Testing / comparing : Intel D975XBX2 / Asus P5B DX ***56K WARNING***

[Skerlnik]

OK, I found out what the problem was with my RAID5 config. I have *not* tested this with another RAID configuration (i.e. RAID0,1,10, etc), but I am confident what caused my RAID5 to go in a degraded state was Apple iTunes.

Yes, I know it is odd, but my RAID5 has been fine since I installed it 3 days ago. Nothing has been causing me problems until tonight. Once I installed iTunes, immediately everything went to hell again. This is the same thing that happened 3 days ago. I installed iTunes, downloaded a music video and BAM....RAID problems.

Tonight I was simply installing it and after installation it was "importing" music files from my hard drive and again my RAID array was immediately degraded. I am 100% positive that iTunes is the problem. Keep in mind that this is AFTER transferring many GB worth of other types of files from my old PC. Never an issue...things were going well. As soon as I installed iTunes and allowed it to "import" files it bombed.

I have no idea how to fix this (or IF I can fix it), but that was the culprit...I'm feeling pretty pissed at the moment since I have spent many hundreds of dollars on my iTunes music.

This may be a problem with iTunes and Windows Vista32 or it may just be a problem in general. I am not an Apple basher...I own 3 Macs...but this is really ticking me off. I burned 3 days on thinking my system was good...and after installing iTunes it completely took a digger on me. NO overclocking or anything else that could be blamed for the problem...it is solely iTunes (and probably RAID5 since not many people use this configuration).

-scaryogre

That's a real bummer. I hate it when my RAID-1 goes into Verify mode after a system crash or two (yeah yeah I mess with OC'ing the darn thing).

Unfortunately it looks like you're not alone. Others have been reporting the same thing.

iTunes + Raid 5 Rant

iTunes + Raid 10 Rant

[Skerlnik]

Man, tried these settings, keep getiing the 3 beep memory error deal. Using 4x1024 OCZ ATI cert DDR2/800. I know this memory will run almost 900 on my old P5WD2-E, what gives???

Keep in mind that 4 sticks of memory will usually need a higher voltage setting than 2 sticks to be stable. I was actually informed of this by OCZ tech support.

On a semi-related note, my 4x1gb OCZ Titanium Alpha's refused to boot in 2 boards at stock voltages. They wanted 2.3v all the time - then later they refused to boot at any voltage! Needless to say, they're in RMA land at the moment. I'm hoping the BadAxe2 didn't kill them.

Good luck on the OC! My rig won't post at 400fsb. 380 tops!

Regards,
Sker

[neonflx]

Anyone try using either the OCZ XTC Memory Airflow Cooler or the Corsair Dominator Airflow Memory Fan on this board?

I am curious to see if they'll clamp on with the vid card and memory tabs so close to each other.

Thanks in advance....

i have the corsair fan it is indeed a tight fit but it works

[SiGfever]

As gtj requested I emailed Intel with my computer specs and asked about the issue with C1E not really being disabled after you disable it in your bios. This was the reply that I just got...

"Hello again, John,

Thank you once more for contacting Intel(R) Technical Support.

We have done some further research in this situation, and found out that the situation you are having is related to a feature called the Intel(R) Thermal Monitor 2, which lowers frequency and voltage (Dynamic VID) to help reduce power consumption.

Unfortunately, this feature is hardware-enabled in the processor, and cannot be disabled. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Please do not hesitate to contact us again if you need further assistance.

Sincerely,

Paul C.
Intel(R) Technical Support"

[ChaosMinionX]

As gtj requested I emailed Intel with my computer specs and asked about the issue with C1E not really being disabled after you disable it in your bios. This was the reply that I just got...

"Hello again, John,

Thank you once more for contacting Intel(R) Technical Support.

We have done some further research in this situation, and found out that the situation you are having is related to a feature called the Intel(R) Thermal Monitor 2, which lowers frequency and voltage (Dynamic VID) to help reduce power consumption.

Unfortunately, this feature is hardware-enabled in the processor, and cannot be disabled. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Please do not hesitate to contact us again if you need further assistance.

Sincerely,

Paul C.
Intel(R) Technical Support"

Funny it gets turned off on other boards.

[gtj]

As gtj requested I emailed Intel with my computer specs and asked about the issue with C1E not really being disabled after you disable it in your bios. This was the reply that I just got...

