Huge EVGA Fail!!!! GTX 295 Hydro "copper" mixes ALU and CU in the same BLOCK!

[evil-98]

i present to you

INNOVATEK.. cool-matic GTX 295...






looks like the only difference between the two is the copper base... sad sad sad

[Waterlogged]

Well, evil beat me to it by 5 minutes but yeah, that turd has Innovatek's crappy machining and flow pattern written all over it.

[evil-98]

yay i win! wheres my cookie...

yea the way it was design it was obvious that i was made by innovatek.

atleast we can say that EVGA made a bad decision and that it wasnt there fault entirely.. ?

[Waterlogged]

yay i win! wheres my cookie...

yea the way it was design it was obvious that i was made by innovatek.

atleast we can say that EVGA made a bad decision and that it wasnt there fault entirely.. ?

By my count, it's at least the third time EVGA has made this mistake (Innovatek). They also had a full MoBo set for 680 (IIRC) and 8800Ultra(again IIRC) both called "Black Pearl". They took a beating on the GFX block on their own forum, ask DB.

[DarthBeavis]

By my count, it's at least the third time EVGA has made this mistake (Innovatek). They also had a full MoBo set for 680 (IIRC) and 8800Ultra(again IIRC) both called "Black Pearl". They took a beating on the GFX block on their own forum, ask DB.

LOL . . . .who did the beating

[Chruschef]

*snip*

didn't read the rest of the thread, came back to my computer, forgot to refresh ::P:
well we'll if this is real when we see it on the shelf.

i have to ask though, did EVGA machine their own blocks back then? were their first two waterblocks the aformentioned blocks?(680/8800GTX/ultra)? was it the case that they started machining their own to sell, instead of letting another company(innovatek) mess it up a third time. the copper bit was a bit suspicious though. where the old blocks copper for the core matrix, or straight aluminum?

[Waterlogged]

LOL . . . .who did the beating

Heh, I just dug up that topic on DD to follow the link you posted and what do you know, that topic of them getting their arse handed back to them not so politely isn't there anymore.

[NaeKuh]

OMG WTF is eVGA thinking...

This could be the OEM innovotek block... maybe...

Well, evil beat me to it by 5 minutes but yeah, that turd has Innovatek's crappy machining and flow pattern written all over it.

yay i win! wheres my cookie...

yea the way it was design it was obvious that i was made by innovatek.

atleast we can say that EVGA made a bad decision and that it wasnt there fault entirely.. ?

actually i got way b4 u guys did.

[NaMcO]

Don't know what's wrong with metal mixture in a loop. Had loops working for over 2 years with blocks from Innovatek in Aluminum and EK in Copper and never ever had a single spot of corrosion. It's all in the cooling fluid...

Anyway, back on topic... That product should have never been advertised as Hydro Copper, it's fooling the consumer and we all know Copper is a better heat conductor and works better (and is more expensive as well) than Aluminum. Looks like a fail to me.

[Spankyfart]

Heh, I just dug up that topic on DD to follow the link you posted and what do you know, that topic of them getting their arse handed back to them not so politely isn't there anymore.

Pretty sure it's out there somewhere.
http://www.archive.org/web/web.php

[Nickel020]

Don't know what's wrong with metal mixture in a loop. Had loops working for over 2 years with blocks from Innovatek in Aluminum and EK in Copper and never ever had a single spot of corrosion. It's all in the cooling fluid...

Anyway, back on topic... That product should have never been advertised as Hydro Copper, it's fooling the consumer and we all know Copper is a better heat conductor and works better (and is more expensive as well) than Aluminum. Looks like a fail to me.

+1

You can mix metals just fine as long as you don't as you you use proper cooling fluid/additives. I mean every other car cooling system mixes metals, and they seem to be doing well...
Lots of people are also running Innovatek and Aqua Computer alu stuff with copper blocks and it works just fine (as long as they use proper additives of course).
I'm not saying that alu is good, but it's definitely usable in a WC setup.

Selling that block as Hydro Copper is deliberately misleading customers though, they should have never done that. Also, if someone sells alu blocks they should provide sufficient information on what corrosion protection should be used, which EVGA seems to not be doing considering the look of the block in the pics

for some reason, i almost kind of doubt this. it is fud, and eVGA machines their own waterblocks last time i checked. they've always machined them out of copper and delrin, all of them having the same identical design with the E's for a fin matrix; why would they so suddenly change from that? their hydrocopper cards have always been very expensive, i haven't ever seen eVGA get cheap on us. this product isn't even listed on their website yet, don't they usually have pre-order.
something just seems fishy. we'll see though when the products released.

$0.02

EVGA has been selling video cards with Innovatek blocks for years in Europe. Considering this there's no reason to doubt this. Also Fud is not really known for faking reviews, they may often provide dubious rumors that turn out to be wrong, but they don't fake reviews.

[SoulsCollective]

+1

You can mix metals just fine as long as you don't as you you use proper cooling fluid/additives. I mean every other car cooling system mixes metals, and they seem to be doing well...
Lots of people are also running Innovatek and Aqua Computer alu stuff with copper blocks and it works just fine (as long as they use proper additives of course).
I'm not saying that alu is good, but it's definitely usable in a WC setup.

These additives are called corrosion inhibitors. Not corrosion blockers. Galvanic corrosion cannot be halted by adding in compounds, only slowed - any mixed volatile metals in a loop will cause corrosion. In order to fully protect yourself against any corrosion within the usable lifetime of the products, you'd have to add so much corrosion inhibitor to your loop that performance would suffer a huge hit - and you still couldn't guarantee anything.

Mixed metals are definitely not "usable", unless you like gambling with your hardware, and especially not when there are Cu variants available for more or less the same price.

