Onepagebook Lifetime Ban at HWbot

http://www.hwbot.org/hwbot.post.do?postId=1107

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Dear HWbot members,

We regret to inform the user Onepagebook, previously third in the ranking, has been suspended from the Hwbot competition. Irregularities have been found in numerous benchmarks, including 3DMark06 and Aquamark, which were not possible to be reproduced by any of the crew members. Furthermore, the results can not be explained as bug or system anomality, but can be explained by using illegal software. Onepagebook did not deny this.

Since this is the second time Onepagebook has been caught producing very suspicious scores , the HWbot crew has no other option than to call in the lifetime ban option.

Next to that, underneath the Aquamark3 results. Pay attention to the FPS in the upper right corner and the total score. The total score should always be 1000x the FPS in the upper right corner. If not, it suggest tampering with the screenshot.

proof2.jpgproof1.jpg

Comments have been disabled in this post.

Kind regards,

The HWbot crew.

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:clap:

I think the "clap" don't must be...

and also not the news, what do you think why the comment is disabled at hwbot? -.-

Clap goes to the careful eyes who caught the obvious cheat/glitch/what-ever-you-want-to-call-it.

It sure is news, people should be aware of consequences. Make it a prime example. Why would we have to tolerate people ruining this fun hobby of ours? :shrug:

We don't must tolerate this, It is good that hwbot does this!
I totally agree with them.

But hwbot disables commenct because there is to much spamming about cheats and so on...
Same here I think, espacialy if OPB is involved

tiborr is 100% right to bring this issue up. Now that things are geting serious (F1 Overclocking etc) actions like this deserve punishment.
OPB is probably a great guy in his personal life, though we are NOT judging him as a person but as an active member of Hwbot and highly decorated member of the o/cing community.

Well, he crossed the line, not only once but twice.

Whoops,caught with hands right in the cookie jar...

Don't do the crime if you can't do the time.

Kind of funny that HWBot just posted about OCX passing HOT in overall score. HOT is once again #1. Conspiracy? :p:

i remember a 3dmark05/06 first place score that was passed as legit by the ORB system, but there was no way it could have been based on the hardware. in the description it clearly stated "this is a school project" and caused a huge fuss on their forum. while to some OCing is just fun, to others its a job, and you need to think about how your actions will make them feel when you bend the rules. im sure they wouldnt care if he played with the scores/code, as long as he did it with the right approach and not attempt to lie about the results

Seriously that's the proof you have to ban the man?C'mon he found a tweak and doesn't share it is cheating?

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Originally Posted by DMH

Seriously that's the proof you have to ban the man?C'mon he found a tweak and doesn't share it is cheating?

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scores a generated based on framerate, and in the photo they dont match, its not a tweek at all

So 2x2 = 5 is a tweak? In which galaxy?

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Originally Posted by DMH

Seriously that's the proof you have to ban the man?C'mon he found a tweak and doesn't share it is cheating?

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I'm sorry but that's not a tweak. No matter what tweak you're using, average FPS x 1000 = final AM3 score.

Okay guys - we have many good friends from OCX and we don't want to start up another forum war with them.
XS staff will be watching this thread and any similar threads to stop flaming from the start.
This is the first and last warning on this subject. Violators will receive vacations accordingly.
If you have an arguement with hwbots decision, go argue with them. Don't do it here.
thank you :D

Fair enough Ron :up:

thank-you very much Ron, xtremely well said :up:

Well, if it is only a tweak., why doesnt he say, rather than say nothing when accused of cheating.
I dont really know, but its good that it has been dealt with quickly.

Hats off to OPB for at least not denying it when he got caught. You don't see many people doing that.

-Edit- He didn't admit. He just isn't raising sand trying to prove otherwise and furthering the embarrassment for both parties.

this wasnt in a post there is alot of this going on in the mobile sections (might not be intentional since their monitors dont support native rez), but the HW bot admins were fast to clear out alot more than the few i reported.

its amazing to think that some1 ranked 3rd would not be found for this long

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Originally Posted by runmc

Okay guys - we have many good friends from OCX and we don't want to start up another forum war with them.
XS staff will be watching this thread and any similar threads to stop flaming from the start.
This is the first and last warning on this subject. Violators will receive vacations accordingly.
If you have an arguement with hwbots decision, go argue with them. Don't do it here.
thank you :D

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I want a 7 day cruise to Norway!

Thought I'd ask :shrug:

Hmmm says a lot about the person and the company he works for (Team Group). They owe me 300 bucks for a set of OPB Special Teamgroup ram with lifetime warranty that died on me and never responded to any of my requests. So not really surprised by this.

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Originally Posted by Reznik Akime

Hats off to OPB for at least admitting it when he got caught. You don't see many people doing that.

