Man that really sucks. Well I was glad I was able to help a little even though it didn't work out for you.
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Man that really sucks. Well I was glad I was able to help a little even though it didn't work out for you.
I'm online! Last board was bad.
Take note that this is at default frequency (2.2 GHz) without any memory dedicated to CPU2. All memory I/O goes over HT to CPU1. This slows things down quite a bit, but I've only got the two DIMMs for now. :) Even so, it's pretty clear how terrible the CB10 engine is at MT.
http://www.pcrpg.org/pics/computer/o...b10x64-001.png
:woot:
Awesome! Nice to see it working finally.
Hey, you know I'd always be willing to swap those 1MB Pentium Pros you want for those Istanbuls :rolleyes:
:up: Go going there Particle. The kernal usage graph looks like the sickest roller coaster ever :ROTF:
Two CPUs + Radeon 3870 = 259W in WCG :) I win! (at something at least lol)Quote:
Originally Posted by jcool
http://www.pcrpg.org/pics/computer/opty2427/wcg.png
OVERCLOCK! Really I wanna see some overclocks both 1 socket and dual, with stuff like w-prime...
Also whats with red lines in task manger with green?(NVM)
Edit: Found my own answer... kernal times
nice man nice damn i wish someone releases a dual socket overclockin board
yes, but i think if u o/c'd the ramz a tinch it would help the scaling :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Particle
but seriously, nice configuration. i'm figuring atleast 10.xxx speedup when u get the rams for the second cpu
Very nice! 26.4 more gigglehurtz to the GRID! :up:
Awesome! Really curious what the speedup will be when the 2nd CPU has access to it's own memory. If you wouldn't mind, run a wPrime 1024M run and record the time for me.
Yes this dis the awesomest-especially at 4 in the morning. Congratulations:up: on all the work thus far on this. Quiet an adventure!!!
Oh my god that's sexy:eek:
Why aren't you overclocking it like a maniac already!:rofl: We want atleast 3GHz!
Gongratz on getting it sorted.
I hope some extra ram arrives soon. I wanna see that thing run alright.
Awesome to see this up and crunching particle! :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
Yeah, you win.. if this will match my Gainestown's output of approx. 48k/d.
I'm not sure it can do that, maybe?
Oh yeah, I agree, we want to see you OCing that rig :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgt.McRuff
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartidiot89
I'll get to work on that tonight. hehe Last night was spent doing some testing on the system to make sure everything operated as expected. Then I began the process of modifying my case to accept an E-ATX motherboard. Being a custom case, I designed it with a 13x14" motherboard tray so that it had the capability to accept an E-ATX board if I chose to use one at a future date, but I'd only drilled and threaded holes for the normal ATX standoff positions. No longer! The new board is mounted! :up: Just needs some more work to finish up before I can get back online for good.Quote:
Originally Posted by msimax
The application I'm using to overclock with seems to stop at an HT base of 250 MHz, effectively limiting me to 2.75GHz. No promises that we'll even hit that, however. These are completely unknown waters to everyone at this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by N19h7m4r3
Quote:
Originally Posted by i found nemo
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptMorgan
Thank you guys for supporting me. :) That's probably most of the reason I did this in the first place--I knew there were curious people around like myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppaGeek
Me too. I actually seem to get slightly higher runs out of one 2GB stick in single channel on each CPU, so I'm hopeful that dual channel DDR2-800 will help out significantly.Quote:
Originally Posted by [XC] gomeler
I'll try to do that wPrime run tonight for you.
Yeah, yeah. :yepp: That's what I was getting at--win at "something" (just power consumption). At 2.2GHz, I've no illusions of setting stunning performance records for anything even with 12 cores. We'll have to see how far it'll clock, and before I go too crazy I want to inspect the VRMs to see what I'm dealing with. I'd also like to get a fan on their heatsinks and maybe some real thermal paste.Quote:
Originally Posted by jcool
Anybody know where I can get a pair of Istanbulls from in the UK?
