Nanofluid tested with three different temperatures on a Q6600

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mcoffey

As interesting as all this has been, I'll stick with good old distilled water. Distilled easier to deal with and the Nano Fluid's improvment gains don't seem to worth the added cost and hassle.

I'm sure there's a market for it though, and good luck to you.

andyc

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That's been my stance all along. Seems like a load of hype to me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

okey excuse me im a legend on anandtech for h2o also the cases and cooling mod.

just who are you giving nano fluid to on anandtech thats loving it? (if its chris you will never see a review on it)

Infact i can only think of 5 people on AT who would be able to test a LC system, and none of them have nano fluid.

Also im very skeptical about this stuff.

Why? cuz any answer you've given us was with a shaddy wrong backwards answer.

Volumne not being important in any system is really funny. Volumne holds delta, more volumne the more work the system needs to do bring coolant temps up.

Your coolant would be at best for LOW FLOW systems which is NOT LOW VOLUMNE systems. And if your saying we can use a smaller radiator, then no, smaller radiators still dictate to faster fans regardless of any coolant used. So no, your statement is completely wrong.

Sorry we arent like TOMS hardware who accept blind truths. A lot of us here are probably WAY more experienced then you, and have been cringing at your comments. If you want to promote this product, lets speak to the guy who developed it. Because from the sounds of things, your the guy who is marketing(PR), and not in RnD.

So i want to know who your source testing is at anandtech, because i dont like people using my forum name without proper backing up.

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:up: :rofl: :ROTF:

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Originally Posted by [XC] riptide

Good points... but he said the mixture was the same density (or nearly) as water?

But anyways... what we need to know is what is the hardness and does it decrease with the size of the grain at these particular sizes.

When you decrese somethings size, Naekuh, it becomes virtually harder but after a critical size hardness decreases. Sounds mad but true.

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Density is irrelevant, you can etch materials with water and suspended sponges given enough velocity. I think the overall evasiveness and butchering of the properties of cooling have NaeKuh honed in like a rabid squirrel on a trashcan. He smells BS and reltem is just being more and more evasive and butchering his replies.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mcoffey

Again, I'm not arguing the validity of this particular fluid and it's value as a LC coolant. I'm just saying that abrasion isn't an issue.:shrug:

If I thought it was worth testing and using, I would have done so when the chance was offered to me. But my concerns wern't centered on abrasion issues. As far as the testing I've seen, the value isn't there just as with any coolant other than distilled water.

andyc

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ability for water to carry more heat.

Ability to cheat the system by using a different medium to more efficiently transfer heat from one end to the other.

I really want this kind of coolant... however... my friend says go gallium then. :rofl:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sabre2

Do systems typically last long enough for damage to be done by nanofluids? Seriously, if you're using the same WC hardware after 10 years of use... something isn't right (like those people who still bring Windows 98 machines into my shop).

I can understand the effects of it all... but what is the timeline for damage to be noticable and affect performance?

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brings us back to the first page... what is the particle causing impact, and how much pressure is your system holding...

let me ask an RD-30 owner, after reading this page, are you willing to drop your 275 dollar pump package on the coolant without knowing what particle it is?

Or even more fear anyone thinking of using it in a DDC-2 which are prone to dying for no reason?

NaeKuh, he already explained why he isnt sharing all that information. And I think his reason actually makes sense. If I had a great idea, I wouldnt go spilling it out on a forum full of technically inclined people and risk loosing my ideas to copycats.

It sounds to me like you're concern is genuine but you aren't taking the whole picture into consideration. When the liquid is ready, it will be ready. When it is distributed, it will be tested. When it is pattened and fully protected, he will probably tell us all the details. When it's tested, your conclusions will either be valid or not but there is nothing more important than real testing when it comes down to this type of stuff.

Patience :), this guy is convinced this will work!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gillbot

Density is irrelevant, you can etch materials with water and suspended sponges given enough velocity.

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Oh. I know! I spoke density specifically to Naekuhs post. Which mentioned density. ;)

I know water can be used to cut titanium at >50,000 PSI with jewel heads and at Mach 3. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mcoffey

LOL,

Until someone shows me some new earth shattering results, I'll be using good old pure distilled direct from Wally World or Safeway. I've gotten so I buy it in the 2.5 gallon jugs now with the little faucet.

andyc

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:up:

which is why im dreaming for a uber coolant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

and how do you know this?
The OP hasnt even given any sample to skinnee or Martin310 who had all the stuff to test it.

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Actually, I did get an early sample and I completely botched a couple of things...such as flow rate. :shakes:

Dual Core Nanofluid Test

...but the formula has changed since. In my testing there was a slight gain in a low flow setting (~2ºC).

I completely disagree with the statement/concept of Nanofluid turning a single rad into the cooling capacity of a double or triple though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sabre2

It sounds to me like you're concern is genuine but you aren't taking the whole picture into consideration. When the liquid is ready, it will be ready. When it is distributed, it will be tested. When it is pattened and fully protected, he will probably tell us all the details. When it's tested, your conclusions will either be valid or not but there is nothing more important than real testing when it comes down to this type of stuff.

Patience :), this guy is convinced this will work!

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blah

So we wait until after people buy it know what it is?

Can we just talk to the developers. Shiet let me talk to them, i'll even sign an NDA.

I would just like to say that your avatar is so fitting NaeKuh.

Not that its a bad thing, but just reading this thread and then seeing your avatar has me literally LMAO.

I thought I answered all the questions except what it is made of and the exact concentration/formula, which I won't until the patent comes back favorably, but I told you the density is close to water - extremely close. So close that for rudimentary calculations you can assume water density. Oh, cost and availability I haven't answered either. I don't have an answer to those yet
You can calculate the velocity needed to cut copper with a nanoparticle if you would like. You can easily assume a nanoparticle with a size of 50nm and do it, you can also do it with varying nanoparticle materials since it will be mass dependent. Or, since it was mentioned that the pump head was 10psi you can calculate what size of hole you would need to push your fluid through to obtain that velocity. Then, you can compare it to the hole size in your set-up. Also, knowing the hole size and pump head you can calculate the velocity of the water going thru it to see how close you are to reaching the cutting velocity.

Well to be perfectly honest plain water will cut copper given enough time at any flowrate and pressure above zero, it's called erosion(not trying to be smart alec just making a point). Given this fact unless your particles are smaller than a water molecule then they will accelerate the process, regardless of density of the material. The trouble is how much erosion will occur over a given timeframe in the typical WC'ing setup. Granted cpu, gpu blocks get changed when ever their is an upgrade so if the nano fluild takes ten years to show signs of wearing the block I think it would be safe enough on the blocks.