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Did he admit it? All the article says: "Onepagebook did not deny this." , or maybe he admitted it somewhere else?

He admitted it?
I thought he said nothing, not admitting,
Either way, the admins have done a great job.

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Originally Posted by NeedMoMegaHurtZ

Did he admit it? All the article says: "Onepagebook did not deny this." , or maybe he admitted it somewhere else?

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Ah, I misread it. I should then say not denying it and making up some BS excuse. Either way it's a somewhat graceful unraveling without the admins and OPB shouting back at each other.

Without a doubt, fraudulent scores generated and posted. This decision is backed by all XIP and Legends here as we validated the proof with 100% certainty.

Futuremark is also aware and will be taking action shortly.

I believe his sponsors should be made aware as well of the current findings.

A twenty spot says he's back in two or three years.

will be back as TPB two page book

I'm surprised it's taken this long to be honest, he's been dogged by rumours of cheating for years.

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Originally Posted by [XC] gomeler

I want a 7 day cruise to Norway!

Thought I'd ask :shrug:

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Come visit me in Norway (Oslo) :)


Then we can play some pcmark :D

Do they also ban IP address so he can't create another name ?

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Originally Posted by Buckeye

Do they also ban IP address so he can't create another name ?

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Dynamic IP?

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Originally Posted by Buckeye

Do they also ban IP address so he can't create another name ?

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I think we would notice if he tried to start posting under a new name :rolleyes: everybody keep an eye out for a user who jumps 20,000 spots in a week into the top 50 :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Buckeye

Do they also ban IP address so he can't create another name ?

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IP bans, one of the last things on the internet that will work :shakes:
1. if you don't have dynamic ip or nat in use your ip will change every boot.
2. if you're behind big nat, everybody else in the same network will bet banned to that site.

And rare cases have dynamic IP in personal unless they host servers or etc...

This is just sad on so many levels.....:shakes:

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Originally Posted by [XC] gomeler

I want a 7 day cruise to Norway!

Thought I'd ask :shrug:

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Chris-

After rebuilding that cascade for "Noob of Leet" :slapass: you of all people deserve a vacation :yepp:

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Originally Posted by runmc

Chris-

After rebuilding that cascade for "Noob of Leet" :slapass: you of all people deserve a vacation :yepp:

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Woohoo! I'm going to Norway! I hear they have lots of leggy blond women :cool:

I wonder if he'll unban me from OCX any time soon?

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Originally Posted by Bobbylite

will be back as TPB two page book

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:rofl: You owe me a new keyboard as I spilled my coffee when I read that.

The news is sad as OPB obviously has the talent to compete. I hope he does find a way back one day.

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Originally Posted by ShoNuff

The news is sad as OPB obviously has the talent to compete. I hope he does find a way back one day.

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How is this obvious? Realistically he has no real proof of any of his real skills as none of his previous results can really be trusted at this point can they?

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Originally Posted by EnJoY

How is this obvious? Realistically he has no real proof of any of his real skills as none of his previous results can really be trusted at this point can they?

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Unless you can go back and void 100% of his submission as fake...he demonstrated the skills to compete on the big stage.

Don't read more into this than necessary.

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Originally Posted by ShoNuff

Unless you can go back and void 100% of his submission as fake...he demonstrated the skills to compete on the big stage.

Don't read more into this than necessary.

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I guess I'm just reading it differently, I assumed I was being realistic.

For me it is sad to try and create scores when you have pretty good ones allready,i mean according the aq3 FPS he had a 392K.Was it that bad....Anyway,good job for hwbot crew.
After all o/c is mainly for fun...noone should forget this.

I would have to agree with ShoNuff. Scores may have been faked, but the dude does have real knowledge and experience. Its a shame he would use cheating to get ahead when he has the connections to do it for real.

Dont misinterpret me either I think there should be no room for bending or breaking the rules, especially in this fashion. :up:

What I wanna know is if he was gonna fake one score why didnt he fix the other???

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Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

What I wanna know is if he was gonna fake one score why didnt he fix the other???

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What do you mean?

It's a tough blow to OPB and a just punishment from HWBOT. i feel disappointment in him and sadness about the whole situation at the same time. i am a member of OCX and post a lot there and have learnt a lot from OCX guys including OPB. Kevin does have a problem with competitive benching. it gets the better of him but he knew how high the price is if he does it again.

I still plan to spend as much time on OCX as i used to. Nothing changes for me. It's a great forum and i have a lot of friends there.

Kudos to kevin for standing up and being a man and admitting guilt on his own forum.

This isn't news.

OPB and Coolaler have their faults and irrespective of how they play around with HWBot, it won't change the fact that at the apex of benching and tweaking there lies an arena where the highest WRs are separated by a few Mhz, at which point even friends will turn on each other and make accusations of foul play.

Always has been like this, always will be.

