A Good Amusing Must-Read (if you like intarweb debates!)

btw Top Nurse welcome to xc liquid cooling section


ranker, there's a philippine term we call "Pikon" for statements made by RickCain...
can't find english translation yet, will research some more.;..

septim,

"Pikon," in Tagalog? Like in "Galit" ? as in a guy who easily gets angered and gets upset often? (rest of you... Pikon is derived from piqued.. as in upset)

Sounds just like me !! :)

FANBOYISM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!




<<<runs and hides -:sofa:

top nurse... what you dont get is if people asks for TOP PERFORMACE dont recomend AC because there is no performance in AC products the top of rads are themorchill pa series the top in pumps are iwaki and the top in blocks are from dtek swiftech and cathar and i can assure you i could build a dead silent loop without AC parts you just have to use common sense and all the info that is in this forum will help you to achieve that...

the only thing you might argue with me is the control unit from AC but as ranker posted there are other solutions

why i should get products with subpar performance with "looks" and expensive to get in this side of the world , when there are a lot better alternatives???

“Pikon” is a useful Tagalog word meaning something like “bad loser”

lucky ian for him you werent there [H]

using left hand to type is a chore. right hand carrying sick baby to sleep. slight fever while teething i think...

Sorry for the teething, Septim.

Be assured its perfectly normal and will pass over. Do watch for the ears.. because teething usually comes along with ear pulling.. and you know what's next...

arg he's pulling my ears.... gud nyt guys and gals...

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Originally Posted by septim

arg he's pulling my ears.... gud nyt guys and gals...

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HAHAHA welcome to parenthood :-P.

ranker,

The next time I'm in the Washington area, I think I'll buy you lunch :) Dude, go pick on someone your intellectual equivalent, please :)

You see, you probably interned around room 202A of the Cannon House Office Building, and I'm an avid donor to the RNC. Yes, I even have a personalized signed and numbered autographed from W. Even then, we can agree to disagree and still have a constructive, logical debate and then toast to drinks afterwards.

These guys are something else. If they disagree, you become the enemy !

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Originally Posted by buffbiff21

To be honest, I saw that thread when it was on pg 5 and was going to comment on how much the topic had swayed. I was thinking of just saying: "guys let's just help the thread starter."

It's really ridiculous. I recall seeing rickcain's post here: (though not in the same thread, it still reeks of BS): http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?...post1031101126
I mean, what the hell is he talking about? :confused:

Ranker, I think you need to give [H]ardforum a break man. :rofl:

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I'm not sure what he's talking about, but I'd love to see a 100% overclock on stock cooling.

wow. internet is serious business

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Originally Posted by RickCain

Are you saying that because you can't afford it or just don't understand what it is?



Yes and it is true, which is not a bad thing. Just when you see XS in the e-news, it is regarding some insane overclock with LN2 or Phase that just broke an overclocking or 3dmark record. Am I wrong?

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mmmm cant afford it, i think in my loop case it would be the other way around. Because i can afford this:

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0721.jpg

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0718.jpg



AS for the reason why idont buy AC. Because i can get FAR better, for FAR LESS.

We live in a capitalistic world. Given my CPU's and systems are excessive, at least they can live up to the reputation KING of performance.

AC can only live by what? KING of looks? Im sorry, why would you want to drive a Lambo with a civic engine? If your dropping 700 dollars on a complete H2O system, wouldnt you expect the car to do 0-60 in sub 2 sec?

You can have that yaris you guys were talking about. We may get to the same destination at the same time, however, i will be with some uber hot chick, to the same destination, while most likely you will be with your mom.


im also with ranker 100&#37; at this. AC products just arent worth the price. The only people who should even be looking at the coolplex XT DI, is people like me with RD-30's or dual DDC-2.


Also dont even start saying my system is subpar to AC. I'll kill it at any temperature, any config.


In Fact, i think i'll go post over there and help ranker out a bit. Usually my pictures end the discussion over at Anandtech.

Ouch :) Naekuh strikes back ! :)

this $hit cracks me up....