My concern isn't the blocks but the bearings in the pumps, because these small particles will get in between the impeller shaft and the bearing. If your particles are like bucky balls the bearings would actually last longer. Aleternitively if they are shaped like cubic zirconia crystals they will eat the bearings up in no time flat.

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Originally Posted by relttem

I thought I answered all the questions except what it is made of and the exact concentration/formula, which I won't until the patent comes back favorably, but I told you the density is close to water - extremely close.

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Excuse me, but what do you want to patent ?? Nanofluids are known and developped since 90' and there's already a bunch of patents on them. With some previous posts here and on others forums, you simply buy some at Nanophase, dilute it (if you buy a concentrated solution) and put a surfactant to ensure colloidal stability, so where's the innovative value into that ? Nothing seems new. Every people working with this stuff does the same (except for nanofluids which don't need others chemicals and those who made their fluids themselves)...

Concerning the material, there's only a few possibilities for this particular color, the most common are aluminium oxide and zinc oxide. Given the very limited choice of materials provided by Nanophase and the fact you talk about zinc in your paper, the zinc oxide seems to be the one. Moreover, it's one of the cheapest nanofluid we can make/get (prices go up quickly), but far to be the most interesting concerning thermal aspects.

if it is a zinc oxide base then there will be problems with galvanic corrosion. Aluminum oxide would be worse.......

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

Well to be perfectly honest plain water will cut copper given enough time at any flowrate and pressure above zero, it's called erosion(not trying to be smart alec just making a point). Given this fact unless your particles are smaller than a water molecule then they will accelerate the process, regardless of density of the material. The trouble is how much erosion will occur over a given timeframe in the typical WC'ing setup. Granted cpu, gpu blocks get changed when ever their is an upgrade so if the nano fluild takes ten years to show signs of wearing the block I think it would be safe enough on the blocks.

My concern isn't the blocks but the bearings in the pumps, because these small particles will get in between the impeller shaft and the bearing. If your particles are like bucky balls the bearings would actually last longer. Aleternitively if they are shaped like cubic zirconia crystals they will eat the bearings up in no time flat.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

if it is a zinc oxide base then there will be problems with galvanic corrosion. Aluminum oxide would be worse.......

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:up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

if it is a zinc oxide base then there will be problems with galvanic corrosion. Aluminum oxide would be worse.......

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No, because it's already oxidized; at least that is my understanding.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

My concern isn't the blocks but the bearings in the pumps, because these small particles will get in between the impeller shaft and the bearing. If your particles are like bucky balls the bearings would actually last longer. Aleternitively if they are shaped like cubic zirconia crystals they will eat the bearings up in no time flat.

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A valid concern. The nanoparticles are on the same order in size with a molecule of water. Your pump should have sealed bearings or it would rust from the water leaking in. I think rust would happen before any detriments due to the nanoparticles if your seal is broken.
With our lab experiments we had a copper plate that was coated with a high temperature paint. We were flowing the nanofluids thru clear PVC piping and high clarity lexan from GE Polymers test section. We had to have high clarity lexan because we were shining a laser onto the copper plate - which had to be painted black with a high temp paint so the laser would reflect. The nanofluid didn't have any effects on the painted copper plate - even after months of tests with Reynolds numbers up to 500,000 in a 2x2 section - that is some serious water velocity, so any sand-blasting effects would have been seen on the paint. Also, the lexan wasn't affected.
But, I will agree, over a million years you might see some wear and tear on a copper block.
I really don't have an answer for the 3M question. I don't think 3M really does any sort of cooling stuff. DowTherm does, but their niche is not electronic cooling. Also, this nanofluid stuff is new technology, maybe they just haven't gotten around to it yet. We were lucky that we had the Air Force to sponsor us.
I appreciate all the questions and comments - it keeps us honest.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

if it is a zinc oxide base then there will be problems with galvanic corrosion. Aluminum oxide would be worse.......

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I think you need an electric current for that to happen

Most pumps we use have ceramic bearings and the water is the lubricant in the pumps. Also the pumps we use primarily are mag-drive pumps so no seals are required other than to seal the pump top to the housing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

if it is a zinc oxide base then there will be problems with galvanic corrosion. Aluminum oxide would be worse.......

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No. Nanoparticles are already in an oxidized form, they won't oxidize more. Chemicals reactions for galvanic corrosion occur between 2 pure metals or alloys, not with their oxidized forms in a simple watercooling with water (will require some current for example to initiate inverse reactions like electrolysis). Pure metallic nanofluids are generally more problematic because their nanoparticles will oxidize into water with dissolved oxygen and then the nanofluid looses a lot of its capabilities. Others fluids such oils are often required to use pure metallic nanoparticles and also specific one-step methods to produce them and avoid oxydation by air.

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Originally Posted by relttem

I think you need an electric current for that to happen

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No, because the coolant will act as an electrolitic. You can never have perfectly neutral ph. and with different metals in a loop with the heat being transfered to the coolant you will generate the electric current that causes galvanic corrosion. so you have a self generating system of micro-elctric currents which eat away at one or the other metals in the loop.

Go check some of the threads showing the damage of having mixed metal loops.(yes there are ways to control this, but that is an added expense for how much benefit?).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

Most pumps we use have ceramic bearings and the water is the lubricant in the pumps. Also the pumps we use primarily are mag-drive pumps so no seals are required other than to seal the pump top to the housing.

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the ceramic's brinell hardness will be higher than the nanoparticles. I will have to look into this. But, I think due to the use of Copper that the ceramic would have to be stronger brinell-wise, and our nanoparticles are less than copper.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skinnee

Actually, I did get an early sample and I completely botched a couple of things...such as flow rate. :shakes:

Dual Core Nanofluid Test

...but the formula has changed since. In my testing there was a slight gain in a low flow setting (~2ºC).

I completely disagree with the statement/concept of Nanofluid turning a single rad into the cooling capacity of a double or triple though.

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bah i completely forgot about this test... (I take back on what i said about you chosing wrong people)

Cam can you take a picture of your block and pump used internals when you have time.

Look for hairline scratches to see if any is visable.

If you dont have the system up anymore.. then blah

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

bah i completely forgot about this test... (I take back on what i said about you chosing wrong people)

Cam can you take a picture of your block and pump used internals when you have time.

Look for hairline scratches to see if any is visable.

If you dont have the system up anymore.. then blah

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No worries...You were in Rabid Squirrel mode as gillbot put it (thanks for that btw, made my day).

