Official HD 2900 Discussion Thread

[ahmad]

Here's the bottom line. The R600 is going to be an NV30 level disaster. Crazy late, with performance hardly better than the competition's 2nd best from 6 months ago, and while sucking up an insane level of power (200 watts, with 225+ needed for overclocking?!?) that dwarfs the already power hungry GTX and with heat and cooling issues associated with that. After all this time that's nothing but a very ugly disaster, one that won't be helping AMD one bit and will do very little to push NV into cutting prices. That is bad for everyone, but it doesn't change reality, and that is what the reality is.

You keep saying that. Everyone except dailytech said its as fast in the GTX in a lot of benches if not faster (people with samples).

And promise you will never, EVER buy an r600 no matter how good it is, if you really believe what you are saying.

[cadaveca]

DT, Kyle, and Fuad may have all had the same source...a source that no longer works for AMD/ATI after the merger. Simple answer to that question.

It was said MUCH earlier...NO XTX this gen. Original XT is the 12-inch models, which actually feature smaller PCB than current "XT", with much crappier power regulation. XTX has become the XT

They sold enough OEM 12-incher's to cut out the XT part and switch XTX to XT, buying them time to pull a miracle w/ GDDR4 boards. XL can then be 12-inch model with current "XT" heatsink slapped on(notice that 12-inch features only three heatpipes, but 9.5inch card has 4, good way to deal with poor yeild parts).

Performance...I cannot comment on. I do however know that alot of NDA's on the old parts should have expired recently, and that alot of people have been mentioning recently that they have not signed any NDA's...which tells me that previous expired, and they chose not to sign new NDA.

No new NDA signed...info begins to leak. However, info is based on prevous incarnation of R600, and some development cards(which had half the ringbus turned off), neither of which really portray the real performance of R600. Figure in that in march...all GDDR was questionable in how it performed. If you check boards produced during this period, we have lots of samsung go missing, and infineon starts to appear. Looking back on orders placed by various parties, and available parts, it's easy to see what happened, IMHO. Oh, and don't forget nV's BIG bigwig paying a visit in person to TSMC...


Seems to me that 6000 HD 2900XT boards is worldwide, based on allocation. Boards ship out to retailers tomorrow...because back rooms of my favorite retailers do not have these parts ATM. Launch is 14th, but not all retailers may have recieved thier parts, or may hold back thier parts to see how other set pricing. Irregardless, I want 6 cards...cash saved...I doubt I'll get one. Full retail availability in June, for ALL PARTS.

[Kurz]

Who is to say r600 is going to fly on DirectX9?
What if their true strength is DirectX10.

Look at this the G80 uses 128 stream processors.
AMD uses 320 (Probably more inefficient than Nvidia) the DirectX10 format is made for using a unified structure, DirectX9 needs a converter to translate to the unified shader system (Which might become more inefficient with more stream processors).

Don't say its a failure till we see benches of Both DirectX10 and DirectX9.

[Shintai]

Who is to say r600 is going to fly on DirectX9?
What if their true strength is DirectX10.

Look at this the G80 uses 128 stream processors.
AMD uses 320 (Probably more inefficient than Nvidia) the DirectX10 format is made for using a unified structure, DirectX9 needs a converter to translate to the unified shader system (Which might become more inefficient with more stream processors).

Don't say its a failure till we see benches of Both DirectX10 and DirectX9.

AMD dont have 320. They have 64 that can do 4+1.
Secondly DX9 dont need a converter more than DX10 does. Its no different than with DX10. DX10s new API is just more efficient with the new VDDM.

[Periander6]

And promise you will never, EVER buy an r600 no matter how good it is, if you really believe what you are saying.

I'd be very happy to be proved wrong. I would be very happy to replace the GTS I got in Jan with a $399 card that blew away the GTX. Wishes, however, don't make reality. I gave multiple reasons, the strongest being DAAMIT's own actions, the pricing and the NDAs, why I think it's going to be exactly what I said it was.

I'm not happy about it, I'm angry. Angry because NV feels so confident that they can put out the 8800ultra and the 8600s at rip-off price points because of the lack of competition. Angry because the whole of AMD/ATI is endangered because of the stupid price/manner of the ATI acquisition and the recent lack of execution from both AMD and the former ATI.

[ownage]

Must R600 news is BULL, Fudzilla has to shut up.
You onlys should believe news from guys that are under NDA, but are allowed to release a part of the info.
A few guys on tweakers.net forum are under NDA, and one of them has two X2900XT cards to test on his DFI RD600.
This info did he get from ATI

Review Guideline:
Required & Restricted to compare with GF8800GTS 320/640M, GF8800GTX, 7900GTX, X1950XTX, X1950XT

Highlight: DirectX® 10 Ready, Avivo™ HD, UVD (full hardware decoding of Blu-ray and HD DVD), Built-in HDMI and 5.1 surround audio, Free “Black Box” game bundle, killing price/performance ratio over 8800GTS/GTX.

Radeon™ HD 2900XT Product Features

•Superscalar unified shader architecture
•320 stream processing units
•512-bit 8-channel memory interface
•Comprehensive DirectX® 10 support
•Integrated CrossFire™
•High-speed 128-bit HDR (High Dynamic Range) rendering
•Up to 24x Custom Filter Anti-Aliasing
•ATI Avivo™ HD video and display technology
•Built-in HDMI and 5.1 surround audio
•Dynamic geometry acceleration
•Game physics processing capability
•Free “Black Box” game bundle from Valve Corporation*

ATI Avivo™ HD

• ATI Radeon HD 2000 Series GPUs with ATI Avivo HD technology offer advanced audio, video processing, display and connectivity capabilities for high definition entertainment solutions
• Introduces a breakthrough for the playback of Blu-ray and HD DVD discs.
• UVD (Universal Video Decoding) is a new full-spec HD video processing technology that provides full hardware decoding of Blu-ray and HD DVD
• UVD technology enables a cool, quiet media PC with low power requirements for the GPU and CPU
• UVD technology enables entry level PCs to play full-spec HD discs
• ATI Avivo HD technology includes fully integrated high definition audio support enabling playback of multi-channel (5.1) audio streams and when combined with the integrated HDCP copy protection, enables a one cable HDMI connectivity solution to high definition home theaters

ATI benchmarks (<--allready seen a while ago!