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

mmmm cant afford it, i think in my loop case it would be the other way around. Because i can afford this:

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I think its safe to say someone got::owned: :party:

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Originally Posted by hoax

or beer...could have a nice drain valve:

http://www.breworganic.com/ProductImages/kegs/Sanke.jpg

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Something interesting in this thread after all :D :eek: :toast: :toast2:

Oh incase you want RAW numbers here:

100&#37; loaded kentsfield @ 1.475 bios
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/NewTemps.jpg

My 3.75ghz validation /w old h2o loop. It was subpar to my current one:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...omorla/3-1.jpg

My favorate, OMFG APOGEE GTX Pwnerz pic:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p.../ApogeeGTX.jpg


those numbers look good to me on a custom setup. I dont see good numbers on the AC yet. :T

Care to post?


BTW, welcome to liquid cooling! We take things seriously here.


oh incase your wondering, That is the legendary RD-30 you guys were talking about. And yes i was the one that lead the second wave in getting them. I wanted a Cathar G5, but there impossible to find. So i got the next most expensive thing.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0658.jpg


You wanna still say the AC product will be better then my PA120.3 + RD-30 on yates DH, in push/pull config, off a ApogeeGTX bowed.

Because if you can prove to me its better, i have about 1200 i can drop. But i dont see the point in it. If i wanted all that pretty stuff, id get an astek. Or even better, id drop 500 on newls1 and have him design me a OMGWTFBBQ external case, which would put that AC to shame.

But thats how things work in XS. If it hasnt been done excessively yet, its bound to happen soon.

Look at iany and his WCG farm. EXCESSIVE!!

:P

Reminds me of the "Mother of all Battles" :)

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Originally Posted by stormshadow

wow. internet is serious business

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OT: one more day to eps 127 :D

<<<<<looks up as he hears the rounds passing over head...............

"I feel sorry for the sorry S.o.B. on the receiving end."

Shock and Awe :D

wow the admins are taking a long time activing my account over at [H]


i dont want to sound like a :banana::banana::banana::banana:. But honestly i would like to hear the guys over at AC answer my questions.

i think i answered them all in my posts:

did it increase my overclocking: yes i got 3.75 while i could normally only do 3636

Did the benifit do anything?
I think a intel engineer once said, every 10C you drop your temps off your load on your cpu, you effectivly double the life of the processor. <-- i dont know where this link and proof went. I had one posted at Anandtech. Im considered the nikhsub1 over there incase you want to know.

Was it worth it?
Hells yeah, lets see you drop a overclocked quad kentsfield on that AC system. Can we hear crying??? i think i do when i see the load temps in the upper mid 60's when you overclock that system near my specs.

So lets do the math from a financial standpoint: mid 60's to low 50's thats about a 15C coretemp reduction. A bit wayyyyyyy more then your 3-5C.

PS, you guys are looking at coretemp correct? because if your using the bios monitor. You guys need to take overclocking101 all over again. Your way behind the technology. Even Iany's upgraded his method section in his overclocks. :rofl:

So PLEASE show me something that would merit the 600 dollar price tag on that radiator unit alone. Im dying to see why you guys are going on and on about this product.

PS. im actually interested in a coolplex XT DI. But i would only put it on my RD-30. I dont think ANY of you guys over there can say my same statement.

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Originally Posted by Top Nurse

Very well said and totally true. I have noticed that most of the people here are pretty informative and don't have axes to grind. I will listen in again now that I'm back. I have been playing around with the idea of running an alcohol chilled loop.

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LOL. If only they read posts you've made about XS people... kudos for the PR attempt.

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ranker,

The next time I'm in the Washington area, I think I'll buy you lunch Dude, go pick on someone your intellectual equivalent, please

You see, you probably interned around room 202A of the Cannon House Office Building, and I'm an avid donor to the RNC. Yes, I even have a personalized signed and numbered autographed from W. Even then, we can agree to disagree and still have a constructive, logical debate and then toast to drinks afterwards.