I plan on doing more tests with the updated Nanofluid formula from relttem, that is if he is willing to send me a sample. I have changed the setup I was using during those tests. The only thing I can really point at in terms of cons to nanofluid was the tube staining and residue that was left behind in the reservoir. To me this happened at an accelerated pace with nanofluid compared to any other coolant I've used, was also much more difficult to clean than other coolant residue/staining.

However, I made relttem aware of this problem shortly after the first test and he stated they would look into any possible resolutions for the problem.

How about pump bearing damage?

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

How about pump bearing damage?

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that was my brinell hardness response.. I will have to check on that. But, that is the way I am leaning.. I will let you know.

i should have been more specific, sorry. I was asking skinnee, since he has already tested it once.

Don't get me wrong the nano fluid sounds interesting, it's just that all concerns need to be laid to rest with data and pics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

How about pump bearing damage?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

that was my brinell hardness response.. I will have to check on that. But, that is the way I am leaning.. I will let you know.

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Nothing evident...and the same goes for Naekuh's request on the block internals, nothing evident. There was more build-up on the Fuzion V1 inlet (slight lip on the washer where the cover meets the mid-plate), but this is versus distilled which has absolutely no build-up.

The only major difference between distilled and nanofluid was the residue and build-up throughout the loop. Every component in the loop had residue or build-up from the nanofluid, including the funnel I used for filling.

I will be using more instrumentation on the next round of tests, thats for sure.

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Originally Posted by skinnee

The only thing I can really point at in terms of cons to nanofluid was the tube staining and residue that was left behind in the reservoir. To me this happened at an accelerated pace with nanofluid compared to any other coolant I've used, was also much more difficult to clean than other coolant residue/staining.

However, I made relttem aware of this problem shortly after the first test and he stated they would look into any possible resolutions for the problem.

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That was a surfactant problem, which we are working on now. The surfactant, for those that don't know, is going to keep the nanoparticles separated in the fluid. If they agglomerate, which I have mentioned earlier as a problem, you have what is called "stokes settling", and this gets worse as more agglomeration occurs. The rate of agglomeration occurring is going to be a function of the available surface area. So, basically, the surface area doubles when two particles stick together and increases as more stick..that gives more mass, which is going to cause the particles to settle faster. But, we are definitely working on that because that, to us, is the most important thing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skinnee

Nothing evident...and the same goes for Naekuh's request on the block internals, nothing evident. There was more build-up on the Fuzion V1 inlet (slight lip on the washer where the cover meets the mid-plate), but this is versus distilled which has absolutely no build-up.

The only major difference between distilled and nanofluid was the residue and build-up throughout the loop. Every component in the loop had residue or build-up from the nanofluid, including the funnel I used for filling.

I will be using more instrumentation on the next round of tests, thats for sure.

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sorry, I thought he was asking me about that..:)

Look at this way relttem we're going to ask hard questions here and not give up till we have answers and proof. If you can show us and convince this bunch of diehards, Your sure to have winner on your hands. So just hang in there.

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

i should have been more specific, sorry. I was asking skinnee, since he has already tested it once.

Don't get me wrong the nano fluid sounds interesting, it's just that all concerns need to be laid to rest with data and pics.

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I totally agree..that is why we are sending this stuff out to get tested..pretty much to almost random people. The three on here that tested we recommended to us, as where the guy from Anandtech and Toms. The three on here ran similar but different tests, which gave pretty much the same results - within statistical error. HESmelaugh was our European tester and was able to run slightly different tests than the three here. And, he also got very similar results. Which, is a good thing. Again, I am all for answering your questions and trying my best to explain stuff. The last thing I want to do is sell some crap stuff.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

I totally agree..that is why we are sending this stuff out to get tested..pretty much to almost random people. The three on here that tested we recommended to us, as where the guy from Anandtech and Toms. The three on here ran similar but different tests, which gave pretty much the same results - within statistical error. HESmelaugh was our European tester and was able to run slightly different tests than the three here. And, he also got very similar results. Which, is a good thing. Again, I am all for answering your questions and trying my best to explain stuff. The last thing I want to do is sell some crap stuff.

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This is why I had brought up the bearing issue, most people don't even think of things like this, but due to my professional experiences a bearing failure just ruins your day. So on a high end system this would be especailly heart breaking.

Hopefully we can think of things your people haven't, and get them all covered, minimizing any possible failures.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

the ceramic's brinell hardness will be higher than the nanoparticles. I will have to look into this. But, I think due to the use of Copper that the ceramic would have to be stronger brinell-wise, and our nanoparticles are less than copper.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

that was my brinell hardness response.. I will have to check on that. But, that is the way I am leaning.. I will let you know.

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Brinell hardness has zero to do with wear. If you can cut steel with pure water, which i'm positive water "softer" than steel, what the hell does brinell hardness have to do with anything?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fart_plume

This is why I had brought up the bearing issue, most people don't even think of things like this, but due to my professional experiences a bearing failure just ruins your day. So on a high end system this would be especailly heart breaking.

Hopefully we can think of things your people haven't, and get them all covered, minimizing any possible failures.

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I honestly never thought of it because I had thought that the pumps were all sealed bearings. But, when you mentioned ceramic bearings and water being used as a lubricant I thought about the pump manufacture that is making that set-up must have taken into consideration metal particles in the water; due to tightening of fittings, micro shavings from the block that weren't cleaned out..etc etc..and, for people that just use tap water in their system, eating up the bearings. They would have had to think of a way to get past that. One easy one would be to make the bearing harder than typical metals. That is why I thought that the ceramic bearings are probably harder than the metal. But, again, I will look into that some more.

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Originally Posted by gillbot

Brinell hardness has zero to do with wear. If you can cut steel with pure water, which i'm positive water "softer" than steel, what the hell does brinell hardness have to do with anything?

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who cuts steel with pure water?

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Originally Posted by relttem

who cuts steel with pure water?

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Quote:

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Within every abrasive waterjet is a pure waterjet cutter, and you can switch from abrasive waterjet cutting to pure waterjet cutting in just two minutes.

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The harder the material, the higher the pressure. The only limitation is the pressure of the machine. Regardless of what you are cutting, i'm sure MOST of the materials are "softer" than water, even if it's only plastic. Brinell hardness is completely irrelevant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

I honestly never thought of it because I had thought that the pumps were all sealed bearings. But, when you mentioned ceramic bearings and water being used as a lubricant I thought about the pump manufacture that is making that set-up must have taken into consideration metal particles in the water; due to tightening of fittings, micro shavings from the block that weren't cleaned out..etc etc..and, for people that just use tap water in their system, eating up the bearings. They would have had to think of a way to get past that. One easy one would be to make the bearing harder than typical metals. That is why I thought that the ceramic bearings are probably harder than the metal. But, again, I will look into that some more.