Or have they not hit our shores yet in anything other than OEM form?
Building a new rig in just over a month and would love to go dual socket.
As always, us Europeans are late to the Istanbul party... that's why I have started buying stuff from the US, it's not only way cheaper but soemtimes the only way to get recent HW.
For example, my Tyan Dual LGA1366 mobo STILL isn't available in Europe! :shakes:
Which stores do you get stuff from jcool and do they deliver to the UK?
One thing that puts me off a bit about importing is that if HM customs intercept the package then they will bend you over a desk and... well... I can't say it because of the dancing bananas but you get the gist.
Sorry I forgot to mention in my previous post particle that your system is amazing and have sub'd this thread cos I can't wait to see your OC'ing results. Even if they are minimal I am very interested to see if it is possible to push any gain out of the system at alll.
I predict that when you have memory for both CPUs, and maybe a board in the future with a much faster HT link speed, you'll see a multi-threaded speedup ~11x, instead of 8.53x. I really think the current boards bottleneck these Istanbuls a lot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
I'm confident we're only seeing a fraction of their performance right now.
Yeah I know direct import isn't an option because of customs, that's why I use.. other means. I can't really disclose them here but generally getting someone else within the EU who lives in a country where customs isn't such an issue to help you reroute the package will do the trick. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_redfield
Good idea, your task manager ss looks like your cpu is throttling @ only 2.2GHZ; check it out before you break your expensive hardware.Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
Very interested to see if you can OC.
Here's my question, is it possible to get a Quad Socket F board and put 4 of these badboys in?
Yes, but you'd need series 8000 Istanbuls, which are priced out of this world. Like 1600€ per CPU for the slowest 2,4Ghz model.
I've been a bit puzzled by this actually. The Istanbul CPUs support HT3 and the motherboard does as well. I'm not sure why the link is only 5x200. *scratches head* I think the speed seen here isn't really relevant. The link between the CPUs themselves should auto-negotiate directly and establish the proper 4.8GT/s HT link. Only the link to the chipset for PCIe traffic and such should be impacted by the HT link speed shown. I'll see what more information I can find on this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechromancer
I'm not certain what you mean. The CPU frequency of the 2427s is 2.2GHz. I've disabled both throttling and PowerNow.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zucker2k
It can certainly be overclocked. I experimented with it briefly on my faulty motherboard and did some 2.5GHz action. I haven't yet figured out how to get vCore up on this board as K10Stat's VID settings don't seem to take effect as far as I can tell.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slappa
There are quad boards that can support Istanbul processors, but you'll need 8000 series ones instead of 2000 series like mine. They have extra HT links allowing more CPUs to work together at once, and they're much more (prohibitively) expensive.
Ah, right. I've directly imported one or two items in the past and I haven't had a problem at all but its all down to the luck of the draw and I don't want to push my luck too much.Quote:
Originally Posted by jcool
I do have enough airmiles in order to get a free round trip to the US so I suppose I could pick some stuff up that way but that just seems like one hell of a trek. Still I have always wanted to go to vegas.
I really don't know that much about the Socket F boards at the moment, but do you know when we will be seeing newer models or chipsets that might improve performance. Are they just around the corner or are they still a way off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechromancer
What is the default Vcore?Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
It's understandable if you cannot increase the Vcore on those boards...because well, they aren't really meant for that. However, Istanbuls and server chips are built on the best silicon. I believe you may be able to see some 2.6GHz+ action.
But like said above, these are untested waters. 6 Cores on one chip could hinder the OC ability.