These guys are something else. If they disagree, you become the enemy !

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Most of the time, as people age, they become conservatives. You know what they say, "if you aren't a liberal when you're young, you're heartless. If you aren't conservative when you get old, you're stupid." I still love you anyway Iany. One of my closest confidants I made up on the Hill happened to be a republican.

I believe everyone is entitled to their own opinion and their way to live their lifestyle. The only thing that really ticks me off is when people are misled. In this specific issue over on [H] I feel as if people are being misled solely for the satisfaction of the people who own AC products.

I'm still waiting for Top Nurse, Rick, Aqua-PCs, Slame, Shoggy to back up their misinformation with some facts.

Aqua Pcs in regards to a complete AC setup vs a D-Tek CPU, Swiftech GPU/Chipset setup, DDC-2 pumps:

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Originally Posted by Aqua-Pcs

My vote would have to be Aqua-Computer putting a block side by side AC wins all the way...

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Here Aqua-Pcs spreads more FUD stating that D-Tek/Swiftech blocks won't benefit from the Aquaero. The Aquaero is not limited to use with only AC waterblocks. I'm surprised an owner of a store who claims to have years of experience and be completely objective in his advice can make such a faulty claim.

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Originally Posted by Aqua-Pcs

AC would also be a good choice in that matter as all the components will integrate with the aquaero and muiltiswitch mentioned whereas the D-tek products will not.

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After debunking their initial claims I offer them a challenge:

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Originally Posted by Ranker

My challenge remains the same, find a well established review site that conducts objective testing for performance that puts the AC cpu block ahead of either the D-Tek Fuzion or the Apogee GTX.

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What followed was more spin, more BS, and nothing to back up their claims that AC was better/as good as a D-Tek/GTX block.

An excerpt for more misinformation from Top Nurse. She decides to rail on the suggested alternative T-Balancer/BigNG and claims that Aquaero was the first revolutionary product that let one control pumps and fans... gee The T-Balancer was released in 2004. I wonder what company came first. Stick to the facts please TN. Aquaero is the one good thing from AC, but please don't make stuff up.

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Originally Posted by Top Nurse

They made a hardware/software controller for the Laing pumps that interfaces with the AquaSuite some 6 months ago.

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Ahh so Shoggy, an AC representative, begins the 3C mantra as the difference between an all AC setup vs a setup consisting of the top performance parts.. and of course begins to rail on the USA. I'm sorry Shoggy, but there are many countries out there that use non-AC products so let's not turn this into "My country is better than yours HAHA" type of poop fest.
[QUOTE]

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Originally Posted by Shoggy

...don't really care about its performance because you know it doesn't really matter if your CPU runs 3°C higher or lower.

I think it's also no secret that the most people over here make fun of the widely common garden-tube-systems with their killer-pumps in the USA :D

Well, why do some people drive a luxus car for $50.000 and others a simple car for $5.000? In fact both have four wheels and will bring me from A to B ;)

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...except in this case the $5,000 performs better than the $50,000 car. If a Pinto beat out a BMW M3 and costs $5,000 vs $50,000... I wonder what's the better investment.

So Slame, another AC representative, FINALLY responds to my challenge of finding a review that puts AC ahead of a D-Tek/Swiftech/DDC solution ...by claiming that reviews are all biased. I guess if you can't man up with the proof, you attack the question itself right?

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Originally Posted by slame

My personal oppinion on reviews is ...

as long as i didn´t do the review on my own i don´t trust them. There are some actual examples out there showing what i mean. Take a look who is sponsor of a site and think again about reviews. I don´t mean any special site with this oppinion, but i know that there are so many "mistakes" while testing.

We do our own testing but don´t show them public. If the cooler wouldn´t perform good there would be no release.


Some more about testing.

