Mcw60-4870

[Blazing fire]

Thanks for your support! Perhaps we could start a poll on this

[ward0]

oh well i think gabe is reading this topic aswell, i might change to DD FC this is taking to mutch time!!!!

[gabe]

$60 is more like it. It's an MCW60 (~$45) with extended plates and a heatsink.

Ok, you guys want justifications. Here you go:

MCW60 copper base = 82g
MCW60-4870 copper base plate= 240g

Three times as much copper = three times production cost.

Price wise, compare our product to existing full cover solutions.

DD: $130
EK: $112 to $121
Koolance: $100
Swiftech: $90


Not only do you get better performance (thanks to MCW60) than all these blocks, but you get it for less. Isnt' that "bang for the buck"?

cheers

[Kayin]

Considering the price of copper, yes, yes it is.

Don't always find myself agreeing with you, but as I buy copper too, that's spot on.

Actually, I have to say that this is one of the nicest designs I've ever seen for a video card. Thought about one for 4870x2 just like it?

[jc99]

Don't you guys read in the news how people are stealing metal for scrap and selling them for quite a bit of money? Metal is expensive. So expensive that some people are dumb enough to go into high voltage electrical substations to steal live copper wire. 500kV to ground isn't very pretty when you're the conductor.

The XSPC block also uses a lot thinner copper than the other FC's. Plus they do minimal amounts of CNC'ing to the copper and do most of the channel cutting in the delrin. Yes it's cheaper than the other FC's but it's not exactly brimming with performance minded features.

[gabe]

Considering the price of copper, yes, yes it is.

Don't always find myself agreeing with you, but as I buy copper too, that's spot on.

Actually, I have to say that this is one of the nicest designs I've ever seen for a video card. Thought about one for 4870x2 just like it?

The 4870-X2 does not lend itself to this type of design. We have something else in store coming for this board, the Caldera system. A full coverage heatsink that is compatible with (2) MCW60's, or the new Caldera water-block coming up in a few day.

[Blazing fire]

Ok, you guys want justifications. Here you go:

MCW60 copper base = 82g
MCW60-4870 copper base plate= 240g

Three times as much copper = three times production cost.

Price wise, compare our product to existing full cover solutions.

DD: $130
EK: $112 to $121
Koolance: $100
Swiftech: $90


Not only do you get better performance (thanks to MCW60) than all these blocks, but you get it for less. Isnt' that "bang for the buck"?

cheers

Thank you very much for that info. Now I'm justified but there's one question. What do you mean by the "copper base plate"? I'm quite sure it includes the extended RAM cooling, otherwise it would not be 3 times the mass. If that's the case, why not use aluminum? After all, it does not contact the coolant and it would be cheaper and lighter.

As for the 4870x2, what's the difference between the one you've mentioned and the other full cover blocks on the market?
Cheers!

[jc99]

As for the 4870x2, what's the difference between the one you've mentioned and the other full cover blocks on the market?
Cheers!

Interesting question. Don't know how pins would work on the Caldera block. Would it cool as well as the MCW60?

[Blazing fire]

I think I just found the answer. Normal full cover blocks channel the water through the core* as well as the RAM/MOFSET*. This one merely force water through the GPU core* while the heat produced by the RAM/MOFSET* is conducted to the surrounding areas of the GPU block (the greenish area with the "swiftech" logo).

*Of course I don't mean through the GPU itself but the part which cools the respective components.

As for performance, it should be on par with the MCW60. I believe the pins would be above the 2 cores and the water flows through it.

[ward0]

yay only a couple more days left

[SNiiPE_DoGG]

The 4870-X2 does not lend itself to this type of design. We have something else in store coming for this board, the Caldera system. A full coverage heatsink that is compatible with (2) MCW60's, or the new Caldera water-block coming up in a few day.

looks very good gabe, will it be here by thanksgiving (to retail outlets) cuz I will be in the market then and whatever is available I will buy

[GameGuru]

I would buy too as a waterblock is all I need to complete my build. For now I'm on air till then

[GameGuru]

Is it just me or does the Caldera look like something made from the military. Looks sweet

[Utnorris]

Ok, you guys want justifications. Here you go:

MCW60 copper base = 82g
MCW60-4870 copper base plate= 240g

Three times as much copper = three times production cost.

Price wise, compare our product to existing full cover solutions.

DD: $130
EK: $112 to $121
Koolance: $100
Swiftech: $90


Not only do you get better performance (thanks to MCW60) than all these blocks, but you get it for less. Isnt' that "bang for the buck"?

cheers

Not trying to argue price with you, but the XSPC is $80-$90 and is all copper and I am sure, because it is a full cover block, it has more in it, but that isn't my gripe. My gripe is that you stated earlier that you guys were doing this as a lower cost solution that would reduce cost of ownership.

Your post:

Gabe: This product is VGA model specific. The biggest difference compared to other solutions is the deliberate attempt to reduce wasted material, while preserving (actually enhancing) performance. This is costing us time to market since it requires more thought and resources, but should allow us to reduce cost of ownership.

Please explain how this will cost me less over time?

And a few posts later:

Gabe: "This simple, yet effective design is expected to be reflected in the product street price."
Please allow me the simple pleasure of letting our competition worry about this for a while

At the current price/solution I seriously doubt any of them are worried.