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Typically water pumps that use a ceramic bearing are the type that self polish,(because the impeller shaft has a matching bearing surface). Introducing a forien object in to this surface can scar it. depending on the clearances of the bearings and the shape of the object, the shape affects the scarring as much as hardness does. ie a soft steel shaving in an automatic transmission can do damage to the hardened bearing surfaces.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

who cuts steel with pure water?

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Well steel shim stock can be cut with just water, but as you said why when there are better methods..............

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gillbot

The harder the material, the higher the pressure. The only limitation is the pressure of the machine. Regardless of what you are cutting, i'm sure MOST of the materials are "softer" than water, even if it's only plastic. Brinell hardness is completely irrelevant.

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you do have a limit to what pressure you can achieve. Now I am curious as to how much pressure you would need to cut thru a .25" steel plate. I will calculate that out tomorrow. Believe it or not, it will be a function of density..how about that?

Why is this even an issue, unless you're planning to sell the fluid outside computer cooling. The turbulence of the fluid through the pump and tubes is plenty enough to keep the particles suspended indefinitely.
If computer off for 6 months, no problem, them selttling will go away as soon as you introduce turbulence with the startup of the pump.

David

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

That was a surfactant problem, which we are working on now. The surfactant, for those that don't know, is going to keep the nanoparticles separated in the fluid. If they agglomerate, which I have mentioned earlier as a problem, you have what is called "stokes settling", and this gets worse as more agglomeration occurs. The rate of agglomeration occurring is going to be a function of the available surface area. So, basically, the surface area doubles when two particles stick together and increases as more stick..that gives more mass, which is going to cause the particles to settle faster. But, we are definitely working on that because that, to us, is the most important thing.

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First of all: Sorry I haven't checked in here lately. I hadn't noticed that this thread had become active again.

While I can't answer the technical side of most of the questions asked (I don't have any insider-knowledge on the Nanofluid) I can announce that I'm planning on doing a long-term test with the Nanofluid. I will use it in my productive system which runs about 18 hours a day. Maybe that will help answer some questions about long-term effects.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eternalightwith

Why is this even an issue, unless you're planning to sell the fluid outside computer cooling. The turbulence of the fluid through the pump and tubes is plenty enough to keep the particles suspended indefinitely.
If computer off for 6 months, no problem, them selttling will go away as soon as you introduce turbulence with the startup of the pump.

David

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We have noticed this being a problem only with certain pump set-ups. After Skinnee told me about it, I checked my WC system and had some residue in it. Yes, the flow thru the block and tubes does keep it mixed well, but when it is in the reservoir - not so much. My pump intake is on the side of the reservoir, therefore I have a dead zone beneath the intake port. We have reservoirs that have the intake at the bottom that will not see this happen, because there is no dead zone. If that makes sense.
I believe HESmelaugh's set-up has a bottom intake. If you look at the pictures of his set-up you can see that. I am not sure what kind Skinnee had. Also, I have had the nanofluid running in my WC system since June, 2008.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gillbot

Brinell hardness has zero to do with wear. If you can cut steel with pure water, which i'm positive water "softer" than steel, what the hell does brinell hardness have to do with anything?

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Because Brinell scale measurement measures the indentation ability of a material. The virtual hardness of water is massively increased in cutting machines in jets.

I'd rather use this than some white tubing as there's always certain advantages when you can actually see the coolant.

Nice testing, but I'd also like to see some passive rad tests:up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

I really don't have an answer for the 3M question. I don't think 3M really does any sort of cooling stuff. DowTherm does, but their niche is not electronic cooling. Also, this nanofluid stuff is new technology, maybe they just haven't gotten around to it yet. We were lucky that we had the Air Force to sponsor us.
I appreciate all the questions and comments - it keeps us honest.

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3M makes FlourInert and HydroFlouroEther. Both are completely non-conductive. And used to directly cool electronic components and motors.

Both do not cool as well as water, but are a necessity in some applications. But then again in those applications you can use a refrigeration system and a heat exchanger.

Speaking of which, my AC guy should be here soon to fix my refrigerator for just that application.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorinert

3M makes almost everything. :rofl:

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Originally Posted by Lagaaja

I'd rather use this than some white tubing as there's always certain advantages when you can actually see the coolant.

Nice testing, but I'd also like to see some passive rad tests:up:

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We've been trying to get some passive radiator testing done. But, we need a radiator that has fins that run up and down as opposed to left and right. When we find one of those we will give it a go.

Thanks for the info on 3M - I had no idea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

We've been trying to get some passive radiator testing done. But, we need a radiator that has fins that run up and down as opposed to left and right. When we find one of those we will give it a go.

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Now you ask for one... just threw away one about 4 days ago that would have been perfect for what you wanted (already had it modded for pc use too).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

We've been trying to get some passive radiator testing done. But, we need a radiator that has fins that run up and down as opposed to left and right. When we find one of those we will give it a go.

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Just turn the rad around....:rofl: Yeah I know I am a smartass!

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Originally Posted by Sadasius

Just turn the rad around....:rofl: Yeah I know I am a smartass!

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actually, well...I will let you figure that one out..:)

I have an update on the subject of Nanofluid. I got a new sample (new formula) of the fluid for testing.
I decided to do a very down-to-earth practical test of the fluid this time. I used it in my business PC, equipped for this purpose with a GTX 285, so that it produces a bit more heat.

Here are the components making up the loop:
- XSPC X2O 450 pump
- Watercool 360 radiator
- D-Tek Fuzion V2 (on a Q6600 @ 2.7 GHz, 1.3 V)
- EK FC-285 GTX (on a PNY GTX 285 @ stock)
- 1/2" tubing
- Some thermal probes

As you can see, the loop has a relatively underpowered pump (nice and quiet, though =) ) and a radiator that is actually a bit too small for the CPU and such a powerful GPU.

For the test, I first ran the loop with distilled water. I ran Prime95 (small FFT) and Furmark for 45 Minutes and measured the temperatures. Then, I changed to Nanofluid in the loop, did the same test and measured temperatures again. Here are the results, shown in temperature-differences between component and fluid temperatures.

http://www.abload.de/img/newnf1a8i3.jpg

As you can see, the Nanofluid does make a measurable difference, here. I must add that the error margin for this test is expected to be higher than for the tests I run on my test-bench, since I don't have the same, precise measuring tools in my working PC. The results still show a positive trend, though.