1. you need to have the same room temperature on all tests.
2. no whiffs allowed
3. the pressure on the processor needs to be the same on every cooler
4. thermal compound needs to be the same everytime
5. error ratio on temperatures

and on and on and on, i could do this for hours

See .. it´s nearly impossible for any amateur / semipro site to do serious testing. and if u only have one "mistake" the results will differ a lot.


and btw ... i don´t care about flow ratio

my rig ...

airplex evo 360
airplex evo 240
airplex evo 1800
2 aquadrives
cuplex XT
ABIT OTES voltage regulator cooler
2 ramplex
2 small ABIT voltage regulator coolers
1 NB twinplex
1 SB twinplex
2 aquatubes
1 aquapower
1 aquagratix1900 core pro

and the pump ? is an aquastream on standard flow

CPU is a Core2Duo6600 and it runs with 3600 Mhz. i can also overclock it up to 4000 Mhz stable

The temperature is max 55° C

so who cares about flow rates. flow rates are overrated as hell.

gimme the same rig and worse temperature .. i overclock higher

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...Not sure what the "gimme the same rig..." statement is supposed to say. But I assume he's saying, AC can overclock higher.

Welcome here, Top Nurse :) Glad you are here and we will all get to know each other in due course :)

:horse:

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Originally Posted by nikhsub1

:horse:

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It's still wiggling and spreading misinformation.

Time to get back to beating it. *pulls out club*

<<<<Reclines back on the nearest rise and watches the light who in the distance.

Enjoying a cold drink.

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Originally Posted by nikhsub1

:horse:

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The only thing that needs to be beaten are AC owners. Everyone who owns aquacomputer watercooling (especially that 560 dollar monstrosity that probably performs worse than a single BIP /w yate) should be rounded up and bashed over the head with whiffle bats for as many hours as it takes for them to come to their senses.

This is like the gladiator pit.

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Originally Posted by afireinside

The only thing that needs to be beaten are AC owners. Everyone who owns aquacomputer watercooling (especially that 560 dollar monstrosity that probably performs worse than a single BIP /w yate) should be rounded up and bashed over the head with whiffle bats for as many hours as it takes for them to come to their senses.

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LOL. Thanks for the laugh. Lacrosse sticks and other assorted club like objects would work too.

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Originally Posted by IanY

This is like the gladiator pit.

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Nah, THIS.. IS.. SPARTAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!

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Originally Posted by IanY

This is like the gladiator pit.

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i think he ran back to [H] forums to dig up answers to the next wave of questions.

These are valid questions. If the block does perform better, then hell, i was looking at a 300 dollar G5 block, a 90 dollar Coolplex XT DI is chump change compared to it.


Also, If we look back at the storm, we can tell it performs absolutely terribly on a quadcore. The CoolplexXT which is a storm knockoff, will not be adaqut for a quad. The Double Impact has a much larger cooling zone, however, i would assume the recycled water on the second jets would hurt the second cooling area.

I think someone said it b4, it could of been done with a single larger jet, and no need to add uber restrictions with the double jet. This was just added bling.

If i honestly wanted bling, i would get that new koolance unit. 5 inigrated Pumps is :shocked:

Now thats bling...


However i dont think it would perform near par to my current layout. But hell, if were looking at bling.
http://www.koolance.com/shop/product...roducts_id=372


Ahhh... thats yummy if you could take it apart and mod the unit. But at 1400 dollars its 200 dollars shy of my budget. :shrug:


WOW someone get the admins over there to activate my account.

Its taking forever....

Us silly Americans don't value silence... at least according to AC reps. Hmm, wonder why undervolted Yates and Thermochill PA's are so popular..

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Originally Posted by Shoggy

Originally Posted by slame View Post
3. watercooling is for silence, thats what we think.