Excellent. I want to see someone sporting a 24 core setup :P
Word on the street (XS) is roughly 2 months from now. I don't know if that is when the chipsets start shipping, or when we'll have AMD based boards on store shelves.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_redfield
Default VID is 1.225V. The boards are technically capable since they're digital, programmable PWM voltage controllers. They have to be able since the VID can vary from CPU model to CPU model.Quote:
Originally Posted by Slappa
You go ahead and try OCing particle, so you can tell me how to do it when I get my quad socket mobo in :D
I honestly have no clue about those tools you used, all us Intel guys have to play with is SetFSB when the Bios doesn't sport any settings...
using ntune? just make a file 260.nsu and load it from the profile and bam!! lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Particle
i read it on here before, the guy said to go up in incriments of 1 i.e. 251.nsu 252.nsu
edit - also, there's no limit if u use the " work around " on the htt freq
If you mean editing the SMBus directly, that isn't a promising approach. It didn't do anything. :) As for nTune, that won't work for me. nTune causes the computer to instantly lock up if I so much as click on the profiles tab. It's all pretty fragile, but it's better than nothing.
ahhhh! well idk maybe try other versions of ntune?
Worth a shot, but I was elated just to find one that worked at all. Most cause the computer to lock on launch.
yea that sux. but none the less 20+ ghz easy system. damn!
Reading this is mad fun- I did not catch it earlier but did you end up using those heat sinks from FrozenCPU the Noctua NH-U12P?
I haven't figured out a permanent cooling setup yet, actually. I'm just using generic AM2 box coolers during testing. I'll try and see if my Xigmatek HDT-1283 and Sunbeam Core Contact can fit on the board together when I finish building tonight. If so, I'll probably just use them.
Are you planning to buy a new board when the new chipsets arrive later this year?
I'm planning on getting some Instanbuls once they hit europe.
But I might end up waiting for the new chipsets.
Although I'm very interested in ALL the results you'll be getting. I'm looking forward to you OC'ing efforts.
Am I right in thinking though there is no SLI for dual socket chipsets with the 1336 Xeon's?
i got 20% higher scores in cinebench with a 64 bit OS. nice to see the hex get similar scores to a core i7
Finally Particle :up:
Now that CB10 score won't scale much higher than that, even with dual channel for each socket.
That's the nature of this benchmark. The scene is too simple for more than 8 cores. Still I hope you can nudge 9x CPU scaling!
Have fun clocking that baby!!:p:
Q1 2010 will be the time AMD customers will no longer be able to transition their existing systems to the newer processors due to a new platform. So we will see a Istanbul prices drop and a LOT of Shanghais and Barcelonas on Ebay :D :D :DQuote:
Originally Posted by jcool
The sheer jump from 4 cores to 6 though is very impressive. However, if this occurs for Intel's Gulftown as well, we will see Cinebench numbers for Intel's top models in the 40,000s at Stock. 0_0
Perkam
really? i was thinking ATLEAST 10.xxx scaling. well, i learn new stuff everydayQuote:
Originally Posted by Lightman
SolidWorks's PhotoView 360 app really eats up this 12 core action though. :) Now there's a modern renderer.
Send that to Bit-Tech so they atleast have one program that can use more than 4 threads :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
QFT. That review was useless..Quote:
Originally Posted by N19h7m4r3
It's really cool. It's a render/finishing part of SolidWorks. It uses all threads extremely well since they each render staggered pixels when in preview mode. It uses all available CPU time while you're still in pre-render and gets it toward your current render settings until it's actually finished. Thus, you're rotating and angling, changing backgrounds and material types, and it's rendering at every step with all threads...just sharpening up as quickly as it can. With the dual 2427s, even complex parts very rapidly get to where they look like renders again. It's blocky during the rotate but instantly snaps back to quality when you let go. :D
I'll post a video.
I can't wait for the video.
Will be good to see how they perform with a real task like that.
lets see some benchies with that beast!! for games the inferno engine (ghostbusters) scales well with cores and so does lost planet and try y-cruncher by poke349
Particle, when you ran WCG, any indications on how many points per day (or hour) you were averaging?
Perkam
If there was a Phenom II x4 2.2GHz at market, Particels Istanbuls would be 50% more efficient at folding than those ;) Folding doesn't require a bunch of cache so the fact that they are sharing L3 doesn't matterQuote:
Originally Posted by perkam
In that case I would guesstimate 15k ppd and 30 WUs average per CPU.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartidiot89
Opterons on average perform a lot better than Phenoms, so I'm not quite sure that's a fair assessment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smartidiot89
@ Poppa, 15k PPD per CPU seems low :(
Hopefully Particle can retest.
