NVIDIA Analyzes 3870 X2

[BTK]

FULL ARTICLE
http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...snow-financial

1) I say pics or it didn't happen.
2) I don't trust the Inquirer.
3) They always bash NVIDIA
4) If true, that's bad. Or good?
5) Basically BS!

From: Michael W Hara <MHara@nvidia>

To: Amanda Hindlian <amanda.hindlian@gs>; Andrew Buscaglia < abuscaglia@thinkequity>; Arnab Chanda <arnab.chanda@db>; Bobby Gujavarty <bobby.gujavarty@db>; Brian Piccioni <brian.piccioni@bmo> ; Craig Berger <cberger@fbr>; Daniel Ernst <daniel@hsqr>; Daniel Gelbtuch <daniel.gelbtuch@us.cibc>; Daniel Morris < daniel.morris@us.cibc>; David Hodgson <david.hodgson@genuitycm>; David Wu <david.wu@globalcrowncapital>; Devan Moodley < devan_moodley@scotiacapital>; Dinesh Moorjani <dmoorjani@bear>; Doug Freedman <dfreedman@amtechresearch>; Elizabeth Pate <epate@fbr>; Garik Shmois <gshmois@longbowresearch>; Glen Yeung < glen.yeung@citigroup>; Gordon Johnson <gordon.johnson@lehman>; Gurinder Kalra <gkalra@bear>; Hans Mosesmann <hans.mosesmann@raymondjames>; Heidi Poon <hpoon@tweisel>; James Covello <james.covello@gs>; Jan-Jesse Flores <janjesse.flores@lehman>; Jason Pflaum < jpflaum@tweisel>; Jean Orr <jorr@nutmegsec>; Jean-Pierre Becker < jean-pierre.becker@tdsecurities>; Jesse Tortora <jesse_tortora@prusec> ; JiHyung Yoo <jihyung.yoo@citigroup>; Jim Karlis < jkarlis@williamblair>; Feeney, JoAnne <joanne.feeney@ftnmidwest>; Joel Jackson <joel.jackson@bmo>; Kamal Das <kamal.das@lehman>; Krishna Shankar <kshankar@jmpsecurities>; Larry Cao <larry.cao@morningstar> ; Michael Masdea <michael.masdea@credit-suisse>; Michael McConnell < mmcconnell@pacific-crest>; Naser Iqbal <niqbal@salmanpartners>; Nicholas Aberle <naberle@cariscompany>; Peter Karazeris < peter.karazeris@citigroup>; Quinn Bolton <qbolton@needhamco>; Rick Schafer <richard.schafer@us.cibc>; Robert Burleson < rburleson@thinkequity>; Ryan Elliott <ryan.elliott@tdsecurities>; Shawn Webster <shawn.r.webster@jpmorgan>; Sidney Ho <sidney_ho@ml>; Simona Jankowski <simona.jankowski@gs>; Suji De Silva <sdesilva@kbro >; Tayyib Shah <tshah@longbowresearch>; Terry Thib < terry.thib@nbfinancial>; Thomas Smith <thomas_smith@sandp>; Tim Luke <tim.luke@lehman>; Uche Orji <uche.orji@ubs>; Will Gabrielski < wgabrielski@amtechresearch>; Yuka Miyake <yuka.miyake@gs>

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Sent: Wed Jan 30 15:53:29 2008

Subject: Analysis of Radeon HD 3870 X2

On Monday, January 28th, ATI launched the Radeon HD 3870 X2 graphics card. This is a dual-RV670 board that ATI is positioning at ~$449-499. Attached is a comparison presentation that outlines the advantages of the GeForce 8800 GPUs over the Radeon HD 3870 X2. There are a couple important things to keep in mind regarding the 3870 X2:

1) Radeon HD 3870 X2 relies on CrossFire driver technology, and thus has the same poor driver support that CrossFire has suffered from including:

- Poor support for next gen DirectX 10 games at launch

- Poor scaling and compatibility on games that are not top benchmarks

2) ATI has not been able to get their Quad drivers for 3870 X2 working and has delayed driver support for QuadFire until March(!). This indicates they are having serious problems with Quad support. GeForce 8800 in SLI remains the undisputed fastest gaming platform on the market.