And finally:

Considering that the 4850 is a low cost solution to begin with, therefore catering to consummers on budget, I am not entirely convinced that an expensive full cover solution is justified for this card.

Little bit of a contradiction to what you said earlier but more importantly, it is a serious mistake to not support the HD4850 or any other card for that matter. If people were not buying the DD, EK, Koolance, Aqua PC and the XSPC then then they would not make them for that series. And since this is a modular design like a UNIsink, manufacturing different models for different cards seems like it would not be hard. I can name several sites off the top of my head that recommend the HD4850 in CF over a GTX280 because of price/performance. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I would venture to say that the HD4850 at $150 is probably the most popular card right now.

[theclash]

Is it just me or does the Caldera look like something made from the military. Looks sweet

You may have been tricked by the font used in the picture.

[ward0]

we all have seen the pics, now bring it to the stores

[Gir92]

Petras has it in stock. But Alex has been busy, so they won't be up on the site until tomorrow.

[Baenwort]

The 4870-X2 does not lend itself to this type of design. We have something else in store coming for this board, the Caldera system. A full coverage heatsink that is compatible with (2) MCW60's, or the new Caldera water-block coming up in a few day.

Great news! The 2x MCW60s version looks great. The only thing that makes me a little is the air channels are not along then length of the card like the 280 version was. That line up of the fins would have been better for my case but I can understand that you most likely had a reason for changing it up.

[_G_]

Ok, you guys want justifications. Here you go:

MCW60 copper base = 82g
MCW60-4870 copper base plate= 240g

Three times as much copper = three times production cost.

Price wise, compare our product to existing full cover solutions.

DD: $130
EK: $112 to $121
Koolance: $100
Swiftech: $90


Not only do you get better performance (thanks to MCW60) than all these blocks, but you get it for less. Isnt' that "bang for the buck"?

cheers

You left out less weight than any full cover solution(a big plus considering how flexible 4870 pcb's are lol)

[jc99]

Great news! The 2x MCW60s version looks great. The only thing that makes me a little is the air channels are not along then length of the card like the 280 version was. That line up of the fins would have been better for my case but I can understand that you most likely had a reason for changing it up.

Once you put the caldera block on it blocks the flow in that direction anyway. That's probably the reason.

[Blazing fire]

Thank you very much for that info. Now I'm justified but there's one question. What do you mean by the "copper base plate"? I'm quite sure it includes the extended RAM cooling, otherwise it would not be 3 times the mass. If that's the case, why not use aluminum? After all, it does not contact the coolant and it would be cheaper and lighter.

Bump...

[LordEC911]

Bump...

Al also performs nowhere close to copper.

Utnorris- They are offering a full featured competitive product at a cheaper price than competitors. How is that not a win-win?
Reminds me of the people complaining about the CM ATCS 840.

[Utnorris]

Al also performs nowhere close to copper.

Utnorris- They are offering a full featured competitive product at a cheaper price than competitors. How is that not a win-win?
Reminds me of the people complaining about the CM ATCS 840.

Maybe I missed something, did the price of the XSPC FC block go up in price? It is still listed at $80 on Jab-tech. If they were offering the add on part as an add on then I would agree, but as it stands, the part costs $90. Right now, it isn't a win-win situation. What it means is if I wanted to do this solution, I would have to sell my MCW60's at a loss and then spend $90 for their solution, thank you, but no thanks. The way it was posted originally it was if it would be sold separately so that folks who already owned a MCW60 could upgrade to this at a substantial savings and at this point that is not true. If they start offering the add on part separately, then great, it will be a win-win situation for most who have a dedicated GPU block. This is a legitimate complaint and I am sorry you feel I am complaining without warrant.

[jc99]

It's worth noting that the price for the xspc block will be closer to $85-90 once you include barbs.

Yeah it would have been nicer to have a modular solution but I'd rather have something that cools better and is free from the problems that plague other FC blocks (warping, weight, cracking, etc.)

[Shocker003]

Maybe I missed something, did the price of the XSPC FC block go up in price? It is still listed at $80 on Jab-tech. If they were offering the add on part as an add on then I would agree, but as it stands, the part costs $90. Right now, it isn't a win-win situation. What it means is if I wanted to do this solution, I would have to sell my MCW60's at a loss and then spend $90 for their solution, thank you, but no thanks. The way it was posted originally it was if it would be sold separately so that folks who already owned a MCW60 could upgrade to this at a substantial savings and at this point that is not true. If they start offering the add on part separately, then great, it will be a win-win situation for most who have a dedicated GPU block. This is a legitimate complaint and I am sorry you feel I am complaining without warrant.

@Utnorris
+1
Am in with you in this.
Gabe didn´t keep to his words for now. I got the picture that the mcw60 rev will be cheaper than most fc blocks in the market atm, but it´s the other way round. I was equally waiting to upgrade to it, by getting the add on as i already own an MCW60 but with the current price am considering the XSPC FC block for HD4870 which has easy sli config possiblility and stand off, so no card warp. Well another thing i will like to know is which weight was he writing about? The copper base of his new block or the whole package(mounting stuffs and barbs). That am a fan of swiftech products doesn´t mean that am blind and can´t see a rip off, when i see one. I guess xspc will get my money this time around and you guys shouldn´t spread wrong info cos the mcw60 rev2 will still dump the same amount of heat in the loop as any HD4870 FC block too. The mem chips and the heatpipe are been coolled by the loop or is there something am missing.