Perkam

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Originally Posted by crio

What do you mean?

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Well he has clearly got screens with conflicting numbers, I dont get why he didnt take the time to shop them and make them right. Not saying that I support his actions at all, its just that if your gonna cheat you might as well do it right.

It's not only the screens.Hwbot crew have the abbility to find out if a score is possible with the current settings and hardware

I say, great job booting him and it's good that somebody is looking.,
in a sport that a big part is based on the honor system, this sends a good message.

kudo's to all the hard working overclockers, keeping it real and honest :up:

OPB cheated? News to me!

Oh wait, we knew he was a cheater for years LOL

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Originally Posted by TheKarmakazi

I would have to agree with ShoNuff. Scores may have been faked, but the dude does have real knowledge and experience. Its a shame he would use cheating to get ahead when he has the connections to do it for real.

Dont misinterpret me either I think there should be no room for bending or breaking the rules, especially in this fashion. :up:

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I feel similarly. I'm sad to see this as I know he is a very skilled bencher and am disappointed that he would cheat to get those last few points. I always liked how willing he was to share knowledge with others.

Definitely deserves the punishment though, and he has posted on OCX how he feels similarly.

Sad news indeed, especially for the OCX guys who must feel very disappointed. Its a shame he was compelled to resort to this. Credit to him for admitting it.

you guys are saying "kudos to him for not lying about cheating" have seriously got to grow up.

he isnt the only well known scammer around this overclocking world. some of the most well known people who are working for some of the biggest names in the hardware business have been caught on several occassions cheating to make their companies hardware seem better than it was.
you have to remember a certain someone who was caught and later quietly admitted to using sub zero cooling on the northbridge of the board he was promoting so he could say he got some insane FSB clocks but conveniently failed to mention during his review of the mobo... i wont call him out but those people who remember dont need reminding.

cheating in privately ran non public competitions such as those put up for display by ORB and hwbot is wayyy too common and people just keep believing the results are real. orb and hwbot are in no way shape or form to blame they only post results, but if anyone there is found of knowingly allowing these results to be posted,,, well thats diff.

i bet OPB is just riddled with guilt,, oh yeah i just bet he is.. dont think for one fracking second that the kid gives a rats arse about being banned.

the frack in their right mind would give a crap? i mean seriously what kind of fvcked up retard would give a crap about being banned from a fracking web forum...

jesus,,, is this the form of punishment that is acceptable these days?

i guarentee his sponsors slapped his wrist and said, we told you to be careful and not be too obvious with the lies,,, atleast we got some good publicity and higher sales during that time. because that is ALL that mattered,, hardware sales

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Originally Posted by dinos22

Kudos to kevin for standing up and being a man and admitting guilt on his own forum.

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wow

The way to solve this problem...no more online submissions...just like any other league, sport, race, or competition, all participants show up to compete on the same playing field, in the same conditions. Then everyone throws down, and someone walks away a winner. How could you hold quakecon remotely and expect no one out there to use a bot..especially when $$$ are at stake, never mind recognition.

As long as people can hide behind the veil of accountability and anonymity in the online world...the worst in human nature will continue to rise to the forefront.

-cheating
-piracy
-trolling
-flaming
-harassment
-thievery
-sexual predators
-fraud
-invasion of privacy
-scams and manipulation

So get in on it while the gettings good!!!!

(and always view those screenies with a grain of salt)

For years I have purchased the highest end hardware availiable based on results from members on forums and review sites...although im not world class, Id like to think know how to go into the BIOS and flick a few switches and eek some more performance out of my system...Over the years, in the majority of cases my personal results on both AMD and Intel hardware have not reflected what I have seen others capable of doing online, or what review sited have posted while using the exact same setups in many cases.

Alot of this is due to hand picked samples, but I am sure every person in this forum has visited a thread with a fake screeny....whether they realize it or not. People are idiots, and alot of guys try to be something thery aren't when online cuz in the real world they just plain suck!

Its all about someone making a buck somewhere, and all you can do to help the situation is just post honest, concise, ACTUALLY STABLE results with your gear.

Perhaps XS should develop a set of requirement you must pass before a screenie can be posted or your thread will get deleted, or a downloadable/encrypted executable that can't be modified. You run it on your system and it posts you a thread automatically with the results.

I.e. 5 hrs linpack stable/3dmark looping or something hardcore like that.

That would seperate the men from the boys, and alot of the BS would dry up pretty quick...

all executables can be modified because they run in memory. there is no way to stop people from cheating.


one thing we could do is require a valid name address and phone number for every member of XS.... but most people will say "no I want my privacy!!!" guess what, noone has privacy lol

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

The way to solve this problem...no more online submissions...just like any other league, sport, race, or competition, all participants show up to compete on the same playing field, in the same conditions. Then everyone throws down, and someone walks away a winner. How could you hold quakecon remotely and expect no one out there to use a bot..especially when $$$ are at stake, never mind recognition.

