MSI 5850 Twin Frozr II Voltage Issues

[jacksonkid]

This goes out to anyone with a 5850 but hopefully someone else has experience with this model.

Setting the voltage above 1.150 results in a blank screen (monitor power saving mode) when running any kind of 3d app. Apparently i'm not the only one with this problem. I'm wondering if this is a BIOS issue, or just crappy PWM circuitry? I'm pretty sure this card doesn't use the Voltera chip, but i'm not sure which one it does use.

To all 5850 owners out there, is it common to have problems with voltages above 1.150? I know every chip is different and their not all going to oc the same but i haven't seen anyone having problems setting upwards of 1.3 or even 1.35. This is just a crippled Cypress XT chip after all, and the default core voltage for the 5870 is 1.162 - 1.175 or somewhere around there from what i've gathered.

I've put in a ticket with MSI tech support asking if there is a BIOS that fixes this issue. I'll post their response when i get it. Hopefully it is just a BIOS issue and not the result of the power circuitry, which was one of the biggest selling points of this card. Well, if you believe what all the release information and the box tells you anyway. With its "Military Class Components" Highly conductive capacitors, Solid State Chokes, all Solid caps, blah blah blah. Beefed up power components don't make a sh*t if you can't actually put any voltage to it!

Maybe this thread can be the gathering place for people with this problem and we can get it solved.

Or maybe i'm the only dumb*ss who hangs out here who bought it!

Peace fellas...

[Frogeye]

I've got a saphire 5850 reference and an Ati reference 5850 both can take voltages @ and above 1.15v. I've flashed both of my cards with an unlocked bios found in the Official 58XX thread in this forum.

[screwtech02]

Man, the only thing good I've seen oughta MSI latley is the afterburner program..... Have you been to their "support" forums yet???

[jacksonkid]

I've got a saphire 5850 reference and an Ati reference 5850 both can take voltages @ and above 1.15v. I've flashed both of my cards with an unlocked bios found in the Official 58XX thread in this forum.

I was pretty sure voltages above 1.15 weren't an issue with anyone else. I believe the Asus DirectCU is non reference as well but allows voltage adjustments and has no problems.

Man, the only thing good I've seen oughta MSI latley is the afterburner program..... Have you been to their "support" forums yet???

I have now! Yeah, i'm not impressed. I should have checked beforehand, but I've ran a few MSI mobos back in the day and usually they were pretty decent though not the best out there. I haven't used one for probably three or four years though.

And "their" Afterburner program is basically just a skinned Rivatuner, and Kombustor is Furmark.

Still haven't heard back from MSI yet. Hopefully they provide a fix soon. If it's even fixable!

I tried setting the 3D clocks with AMD GPU Tool so it would be in 3D mode before i upped the voltage with Afterburner (thought maybe it was a Powerplay issue, shutting down when it switched modes since it craps out as soon as i launch a 3D app and Afterburner only applies changes to the 3D clocks and voltage). It worked as far as keeping the card in 3D mode as Afterburner showed the 1.090 voltage as opposed to the 9.49 2D voltage. It made no difference with the problem i'm having though.

[jacksonkid]

I've been in touch with MSI tech support. They gave me a new BIOS version to try but i'm having the same issue. The new BIOS they gave me also sets the default vgpu to 1.164, resulting in instant loss of video when i launch a 3D app. Hopefully they'll keep working at it.

I'm starting to wonder if i just got a bum gpu, but having read every page of the official 58xx owners thread, and no one else having any problems setting whatever voltage they want, i have to wonder if thats the case. Especially since i've seen multiple users complaining of signal loss at the exact same voltage on this model.

Hopefully they'll release a BIOS fix that'll take care of this problem, unless it really is just down to a sh*t gpu.

