Real Temp - New temp program for Intel Core processors

[msgclb]

msgclb: RealTemp 2.84 is definitely not working properly with Core i7. Now that I have access to the Intel Core i7 documentation, I'm making progress. The fix is almost done and should be ready for testing before I go to bed tonight.

Read my update in the above post!

[unclewebb]

Version 2.84 has a big bug and is only reading the first two cores of i7 CPUs. No wonder they track each other so well!
That fix along with a few others is on the way. VID for Core i7 is also a work in progress.

I decided to convert RealTemp to UNICODE today to try and get rid of the funny degree symbol that gets displayed for users in Asia, etc. That alone has turned into a project and a half that I probably should have saved for another day. A fresh beta is getting near.

[unclewebb]

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/3/...alTempBeta.zip

This is the first version that might work properly with Core i7. I made a few hundred changes and I likely screwed something up so let me know if you see anything more bizarre than usual.

Converting to UNICODE after the fact is a pain in the butt. RealTemp used to have some funny looking Chinese characters displayed instead of ºC on the main page in some countries. If I've finally fixed that then give me a thumbs up because it took a huge amount of time today.

msgclb: You've been promoted to head Core i7 tester. The VID for Core i7 is still a work in progress. Show me a Core i7 screen shot of the Settings window with Min and Max VID in there. Your core temps probably won't look nearly as consistent with this version.

[msgclb]

You've turned my quad into a dual!

[WaterFlex]

[unclewebb]

I guess that means I'm half way there.
At least it still knows you've got a Core i7 920.

Here's a separate testing program that should show the temps of all your cores.
http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/3/.../i7_Tester.zip

You could also head to EBay with the world's lowest VID Core i7 CPU.
There will definitely be an updated version of RealTemp available later today.

[msgclb]

Is this what you were hoping for?



Update:

The screenshot of 2.85 with 2 cores was taken with HT disabled. I just made some BIOS changes and also enabled HT. Look at what happened to Real Temp.



I'll leave up to you to interpret these results.

[unclewebb]

msgclb: That explains everything! If CPU-Z is correct ( Cores 4 - Threads 4 ) then I'll have to assume that you have hyper threading turned off.

When it is turned on, that testing program will probably look more like this:



I assumed all Core i7 CPUs would look like that but obviously I didn't consider what happens when hyper threading is turned off.
Thanks for your help. Now I have to go make an adjustment or two or three or ........

Anyone that wants to someday have RealTemp recognize all 8 of their cores on a SkullTrail system should run the Core i7 Tester program and show me a screen shot.

[DJSUB]

wow thanks for the new version
keep up the good work uncle!
someday you will be rewarded

[msgclb]

This is what I got with HT enabled. I wish you luck!

[unclewebb]

With hyperthreading turned on, RealTemp 2.85 should be reporting your core temperatures correctly.

Do you know if hyperthreading can only be turned on or off in the bios or is there a windows based program that can access hyperthreading. As far as I know, I think you can only adjust it in the bios.

Now that I understand what's going on, I should be able to come up with a fix. I have another feature I'd like to add at the same time that might allow the SkullTrail guys to access the temperatures of their other 4 cores.

When hyperthreading is enabled, the Core i7 Tester program shows the temperatures from all 8 threads. There are only 4 cores so threads 0/1 share the same temp data for core 0, threads 2/3 for core 1, threads 4/5 for core 2 and threads 6/7 for core 3. That should line up with what RealTemp 2.85 shows.

RealTemp 2.84 was only showing the data from threads 0/1/2/3.

[burebista]

I have another feature I'd like to add at the same time that might allow the SkullTrail guys to access the temperatures of their other 4 cores.

I think is kinda useless. Virtual cores with virtual temperatures?
Those virtual cores should have another measurement unit: virtual °C or °Cv.

[nuclearjock]

Quick question:

I just checked Intel's web site (proc spec finder), and the thermal spec field is blank.

What's the thermal spec or temp limit for i7??

[unclewebb]

nuclearjock: TJMax is stored within each Core i7 CPU. This allows Intel to change it at any time without causing problems with temperature monitoring software.

All of the Core i7 CPUs I've seen so far are TJMax=100C.

burebista: Skulltrail isn't virtual cores, it's real cores. It's the platform that uses two QX9775 CPUs on the same motherboard so there are 8 different cores that you can read temperature info from. RealTemp has only been able to read the temps from the first CPU. I've added a new INI switch to help with this problem:

Skull=1
Skull=2

This will allow Skulltrail users to run two instances of RealTemp, one for each CPU. If this works then maybe I'll be motivated to write a special version of RealTemp that can read all 8 cores at once.

That's done and the Core i7 without hyperthreading bug has been fixed and should work properly now as well. I just need to do some more testing to make sure it's ready to upload.

[Demo]

@unclewebb

Im getting 71-71-65-65 on a linpak testing, would this indicate a mounting problem on my TRUE-120EX or just the surface of my cores ?

[msgclb]

With hyperthreading turned on, RealTemp 2.85 should be reporting your core temperatures correctly.

Do you know if hyperthreading can only be turned on or off in the bios or is there a windows based program that can access hyperthreading. As far as I know, I think you can only adjust it in the bios.

Now that I understand what's going on, I should be able to come up with a fix. I have another feature I'd like to add at the same time that might allow the SkullTrail guys to access the temperatures of their other 4 cores.