As long as people can hide behind the veil of accountability and anonymity in the online world...the worst in human nature will continue to rise to the forefront.

-cheating
-piracy
-trolling
-flaming
-harassment
-thievery
-sexual predators
-fraud
-invasion of privacy
-scams and manipulation

So get in on it while the gettings good!!!!

(and always view those screenies with a grain of salt)

For years I have purchased the highest end hardware availiable based on results from members on forums and review sites...although im not world class, Id like to think know how to go into the BIOS and flick a few switches and eek some more performance out of my system...Over the years, in the majority of cases my personal results on both AMD and Intel hardware have not reflected what I have seen others capable of doing online, or what review sited have posted while using the exact same setups in many cases.

Alot of this is due to hand picked samples, but I am sure every person in this forum has visited a thread with a fake screeny....whether they realize it or not. People are idiots, and alot of guys try to be something thery aren't when online cuz in the real world they just plain suck!

Its all about someone making a buck somewhere, and all you can do to help the situation is just post honest, concise, ACTUALLY STABLE results with your gear.

Perhaps XS should develop a set of requirement you must pass before a screenie can be posted or your thread will get deleted, or a downloadable/encrypted executable that can't be modified. You run it on your system and it posts you a thread automatically with the results.

I.e. 5 hrs linpack stable/3dmark looping or something hardcore like that.

That would seperate the men from the boys, and alot of the BS would dry up pretty quick...

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You make a lot of points however.. who is going to pay for all this. Unfortunately we are scattered all across the world and in the limited amount of times someone is willing to pay to fly us all around the number of seats are limited. So therefore online submission and competition is required.

When benching if you required any sort of test like linpack for any period of time longer than ~10 minutes, you aren't going to have any serious benchers competing. Just look at Phenom II SPi 32M. All in all you might have a dozen serious attempts on LN2. Nobody wants to sit there burning LN2 for 15 minutes for a benchmark to complete.

Lastly, the moment the end-user is given your application you can no longer consider it secure. You can do your best to prevent tampering, but a person given infinite time will crack your system. So you depend on careful analysis of results and in our case a team dedicated to insuring things are correct.

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Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

all executables can be modified because they run in memory. there is no way to stop people from cheating.


one thing we could do is require a valid name address and phone number for every member of XS.... but most people will say "no I want my privacy!!!" guess what, noone has privacy lol

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What if the executable was randomized somehow and only valid for 6 hours or something, you gotta pass the test in a given time frame or you are pooched.

option B

Use VNC to allow a "referee" to administer the test on a user's system. the user tweaks the setup, requests verification, remote administrator executes.

Pretty easy to dial in on VNC, and download linx / CPU-Z and super Pi

If people are really that hardcore and want to prove validation...remote access for a few mins is no big deal. You could even have opposing teams administering the tests to thier competitors, ensuring no monkey business and encouraging the competition. Anyone hardcore tweaking won't be storing vital data on the test rig, and as far as security is concerned..just unplug your lan cable or kill the VNC client..no one gonna get hacked from this. How fun would it be to try and prove your worst enemy is full of BS.

Sign me up lol.

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

What if the executable was randomized somehow and only valid for 6 hours or something, you gotta pass the test in a given time frame or you are pooched.

option B

Use VNC to allow a "referee" to administer the test on a user's system. the user tweaks the setup, requests verification, remote administrator executes.

Pretty easy to dial in on VNC, and download / double click an executable.

If people are really that hardcore and want to prove validation...remote access for a few mins is no big deal. You could even have opposing teams administering the tests to thier competitors, ensuring no monkey business and encouraging the competition. Anyone hardcore tweaking won't be storing vital data on the test rig, and as far as security is concerned..just unplug your lan cable or kill the VNC client..no one gonna get hacked from this.

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lol who benchers with ethernet drivers or ethernet ports activated? You guys are killing me here :rofl: Your ideas are great in an attempt to secure benchmarks. Even benching in front of someone I could cheat. The best defense for this is what just happened, competitors becoming suspicious and investigating.

i used network drivers and lan is enabled :p:

reading through this and the comments what it all comes down to is honor.
Either you have it or you don't.
As to OPB, I don't hate him, I pity him for feeliing that he had to stoop to cheating to maintain his 'name"..
Lestat had some very vaild points.
There is too much pressure to perform to maintain those sponsorships and he's right, it's all in the money.
The competition and how close it is among what? 200-300 of the top people involved in the sport makes it difficult for one person to stand out but some do.
I'm not getting into names as I'll miss some but you all know whose benches you trust and whose you do not.
As I said, it all comes down to honor.