3) GeForce 8800 GTX prices have been coming down, with overclocked versions readily available for <$449. As you can see from the attached presentation, GeForce 8800 GTX delivers superior DirectX 10 gaming performance than Radeon 3870 X2, and with overclocked 8800 GTX's available for less than Radeon 3870 X2, 8800 GTX continues to deliver the best price/performance. Even the GeForce 8800 GTS 512MB beats Radeon HD 3870 X2 in a number of games and at ~$299 delivers outstanding price/performance.

Enjoy. <<3870 X2 Launch Analysis.Jan08.pdf>>

Michael Hara - NVIDIA Corporation - Vice President of Investor Relations - (408) 486-2511 - Fax: (408) 486-4511

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[TSFroggy]

Even if it were true, consider the source. :P

[BTK]

I said i dont trust inquirer........

[Unbornchild]

Are they sane, posting several other people's email addresses on a public page?!

[generics_user]

to be hones, these are bold statements

i have no problems with my 3870s in crossfire, scaling is good and i still have to find a game which has problems with CF (crysis works perfect for me, same with COD4, source based games, oblivion )

[G.Foyle]

to be hones, these are bold statements

i have no problems with my 3870s in crossfire, scaling is good and i still have to find a game which has problems with CF (crysis works perfect for me, same with COD4, source based games, oblivion )

QFT

[Rattle]

retards

[Monkeywoman]

this "news" is first class BS

[jimmyz]

Wow ati really must have them rattled. this doesn't look good for their x2 coming soon.

[disruptfam]

bs!!!!!!!

[jkabaseball]

well they removed all teh .com from the end of the address, but I would still be pissed about it. maybe I could email Michael W Hara <MHara@nvidia.com> and see if I can get that PDF, or maybe a pair of 8800 Ultras, hell 3 of them!

[saaya]

1) Radeon HD 3870 X2 relies on CrossFire driver technology, and thus has the same poor driver support that CrossFire has suffered from including:

- Poor support for next gen DirectX 10 games at launch

- Poor scaling and compatibility on games that are not top benchmarks

same as 9800gx2...

2) ATI has not been able to get their Quad drivers for 3870 X2 working and has delayed driver support for QuadFire until March(!). This indicates they are having serious problems with Quad support. GeForce 8800 in SLI remains the undisputed fastest gaming platform on the market.

quadfire betas are publicly available on ati.com and while the dont scale well YET they are better than nvidias quad drivers which are nonexistant

3) GeForce 8800 GTX prices have been coming down, with overclocked versions readily available for <$449. As you can see from the attached presentation, GeForce 8800 GTX delivers superior DirectX 10 gaming performance than Radeon 3870 X2, and with overclocked 8800 GTX's available for less than Radeon 3870 X2, 8800 GTX continues to deliver the best price/performance. Even the GeForce 8800 GTS 512MB beats Radeon HD 3870 X2 in a number of games and at ~$299 delivers outstanding price/performance.

true! i wouldnt say the gtx cards beat the 3870x2 but they perform about the same and cost about the same with the 3870x2 being slightly faster and slightly cheaper.

[wickedld9]

Rant: First off I'd like to say, if you're just going to bash it for being from the Inq, don't reply, don't comment, just go about your day. I'm sure it's fun to post "it's from the Inq so it's garbage." It didn't use to be this way here at XS until so many of you came over from other forums like [H] where you're not cool unless you bash the Inq and Fudo.
So please, if you don't have anything relevant to add to the discussion hit the back button on your browser instead of clicking reply/quote.

Back on topic...the 3870 X2 is a considerable threat to Nvidia, they were beaten at their own game with a much more elegant solution and they know full well that the press is going to rip the upcoming GX2 apart for lack of innovation over the 7950GX2.

If you are in the mood to make Mr. Hara squirm, ask him about NVs relationship with Intel right about now, and then ask Intel the same questions. How much of their business is based on Intel chipsets?.....*snip* Ask why it is having such trouble geting chipsets working with Intel 45nm parts. *snip*

Aw come on Charlie, let the whole cat out of the bag on this one! Ask Nvidia how they are liking C1/C2 Quad 45nm!

[L7R]

BS or not, but funny.