I am now running my PC with the Nanofluid and intend to keep it like this for at least a few months. Then, I'll take the loop apart to see if there are any long-term impacts from using the Nanofluid.

how does this fluid get along with a d5 mag drive pump(mcp655)?
i think this might help in a matx corei7 box i'm working on.

When we did the original research we found no damage to any of equipment. We had different concentrations of different types of nanoparticles slamming into a painted copper paint at some very high velocities with no paint peeling etc. Earlier Skinnee had reported about some staining..we only had that problem with the copper nanofluid, but that was due to the surfactant. We have been working on that, and I asked both Skinnee and HESmelaugh to look into that.
There shouldn't be any adverse effects to a pump.

thanks, HESmelaugh

Here are the old results and new results side by side, for anyone wanting to compare:

(old test):
http://www.abload.de/img/graphliquid2na9.jpg

(new test):
http://www.abload.de/img/newnf1a8i3.jpg


I made a few quick pics of the current loop with the Nanofluid:

http://www.abload.de/img/25y0vy.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/26f1xc.jpg

Thinking on the cooling side, wouldnt a liquid with higher density and low viscosity, lower freezing point be better? Btw, whats the freezing point?

higher density is tougher on the pump. The freezing point of the nanofluid is almost the same as water.

I cannot wait for you guys to bring this to market, any more word on that?

we are still really close. Skinnee is still working on his review, and HESmelaugh is as well. So, we will wait to see what they have to say. Soon. I promise you all will be the first to know tho.

*****im not bashing please understand as im ALWAYS looking for something better for my water setup and price does not matter.but what does this stuff bring to the table for watercooling guys?****



staining/buildup-
skinne-post #127

"The only major difference between distilled and nanofluid was the residue and build-up throughout the loop. Every component in the loop had residue or build-up from the nanofluid, including the funnel I used for filling."

so admitting already this stuff builds up and stains....ugh.not go0d at all.i went with fesser one pure water to not have stained tubes anymore.3 months later there still sparkling clear.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
performance- ?


Let's have a look how the Nanofluid affects the CPU-Temperature:
http://www.abload.de/img/graphcpur556.jpg

Here, we see the same effect: At lower temperatures, the Nanofluid doesn't do any better than distilled water, but at higher temperatures, we see a clear advantage of the Nanofluid.


your kidding right?clear advantage??? 40.5 - 38.9 = 1.6 diff...sorry but thats not clear advantage on this planet.on the subject of clear.i retubed my loop 3-4x now over the years because of special space age fluids etc and they ALL stain tubing.fog,haze,bleh.this milk stuff after after few months will look HORRIBLE,TRUST ME.fesser aqua pure water after 3months months,tubes look brand new and temps are awesome...pass on the milk.i would ONLY consider this stuff if proven 0 staining which skinne already admitted in post #127 "Every component in the loop had residue or build-up from the nanofluid" 1-2 degres at best and stains tubes?...




-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

heres your other tests i was staring at....


http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j11/bf2nut/nano1.jpg

cpu results

18.3 -17.6 = 0.7 .....umm? not even 1 degree diff,im sticking with stainfree fesser water here.



gpu results

20.5 -19.8 = 0.7 again not even 1 degree diff....?



http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j11/bf2nut/nano2.jpg

ok this test....nobody uses 1 fan rads here.2 min so im looking at the 2 fan rad setup test u did..

9.0 -8.9 = 0.1 !!?!?!? ummm why on earth would i(or anyone)switch to this.its def not for performance.to have white fluid that will stain my tubing in a few months?



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

im not bashing please understand as im ALWAYS looking for something better for my water setup and price does not matter.but what does this stuff bring to the table for watercooling guys?

.7 is actually pretty good if you crunch through the equations.. I already covered that tho. I only use one fan too..nice and quiet

Performance: "Clear advantage" is meant literally. It is clearly measurable that there is an advantage. I'm observing this, not passing judgement. You see a lot of people choosing one waterblock over another because of performance, yet the blocks are mostly very, very close in performance. Also, many people optimize their loops for higher flowrates even though more flow will net you only fractions of degrees in better temperatures after a certain point. In this context, I can imagine that 0.7° is an advantage worth having for some people. Ultimately, that's up to each individual to decide.

Residue: The current sample is a new one and I'm doing a long term test. So just sit back and wait. We'll see if the residue problem is still present. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just saying we don't know yet.

Why would anyone use it? In my experience, because it looks awesome. I've gotten dozens of e-Mails and PM's since I published the first review, asking about the Nanofluid. Of everyone who wrote, I think no one cared about the performance. They all just wanted cool looking white stuff in their loop.
This is also what I personally like about the NF most (as I stated in the original review).

****im not bashing please understand as im ALWAYS looking for something better for my water setup and price does not matter.but what does this stuff bring to the table for watercooling guys?***

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HESmelaugh

Performance: "Clear advantage" is meant literally. It is clearly measurable that there is an advantage. I'm observing this, not passing judgement. You see a lot of people choosing one waterblock over another because of performance, yet the blocks are mostly very, very close in performance. Also, many people optimize their loops for higher flowrates even though more flow will net you only fractions of degrees in better temperatures after a certain point. In this context, I can imagine that 0.7° is an advantage worth having for some people. Ultimately, that's up to each individual to decide.

Residue: The current sample is a new one and I'm doing a long term test. So just sit back and wait. We'll see if the residue problem is still present. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just saying we don't know yet.

Why would anyone use it? In my experience, because it looks awesome. I've gotten dozens of e-Mails and PM's since I published the first review, asking about the Nanofluid. Of everyone who wrote, I think no one cared about the performance. They all just wanted cool looking white stuff in their loop.
This is also what I personally like about the NF most (as I stated in the original review).

---

"We'll see if the residue problem is still present. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just saying we don't know yet."

whatever cooler the fluid is,whatever manf,i tired them ALL!!:shakes:.tygon 3603 is pourus aka asorbs whatever color the fluid is AFTER it dries inside the tubing.after many frustrating attempts for "cool colors" which i love very much! i had to be realistic and accept this fact: cool colors equal stainined tubes or just clear water for clear tubing.after talking ON THE PHONE to one of the engys at tygon he schooled me on staining.the man himself said "stick with a CLEAR processed water for 0 staining".i thanked him for his time and live by that rule from now on.