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Originally Posted by dinos22

i used network drivers and lan is enabled :p:

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noob :doh: :D

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Originally Posted by dinos22

i used network drivers and lan is enabled :p:

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I have been using them also but I am just trying to get started benching, I have been using full windows also...

Fair enough, but at what point does benching switch from hardware tweaking/cooling prowess to driver optimization/software tweaks in order to gain the upper hand.

I guess it depends on what you see as the goal..if the highest score on a given bench is all you are after...then really, the compeition is all about cheating that benchmark, or at least bending the rules and software your system is running on in order to gain a few more points.

so in the end, why not just photoshop? Bending the rules, is bending the rules. Hacking the driver, trimming the fat off your system, modifying the OS, running the bench under multiple frequency profiles to allow it to make it through certain parts...in the end...Ask yourself whats more impressive...someone who cracks 6ghz stable or someone at 5.7 suicide scoring higher in 3dmark due to optimizations?

A solid hardware overclock is the most impressive, at least for me.

Proof the rig is up and stable at a given speed is what i see as the goal, but I understand others such as OPB and other pro benchers are more interested in the other side of things...and im sure to compete in this arena requires just as much skill, or perhaps combining them is even harder.

but for me, when I am stability testing.... the ethernet drivers better be working, and the sound drivers, and the video drivers and everything else the system needs to be up and running and fully functional...otherwise is it really actually stable?

Whats the use of a really, REALLY, REALLY fast computer you can't even check your email on?

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

Fair enough, but at what point does benching switch from hardware tweaking/cooling prowess to driver optimization/software tweaks in order to gain the upper hand.

I guess it depends on what you see as the goal..if the highest score on a given bench is all you are after...then really, the compeition is all about cheating that benchmark, or at least bending the rules and software your system is running on in order to gain a few more points.

so in the end, why not just photoshop? Bending the rules, is bending the rules. Hacking the driver, trimming the fat off your system, modifying the OS, running the bench under multiple frequency profiles to allow it to make it through certain parts...in the end...Ask yourself whats more impressive...someone who cracks 6ghz stable or someone at 5.7 suicide scoring higher in 3dmark due to optimizations?

A solid hardware overclock is the most impressive, at least for me.

Proof the rig is up and stable at a given speed is what i see as the goal, but I understand others such as OPB and other pro benchers are more interested in the other side of things...and im sure to compete in this arena requires just as much skill, or perhaps combining them is even harder.

but for me, when I am stability testing.... the ethernet drivers better be working, and the sound drivers, and the video drivers and everything else the system needs to be up and running and fully functional...otherwise is it really actually stable?

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I think you miss the point of competitive benchmarking then. The goal isn't stability testing. We don't bench Prime 95 or Furmark. We don't care if the system will run 24/7 stable, hell most of us use cooling solutions that won't run for more than a few hours.

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

Whats the use of a really, REALLY, REALLY fast computer you can't even check your email on?

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This is why I have an iPhone and laptop :up:

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

Whats the use of a really, REALLY, REALLY fast computer you can't even check your email on?

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This is the first time I have ever even considered quoting someone in my signature, but this one is totally worth it :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dsumanik

Fair enough, but at what point does benching switch from hardware tweaking/cooling prowess to driver optimization/software tweaks in order to gain the upper hand.

I guess it depends on what you see as the goal..if the highest score on a given bench is all you are after...then really, the compeition is all about cheating that benchmark, or at least bending the rules and software your system is running on in order to gain a few more points.

so in the end, why not just photoshop? Bending the rules, is bending the rules. Hacking the driver, trimming the fat off your system, modifying the OS, running the bench under multiple frequency profiles to allow it to make it through certain parts...in the end...Ask yourself whats more impressive...someone who cracks 6ghz stable or someone at 5.7 suicide scoring higher in 3dmark due to optimizations?

A solid hardware overclock is the most impressive, at least for me.

Proof the rig is up and stable at a given speed is what i see as the goal, but I understand others such as OPB and other pro benchers are more interested in the other side of things...and im sure to compete in this arena requires just as much skill, or perhaps combining them is even harder.

but for me, when I am stability testing.... the ethernet drivers better be working, and the sound drivers, and the video drivers and everything else the system needs to be up and running and fully functional...otherwise is it really actually stable?

Whats the use of a really, REALLY, REALLY fast computer you can't even check your email on?

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I just got one question for ya

what the heck is this "stable" you speak of? :confused: :p:

OPB has done some great testing, tearing through a lot of hardware and sharing a lot of interesting information. Are people thinking he phoshopped these results or what is the exact charge? I don't get it. I'm quite sure his legit scores would still kick the crap out of most guy's scores. It seems to not make sense that he would do that.

agreed, We just seeing two different sides to the coin.