[WeaponX]

Isn't it kind of funny why they even show the "product comparison table" when it just lists everything the R600 has and nothing that the 8800GTX/GTS has? They could've just made a list lol, just thought that was kind of funny how they would make a whole chart to show that.

[J-Mag]

How is the r600 a second gen unified shader architecture? Did ATI make a card that I am not aware of?

[deathman20]

How is the r600 a second gen unified shader architecture? Did ATI make a card that I am not aware of?

The Xenos for the X360 was unified shaders if not mistaken.

[BenchZowner]

How is the r600 a second gen unified shader architecture? Did ATI make a card that I am not aware of?

They're counting Xenos as their 1st

[cantankerous]

yes, the Xenos based card for the Xbox360 was a unified shader part.

That comparison chart is stupid. Listing a 512-bit memory interface over the 8800 means nothing if the 384-bit 8800 out performs the ATI card even with its higher bit interface. Higher numbers mean nothing.

They mention integrated crossfire, yea? Big deal, the 8800 can do integrated SLI, can ATI's card do that?

One thing I do like however is the first two sentences.

Review Guideline:
Required & Restricted to compare with GF8800GTS 320/640M, GF8800GTX, 7900GTX, X1950XTX, X1950XT

Highlight: DirectX&#174; 10 Ready, Avivo™ HD, UVD (full hardware decoding of Blu-ray and HD DVD), Built-in HDMI and 5.1 surround audio, Free “Black Box” game bundle, killing price/performance ratio over 8800GTS/GTX.

I like how they mention GTS/GTX, not just GTS.

I wonder what the valve gaming pack will be, Left 4 Dead? Ep.2? Team Fortress 2?

I hope tomorrow truly is the day that all beans are finally spilled.

[cadaveca]

I wonder what the valve gaming pack will be, Left 4 Dead? Ep.2? Team Fortress 2?

Half-Life 2: Black Box


Also known as: Black Box --- Half-Life 2: Episode Two, Team Fortress 2, & Portal

[J-Mag]

yes, the Xenos based card for the Xbox360 was a unified shader part.

Oh ok that's valid then. Thanks to you three.

They mention integrated crossfire, yea? Big deal, the 8800 can do integrated SLI, can ATI's card do that?

Also what's up with the integrated physics checkbox? The G80 has quantum physics and both are vaporware anyway.

[deathman20]

They mention integrated crossfire, yea? Big deal, the 8800 can do integrated SLI, can ATI's card do that?

What I think they mean by that is ATI cards can use crossfire on any board. nVidia can't since they require there board unless you get modified drivers.

Half-Life 2: Black Box


Also known as: Black Box --- Half-Life 2: Episode Two, Team Fortress 2, & Portal

Ah thats what the black box is. I'm down for that.

[XeRo]

That Crysis benchmark still looks kind of wierd.

[Gnome]

that crysis bench is on par with other rumors saying ~+4 fps on average for hd2900. I hope that bench is real, because if it is that means that 8800 and hd2900 owners can play @ 1600x1200 4xfsaa 16x aniso with a decent framerate. Normally we should get more info tommorow :p

Personally i hope the hd2900xt is faster then the 8800gtx, just to make nvidia release (yet again) that magic driver they keep for when ati launches their new cards... now everyone has cards to play crysis on their 1080p screens...

la vie serait belle!

[theteamaqua]

i dont know man .. i mean G80's shaders r running at much higher clocks speed.. the bus width does help R600 a lot especially in bandwidth

[LowRun]

ATi HD2900XT - AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+@2009Mhz - 1GB DDR2
3DMark 06: 11335



http://www.generation-3d.com/11335-s...-XT,ac8886.htm

This one has been confirmed to be a fake by the guy that runs the site, the moron is starving for clicks

[ownage]

i dont know man .. i mean G80's shaders r running at much higher clocks speed.. the bus width does help R600 a lot especially in bandwidth

It's not all about shaders theteamaqua.
R600 has some new things like TMU and Render Back Ends, and a few others, but i cant remember the names of those terms

[Lizardus]

It's not all about shaders theteamaqua.
R600 has some new things like TMU

eeee???
TMU=texture mapping unit ??
It was even in geforce 1

[Brother Esau]

Good Morning..........argh.....stretch

Guess we will have to wait and see before we know for sure.

[wickedld9]

Oh ok that's valid then. Thanks to you three.



Also what's up with the integrated physics checkbox? The G80 has quantum physics and both are vaporware anyway.

For G80 it is vaporware, I've actually seen demos for ATI's implementation and they are pushing it hard. NVIDIA has not said anything about physics for the last 6 months.

For those expecting non-NDA numbers tomorrow, you're going to be upset. You can blame VR-Zone.

[CBONE]

What did vr-zone do? Why would it keep numbers from coming out on the launch day?

[XeRo]

What did vr-zone do? Why would it keep numbers from coming out on the launch day?

I thought it was just a rumor that NDA would expire tomorrow

[jas420221]

I thought it was just a rumor that NDA would expire tomorrow

Thats what I thought too. I didnt see any confimrations or otherwise...