"Grouper" first look

**politenessman** · 08-19-2005, 10:02 AM

i have had the ecs radeon xpress (micro atx) board in my htpc for around 5 or 6 months now and i am very impressed. it was the first rev of the board and chipset, also only 1 bios revision (after the shipping bios), also uses the ati southbridge rather than the uli. it has run problem free, slightly overclocked for the entire time i have had it and its in an aspire x-qpack, which is like an oven (no intake fan). the vcore only goes to 1.45v, vdimm to 2.7v, and not much tweaking options, but is running @ 11x225, 1/1 ram.
config -
3500 venice @ 11x225 1.45v
2x512mb pqi turbo tccd @ 225mhz 2-3-7-2 1t
ecs rs480 (same chipset as grouper with built in x300 vid)
2x160gb wd sata raid 0
liteon dvdr 1693s
6600gt
hauppage pvr-150
stock x-qpack 420w psu - 12v rail is around 14amps

so the basic 480 chipset works great in my experience. benchmark results are about the same as nf4 boards, a little better than dfi ultra-d, a little worse than epox 9npaj, but only a few percent separating all 3 boards.

very truly yours,
politenessman

**MaxT** · 08-19-2005, 04:57 PM

Originally Posted by crodan85

Aren't ati currently doing a chipset revision that might be why there Is no news.

nope, they are revising the crossfire edition of the chipset. They might be secretely revising the regular chipset too, but they should have said so, at least i would know why it's delayed.

**crodan85** · 08-19-2005, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by MaxT

nope, they are revising the crossfire edition of the chipset. They might be secretely revising the regular chipset too, but they should have said so, at least i would know why it's delayed.

Arr right so I wonder what the delay is as the grouper board was supposed to be released earlier this month.

**Grayskull** · 08-19-2005, 10:47 PM

Just setting the record straight, none of the chipsets are being revised. rs480, rd480 and rs482 are all production ready and have been for a while. All this hype about the crossfire edition part needing a revision is not true.

Originally Posted by MaxT

nope, they are revising the crossfire edition of the chipset. They might be secretely revising the regular chipset too, but they should have said so, at least i would know why it's delayed.

**MaxT** · 08-19-2005, 11:49 PM

Originally Posted by Grayskull

Just setting the record straight, none of the chipsets are being revised. rs480, rd480 and rs482 are all production ready and have been for a while. All this hype about the crossfire edition part needing a revision is not true.

Thanx for setting the record straight, grayskull.
You might want to do something about this then: http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=25198

I know the inquirer has never been exactly a reliable news source, but they are hurting ATI with rumors like that. Unless they are not rumors

**crodan85** · 08-20-2005, 03:01 AM

Thats in INQ for you they are worse than british tabloids.

**Afterburner** · 08-20-2005, 05:04 AM

Can we expect to see the Grouper in the last week of August or first week of September.......

**Revv23** · 08-20-2005, 09:06 AM

grayskull why not set the record straight about an ETYA on this, many have rigs waiting to be built and it would be nice to know what day we should start looking for it, im tired of searching on 10 websites every day for it.

**Master_G** · 08-20-2005, 09:47 AM

Looks like early September for the UK according to OcUK, US usually gets stuff earlier though, so that still leaves options of both 1st week of September and last week of August.
Some answers on this would be nice, surely it cant be that secret?

G

**don_vercetti** · 08-20-2005, 09:51 AM

Some answers on this would be nice, surely it cant be that secret?

Maybe they just don't know?

**Master_G** · 08-20-2005, 11:48 AM

I cant honestly believe that a company can be unable to say whether it is releasing a product in a week or 2 weeks, they must have set an internal deadline by now, or at least must be well aware if it is going to make next week or the week after (or possibly later).

G

**Afterburner** · 08-20-2005, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by don_vercetti

Maybe they just don't know?

I certainly hope that isnt the case.......

I can imagine piles of Groupers stacked up waiting for the Green light.......

**cadaveca** · 08-20-2005, 12:18 PM

seiing how ATI does not have direct control of the release of public products, only it's chipsets, i think it would be a bit more accurate to say that ATI really has no idea, adn that asking grayskull when they are coming out just isn't gonna get an answer....'cause he really doesn't know. I mean really...even the vidcards...they don't make those either...they don't even make the chipsets, TSMC does.