Just so you know..im not photoshopping any screens I post, and my ethernet drivers are always enabled...I guess thats why im not winning any bench comps lol

I guess i havent been able to cross over to the dark side .......foregoing a functional rig just to use it for purely benching.....but i guess this is XS...omg maybe im in the wrong forum....I think I am having an identity crisis...the room is starting to spin...where am I... oh crap wheres my vicatin...:shakes:

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Originally Posted by Gautam

I just got one question for ya

what the heck is this "stable" you speak of? :confused: :p:

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And that is the question. Stable is different things to different people so there is no one catch all for everyone.
For me its my machines at 100% load 24/7 on WCG.
For another guy it's SP32m stable, or prime 85 stable for X hours..
Stable is what you want it to be for your uses.

the guy stumbled into the wrong forum me thinks :D

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Originally Posted by Movieman

And that is the question. Stable is different things to different people so there is no one catch all for everyone.
For me its my machines at 100% load 24/7 on WCG.
For another guy it's SP32m stable, or prime 85 stable for X hours..
Stable is what you want it to be for your uses.

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Well said.

Stable for me is stable as the system is at stock speed but even stock systems are unstable sometimes, so where can you draw the line.

I would say a good start is a minimum one hour linpack stable on the CPU, I can crank my i7 up to ~4.5 ghz and it will game just fine. As soon as I run linpack though blue screen....perhaps XS could develop some tiered regulations.

level one certified -1 hour lin pack
level two certified - 1 hour linpack + 3dmark looping
level three certified - 1 hour linpack + 3dmark looping +random/sequential read/write bench

I dunno someone else should make the rules up im just tossing ideas into the salad of life

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Originally Posted by mrcape

OPB has done some great testing, tearing through a lot of hardware and sharing a lot of interesting information. Are people thinking he phoshopped these results or what is the exact charge? I don't get it. I'm quite sure his legit scores would still kick the crap out of most guy's scores. It seems to not make sense that he would do that.

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this isn't a charge, this isn't a thread discussing accusations. this is a thread reporting on a legitimate news story that HWBot posted and Kevin confirmed. please do not question the outcome, there is nothing to hide on this subject anymore. if you want to discuss this, contact Kevin directly, please don't start asking questions here. TIA

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Originally Posted by mrcape

OPB has done some great testing, tearing through a lot of hardware and sharing a lot of interesting information. Are people thinking he phoshopped these results or what is the exact charge? I don't get it. I'm quite sure his legit scores would still kick the crap out of most guy's scores. It seems to not make sense that he would do that.

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For me if a person is caught cheating, in this case several times, all his other scores are suspect and should be removed.

If a person is caught cheating and again in this case several times, how many other times has he cheated and has not been caught.

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Originally Posted by mrcape

OPB has done some great testing, tearing through a lot of hardware and sharing a lot of interesting information. Are people thinking he phoshopped these results or what is the exact charge? I don't get it. I'm quite sure his legit scores would still kick the crap out of most guy's scores. It seems to not make sense that he would do that.

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To simplify this, in this case it is simple;
When you run Aquamark3 your score is 1000 times your average FPS..
His were not..Please go and look at the images on HWBots page and you'll see what I mean.
This is pretty black and white and thats why they took the action they did.

It however is not simple multiplication of 1000 on the average though. There is a formula that is apparently supposed to always hit 1000.
This could be tweaked if it was tested. I fear photoshop is a little basic.
Either way, the tweak is invalid.

what a dum dum, was this scoring schema previously unknown?

If it was, peeps gonna be photoshoppin galore now lol

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Originally Posted by n00b 0f l337

It however is not simple multiplication of 1000 on the average though.

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Yes it is.

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Originally Posted by Aquamark3 Documentation

The total score is based on the average frames per second which is the total number of frames
divided by the time the benchmark needs to complete. The AvgFPS value is multiplied by 1000 and
the result is the AquaMark3 total score. The value of 1000 has been explicitly chosen to scale the
result on high-end desktop PC at the time of release to a value of approximately 50 000.

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Originally Posted by Gautam

Yes it is.

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:rofl::rofl::rofl::ROTF::ROTF::ROTF:

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Originally Posted by Aquamark3 Documentation

The total score is based on the average frames per second which is the total number of frames
divided by the time the benchmark needs to complete. The AvgFPS value is multiplied by 1000 and
the result is the AquaMark3 total score. The value of 1000 has been explicitly chosen to scale the
result on high-end desktop PC at the time of release to a value of approximately 50 000.

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Then check backwards even more in the calculation.
If the average is created from total frames divided by time, if the time is changed, the results may differ. You'd be surprised how programming doesn't always create direct input values. The value shown in one place may be pulled at a different spot from another value.
My bad on the brute X1000. I feel however, simple photoshop is really rather shabby. A photoshop expert should be able to spot some irregularities.