[BringerOdeath]

Well, now EVGA has this gem under their belt too!! http://www.evga.com/articles/00467/

WOW, 197 Euros for that Aluminum POS??

[Jah]

/golfclap

Seriously, people will never learn

[hotdun]

....In order to fully protect yourself against any corrosion within the usable lifetime of the products, you'd have to add so much corrosion inhibitor to your loop that performance would suffer a huge hit - and you still couldn't guarantee anything.

Mixed metals are definitely not "usable"....

As much as I hate mixing metals, I gotta disagree with you on this. Mixing metals is not ideal but "OK" with the proper corrosion inhibiter. Adding more corrosion inhibitor than necessary will not extend the life of your product. A product's life cycle nowadays is what?....6 months to maybe 2 years max? I agree, you _will_ lose out on performance from using coolant instead of straight distilled but the drop will be minimal for most users.

That being said.....mixing metals in a loop is one thing...mixing metals in a single block is another....what a piece of crap....

[Nickel020]

Mixed metals are definitely not "usable", unless you like gambling with your hardware, and especially not when there are Cu variants available for more or less the same price.

How do you explain that people have been running mixed metal loops for years with no problems?
Why do the radiators and other parts of the cooling system in cars work for dozens of years if corrosion is such a problem?

Because of the "don't mix metals" hysteria on XS you don't find many people doing it here, but many German companies have been selling alu stuff for like 10 years now. How do you explain that these companies still exist if their products are not usable as you claim?

Sorry, but you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

PS: I'm not defending EVGA here, this product and the way it's marketed sucks. I'm jsut saying that alu is not inherently bad. If price and performance are right then there's no reason not to use alu with a good corrosion inhibitor. And this is coming from someone whose Swiftech Apogee GTX top suffers from corrosion (no inhibitor used though, I know what to do next time...).

[SNiiPE_DoGG]

How do you explain that people have been running mixed metal loops for years with no problems?
Why do the radiators and other parts of the cooling system in cars work for dozens of years if corrosion is such a problem?

Because of the "don't mix metals" hysteria on XS you don't find many people doing it here, but many German companies have been selling alu stuff for like 10 years now. How do you explain that these companies still exist if their products are not usable as you claim?

Sorry, but you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance Performance

[NaeKuh]

Sorry, but you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

yeah ur right i dont know what im talking about..

Just like this wasnt corrosion eh?



The point is to avoid that, not delay it.

Mixing metals with AntiCor coolant will delay that, skipping it will avoid it entirely.

And its not happy or nice when you got that and you need to clean it up from your loop.

but many German companies have been selling alu stuff for like 10 years now. How do you explain that these companies still exist if their products are not usable as you claim?

Its called lack of real competition, and grossely messed up testing methodology.

dude dont even try to defend germans here unless its benz porsche or bmw.

[Hondacity]

wasn't that steel?

[NaeKuh]

wasn't that steel?

corrosion is still corrosion.

it involves mixing of metals.

if it was alu it would of been the same result.
im showing him that its possible. (because he said We have no idea WHAT we are talking about right?)

Oh and that company fixed that mistake, not much can be said about the germans.

(im not very happy with german h2o people, there low flow bs and messed up testing methodolgy is spreading like virus).

[Chruschef]

EVGA has been selling video cards with Innovatek blocks for years in Europe. Considering this there's no reason to doubt this. Also Fud is not really known for faking reviews, they may often provide dubious rumors that turn out to be wrong, but they don't fake reviews.

are you saying in europe they sell these cards w/ innovatek blocks because its cheap, and in america they sell them with their CU blocks? i haven't even seen an aluminum block on an EVGA card in the states. maybe the review is of european sample. i really hope they didn't botch this up, otherwise thats a lot of respect lost from watercoolers, tis a shame as well because their FC GPU blocks were really top notch.

[NaeKuh]

gives them even more a reason to hate us now eh chruschef....

us fat americans get all the best stuff and give eu the second par stuff?

^nickle this is what your implying more.

[evil-98]

actually i got way b4 u guys did.

you win atleast i got the pics

anyways, i just feel that there is no reason to mix metals when its so easily avoided. the point is not that you "can" mix metals is why should we. So we rant and avoid. the XS way

[Chruschef]

gives them even more a reason to hate us now eh chruschef....

us fat americans get all the best stuff and give eu the second par stuff?

^nickle this is what your implying more.

across the water they're more accepting of mixing metals, unlike us the picky stubborn fat americans.

nickle on this block? maybe. but that doesn't explain the innovatek design. im suggesting this is just an EU card, and they'll have a CU block for the US'of'A & canada. can't forget about canada

edit maybe we should post this on their forums, and give'em hell again just to make sure. what also sucks about this card though, is that if your buying an entirely new card nvidia is about to release a single PCB version(http://www.xtremesystems.org/Forums/...d.php?t=222256), making your shiny new EVGA FC HydroCopper GTX295 obsolete.

[Nickel020]

are you saying in europe they sell these cards w/ innovatek blocks because its cheap, and in america they sell them with their CU blocks? i haven't even seen an aluminum block on an EVGA card in the states. maybe the review is of european sample. i really hope they didn't botch this up, otherwise thats a lot of respect lost from watercoolers, tis a shame as well because their FC GPU blocks were really top notch.

What I'm saying is that EVGA sold video cards with Innovatek blocks here before they developed their own "hydro copper" blocks. This was 8800 GTX/Ultra time, maybe even earlier (8800s were the first ones I noticed).

@Naekuh

Did you even bother to read my post?

If anyone wants proof that alu and copper mix fine with proper additives they just need to take a look at Aqua Computer's forum...

Again, I', not advocating the use of alu, I'm just saying that using alu and copper in one loop without getting corrosion is easily possible.