Adsorption, the binding of molecules or particles to a surface, must be distinguished from absorption, the FILLING OF PORES in a solid. The binding to the surface is usually weak and reversible. Just about anything including the FLUID that dissolves or suspends the material of interest is bound, but compounds with COLOR and those that have taste or odor tend to BIND strongly. Compounds that contain chromogenic groups (atomic arrangements that vibrate at frequencies in the visible spectrum) very often are strongly adsorbed on activated carbon. Decolorization by STEAMING(lol,unrealistic)can be wonderfully efficient by adsorption and with negligible loss of other materials.







somebody wanna invent something?make a NON-pouros or 0.001 pourus tubing....will sell like hotcakes




"Why would anyone use it? In my experience, because it looks awesome."

i agree %100,it looks killer (til it dries up and stains tubing) :up:


"I think no one cared about the performance."

umm the charts above are trying to prove diff?lol


***im not bashing please understand as im ALWAYS looking for something better for my water setup and price does not matter.but what does this stuff bring to the table for watercooling guys?***

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by railmeat

somebody wanna invent something?make a NON-pouros or 0.001 pourus tubing....will sell like hotcakes

---

its called neoprene tubing.

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/tyano1id3odi.html

I Honestly think you guys are hoping too much.

The greater the delta from ambient air -> coolant temp, you'll see better benifits with a heavier water.
However when your coolant is already kept within a very low delta of ambient air, then you guys are just hoping for too much.

Remember this is ambient cooling, you can only go as low as ambient.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

its called neoprene tubing.

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/tyano1id3odi.html

I Honestly think you guys are hoping too much.

The greater the delta from ambient air -> coolant temp, you'll see better benifits with a heavier water.
However when your coolant is already kept within a very low delta of ambient air, then you guys are just hoping for too much.

Remember this is ambient cooling, you can only go as low as ambient.

---

its called neoprene tubing.

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/tyano1id3odi.html


neoprene tubing looks like crap and does NOT flex without kinking(tight corners) like tygon 3603.this is why %95 of modders use it.downside is staining,fogging,hazing,looks cool for a few weeks,then looks like trash.

"I Honestly think you guys are hoping too much."


listen plz..we all seen the charts,the stuff is not meant to perform period(barely)and thats fine cause it looks really cool .i mean white fluid,how cool is that! =) got milk rig!?!?.there selling point is meant for looks?i myself think it looks killer:up:.on that note of looks great-sold!but...if it stains,hazes,fogs tubing a few weeks after filled up its pointless performance and looks wise:confused: this is my point.

***im not bashing please understand as im ALWAYS looking for something better for my water setup and price does not matter.but what does this stuff bring to the table for watercooling guys?***

if it stains the tube the same color as the liquid, I fail to see the issue, unless you're the type of person to change the color of their liquids often, or re-use tube from project to project.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by defect9

if it stains the tube the same color as the liquid, I fail to see the issue, unless you're the type of person to change the color of their liquids often, or re-use tube from project to project.

---

have u ever seen how horrible using ANY color of the rainbow stained tubing looks?:shakes: it looks horrible!!!.....its not the color,its the stained,fogged,hazed,old look u get within a few weeks.


i see in your sig your "Watercooling Initiate (in the process of sourcing all parts)" so your new to water....trust me i been watercooling a few years now used every fluid under the sun.
i replaced tubing 3-4x in the last few years and replacing tubing sux man.u will see....

1 tip if your new to watercooling-
less is more.fesser 1 purewater or distilled water with NO color drops etc drops added.keep it clean and clear.

If you dont like it then just dont use it. If you think you can make it better, then make it or recommend a process.

i personally wouldnt touch it because of the deposits. But some people want the white color coolant. I dont see the point when theres white tubing tho.

If it applies to you, then go ahead and get it, but its been in RD for almost 1 year.

But u guys are acting like u expect it to be pure gallium or something. Ur not going to get the uber thermal transfer when you got something called ambient to hold your hand.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Remember this is ambient cooling, you can only go as low as ambient.

---

That is exactly right. We aren't claiming that the nanofluid is going to lower your temp below ambient or anything like that. But, what it is going to do, and I admit the jury is still out, is going to improve your heat transfer. And, what that means is that when your WC loop is maxing out because of all the stuff you are trying to keep cool instead of adding another radiator and more fans and possibly another pump, you can use the nanofluid.
Now, if you want to look at the big picture, what we have been looking at is server rooms that being water cooled. From our lab tests we found almost a 20% increase in heat transfer, which translates into 20% less power needed to maintain the same temps, which further translates into almost a 20% decrease in decibel noise. When you think about a 20% savings in power consumption for the cooling aspects of a room of servers it starts to add up. And, just from a noise aspect, running a fan/pump 20% less is nice.
And, as NaeKuh, mentioned, the settling is/was a problem. That was the main thing we were trying to fix. The only thing that has shown us anything positive so far is a simple 'wait and see' experiment in which we placed a clear bottle of the nanofluid on a shelf to see if anything would settle out. And, after a few months it still looks pretty good. Of course, just by gravity it will settle out. But, we tried to match the buoyancy of water with the nanoparticle as close as possible. As a result, we think that with constant motion it won't be able settle. What I hope Skinnee can say is whether or not it is better or worse; we are trying to improve the stuff. At the same time, some pump set-ups have dead zones - the intake might be in the side meaning that below the intake might be a dead zone that will allow some settling. We have to wait and see on that. Both of my home computers do not have that, but my old WC pump does have that and did have some settling. HESmelaugh's intake was at the bottom, so I doubt he will see anything, but I am not 100% sure. That is why we have people like the people on here test this stuff for us..total honest and unbiased results.

Just one thing I want to clarify here:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by railmeat

"I think no one cared about the performance."

umm the charts above are trying to prove diff?lol

---

I do reviews/tests, not marketing.

I don't try to prove or disprove anything. I try to accurately measure things.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HESmelaugh

I do reviews/tests, not marketing.

I don't try to prove or disprove anything. I try to accurately measure things.

---

Well said Shane, just because we post our findings and have all sorts of brands people interprit our actions in such wild ways. We're testers, we don't make a dime from products we test, we just post the data logged and our reaction/impression of the product. Not everyone is going to like each product we test or our opinion of it. It is when those opinions differ that folks start flinging mud.