"Hello again, John,

Thank you once more for contacting Intel(R) Technical Support.

We have done some further research in this situation, and found out that the situation you are having is related to a feature called the Intel(R) Thermal Monitor 2, which lowers frequency and voltage (Dynamic VID) to help reduce power consumption.

Unfortunately, this feature is hardware-enabled in the processor, and cannot be disabled. We apologize for the inconvenience.

Please do not hesitate to contact us again if you need further assistance.

Sincerely,

Paul C.
Intel(R) Technical Support"

What a crock. TM2 isn't even enabled by default and when it is, it only kicks in when the processor reaches a critical temp.

If you're up to a challenge, you can respond with something like...

According to the document "Intel® Core™2 Duo Desktop Processor E6000∆ and E4000∆ Sequence Thermal and Mechanical Design Guidelines", TM2 is disabled by default and when it is enabled, it only becomes active when
the processor reaches a critical temperature. Further, it appears that the 975XBX2 BIOS does NOT enable TM2 although the same document states that it is required.

The document is at http://www.intel.com/design/core2duo/documentation.htm

[SiGfever]

What a crock. TM2 isn't even enabled by default and when it is, it only kicks in when the processor reaches a critical temp.

If you're up to a challenge, you can respond with something like...

According to the document "Intel® Core™2 Duo Desktop Processor E6000∆ and E4000∆ Sequence Thermal and Mechanical Design Guidelines", TM2 is disabled by default and when it is enabled, it only becomes active when
the processor reaches a critical temperature. Further, it appears that the 975XBX2 BIOS does NOT enable TM2 although the same document states that it is required.

The document is at http://www.intel.com/design/core2duo/documentation.htm

I will take up the challenge sir, this is great when I can reply with the facts.
Be right back...

Done!

[RealTelstar]

Keep in mind that 4 sticks of memory will usually need a higher voltage setting than 2 sticks to be stable. I was actually informed of this by OCZ tech support.

On a semi-related note, my 4x1gb OCZ Titanium Alpha's refused to boot in 2 boards at stock voltages. They wanted 2.3v all the time - then later they refused to boot at any voltage! Needless to say, they're in RMA land at the moment. I'm hoping the BadAxe2 didn't kill them.

Anybody got luck installing 4 modules on the badaxe2?

[Poodle]

I'm feeling pretty pissed at the moment since I have spent many hundreds of dollars on my iTunes music.

Oh man... Don't do that, Itunes is the Devils work.

[gtj]

Anybody got luck installing 4 modules on the badaxe2?

No problems here with 4x OCZ Plat Rev 2.

[neonflx]

a bit off subject but i need so ideas
i can get a P5B-deluxe on my going out off business CompUSA for 164.00 out the door, i was thinking of maybe replacing my bad axe 2 as i know my chip can go higher than 3.6 but the volt limit on the board won't allow it anyway i know id a subjective thing but any thoughts would be appreciated

[MuttonFlanks]

Hi guys,

Just finished my build recently and because I have no aftermarket cooler at the moment I didn't want to try overclocking yet. We all know how well that goes... I couldn't resist playing around with the settings a bit.

I have it right now at 9 x 310 FSB and it's stable as far as I'm concerned. I have C1E and failsafe watchdog disable. Also have EIST disabled. The rams are at 4-4-4-12 with 2.12 volts. The rest of the voltages I did not touch. The last time I built a computer was 5-6 years ago and this is my first time overclocking

At stock with no overclock my temps are 35/54 (idle/load) and at 2.79GHz they are 37/57. Are these temps pretty inline with what everyone is getting? I know this isn't a huge overclock but I want to be safe while still using the stock cooler for now. I have a Tuniq 120 but I guess I tried to tighten it too tight and one of the tops on the screws popped off. Not sure how to get it to stay back on or where to get a replacement. I wrote Sunbeam but they have not replied yet.

Anyways I have a few questions. I can't remember exactly now but there is a VT and XT Technology in the BIOS... what are those for? How safe of an overclock can I go with stock cooling? Is it supposed to be ideal to run on the 1066 strap no matter what and to keep the RAM at 533MHz? Seems weird to me buying 800MHz RAM and then turning it down to 533HMz.

