Thuban & Zosma info/code name from anandtech "Juicy"

[Oliverda]

I think we can do it now as well with C3 revision,not 100% since I don't have any (C3).

I don't think so.

[Dresdenboy]

i guess we'll see samples of buldozer this year

Thanks for the slides. There are already running samples and I heard of them in december.

[Florinmocanu]

But then each core on the i7 is also more powerful.


It'll be more like 17K.

Nope, your wrong.

a Phenom II 940 scores around 12.5k in R10 Cinebench.

so that means an average of around 18.2k for a 6 core at 3ghz, but you also have higher HT/NB speeds because 965 and 955 brought increases in that area plus higher DDR3 speeds, which also help in 3d rendering.

Overall, a 6 core 3ghz CPU should score close to 19k, which is around a I7 965 XE. If we OC it to 4 ghz a 25k result should be quite easy to get out, higher than a 4ghz I7 which scores around 22.5k (mine scores around that figure).

a Thuban will be a powerfull solution for users who needs lots of rendering power, folding power etc.

[FlanK3r]

dont forgot for diferent efectivity cores, its not 6x, but about 5.1-5.3 max. And Thuban is not simple Phenom core x 6 . Some changes. I know about two news between Deneb.

[Florinmocanu]

well, don't forget that the result a Phenom II gets out is not a 4x, it's more around 3.5x, so the calculation already takes care of the 5.1-5.2x scaling.

a PhII 940 scores around 3500 score for single-threaded in R10 and if it could get a 4x increase you should get around 14000 points, but you get 12.500, so these scaling issues are already taken into account when i calculate the possible score of a Thuban.

And trust me, 3d graphics is my job, i do that for a living. I know what to expect from a 6-core Phenom II, when i read reviews i always pay carefull attention to the 3d rendering results plus i test my own cpus a lot in these apps, like Cinebench, mental ray, v-ray, blender.

I expect a 3ghz hexa-core to score around 18.5k-19.5k, depending on ram speed, whatever improvements they made to the core, HT and NB speeds etc. 25-26k should be a 4ghz result.

[FlanK3r]

ok, its possible (cause i have 17 000+ with my x4 965 BE at 4.1GHz)

[ajaidev]

If we were to compare the R10 results for AMD 965 and Intels i5 750 one will notice that the scaling is better in 965 than in i5 750.

PhII 965 does 3941 for single and 14012 for multi
i5 750 does 4238 for single and 14142 for multi
i7 920 does 3846 for single and 16211 for multi

In i7's case HT helps out a lot..

[initialised]

Are you forgetting the fact that the 920/860 will do 4GHz easy? C3 965s aren't as hot as C2s but they are still hot enough that adding 2 more cores makes me wonder if you'll be able to not be thermally limited in overclocking. I guess we'll see what happens when the chips become available

I did a C3 4GHz on water under 60C a while back, with that kind of thermal performance 4GHz x6 should be possible.

If we were to compare the R10 results for AMD 965 and Intels i5 750 one will notice that the scaling is better in 965 than in i5 750.

PhII 965 does 3941 for single and 14012 for multi
i5 750 does 4238 for single and 14142 for multi
i7 920 does 3846 for single and 16211 for multi

In i7's case HT helps out a lot..

4GHz C3 965 18k x3.6
4GHz i7 23k x4
Hexacore:
Stock 24.7k
3.6GHz 28k
4GHz 31.9k
Scaling factor around x5.7 regardless of clock speed so HT doesn't help as much as on the quads which typically get ~4x expect PhII x6 to be closer to 5x.

I'll have to wait and see how the Thuban x6 goes when the sample comes in but it does have a tough act to follow given how easy 4GHz has been on i7 compared to PhII and the Clock-Clock performance discrepancy.

[Florinmocanu]

I did a C3 4GHz on water under 60C a while back, with that kind of thermal performance 4GHz x6 should be possible.



4GHz C3 965 18k x3.6
4GHz i7 23k x4
Hexacore:
Stock 24.7k
3.6GHz 28k
4GHz 31.9k
Scaling factor around x5.7 regardless of clock speed so HT doesn't help as much as on the quads which typically get ~4x expect PhII x6 to be closer to 5x.

I'll have to wait and see how the Thuban x6 goes when the sample comes in but it does have a tough act to follow given how easy 4GHz has been on i7 compared to PhII and the Clock-Clock performance discrepancy.