Keep on testing Shane! :up:



Ok, the staining... that happened with the original formula (before careful of quoting outdated posts) which to my knowledge only went to a handful of folks. I have three formulas sitting next to me about to each be put in a tube to sit stagnant until I complete the full on testing. Sitting stagnant should show the worst possible staining...or atleast I think--and some other fluids will be done this way as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by railmeat

have u ever seen how horrible using ANY color of the rainbow stained tubing looks?:shakes: it looks horrible!!!.....its not the color,its the stained,fogged,hazed,old look u get within a few weeks.


i see in your sig your "Watercooling Initiate (in the process of sourcing all parts)" so your new to water....trust me i been watercooling a few years now used every fluid under the sun.
i replaced tubing 3-4x in the last few years and replacing tubing sux man.u will see....

1 tip if your new to watercooling-
less is more.fesser 1 purewater or distilled water with NO color drops etc drops added.keep it clean and clear.

---

feser water is overpriced distilled, but i would get it, if distilled or de-ionized is unavailable.

and as for your tubing issues, masterkleer solves that, at least for me it did. it's been 6 months and the blue dye i had didn't get into the tubing, it's still like new.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skinnee

Well said Shane, just because we post our findings and have all sorts of brands people interprit our actions in such wild ways. We're testers, we don't make a dime from products we test, we just post the data logged and our reaction/impression of the product. Not everyone is going to like each product we test or our opinion of it. It is when those opinions differ that folks start flinging mud.

Keep on testing Shane! :up:

---

Agreed. I think it's very important to keep the distinction between marketing and testing in mind.
There's also a big difference in perception between a consumer and a tester. As a consumer, it's fairly normal to be emotional about products and brands and to have your favourites etc. As a tester, you have to step back from all that. If a manufacturer produces something awful, I will point this out in a test. If they then produce something great next, I will also point this out. I can't be holding a grudge or generalizing ("manufacturer X always produces crap") as a tester.

Quote:

---

Ok, the staining... that happened with the original formula (before careful of quoting outdated posts) which to my knowledge only went to a handful of folks. I have three formulas sitting next to me about to each be put in a tube to sit stagnant until I complete the full on testing. Sitting stagnant should show the worst possible staining...or atleast I think--and some other fluids will be done this way as well.

---

Good idea. Bundymania did a test like this for some color additives a while back and the differences in staining showed very well.

I have it, have had for about 2 months.
I havent checked to see if there is any staining, will do that maybe in another month or so i guess.

I have the (so-called) clear shistuff, its kind cloudy looking but i just wanted
to try it as its suppose to be good to below freezing as i used it in conjunction
with my phase cooler. Its currently used 24/7 for a HTPC:shakes:

Its running in my same old Q66, NB, and 2 4770,s all watercooled with 2 ST 220
rads on a ST 355 pump and XSPC res. top in a single loop.

For any one interested in staining i will also post what i find inside after another
month or maybe when HES does his.

:shrug:

havent heard any news on this stuff in a while. i was wondering when it will reach the market

we hope to have it on the market at the end of the month/early Feb.

www.icedragoncooling.com

check this out:

http://tech.icrontic.com/articles/th...s-of-ces-2010/

I honestly don't know where they got the info from, but cool none-the-less

Don't understand this - I have tried that fluid and I got no better temperature with it vs. distilled water. Other tests also back up my findings :shrug:

I agree, I only get about 1.5 degree difference, but I am only cooling my CPU. I also have the latest batch. I don't know what batch you tested..or when.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by relttem

I agree, I only get about 1.5 degree difference, but I am only cooling my CPU. I also have the latest batch. I don't know what batch you tested..or when.

---

1,5 degree C in favour of water ?

yeah, I get a 1.5 favor over water. That is what I was showing at the CES show. It also depends on your rig.. There are a lot of variables that go into it. But, as I mentioned, I have no idea where they go the 3-4 degrees. I promise I didnt say that..plus, both of our test set-ups were right there.

I got about two degrees higher temp with nanofluid in three setups - worthless and extremely overprized is my word on nanofluid.

what nanofluid did you use? It wasnt ours..we aren't even selling it yet?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by relttem

what nanofluid did you use? It wasnt ours..we aren't even selling it yet?

---

ahh so you test your own "nanofluid" ??? really thrustworthy... :D

mine nanofluid came frome pcp's - totally worthless stuff

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Main

ahh so you test your own "nanofluid" ??? really thrustworthy... :D

mine nanofluid came frome pcp's - totally worthless stuff

---

did you even read this thread? it starts with independent tests.

i assume the stuff you are using was http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...ducts_id=25157 which afaik is very different from the icedragon coolant

thanks for clearing that up..

rock on..

Norway does have some good black/death metal these days

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by relttem

thanks for clearing that up..

rock on..

Norway does have some good black/death metal these days

---

jupp deathmetal - more than the world know about really - click my floorlaughing smilie.. tells you some about Norway

anyway - if ur stuff "different" I welcome that :)

oh well now I read almost the whole thread :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by relttem

I don't think 3M really does any sort of cooling stuff.

---

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorinert


And you should really consider calling it something else than nanofluid, look at me - I tought it was the "other" fluid this thread was about

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Main

jupp deathmetal - more than the world know about really - click my floorlaughing smilie.. tells you some about Norway

anyway - if ur stuff "different" I welcome that :)

oh well now I read almost the whole thread :)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorinert


And you should really consider calling it something else than nanofluid, look at me - I tought it was the "other" fluid this thread was about

---

From my experiences with nanofluids; if it is not opaque it is not a nanofluid. That is the first thing I look for when someone else claims to have a nanofluid. If I can see through it, it is a bunch of bs..hail satan

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by relttem

From my experiences with nanofluids; if it is not opaque it is not a nanofluid. That is the first thing I look for when someone else claims to have a nanofluid. If I can see through it, it is a bunch of bs..hail satan

---

oh well :ROTF:

Hope you don't planning $50 for the litre - as the other "nanofluid" costs

Main, did Ice Dragon send you a sample? Or are you referring to the Fluid XP nanofluid stuff?

I'll also ask again, are you the Main from Hardforum that was banned?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skinnee

Main, did Ice Dragon send you a sample? Or are you referring to the Fluid XP nanofluid stuff?

---

I was refferring to the fluidxp

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skinnee

I'll also ask again, are you the Main from Hardforum that was banned?

---

No I'm not

It seems that your nanofluid has a slightly greater ability to absorb heat than distilled water. The nanofluid seems to have a resistance to biologic fouling and seems to perform better as more heat is generated within the loop. For example, having a cpu & northbridge cooled by a 240 rad, then add a vid card. The nanofluid can handle the extra heat generated by the vid card, without compromising cpu/nb temps. Please correct me if I'm wrong on this point.