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Originally Posted by dinos22

It's a tough blow to OPB and a just punishment from HWBOT. i feel disappointment in him and sadness about the whole situation at the same time. i am a member of OCX and post a lot there and have learnt a lot from OCX guys including OPB. Kevin does have a problem with competitive benching. it gets the better of him but he knew how high the price is if he does it again.

I still plan to spend as much time on OCX as i used to. Nothing changes for me. It's a great forum and i have a lot of friends there.

Kudos to kevin for standing up and being a man and admitting guilt on his own forum.

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This the second time i QUOTE you dino in last week :D:D

WELL SAID SIR ;)

I had once a weird output in pcmark 2005, no idea how I achieved it as I'm not a hard core tweaker as most of the benchers here. HWBOT admin asked me to remove the score. So what's the common opinion on the so called bugged GT2 score of the GOOC finals ? Anyone being able to reproduce that ?

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Originally Posted by Leeghoofd

So what's the common opinion on the so called bugged GT2 score of the GOOC finals ? Anyone being able to reproduce that ?

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This is not the place to start discussing that, IMHO, keep it in the GO OC 2009 thread.

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Originally Posted by n00b 0f l337

Then check backwards even more in the calculation.
If the average is created from total frames divided by time, if the time is changed, the results may differ. You'd be surprised how programming doesn't always create direct input values. The value shown in one place may be pulled at a different spot from another value.
My bad on the brute X1000. I feel however, simple photoshop is really rather shabby. A photoshop expert should be able to spot some irregularities.

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i don’t think so.. if he uses the numbers he needs for his fabricated scores from other aquamark scores perfectly from the same spot. (like chancing the second number from a 6 to a 8 or something. and then saves it like in as a medium quality jpg you can not see in any way if the scores are cheated now madder how good a Photoshop expert would look.

I feel how ever there should be better anti cheat systems I think in programs like aquamark. Sins I think it wont be long till someone also chances his frame rate to be 1000 time lower then there cheated score. They could do this by a graphic solution in the numbers so it isn’t so easy to chance them out or maybe something like the checksum super pi uses.

Just sad. Both him being caught again and people defending his "honor".
Like I could fake public revenues, take a cut, say "it was me, sorry for buying my yacht with people's money" and get away with it.

Oh wait-- that's what they do here in Italy.

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Originally Posted by JaD

Just sad. Both him being caught again and people defending his "honor".
Like I could fake public revenues, take a cut, say "it was me, sorry for buying my yacht with people's money" and get away with it.

Oh wait-- that's what they do here in Italy.

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:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
ROFL
gotta love those Italian mafia politicians

What's that saying about karma? Let's ask OPB. lolololol

I´ll bet that OPB will be very quiet arouth there also.

why do people that get hardware to be reviewed submitt scores anyway?
its funny when new chips come out and scores are posted before release.
hwbot will always be a farce till they give no points to anyone getting hardware to review.
i mean if you a pro who needs hwbot?

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Originally Posted by mrcape

OPB has done some great testing, tearing through a lot of hardware and sharing a lot of interesting information. Are people thinking he phoshopped these results or what is the exact charge? I don't get it. I'm quite sure his legit scores would still kick the crap out of most guy's scores. It seems to not make sense that he would do that.

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Originally Posted by n00b 0f l337

It however is not simple multiplication of 1000 on the average though. There is a formula that is apparently supposed to always hit 1000.
This could be tweaked if it was tested. I fear photoshop is a little basic.
Either way, the tweak is invalid.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by n00b 0f l337

Then check backwards even more in the calculation.
If the average is created from total frames divided by time, if the time is changed, the results may differ. You'd be surprised how programming doesn't always create direct input values. The value shown in one place may be pulled at a different spot from another value.
My bad on the brute X1000. I feel however, simple photoshop is really rather shabby. A photoshop expert should be able to spot some irregularities.

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Originally Posted by 3oh6

this isn't a charge, this isn't a thread discussing accusations. this is a thread reporting on a legitimate news story that HWBot posted and Kevin confirmed. please do not question the outcome, there is nothing to hide on this subject anymore. if you want to discuss this, contact Kevin directly, please don't start asking questions here. TIA

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Jody is 100% right. :up: This thread is about reporting a news story. Hwbot has caught OPB cheating scores. If you don't like their decision take your complaint to them. Read through the full thread and get the facts.

Off Topic :

give me a good reason why not Slapmehard ? you test the hardware (and spend precious, though mostly very limited time with it), if you want to submit a score I don't see the point why you shouldn't be allowed to do it... and most hardware has to be send back to the manufacturer or another reviewer. On top of that if you dig deeper in the Hwbot rules at a certain moment there's a stop in hardware points. It's rules are more complicated then that. You can also start a discusion that everybody needs to bench on air and not on LN2 as not all users have access to dry ice or such...

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Originally Posted by Gautam

Yes it is.