Perkam
No idea. I've never found PPD numbers that jive with anyone else's. At 3.5GHz on my PII X4 940 I showed like 5k/day when going 24/7.
so if the l3 is 6mb and there's 6 cores.... u guys think l3 size will go up in these chips in the future? or is that backwards? they're making 1mb l2's again right?
I need some help on raising vCore. Coincidentally, at the stock VID of 1.225V the maximum I can achieve is a little over 2.5GHz. That's actually pretty promising since the desktop chips default to like 1.300, 1.325, and 1.350. I'd like to try my luck at 1.3V and I'm guessing it would get me to 2.8-3.0 without too much trouble.
K10Stat does work, but its modifications are instantly overwritten if they exceed the maximum allowed VID of 1.225V. I can set it lower than that and it sticks/applies. There are no voltage options in the BIOS. nTune can't control it. I just need a way to force this thing to ignore the max VID or overwrite (increase) what that max VID is or something. (Side note: After installing nTune, I have to reinstall Windows if I want the ability to login as new user accounts that don't have profiles yet or it'll lock up at "Preparing Desktop".)
How does PhenomMsrTweaker work for you?
The program crashes instantly on startup.
you have the latest .net frame work? ( 3.5? )
Yes, I do.
I took a look and it appears I have ISL 6323 voltage controllers. Haven't found much on them yet other than the spec sheet/pin diagram.
http://www.intersil.com/data/fn/FN9278.pdf
Any of you know how to make this thing do what I want (or know anyone who you can drag into this)?
As far as Vcore goes the only thing I can think of is performing a pin mod/hard mod on the chips to raise the Vcore.....
However this is risky and also unknown waters to pin mod these chips.
Not sure if this will be of any use to you man, but in the early days of Phenoms some of the Gurus used "Crystal CPUID" to manually set registers on the K10 chips. I just thought I would mention it in case the registers also control the voltage chip.Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
Might be worh a read:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...=crystal+cpuid
sam2008 and justapost both dug pretty deep into those settings.
You might want to shoot them a PM if you think they might be able to help and if they re still around.
I find that hard to believe:Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
http://techreport.com/r.x/opteron-24...ding-total.gif
Although WCG and F@H are different, shouldn't you be doing at least 40k PPD at 2.5Ghz?
You can ask MM for WCG tweaks any time, you know that :up:
Perkam
probably on 32nm but die size for istanbul is 346 mm^2. its smarter to pack on cores these days instead of oversized cachesQuote:
Originally Posted by i found nemo
Yeah--aren't cores like 35mm^2 or something tiny like that?
Brief System Overview
http://www.pcrpg.org/pics/computer/o...be_preview.jpg
lol ur specific-ness makes me lol.
btw cable management much? :p i'm j/p. what thickness is that metal on ur case?
1" 6061 T52 aluminum channel with 1/8" thick walls. All welded. It's pretty industrial. I think the frame ended up weighing like 12 pounds or something stupid light like that. With everything loaded the computer weighs like 60 I think. I was specific so as to answer the questions I figured people might wonder like "What is that?" A single viewer might only wonder about one item, but I figured it'd be kinda neat.
Don't say you're joking m8. You're right.Quote:
Originally Posted by i found nemo
I have never seen worse cable management :stick: Get some extenders and some sleeves.
Perkam
12lbs is lightQuote:
Originally Posted by Particle
I got thremaltake Xaser sitting here in my room with nothing it it weighs more then current case with stuff in it. the xaser is empty lol
Net Weight / Gross Weight: 18.0 kg ; 39.6 lb / 20.8 kg ; 45.8 lb
I mod my machines much more often than practicality allows for cable management. I know where all the cables go and I don't have airflow problems, so I just don't worry about it. I'm kind of an "industrial" art kind of guy, as you can probably tell from the case itself. I find an artsy value in a system like that. :) Well, mine anyway. If I didn't know what's in it I probably wouldn't find it interesting.