What is your nanofluids electrical capacitance, conductivity and ability to short out electronics as compared to distilled water? Be great to have a similar liquid to distilled water in regard to heat adsorption capacity that would not short out your kit in the event of a leak.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sirheck

I have it, have had for about 2 months.
I havent checked to see if there is any staining, will do that maybe in another month or so i guess.

I have the (so-called) clear shistuff, its kind cloudy looking but i just wanted
to try it as its suppose to be good to below freezing as i used it in conjunction
with my phase cooler. Its currently used 24/7 for a HTPC:shakes:

Its running in my same old Q66, NB, and 2 4770,s all watercooled with 2 ST 220
rads on a ST 355 pump and XSPC res. top in a single loop.

For any one interested in staining i will also post what i find inside after another
month or maybe when HES does his.

:shrug:

---

That's an interesting set-up. Is the Q6600 a SLACR GO? What's you're voltage on the cpu and what clocks are you running the Q6600 at? What clocks / voltage are the 4770's running at?

Also what are your cpu / vid card temps under 100% load stress?

Thanks.

Wonder how long time until the effect wears off, or if its just permanent

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mech0z

Wonder how long time until the effect wears off, or if its just permanent

---

Are you refering to the nanofluid's ability to absorb heat? If that's what you're referring to, the ability to absorb heat is a physical property of the liquid that is specific to that liquid. It is not a temporary effect.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sailindawg

That's an interesting set-up. Is the Q6600 a SLACR GO? What's you're voltage on the cpu and what clocks are you running the Q6600 at? What clocks / voltage are the 4770's running at?

Also what are your cpu / vid card temps under 100% load stress?

Thanks.

---

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/b...IME9538GHZ.png

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/b...dof2009005.jpg

Both of the 4770,s were overclocked as high as they could go under
ATI tool, 900/1000. I am now running a single 4890 video card
as i gave one of the 4770,s away .

Which was a mistake as the 4770,s in CF outperformed the single
4890 by a pretty good margin:(

I re-used the same Nano fluid after i swapped out the video cards.
Everything was clean after about 6 months of use. :)

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=242249

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skinnee

I'll also ask again, are you the Main from Hardforum that was banned?

---

Of course he isn't, skinnee.....you know there are TONS of people from Norway that use Main as their handle.

:rolleyes:


Of course, with both exhibiting the same attitude, typing and writing style, I can understand how one could become confused. LOL!

@SirHeck,

That's interesting. But do you realize that this thread is not about the FluidXP product?

I do like the idea of a fluid for cooling that does have the potential for biologic fouling, can be used for an extended period and has very good heat absorbing properties. I'm currently using distilled water plus Petra's PT Nuke, a cpu block, pump and a 240 rad / res combo. No separate reservoir. I like the simplicity of it, no bling, just very good and simple liquid cooling. The one draw back is pump speed. I have a D5 vario and anything higher than 3, puts a lot of air into the loop. A separate larger res would help to keep the air out of the loop at higher pumps speeds. I recently purchased one of Swiftech's MCR Drive 360 Rads. The slightly higher heat absorption capacity of the nanofluid could help a lot in a very simple loop. Simple in that there is no larger separate res and a smaller volume of liquid coolant.

So far the distilled water loop is fine. After 12 months, there's no fouling, temps are very good and the loop water is clear. Distilled is cheap and readily available where I live. I may have already found the ideal coolant.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sailindawg

@SirHeck,

That's interesting. But do you realize that this thread is not about the FluidXP product?

I do like the idea of a fluid for cooling that does have the potential for biologic fouling, can be used for an extended period and has very good heat absorbing properties. I'm currently using distilled water plus Petra's PT Nuke, a cpu block, pump and a 240 rad / res combo. No separate reservoir. I like the simplicity of it, no bling, just very good and simple liquid cooling. The one draw back is pump speed. I have a D5 vario and anything higher than 3, puts a lot of air into the loop. A separate larger res would help to keep the air out of the loop at higher pumps speeds. I recently purchased one of Swiftech's MCR Drive 360 Rads. The slightly higher heat absorption capacity of the nanofluid could help a lot in a very simple loop. Simple in that there is no larger separate res and a smaller volume of liquid coolant.

So far the distilled water loop is fine. After 12 months, there's no fouling, temps are very good and the loop water is clear. Distilled is cheap and readily available where I live. I may have already found the ideal coolant.

---

Sounds like you need to add a little water to your loop :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by warriorpoet

Sounds like you need to add a little water to your loop :)

---

That's what I thought initially as well. The system is pretty topped with water. What seems to happen with the rad / res combo, at higher pump speeds there is a high degree of turbulence. The built in res of the rad does not have enough time to equalize the higher flow. What starts happening is lots of small bubbles start forming water starts to get aerated.

If I had a seperate res, the res would function to equalize the flow and remove some of the turbulence from the higher pump flow.

To remove bubbles from my loop, I squeeze the hose before the pump to remove bubbles. What has caught my attention with this nanofluid, is the slightly higher capacity to absorb heat than water. This coolant shows potential for a simple loop as I run.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by relttem

I honestly never thought of it because I had thought that the pumps were all sealed bearings. But, when you mentioned ceramic bearings and water being used as a lubricant I thought about the pump manufacture that is making that set-up must have taken into consideration metal particles in the water; due to tightening of fittings, micro shavings from the block that weren't cleaned out..etc etc..and, for people that just use tap water in their system, eating up the bearings. They would have had to think of a way to get past that. One easy one would be to make the bearing harder than typical metals. That is why I thought that the ceramic bearings are probably harder than the metal. But, again, I will look into that some more.

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I dont think this would be any issue in a D5 from what I remember seeing on the inside of mine. The "bearing" is more of a ball on a point. It doesnt move or anything. The impeller of the D5 has an indentation that sits ontop of that ball.

I only use tap water in my system (distilled is pointless) , always have and have never had any problems with my pumps. Ive been known to use prestone antifreeze in small quanitys as well.


Are the temps posted idle temps? Id be interested in seeing some full load results, unless Im blind and missed it.

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Originally Posted by Jimmer411

I only use tap water in my system (distilled is pointless) , always have and have never had any problems with my pumps. Ive been known to use prestone antifreeze in small quanitys as well.

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What...?

Distilled = non-conductive
tap water = conductive

As long as you don't have leaks its fine. You get a leak and you might not survive it.. Besides, its $4 for 10L here and I know its ion free.

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Originally Posted by ahmad

What...?

Distilled = non-conductive
tap water = conductive

As long as you don't have leaks its fine. You get a leak and you might not survive it.. Besides, its $4 for 10L here and I know its ion free.

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see in UK tap water makes sense ass its nearly £20 for 5l :(