And here we have the main difference between the German and the American market

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ikellensbro points out wonderfully that tube size does matter. He points out that if you view the chart below, just going from 1/4" to 3/8" a delta of 2.5C is seen. Not to mention it shows various 'noob' ware kits like the Aquamini Gate beating out AC. Hmmm... I wonder how much difference would really be if we extrapolate that data to C2D's in an AC vs Best of the Best matchup.
http://www.systemcooling.com/images/...XT/image28.gif

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Originally Posted by ikellensbro

Slame, 55*C is...awful by this forum's standards. is your e6600 rated for even higher temperatures? Sure, but just like a car (ah, more car analogies), you don't run a car at redline 24/7. With a less restrictive loop with better performing components, you could likely see temperatures in the 40's at worst, which should give you more OC headroom. Cooler chips have longer lives and (more importantly in this forum) higher OC potential. Is this the case for everyone? No, but there's a reason why world records are set on LN2, and the highest 24/7 OCs are done on phase change. Every chip is different, but you're holding yourself back choosing to go low flow? How much? Could be nothing, could be several hundred MHz.

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The master of misinformation here makes his claim for Low Flow = High Flow, which was proven false earlier by ikellensbro and others. However, one must admire his false courage in defending an indefensible position. And then he decides to show off his wallet e-peen by saying his Aquaduct360 costs more than my rig. Sad part is, my rig would kill his and is cheaper to boot. Hell almost two of my loops would be cheaper than his Aquaduct360 and still perform better without dealing with the external monstrosity.

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

the sad part is your "performance" can be match with smaller tubing and far less loops. Just a fact of life I learned years ago while watercooling. And trust me you don't spend alot considering one Aquaduct360 cost more than 90% of your cooling equipment across your three loops and doesn't require two cases welded together to fit. ;)

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Rick is at it again. Now he claims we get less since we pay less. I hate to break it to him, but we get more AND pay less. He keeps flip flopping on his definition of "value". In his mind its correct to overpay for AC gear and get less performance because in the end... we get more?

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

See I would rather buy one device that can do it all than rely on four sub companies to get my task completed. That is the great part of having choice and I am a firm believer you get what you pay for. Three things typically happen to the bargin shopper:

1. Pay less and get less
2. End up paying more to get what they really wanted
3. Complain about price before even understanding what it is

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When asked about his reasons in participating in this thread, Rick states that his goal is to keep me in check because of my made up system and the things I pretend to own. Someone must be running out of misinformation as the personal attacks on myself are ramping up!

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

Actually it is to make sure people with sig files full of e-penis don't over run this forum. You can tell by the incredible detail in your sig you want instant respect based on some text. I would venture to guess you are one of those guys who reads alot, trys very little but have the opinion of a genious (and narrow minded). I would have much more respect if you actually tried 1/8th of the hardware you bash.

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The OP, whom posed the initial question, has made his decision and strikes back at the AC fan club:

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Originally Posted by Narisatu

R1cK, question for you. Why would you enter into watercooling with just whatever companies are trying to push on you, instead of doing research in forums like this, asking other peoples opinions, and then starting your own opinions off of those? Then, once you get into it with good equipment, drawing your own conclusions from your own testing, or use, but all the while building off of the things that other people told you.

I bet the only reason you got into AC was because someone convinced you that AC was 'better' than anything else...

They each have their place. Low flow is great for passive/silent cooling, High flow is performance oriented (and dont give me BS about how flow doesnt make much of a difference. you know it does, though not much, it does make a difference. and dont make a comment that performance is a relative term either, it isnt. Silence, and looks are relative, to the individual, but performance is not, performance is testable, and thats in how well the blocks take heat away from the parts, and how well the rad/fans take heat away from the water.)

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Finally broken, Rick cedes this point. However, in order to secure his manliness he'll continue to attack me personally and resurrect the thread again with more misinformation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

I will agree if temps are the only gauge of performance, then yes don't buy AC gear.

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Rick starts going off about how it's stupid to WC if we're looking to overclock and instead we should use Phase Change. WC should be for silence only according to Rick. Here we have an amusing response by Erasmus to his claims.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Erasmus354

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

My "wise" word of advice is not to water cool if "cooling" is the only metric as it doesn't cool as much as phase changing.......

Again, nobody wants to adress what loop is "better" if loop A and loop B give the same overclock yet are 2-3c off in temps. It's OK to be stuck on raw cooling but you have to ask yourself what is the point if you get no true performance (meaning processing 0's and 1's any faster) gains.