Remember that ATI has already released the chipsets, as well as Crossfire reference boards. At this point and time it has nothing to do with ATI. The only thing ATI could have done is told OEM's to not release the product until they can do a mass release...again, because it's not ATI making these products, the end date of production on the right number of these boards it totally beyond ATI's control.

I've said this time and again, yet i seem to repeat myself anyway...ATI simply design the products. TSMC makes the actual GPU's, and sapphire makes the actual cards, with the exception of card previous to the X800 generation, which any board maker can assemble. So with this in mind, any complaints or animosity because a product is not released should be directed at those companies.

Production runs, like has been reported, with only yeilds of 2-3% of fully functioning chips...that's not up to ATI...LOL...TSMC is in charge of that. Graphics chipsets being as large of a slice of silicon as they are, problems @ 90nm and 65nm have nothing to do with ATI. If a certain design needs a respin, it's not becasue ATI cannot make the grade, but TSMC's production process cannot meet the grade. This is why you have read of nVidia holding back...because TSMC produces thier chips too, so nVidia would be subject to the same problems had they gone that nm route with the G70 series.

If you are going to let something influence your purchase like production yields, you need to look at the big picture. This is something the INQ fails to do, and why it has a bad rep. But just becuase things are not directly true, however, does not mean that the truth is not hidden behind the scenes.

**dnavarro** · 08-20-2005, 01:37 PM

Guys I read this over at hardocp.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=943036
Whats going on at ATI? Could this be the reason for the delays???
Damn I want to see reviews already!

D

**EMC2** · 08-20-2005, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by Grayskull

Just setting the record straight, none of the chipsets are being revised. rs480, rd480 and rs482 are all production ready and have been for a while. All this hype about the crossfire edition part needing a revision is not true.

Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Digitimes on Aug 15, 2005

In related news, the motherboard makers indicated Rival ATI Technologies’ R520 is still facing power-leakage and heat-dissipation issues.

Care to comment on this tidbit Grayskull?

**Ubermann** · 08-20-2005, 02:15 PM

Review:
http://www.gdhardware.com/hardware/m...purek8/001.htm

Not 100% sure this is grouper.

**situman** · 08-20-2005, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by EMC2

Care to comment on this tidbit Grayskull?

that refers to the videocard side of things. Grayskull is referring to the chipset not needing a respin. Who really cares about top end videocards, not many people can afford them anyways.

**situman** · 08-20-2005, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by Ubermann

Review:
http://www.gdhardware.com/hardware/m...purek8/001.htm

Not 100% sure this is grouper.

nice review but could be a little more thorough.

**Ubermann** · 08-20-2005, 05:15 PM

It was a review..but jesus it sucked.
I really dont think they know what board this is.
Nor do i think they know what overlocking is.
But its still a review =)

**newls1** · 08-20-2005, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Tinker

Something about the way this board looks makes me want to eat Oreo's and Milk.

LMAO!!

**keiph** · 08-21-2005, 11:23 AM

hi,it's been a very long thread and the money for this board is burning me any release date (who's got it)

**Tony** · 08-21-2005, 05:35 PM

The board they tested was Grouper, the only issue is they really didn't open up the extra bios options in the dram and get tweaking

I hear its out real soon, the bios is continually under developement and will be during the life of the board. You all have to remember ATI are new to the enthusiast arena as are Sapphire so its best to get this board as good as it can be before release.

I have halibut here also, it features the same overclocking options/power regualtion but has croosfire also, this board is also being fine tuned so should be competitive on launch.

Thanks for sticking with us all on this, its been a long haul but it appears it will come good.

**situman** · 08-21-2005, 05:41 PM

so sapphire is releasing two models only for 939 right? grouper and halibut?

**Fairydust** · 08-21-2005, 05:44 PM

I just set the system it is supposed to replace to self destruct mode (small script that raises Vcore by 0.1 V every 7 Days, if it's not out by the time, the old system goes up in a big ball of fire (well a small bang with scorchmarks), I will have to go with Nvidia

,

**Master_G** · 08-21-2005, 05:50 PM

Lol, going out in style.

G

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