Anyway, in the meantime i had an idea. I know flashing a reference BIOS to this card would be a bad idea since it uses a different voltage regulator and has a different layout, but, what if i flashed a BIOS of a non reference card that uses the same vreg??? This card uses the uP6266 vreg, so does the MSI 5870 Lightning and the 5870 Twin Frozr II. So what are the chances of causing damage to the card by flashing the Lightning BIOS to it? I've seen alot of people flashing reference 5850s with reference 5870 BIOSs, so i'm assuming since the vreg is the same it should work right?

I know i can throw in my old vid card and reflash if it bricks, but i'm concerned about causing damage to the actual hardware since they aren't reference. Anyone know if it's possible?

[b0rnfrompain]

I've been in touch with MSI tech support. They gave me a new BIOS version to try but i'm having the same issue. The new BIOS they gave me also sets the default vgpu to 1.164, resulting in instant loss of video when i launch a 3D app. Hopefully they'll keep working at it.

I'm starting to wonder if i just got a bum gpu, but having read every page of the official 58xx owners thread, and no one else having any problems setting whatever voltage they want, i have to wonder if thats the case. Especially since i've seen multiple users complaining of signal loss at the exact same voltage on this model.

Hopefully they'll release a BIOS fix that'll take care of this problem, unless it really is just down to a sh*t gpu.

Anyway, in the meantime i had an idea. I know flashing a reference BIOS to this card would be a bad idea since it uses a different voltage regulator and has a different layout, but, what if i flashed a BIOS of a non reference card that uses the same vreg??? This card uses the uP6266 vreg, so does the MSI 5870 Lightning and the 5870 Twin Frozr II. So what are the chances of causing damage to the card by flashing the Lightning BIOS to it? I've seen alot of people flashing reference 5850s with reference 5870 BIOSs, so i'm assuming since the vreg is the same it should work right?

I know i can throw in my old vid card and reflash if it bricks, but i'm concerned about causing damage to the actual hardware since they aren't reference. Anyone know if it's possible?

ive got the same problem. when i set the voltage higher, the temperature does not rise. i think it doestn even set the voltages correctly? dont know if its the gpu but my card cant even do 800mhz on gpu........

[jacksonkid]

ive got the same problem. when i set the voltage higher, the temperature does not rise. i think it doestn even set the voltages correctly? dont know if its the gpu but my card cant even do 800mhz on gpu........

Make sure you've got the latest version of Afterburner. 1.6 is the latest. I can set the voltage just fine. My problem is, when i set the voltage to 1.150 or above, i instantly lose signal to the monitor when i launch a 3D app, and have to do a hard reset. 1.139 is the max i can set and actually launch a 3D app, but it crashes after ~5 minutes. 1.125 is the max i can set and actually be stable for ~3 hours (possibly more, this is as long as i've tested). Either way, reference models don't seem to suffer from this problem.

With the latest Afterburner you shouldn't have problems setting voltages. If you still do, look at MSI's forum for a guide on the CaptureDefualtVoltages setting in Afterburner. Also, you have to enable the option to change voltages in the Afterburner settings. I can't remember the exact wording but it's pretty self explanatory.

Let me know when you can actually change your voltages and if you are able to set anything above 1.150.


A quick question for anyone else here. I've seen several people post here and elsewhere, that they were able to swap out their working card for a different model by returning it to NewEgg. Having read their policy, however, they say they won't swap out a card for a different model. I can request a refund, but i'll be losing about $50 due to restocking fees, and i don't really want to do that. I could have bought a 5870 if you factor that in. So how does one go about doing this? Do i just tell them i'm unhappy with the card? And for what reason? The card isn't defective, it works fine at stock speeds, but it doesn't overvolt for sh*t, which means i can't oc it for sh*t. And no oc means me no happy. If i have to leave this thing at stock speeds and stock volts, i'll have to look at my PC in disgust as it sits there not living up to it's full potential. I'll cry and weep in the corner as my fellow geeks point and laugh at my flaccid epeen.



Edit: I'm still within my 30 day return time frame.

[Gaul]

MSI 5850 Twin Frozr II is ref PCB ?
if ref try flash to MSI 5850 unlock BIOS.