Cinebench R10
Some of you had requested I run Cinebench, so I thought I'd do a video run demonstrating the dual 2427s.
http://www.pcrpg.org/pics/computer/o...utube_cb10.jpg
And here I thaught it was cool when I started Cinebench with a Quadcore... Nice job man!Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
This thread has had me thinking about the pro's/con's of server hardware now that I have started crunching for WCG more than just my laptop. I wonder if there will ever be desktop parts like that. And also, I know 790FX is capable of multi-socket, I am curious if that will happen as even dual quad Phenom II's would make for a nice cruncher.
Brilliant videos Particle!
I really like your case and how you manage cables!
It looks so familiar to my own computer! Only difference is that I have some HDDs on the floor because they can't fit into my case (TT Soprano) :p:!
Keep up good work!
24464 was score with 12 cpus so that's like each cpu is getting 2038.666. on avg anyways. what is the speed up now that u have 1 ram in each cpu atleast?
Scaling is a bit off ,around 8.6x iirc from his previous post.So the one core score should be ~2800.Quote:
Originally Posted by i found nemo
"it takes a special kind of person to be excited by this"Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
lol I know what you mean! Thanks of sharing you experience. :up:
This is true. Still, the scaling seems very low to me right now. I guess Particle has some tweaking to do with the memory or somethings. I would expect ~10x scaling at least. 28% is a lot of performance to be losing don't you think? Istanbuls are supposed to be very efficient in multi-CPU setups.Quote:
Originally Posted by informal
I think it was since he was running the board with one dedicated memory (for CPU0 only).Quote:
Originally Posted by Mechromancer
not in the vid. tha's AFTER he switched rams. but the post he had in here earlier was when rams were on cpu0. i'm just wondering how much, if any cpu scaling went up after giving each their own mem. ( even if single channel ) i get 2200 pts with single core @ 2.64 ghz ram @ 264 3-4-3-10
the poor scaling is the software not the hardware in this case. if the scene was larger and more complex you would see a much larger increase in performance
AMd talks a lot about their overall platform, it would be awesome if we saw overclockable dual-socket mobos supporting Istanbul.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom128
Actually, it would be awesome just to see desktop Istanbul :D
watching the video you can quickly see how badly C10 is at trying to balance core loads. if they didnt try to render a whole row at once, it would probably scale much better.
Yes, like many people (including myself..) have said earlier in this thread, CB10's scaling doesn't work properly for more then 8 threads. The engine is showing its age, a way better test is, for example, Frybench
It scales with ram speed as well, which means my Dual Gainestown totally owns the Dual Harpertown here, even tho in CB10 the Harpertown wins. Try it particle, under 4 minutes is good :D
Guess that's not something my Opties are good at. Render time was 5m26s at 12 x 2508. If it's memory sensitive though, it might be suffering from my single channel DDR2-800 @ 780 with vanilla timings.
hi particle,
i havent posted in this thread yet, but i have been following it, i just wanted to say that has been very interesting to see this evolve into 12 core goodness, and too see the results,
i was also very surprised to hear that you sound exactly like you post, if that makes sense?
keep the results coming, nice to see a thread in the AMD section that has some meat in it.
Just to put your time into perspective, on my C2D T5500 (1.66GHz) laptop in 32bit Vista I've got 45min. 42sec. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
Very nice bench I must admit!