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Fo shu?:eek:

It's sad to see these kinda stuff happen. I am not into "extreme clocking" with cascade, Ln2 etc. yet but I love watching other people doing it and cheating shouldn't be tolerated.

I don't care if he admits to what he's done, no kudos for you:down:

I geuss my statement was O.T sry
so someone who does not get parts sent to them but buys them does not spend time on it lol
test hardware thats not out and hardware you did not pay for,thats not a even playing field is it?
theres rules for hardware sharing also now that you mention it so hwbot should get part numbers from theses guys then.
its ok for the reviewers to pass around a 975 that goes faster then most?
es and sometimes cherry picked? thats ok?
so that bolsters my point

As for air and sub zero ranks
nah too many cheaters and no one gives credit to air scores away

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Originally Posted by dread77

Well, he crossed the line, not only once but twice.

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more than that actually... a lot more than that :D
everybody involved in the scene and who watched the top scores had very very very strong suspicions about his scores for about 3 or 4 years now...
for some reason he got sloppy lately and it was possible to finally prove that he cheated.
there have been huge arguments with dozens of members involved and a bunch of people called xs and the ones who accused opb names and tried to cause trouble at xs on several occasions...

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Originally Posted by [XC] gomeler

Kind of funny that HWBot just posted about OCX passing HOT in overall score. HOT is once again #1. Conspiracy? :p:

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even if you were joking i dont think it was very smart to post something like this... im glad this thread didnt go downhill with conspiracy theories :P

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Originally Posted by Expat GriZ

This is just sad on so many levels.....:shakes:

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why? its finally over... after years of hiding behind "i have several super mega tweaks" and people having a hard time to prove he was cheating, its not finally confirmed and we can move on. its a great day!

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Originally Posted by perkam

This isn't news.

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how can you say that? :stick:
this is xs, its all about pushing hardware to the limits here and breaking world records, and one of the worst things to happen to the worldwide enthusiast community was OPB and his cheated scores that destroyed peoples motivation to try and break the world record cause whatever they do, somehow, mysteriously, he would always score slightly higher, sometimes with notably lower clocks...

and now hes finally proven guilty and even admits it... and thats not news???

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Originally Posted by slapmehard

I geuss my statement was O.T sry
so someone who does not get parts sent to them but buys them does not spend time on it lol
test hardware thats not out and hardware you did not pay for,thats not a even playing field is it?
theres rules for hardware sharing also now that you mention it so hwbot should get part numbers from theses guys then.
its ok for the reviewers to pass around a 975 that goes faster then most?
es and sometimes cherry picked? thats ok?
so that bolsters my point

As for air and sub zero ranks
nah too many cheaters and no one gives credit to air scores away

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I would differ with what you said.
I'd imagine that most people who got that "cherry 975 ES" hold on to it like you would to your last dollar!:D
Now think just a minute: Your sitting there with the one of maybe 3 known 6ghz 975's and your going to send it to someone whose going to freeze it to whatever it will take and toss God knows how much voltage into it till the socket pins fuze to the cpu? I don't think so..:p:
Also any decent review isn't a short time deal.
More than you would beleive in testing and comparing to comparable products so that the final result gives good info to potential buyers.
There is also honor involved. I wouldn't ever tell someone that X is great if it wasn't whether the piece was mine to keep or not.
I once had a part sent to me that would be excellent BUT with certain changes made. I outlined those changes in an email and asked if they wanted the part back. They said no, then they made the changes and released the part.
The bottom line was I felt good as the buyers were now getting a good part vs one that was flawed.
That is an unseen part of the review process.
We can have imput that makes the products better for all.

(Wow, I never thought that a thread I started could stretch to four pages. Touchy subject I guess :lol:)

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Originally Posted by tiborrr

(Wow, I never thought that a thread I started could stretch to four pages. Touchy subject I guess :lol:)

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Four? This will be 10 in 48 hours I'd guess.

He admitted....

No tweak changes facts:
AM3 result = fps*1000

01SE result =
nature*20 + highs*20 + lows*10

Are equations for 03 05 06 vantage as well, but those I cannot remember....

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Originally Posted by George_o/c

3DMark2001 Calculation Formula

(Game Tests Low x 10) + [(Game Tests High + Nature) x 20]


3DMark2003 Calculation Formula

(GT1 FPS x 7.3) + (GT2 FPS x 37) + (GT3 FPS x 47.1) + (GT4 FPS x 38.7)


3DMark2005 Calculation Formula

[(GT1 FPS + GT2 FPS + GT3 FPS) / 3] x 250


3DMark2006 Calculation Formula

2.5 x (1 / [(1.7 / [( SM2.0 Score + HDR/SM3.0 Score ) x 0.5]) + 0.3 / CPU Score) / 2])

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These are the formulas