[DemonsBlood]

its not a ref PCB, it is one of the two custom PCB's which retain the ability to change voltage. The other being the ASUS DirectCU version, which I have. I believe that your card is just borked... but in general my feel is that these custom PCB are just not very good with voltage... it takes me well over stock voltages (its at 1.1813) to reach anything above 830... whereas reference PCBs can easily achieve 850+ on stock voltages alone.

Sigh, I would ask them to issue an RMA because their advertised voltage control does not work to some extent...because it is a selling point to that card! Good luck!

[Ket]

I had a very similar issue with my 4830s and it was indeed a issue with the BIOS on the cards. I fixed it by cross referencing the PCB with different BIOSes from other manufacturers until I found one 100% compatible. If its anything like my issue, it may not be a easy fix and tech support will be useless.

[zanzabar]

contact msi they should give u a bios or some way to fix it

[Ket]

Should being the operative word. Doesn't mean they will sadly.

[jacksonkid]

its not a ref PCB, it is one of the two custom PCB's which retain the ability to change voltage. The other being the ASUS DirectCU version, which I have. I believe that your card is just borked... but in general my feel is that these custom PCB are just not very good with voltage... it takes me well over stock voltages (its at 1.1813) to reach anything above 830... whereas reference PCBs can easily achieve 850+ on stock voltages alone.

Sigh, I would ask them to issue an RMA because their advertised voltage control does not work to some extent...because it is a selling point to that card! Good luck!

Yeah, definitely not reference. I sent it back to Newegg I just told the guy that i was unhappy with it and he authorized a full refund. No return shipping or restocking fee. Newegg is frickin awesome. I was still within my 30 day return so they had to take it back, but not charging the restocking or shipping was icing on the cake baby!

I know have an Asus EAH5850 DirectCU. I really wanted a reference model, but they are hard to find. I saw a couple of places that had the Visiontek, but couldn't find any in stock.

This card is definitely much better. I'm sitting at 1000Ggz GPU right now, although it's taking me 1.3 volts to do it. The GPU is under water so i'm not worried about it. I am concerned about the PWM circuitry though. It gets quite hot to the touch. Do any of you have any recommendations on the max voltage for this thing? I'm talking 24/7 use. I don't want this thing to die young. I'm thinking of mounting a fan on the small heatsink that covers the PWM area to help keep it cool.

I'm going to experiment a little bit more and see if i can get the volts a little lower, but i'm pretty sure from my testing so far that this is what it's going to take.

I had a very similar issue with my 4830s and it was indeed a issue with the BIOS on the cards. I fixed it by cross referencing the PCB with different BIOSes from other manufacturers until I found one 100% compatible. If its anything like my issue, it may not be a easy fix and tech support will be useless.

That's interesting. I'm wondering if an eventual BIOS fix might have done it for the Twin Frozr, but i wasn't going to wait around. I tried flashing it to the 5870 Lighting BIOS since they use what looks to be the same PCB and they use the same UP6266 voltage regulator. It took the flash, but it still had the same issue with upping the voltage, instant black screen on 3D.

Should being the operative word. Doesn't mean they will sadly.

Yes, SHOULD, definitely doesn't mean WILL. It came down to them telling me it was a bad batch of GPUs from AMD. Haven't heard of anyone else with this problem on other models of 5850s though so i'm still not convinced of this. Either way, that's all the help i was going to get so i sent that baby back.

Oddly enough, upon removal of the card, i noticed it appears there was some residue (that leftover residue from solder flux) around some of the solder joints on one of the caps, and around one of the chokes. This thing has probably already been RMA'd by someone else, unless it didn't pass quality control after manufacture and those components had to be replaced. Oh well, not my problem anymore.

[Ket]

I hope it all works out. Depending on if a tech feels like being a arse or not they may try and stiff you with a dead card not wanting to admit the solder flux residue happened at the factory. I can say with almost 100% certainty your issue is down to the vBIOS. You may even find you get the exact same card back, just with a new BIOS on it.