not like to have these ads in his project.

first, understand I am not saying they are totally wrong for implementing this. Time will tell. I am just opening it for debate so we can hear all sides. I personally do not put 'banner ads' or stuff like that in my worklogs. I mention who I got what from in next and by showing product.

Now, the risk of this new policy is the liklihood of people not disclosing their sponsorships. I can just as easily say I used someone's stuff in my build but not say I got it free (excellent Thermaltake CPU waterblocks for example). people will see the stuff and order it regardless of if you say you were sponsored with it or not. I do not have to tell people I get free stuff, just as long as people know what I am using my sponsors will be happy.

If they want to raise money from us 'pro' modders then do something like what Fugger has done here or what Kyle has done at [H]. Offer some perks for a one-time fee like a custom name and maybe a higher mailbox limit and stickied worklogs

[Sam_oslo]

It should be the opposite actually. People should get paid, or encouraged/required by other mean to inform about sponsorship.

Some people manage to keep their true enthusiast skills and present a fare plus/minus abut their builds/rewires, but unfortunately too many tend to act as advertisement agency for the sponsors. This can actually do some harm to a forum where enthusiasts try exchange ideas and experiences. Therefore it is very important to have clear information about sponsored works.

[prava]

This is something that I felt as being totally wrong. Lets dissect it:

Traffic:
a) More traffic means more revenue for the forum.

b) More traffic means more visits which means more people joins the forum which means more (and better) content: this also leads us to a).

c) More traffic means more modders will come here to show their work which would also result in an increase of traffic which gets us to a).

So, what is my point? The better the modders, the better the traffic. Also, the better the modders, the better the companies will give stuff to those modders which, also, will mean that their mod will be even better.

So, all in all this is a chain that results in win win win win win for just everybody!

Then, what kind of reasons would make a forum start such nonsense rule? I really don't understand. Lets just check a bit this stuff: how many pages among all those written in here contain ads? 0.1%? 0.01%? Even less? Heck, many pages get hits just by posting the origin of that new/stuff/whatever, should we also ban those for being ads?

This, guys, is total nonsense. People that pay for the ads on the main-screen on this forum could not care less about the negligible quantity of ads that forum users post on their topics and worklogs (which are on page one, not on their sig and/or any of their posts...) because, as I pointed out, its that same sponsorship that makes the mods even better. Lets, for example, talk about this post:

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...6&postcount=21

Do you think such a small mention will hurt anybody? Heck, such a piece of engineering has to cost quite a nice amount of money and I'm quite certain that craigbru will do a much better work with such machine that with his bare hands. So, where is the damage being done? Yea, if the forum was 100% about modding then I could understand it but, in an enthusiast forum such as this we are talking about all the products, does it matter whether they are given to us for free or not? People reviews products all the time..

IMO, there is nothing to discuss as what they are doing in that forum is plain wrong. If I had a sponsored build I would rather not post it rather than not naming the people that allowed (or made it easier) my build to be possible: and this is rather true just seeing that there are a lot less mods compared to here.

[dualbrain]

I personally do not put 'banner ads' or stuff like that in my worklogs. I mention who I got what from in next and by showing product.

I'm completely on your side with the way you do it as far as you describe it.

The huge-banners and "i first want to thank Abmahntuning (written in huuuuge) and Phoetus for their superior products" texts at the beginning of the first posting of a worklog is, what I think is disgusting. I just know it in its extremest uglyness from the german forums, where they pulled the emergency-break because of this. There were 70% of so called "zombie-worklogs" where the only purpose was: The sponsor was praised, no matter what the worklog was, no matter if it was total garbage etc. Only 30% of active worklogs were without the huuuge banners of the two mentioned names.

That's what I refer to basically I don't know if the other place you talk about had these kind of developments.