I've noticed a small problem I've gotten twice so far. When I turn off the computer and go to bed, the next day I turn it on I get no startup screen whatsoever. No BIOS no video card detected screen... nada. The computer powers on and I can hear everything, but that's it. The way I fix it is by putting the jumper in maintenance mode and loading optimal defaults. Then it works and I can put all my settings back. Any idea what this is?

Sorry for such a long post. Look forward to contributing more in this thread


Update: Just tried 9 x 330 and 9 x 355. Both worked. Temps are both at 41/59. I'm using both Core Temp and TAT to monitor the temps. Should I keep trying higher? I'm getting anxious now lol

Update again: Just turned on the air con in my room and it idles at around 36 degrees now (9x355 or 3.19GHz)

[gtj]

Hi guys,

Just finished my build recently and because I have no aftermarket cooler at the moment I didn't want to try overclocking yet. We all know how well that goes... I couldn't resist playing around with the settings a bit.

I have it right now at 9 x 310 FSB and it's stable as far as I'm concerned. I have C1E and failsafe watchdog disable. Also have EIST disabled. The rams are at 4-4-4-12 with 2.12 volts. The rest of the voltages I did not touch. The last time I built a computer was 5-6 years ago and this is my first time overclocking

At stock with no overclock my temps are 35/54 (idle/load) and at 2.79GHz they are 37/57. Are these temps pretty inline with what everyone is getting? I know this isn't a huge overclock but I want to be safe while still using the stock cooler for now. I have a Tuniq 120 but I guess I tried to tighten it too tight and one of the tops on the screws popped off. Not sure how to get it to stay back on or where to get a replacement. I wrote Sunbeam but they have not replied yet.

Anyways I have a few questions. I can't remember exactly now but there is a VT and XT Technology in the BIOS... what are those for? How safe of an overclock can I go with stock cooling? Is it supposed to be ideal to run on the 1066 strap no matter what and to keep the RAM at 533MHz? Seems weird to me buying 800MHz RAM and then turning it down to 533HMz.

I've noticed a small problem I've gotten twice so far. When I turn off the computer and go to bed, the next day I turn it on I get no startup screen whatsoever. No BIOS no video card detected screen... nada. The computer powers on and I can hear everything, but that's it. The way I fix it is by putting the jumper in maintenance mode and loading optimal defaults. Then it works and I can put all my settings back. Any idea what this is?

Sorry for such a long post. Look forward to contributing more in this thread


Update: Just tried 9 x 330 and 9 x 355. Both worked. Temps are both at 41/59. I'm using both Core Temp and TAT to monitor the temps. Should I keep trying higher? I'm getting anxious now lol

Update again: Just turned on the air con in my room and it idles at around 36 degrees now (9x355 or 3.19GHz)

I think your temps are fine. Even the 41/59 @ 9x355. When you start hitting 70 under load, then I'd start getting concerned. Long term, the lower the better of course.

VT and XD are for Virtualization (or Vanderpool) Technology and Execute Bit Disable respectively. VT is only going to get used if you run VMWare or Virtual PC or something along those lines. XD is a security feature the OS can use to prohibit malicious software from running. Neither is going to make a difference when overclocking. I just happen to disable junk I don't really need so for me, VT is off and XD is on.

For the memory, 533 for a memory frequency doesn't really mean anything except in relation to the reference frequency. Check out the calculator in my sig.

[MuttonFlanks]

I think your temps are fine. Even the 41/59 @ 9x355. When you start hitting 70 under load, then I'd start getting concerned. Long term, the lower the better of course.

VT and XD are for Virtualization (or Vanderpool) Technology and Execute Bit Disable respectively. VT is only going to get used if you run VMWare or Virtual PC or something along those lines. XD is a security feature the OS can use to prohibit malicious software from running. Neither is going to make a difference when overclocking. I just happen to disable junk I don't really need so for me, VT is off and XD is on.

For the memory, 533 for a memory frequency doesn't really mean anything except in relation to the reference frequency. Check out the calculator in my sig.

Cool, I've actually been trying to follow the calculator in your sig. What is the ideal frequency and strap to run then? I've read that 1:1 is what you're supposed to be at? If I enter 355 FSB and 9 for multiplier, then for the 1066 strap to get 1:1 I have to run my memory at 533, is that right? So this would be the fastest I can run my memory?