Thanks jcool for linky :up:
Your CB10 score is fine:
http://www.techreport.com/r.x/optero.../cinebench.gif
I'd get at least two ram sticks for each socket stat, Particle, otherwise you were better off with Shanghai :stick:
Perkam
Just to make sure everyone knows: To all of you who have been supportive and extending compliments--I really do appreciate it. Thanks a bunch folks. You guys are what makes this project fun to do in the first place. :up:
As for RAM, that has been and still is on my list of to-dos, but I'm going to wait until I get paid this Friday. :) I've spent a boatload of money already, and I'm below my normal reserve line due to some problems encountered during this build. The RAM I use is frequently out of stock anyway, and Newegg doesn't predict they'll have more until Friday so that times up nicely. Most ECC/Reg is 667 or slower. I've got the fancy shmancy 800 stuff! (Woo, fancy $35 RAM ftw) hehe I only bought two sticks initially so I could run in a minimal state if my mountains of regular RAM didn't work (it didn't).
vCore
I do still need some help on this one. I'd like to get it up to 1.30V and try my luck overclocking a little higher. I still haven't found a way around the (designed) behavior of the system to where if a VID above MaxVID (1.225V) is set, the system ignores it and re-writes 1.225V to the CurrentVID register. I need a way to overwrite the MaxVID register or something, whever it is. I emailed one of those Crystal CPU warriors from the TLB adventure, but he either hasn't noticed my PM or isn't interested. A hardware mod isn't out of the question, either, provided anyone knows how to do it. We need to get this truck rolling at 2.8 or 3.0 GHz I think. :)
Yep! Those are the CB10 scores I'm comparing his thread to. Now that 2435 is running 100mhz faster, but I noticed that CB10 is sensitive to memory speeds. When I went from 4GB@1066 to 8GB@800 there was a noticeable decrease in rendering time. At 800mhz I was able to tighten up my timings quite a bit and that helps too.Quote:
Originally Posted by perkam
Particle is a couple of good DDR2 ECC 800mhz kits away from extracting full power from those Six-Cores.
Particle, I actually want to buy two of the 4GB Kingston ECC 800mhz kits for my PII-940! ECC@800mhz > regular@1066 Iv'e found. How tight can you get the timings on that 800mhz ECC?Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
I haven't played with the timings yet at all. I could see ECC memory in theory granting more overclocking headroom since it can correct single bit errors if they don't happen too frequently, I suppose. Not sure I'd want to be that far out on the edge though! :D You could probably use the ECC memory just fine if your motherboard exposes the options, just not ECC + registered. I'm not sure what the registered buffer does to overclocking stability.
Very interesting thread!:up:
It actually made me take a look at pricing on the Shanghai and Istanbul Opterons, and while two hexacores seem a little too rich for me price wise, I actually found two Shanghai 2376s to have very good pricing. I think I'll hold off upgrading for a few months to see if the usual suspects (Supermicro?) will release dual socket boards based on the new AMD chipsets, and how the Lynnfield release goes.
I'd love to see some Arma II benchmarks Particle, my 3,8 GHz E7200 suffers badly when there is a lot of AI, I need more cores I think:(:D I'm actually CPU limited in gaming at 1920x1200 with a 1 GB 4870 and a 3,8 GHz Core 2 Duo, who would have thought?
Thanks, Frodin. I too am hoping for some 800-series chipset boards this fall. As for Arma II, I have a bit of bad news there. It appears to be bugged out--it won't run with 12 cores in a system. It'll run with 6 cores/1 CPU just fine and a guy on a skulltrail system can run it (2 quads), but with 12 cores it just dies when the menu should be loading up.
PARTICLE! I have news from the PhenomMsrTweaker thread!
Give that a try and let us know if the service allows you to change core VID :D. Also, post in that thread so kink knows just who the heck you are. I seriously don't know how he missed your Istanbul thread.:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by kink
Yes, it is very memory intensive. My Gainestown at 3Ghz with Tri Channel DDR3-1066 C7 takes around 3:30-3:40 to complete.Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle
And here is the Harper on its 24/7 setting, which you managed to beat even though a pair of 4Ghz Harpers would be faster in most other apps. Even though they got QuadChannel FB they are somewhat limited by the FSB interface, even at FSB450.
Now I see why you don't like speculation, you have so much factual info :stick: :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by jcool
There is definitely some potential there in these Istanbuls. Cost/Core doesn't become competitive with Intel, though, until the Octa and Deca-core processors come out next year.
Perkam
do you think you have enough ram to run games?Quote:
Originally Posted by Particle