When hyperthreading is enabled, the Core i7 Tester program shows the temperatures from all 8 threads. There are only 4 cores so threads 0/1 share the same temp data for core 0, threads 2/3 for core 1, threads 4/5 for core 2 and threads 6/7 for core 3. That should line up with what RealTemp 2.85 shows.

RealTemp 2.84 was only showing the data from threads 0/1/2/3.

I believe you're correct that with HT enable RealTemp 2.85 is reading the core temperature correctly.

If there's a windows based program to access HT I don't know about it. If anybody does please speak up!

When you compare these two images it's obvious what's happening!


I had my Core i7 at 3.8 GHz but Core 0 got up to 95 degrees using prime95. That was stable for 2 hours and then I tried to find some lower voltages that would work but all I've had was blue and black screens. I had to go back to default to get it running again.

[bowman]

So RealTemp is Nehalem ready and more accurate than CoreTemp, or?

New to this whole Intel thing. This ain't my daddy's Celeron 450..

edit: http://www.isarapix.org/pix18/1227291023.png woops..

[VOID WARRANTY]

wow i just down loaded real temp and i run my e8400 at 4.45ghz 1.7500 Vcore and 1.4200 vtt..Real Temp is showing 22C idle and 41C at full load after 10 min of prime blend...((Core Temp says 27c idle and goes up to 49C on prime blend who do i believe))...41c at 100% percent load really makes my water cooling look worth it.. really is this right should i trust Real Temp

[unclewebb]

http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/3/...alTempBeta.zip

msgclb: Here's a fix for the hiding cores when hyper threading is disabled.

Once again there have been a lot of changes during the last week so let me know about any problems.

Could you also post a comparison screen shot of RealTemp, CoreTemp and that Core i7 Testing utility. It works good if you run a few threads of Prime95 for a few seconds to try and get the cores at a bunch of different temperatures. That makes it easier to see what temp goes with which core.

As mentioned above, the other addition to this version is the Skull=1 or Skull=2 INI file option for Skulltrail users. Run some Prime threads on your second CPU only and see if starting RealTemp with Skull=1 or Skull=2 makes a difference.

Demo: A difference between the two Dual Cores within a Quad is typical. It's almost always that core0/core1 run up to 5C hotter than core2/core3. I did some testing a long time ago and when I had the CPU fan turned off while running Prime, the difference increased to about 10C between the sets of cores. Same Q6600 with better cooling and the difference is less than half of that. It seems to vary from one processor to the next. I'm not sure if this is related to how the IHS makes contact with the cores or how the sensors are calibrated by Intel or how you applied your thermal paste or ???

I think the manufacturing process and IHS were originally designed to be attached to a single core. With a Quad, the IHS might not make 100% equal contact with both dies so heat transfer and temps are slightly different which is mostly noticed at full load. Anything is possible.

bowman: Download v2.86 and post another screen shot showing CoreTemp and RealTemp and the Core i7 Testing utility.

CoreTemp was originally aware of 8 thread CPUs so maybe it is already working properly. I think RealTemp is too now. Post some screen shots so I can have a look.

VOID WARRANTY: Start by running the RealTemp CPU Cool Down Test to make sure your sensors are working properly. CoreTemp and RealTemp should both be using TJMax=100C for an E8400. You might have to hit the Defaults button in the Settings window if you've copied a new version of RealTemp into a previously used directory. These sensors are not known for great accuracy at lower temperatures when water cooling. Calibrating RealTemp to your CPU can help with that.

[bowman]

[unclewebb]

Thanks bowman.

On some Core 2 Duo motherboards, the APIC ID or the order that software sees the cores changes. I don't yet know if this is an issue with Core i7 but I've included some code in RealTemp to arrange the reported core temperatures into their correct physical order. If anyone ever sees Core i7 APIC in an order other than 01234567 or 0246 with hyperthreading off then let me know.

Now CoreTemp and I just have to get VID working for Core i7.

[msgclb]

msgclb: Here's a fix for the hiding cores when hyper threading is disabled.

Once again there have been a lot of changes during the last week so let me know about any problems.

Could you also post a comparison screen shot of RealTemp, CoreTemp and that Core i7 Testing utility. It works good if you run a few threads of Prime95 for a few seconds to try and get the cores at a bunch of different temperatures. That makes it easier to see what temp goes with which core.

So far the only problem that I see is the Core VID. I ran Prime95 for about 5 minutes. When I next make BIOS changes I'll disable HT.

[unclewebb]

msgclb: Intel thoroughly documents core VID with a bunch of charts and numbers but they leave out a few details like what MSR contains the VID information and how to interpret it. If your hyperthreading issue has been fixed then I'll have some time to read the Intel docs a little closer. When you have 10 minutes to kill can you try doing a CPU Cool Down Test. Your CPU looks like a good candidate for some information since the temps don't line up.

[msgclb]

msgclb: Intel thoroughly documents core VID with a bunch of charts and numbers but they leave out a few details like what MSR contains the VID information and how to interpret it. If your hyperthreading issue has been fixed then I'll have some time to read the Intel docs a little closer. When you have 10 minutes to kill can you try doing a CPU Cool Down Test. Your CPU looks like a good candidate for some information since the temps don't line up.

Is my HT fixed? It looks like it is.



I killed 10 minutes and he's my CPU Cool Down Test.



Here's what I'm looking for in VID category!

[nuclearjock]

nuclearjock: TJMax is stored within each Core i7 CPU. This allows Intel to change it at any time without causing problems with temperature monitoring software.

All of the Core i7 CPUs I've seen so far are TJMax=100C.

Thanks unclewebb, but what I meant is what is the maximum allowable temperature for these chips???