[grimREEFER]

cards like the 8800gtx and 8800u don't make sense nowadays when the g92 8800gts is out, i wonder why it is even mentioned. with all things considered(including price), the 8800gts and 3870x2 are both pretty good, its hard to say which is better.

[LiViD]

Rant: First off I'd like to say, if you're just going to bash it for being from the Inq, don't reply, don't comment, just go about your day. I'm sure it's fun to post "it's from the Inq so it's garbage." It didn't use to be this way here at XS until so many of you came over from other forums like [H] where you're not cool unless you bash the Inq and Fudo.
So please, if you don't have anything relevant to add to the discussion hit the back button on your browser instead of clicking reply/quote.

Back on topic...the 3870 X2 is a considerable threat to Nvidia, they were beaten at their own game with a much more elegant solution and they know full well that the press is going to rip the upcoming GX2 apart for lack of innovation over the 7950GX2.


Aw come on Charlie, let the whole cat out of the bag on this one! Ask Nvidia how they are liking C1/C2 Quad 45nm!

Wow, aren't you the one for supporting the only source of false information that the 'net has to offer. Ladies and Gentleman, welcome to a supporter of the "free-world" news. Allow me to welcome him to the real world and offer him a kick in the right direction when it comes to valid information.

I highly doubt you've been going past the 3DMark scores to see the true performance of the 3870. Allow me to say that I "use to have" a 3870 CrossFire setup while still owing an 8800 GTX. After so many years of AA/AF problems that ATi had with their products, the same still remains for the 3870. ATi still cannot produce a GPU that can adequately perform with 16x/16x AA/AF!

My GTX has no problems performing well with those settings and it is a video card that I still plan to keep for a long time. Before you spout that the 3870 X2 will wipe Nvidia off the map, perhaps you should acquire both competitors cards and do some testing yourself.

Seeing that you mentioned [H], I think Kyle Bennett called. He wants their.... (get the pun?)

[Tim]

Charlie Demerjian has got some serious issues with nVidia, he rants literally every article about them, not very professional, and it's getting really pathetic aswell.

I'd almost call him a troll. Sheesh.

[AMDDeathstar]

Financial analysts could care less all they want to know is are sales going up.

[vitaminc]

Are they sane, posting several other people's email addresses on a public page?!

Those are the emails of sell-side analysts, which are public information and readily available if you look on Thomson, Factset or Bloomberg.

Maybe Mr. Hara needs to learn to bcc.

[TSFroggy]

I said i dont trust inquirer........

What I meant was, even if the email were true (which I'm sure it isn't) consider the source - nVidia.

Anyways, yes, nVidia still doesn't have an answer to quadfire yet - even AMD has beta drivers for them, regardless of how well they work yet. Let's see their answer to the 3870 X2...

[thephenom]

Seems like AMD is putting some pressure from Nvidia, I'm pretty sure they weren't very nervous about R600 when it launched.

But yeah, the email if deemed true is from the NV Investor Relations guy, since their downgrade on their stocks a few weeks back, they need to SHOW the market how "proactive" they are against the competitor.

[Calmatory]

BIG boooo!! for Nvidia. :|

[SKYMTL]

Why is everyone so quick to call BS? From what I see alot of those email addresses are legit...especially the ones from CIBC and BMO.

And YES those types of people DO care about the performance of Nvidia's card against the competition. Why wouldn't they? Many of them SPECIALIZE in the computer industry side of stock trading. If they do not advise their firms to buy stock, companies like Nvidia would fizzle out. Take Mr. Gelbtuch for example:

LINK

I suggest some of you do a bit of research before you call out BS.

I am not saying it is BS and I am not saying it is legit...I am just making a point that people shouldn't be so fast to jump in one direction.

[[XC] leviathan18]

releasing to the public emails and phone n&#176; those guys are retards really....

[Ugly n Grey]

Of course they send out emails discussing the competitors possible impacts on their own marketing. First they show they are aware of competition and second they demonstrate where they think that competition hits their product line and what it will mean. Then when they have the investor relations meetings they dig into the detail of what's getting hit and how they are responding.

Who knows if this particular email is legit or not; doesn't matter. If this wasn't the actual email then they sent one that was similar anyhow, rest assured.