Your wrong, the good scaling in I7 CPU's is due to HT, without HT we would see lower scaling than on a PhII, like in a I5 750.

And also, you calculate scaling based on single thread performance, not on the ratio between increase in frequency over increase in performance.

[Lokinhow]

If we were to compare the R10 results for AMD 965 and Intels i5 750 one will notice that the scaling is better in 965 than in i5 750.

PhII 965 does 3941 for single and 14012 for multi
i5 750 does 4238 for single and 14142 for multi
i7 920 does 3846 for single and 16211 for multi

In i7's case HT helps out a lot..

but i5 and i7 have the Turbo mode.
P2 X4 965 will run at the same clock in both single and multi
i5 750 runs a core at 3.2GHz at single thread and 2.8GHz at multi thread when turbo mode is on, that's a 400MHz difference, that's why it have the worst scalling.



but if it was done with turbo mode off...err, ignore this post

[haylui]

but i5 and i7 have the Turbo mode.
P2 X4 965 will run at the same clock in both single and multi
i5 750 runs a core at 3.2GHz at single thread and 2.8GHz at multi thread when turbo mode is on, that's a 400MHz difference, that's why it have the worst scalling.



but if it was done with turbo mode off...err, ignore this post

err, next time read before post

[Lokinhow]

err, next time read before post

ok, I must have missed something, where did he said that it was off?

[haylui]

ok, I must have missed something, where did he said that it was off?

let's say with turbo mode on, the frequency difference will be 400MHz
certainly it would give a great impact on performance.
but, since 4 cores would not have anything >4 times the boost vs single threaded
so, the score is certainly comes from the most optimized setting they could get to show i7 the most optimized performance.

[ajaidev]

New info

http://www.techpowerup.com/113955/Ph..._May_2010.html



Well at least there is a 140W hex cpu would have liked it more if it was 3ghz instead of 2.8ghz

[Florinmocanu]

that 2.8 part should be around the performance of a I7 940, and if it is priced right it's going to be a really great budget workstation CPU. Hopefully it can clock as well as a normal phenom II.

[Manicdan]

that 2.8 part should be around the performance of a I7 940, and if it is priced right it's going to be a really great budget workstation CPU. Hopefully it can clock as well as a normal phenom II.

i could see alot of mobos being set on fire thanks to these chips. it might almost be time for water cooled MOSFETS on AMD boards

[ajaidev]

i could see alot of mobos being set on fire thanks to these chips. it might almost be time for water cooled MOSFETS on AMD boards

At stock it will all be good but when OCed hell it will be a furnace and a very huge danger for the mobo/smps power systems....

I have to say i disliked intel 32nm duals a lot but the 32nm hex i had was a treat it oced quite well and even tough it was a bit hot...

[tbone8ty]

the new processor will take advantage of HyperTransport 3.x interface, with a HT speed of 2400 MHz (4800 MT/s).

so with a 2400 mhz HT, how will that effect performance?

will the NB freq change? to 2400 mhz?

[Florinmocanu]

Huh? the tdp is still 140W. The same thing that a 965 BE C0 does to a mobo, this guy will do as well. Come on, stop inventing problems. The tdp is the same as older AMD CPUs so i don't understand why it would be a problem now.

OFC, when OCed it's going to go up, but when you OC you usually cool stuff better than normal/stock cooling.

[FlanK3r]

probably...HT can not higher than NB clock...

[Hell Hound]

3.0 GHZ 125 WATT'S AM2+ Is what I want

[MrMojoZ]

3.0 GHZ 125 WATT'S AM2+ Is what I want

Well I want 4.0 ghz at 15 watts but I'm not going to get that either.

[Hell Hound]

I can always go INTEL.If they can't get a 125w 3ghz chip to me,I can just go i7 and get the 130w 3ghz chip.

[ajaidev]

I can always go INTEL.If they can't get a 125w 3ghz chip to me,I can just go i7 and get the 130w 3ghz chip.

In true multi threaded app's the x6 would have a edge over i7 quad. If you wanna get a proper i7 get a i7 980X 32nm 130w and 3.33ghz

[Hell Hound]

I will see if they plan on refreshing to a 3GHZ @ 125W for the am2+.I don't see why they wouldn't.I can get a x6 and 2X 6870's instead of getting cpu mobo ram,which is what I would have to do if the 3ghz+ 125w chip are AM3 ONLY !!!