[MuttonFlanks]

Anyways here are a couple pics to show the temps. Not trying to show stability, but just the temps and CPU speed. I'll try Orthos for stability tonight when I go to bed.

[gtj]

a bit off subject but i need so ideas
i can get a P5B-deluxe on my going out off business CompUSA for 164.00 out the door, i was thinking of maybe replacing my bad axe 2 as i know my chip can go higher than 3.6 but the volt limit on the board won't allow it anyway i know id a subjective thing but any thoughts would be appreciated

Hey, if the P5B-Deluxe will better fit your needs then I'd say go for it. If it doesn't work out and you can't return it, sell it. Is the P5B the same board you used before with this CPU at >3.6ghz?

[Blacklash]

Anybody got luck installing 4 modules on the badaxe2?

Yep, four matching 1GB sticks or two kits of mushkin 996523 . No problems. You may need to increase the voltage a tad as others have indicated.

In my experience with i975x and overclocking I'd advise selecting a frequency of 533 or 667, 800 or a 2:3 ratio, always seems to be problematic when ramping up to higher clocks. I run 533 @ 412 x 9 for a frequency of DDR2 824 @ 3.7, and @ 3.6 I can run 667 @ 400 x 9 for a frequency of DDR2 1000. That's on a 266 ref freq.

[gtj]

Cool, I've actually been trying to follow the calculator in your sig. What is the ideal frequency and strap to run then? I've read that 1:1 is what you're supposed to be at? If I enter 355 FSB and 9 for multiplier, then for the 1066 strap to get 1:1 I have to run my memory at 533, is that right? So this would be the fastest I can run my memory?

I need to add some descriptive text to that calculator.

Facts:

The terms Front-Side Bus and Host Bus are synonymous.

The FSB between the CPU and MCH is quad-data-rate and 8 bytes wide. That means that data passes at 4 times the frequency and it's 8 bytes per clock. I.E. If the FSB Freq is set to 266 then the actual data rate is 1066 MHz (the advertized FSB) or 8528 MB/s (266 * 4 * 8).

The MCH has internal timings just like your memory. The only control you have over those timings is by setting the Reference Frequency which tells the MCH what frequency to ASSUME it's running (strap), not what it will actually be running at as set by the FSB. The MCH then sets it's internal timings accordingly. The higher the strap, the looser the timings will be based on the assumption that the higher the frequency, the looser timings will be required to be stable.

Both the FSB and Reference frequencies are set using their BASE frequencies not the QDR equivalent. I.E. 266 not 1066. It may be REPORTED as the QDR equivalent on the main BIOS page.

The Memory Bus between the MCH and the memory is dual-data-rate and 8 bytes wide. The actual frequency is controlled by the FSB frequency and the ratio of Ref Freq to Mem Freq. To make things a little more confusing, the Memory Frequency is set using the DDR equivalent not the base frequency. Hence 266/533 is 1.0 or 1:1 ratio. So if your FSB is set to 266 and your ratio is 1:1 then your memory will be running at 266MHZ or DDR2-533 and the throughput will be 4264 MB/s (266 * 2 * 8).

If you put DDR2-800 memory in the board, it will default the reference and memory frequency to 266/800 and the FSB to 266. If you do the math, you'll see that this makes the memory run at it's DDR2-800 rated speed. You'll also notice that with a 2/3 ratio, your memory is running 33% faster than the FSB which could be a waste.

My Conclusions:

The 266/1033 strap (Reference Frequency) is optimal. Unless you plan on running a FSB of 450 or higher, going higher on the strap will unnecessarily loosen the MCH timings. You probably won't even be able to boot on a strap of 200 or 133 unless you underclock.

A 1:1 ratio is nice BUT watch the effective throughput of both the FSB and Memory. Ideally, you want the Memory throughput to be slightly higher than the FSB throughput. If you do very heavy disk IO, then the memory thoughput could be even a little higher to allow for direct access to the memory from the disk controller (DMA). Balance this with the speed, latency and voltage capabilities of your memory.

[MuttonFlanks]

I need to add some descriptive text to that calculator.

Facts:

The terms Front-Side Bus and Host Bus are synonymous.

The FSB between the CPU and MCH is quad-data-rate and 8 bytes wide. That means that data passes at 4 times the frequency and it's 8 bytes per clock. I.E. If the FSB Freq is set to 266 then the actual data rate is 1066 MHz (the advertized FSB) or 8528 MB/s (266 * 4 * 8).

The MCH has internal timings just like your memory. The only control you have over those timings is by setting the Reference Frequency which tells the MCH what frequency to ASSUME it's running (strap), not what it will actually be running at as set by the FSB. The MCH then sets it's internal timings accordingly. The higher the strap, the looser the timings will be based on the assumption that the higher the frequency, the looser timings will be required to be stable.

Both the FSB and Reference frequencies are set using their BASE frequencies not the QDR equivalent. I.E. 266 not 1066. It may be REPORTED as the QDR equivalent on the main BIOS page.

The Memory Bus between the MCH and the memory is dual-data-rate and 8 bytes wide. The actual frequency is controlled by the FSB frequency and the ratio of Ref Freq to Mem Freq. To make things a little more confusing, the Memory Frequency is set using the DDR equivalent not the base frequency. Hence 266/533 is 1.0 or 1:1 ratio. So if your FSB is set to 266 and your ratio is 1:1 then your memory will be running at 266MHZ or DDR2-533 and the throughput will be 4264 MB/s (266 * 2 * 8).

If you put DDR2-800 memory in the board, it will default the reference and memory frequency to 266/800 and the FSB to 266. If you do the math, you'll see that this makes the memory run at it's DDR2-800 rated speed. You'll also notice that with a 2/3 ratio, your memory is running 33% faster than the FSB which could be a waste.

My Conclusions:

The 266/1033 strap (Reference Frequency) is optimal. Unless you plan on running a FSB of 450 or higher, going higher on the strap will unnecessarily loosen the MCH timings. You probably won't even be able to boot on a strap of 200 or 133 unless you underclock.

A 1:1 ratio is nice BUT watch the effective throughput of both the FSB and Memory. Ideally, you want the Memory throughput to be slightly higher than the FSB throughput. If you do very heavy disk IO, then the memory thoughput could be even a little higher to allow for direct access to the memory from the disk controller (DMA). Balance this with the speed, latency and voltage capabilities of your memory.

Boy that's going to take a while to digest. That is just way over my head lol. Anyways I turned it down to 9x320 just to be safe until I get a proper aftermarket cooler. The memory I left at 533 4-4-4-12 @ 2.12v. That is 1:1 on the 1066 strap right? Sound good?

[Zucker2k]

a bit off subject but i need so ideas
i can get a P5B-deluxe on my going out off business CompUSA for 164.00 out the door, i was thinking of maybe replacing my bad axe 2 as i know my chip can go higher than 3.6 but the volt limit on the board won't allow it anyway i know id a subjective thing but any thoughts would be appreciated

What volt limit are you talking about? Also what cpu are you overclocking?

[scorpion]

thanks gtj for the heads up on watercooling,scorpion

[C Stat B]

Can giving my memory 2.8v damage my motherboard? I'm aware of the danger to the RAM, but its some crappy OCZ 7200 stuff that doesn't work properly anyway. I just want to see if it can do something good if it's given a chance.

[Zucker2k]

Can giving my memory 2.8v damage my motherboard? I'm aware of the danger to the RAM, but its some crappy OCZ 7200 stuff that doesn't work properly anyway. I just want to see if it can do something good if it's given a chance.

At most, you'd fry the RAM. More than likely, board won't boot. May I ask what memory timings you want to run, speed?

[gtj]

Can giving my memory 2.8v damage my motherboard? I'm aware of the danger to the RAM, but its some crappy OCZ 7200 stuff that doesn't work properly anyway. I just want to see if it can do something good if it's given a chance.

At most, you'd fry the RAM. More than likely, board won't boot. May I ask what memory timings you want to run, speed?

Have a fire extinguisher and a camera handy.

[gtj]

Boy that's going to take a while to digest. That is just way over my head lol. Anyways I turned it down to 9x320 just to be safe until I get a proper aftermarket cooler. The memory I left at 533 4-4-4-12 @ 2.12v. That is 1:1 on the 1066 strap right? Sound good?

You're definitely safe at those settings. You could even move the memory to 667 which would make it run at its rated speed.