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You still dont get it do you (or can't read).

You cannot guarantee that the difference in cooling wont make a difference in overclock until you try it. For everyone that is not a feasible option, therefore if you are watercooling for overclock alone, the choice is simple...get that which COOLS BEST. Please stop throwing around 1000$ phase change units (and ridiculous power bills for full time usage) as if it is in competition with watercooling. You might as well offer that putting your computer on the dark side of the moon and running the cables all the way back to your desk would work better.

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The store owner/pimper of AC products starts getting involved in the poop slinging. Interesting to see a store owner stoop that low. Funny how, I rarely touch on the tubing size within the debate and mainly stick with the overpriced nature and lack of performance aspect. But hey, if you touch a man's livelihood...watch out!

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Originally Posted by Aqua-Pcs

Also if we are "Fan Boys" (and Girls ) I suppose that makes you a "Size Queen" then.

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I keep asking Rick and company to back up their AC mantra of 2-3C; it keeps getting repeated over and over as if it were some indoctrinated cult chant.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

Again, nobody wants to adress what loop is "better" if loop A and loop B give the same overclock yet are 2-3c off in temps. It's OK to be stuck on raw cooling but you have to ask yourself what is the point if you get no true performance (meaning processing 0's and 1's any faster) gains.

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I ask him to back it up and he replies in turn:

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Again, you won't address the question but that is fine. Your like a broken record man... Look at all your posts and they are the same. You just made it to my ignore list so I suggest you do the same, moving forward. I'll keep your sweet post in my sig file so I can remember what you are about.

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So when you can't back up a claim, avoid it AND make a personal attack. This is like turning into a 1 sided presidential debate. I had no idea I was even nominated!

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Originally Posted by Ranker

I'm addressing a claim you're making based upon this critically, fundamentally flawed assumption. If your assumption is grossly flawed, then your whole argument bears no merit. Even if you're misguided assumption were to be correct, Erasmus, ikellensbro, Arcygenical and others have addressed it and proven your claim to be wrong.

I guess it's better to dig one's head in the sand and ignore the voices of reason in this thread than to face the facts that many here have presented.

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The thread is then derailed by more attacks from the AC Mafia on yours truly. We finally manage to get back on topic:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ranker

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R1ckCa1n

If loop A achieves the same overclock as loop B but is 3-5c hotter, which loop give better performance?

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So it's gone from "2-3C" now to "3-5C"? Which one was it. Please be consistent.

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And, more flip flopping. ikellensbro and Erasmus proceed to debunk Rick's "theories" that include, "it doesn't matter what you own, quietness is all that matters"...that begs the question: If that were true, why even pay more for an AC product in the first place? Wouldn't a $100 TT kit be sufficient then?


Noticing the tides of the battle have change, Top Nurse and co quickly change their mantra to one of "We watercool for silence, watercooling isn't made to OC".

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Originally Posted by Top Nurse

After doing my homework I decided to buy a Koolance Exos. You should have heard the howling around here about all the same things that have already been covered in this thread. After I installed it I started using the AquaMark3D program. I was able to reach an OC on my 2600+ AMD processor that was within the top 10% of all reported OC's on water. Obviously this was within the inherent slop of the good and worst of OC processors.

So what did this prove to me? It proved what R1ck, Slame, and Shoggy have all said in this thread. That the reason to water cool is for silence as the water cooling has very little to do with the OC obtained. It also proved to me that about 80% of the BS around here is just that, BULL :banana::banana::banana::banana:!

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At this point they're flip flopping worse than a fish out of water.

LOL ranker... my waterloop would blow the aquapc in price and performance.

Uhh.. lets see...
270 dollar RD-30 + MeanWell
140 dollar PA120.3
70 dollar GTX
40 dollar DD 680i
30 dollar MCW30
60 dollars EK 250

610 dollars just on loop 1!!

I dont think i need to get onto loop 2.



So now that we got both price and performance out of the equation... Why is the aquaPC setup still better?? im still waiting for an answer from anyone that can answer this question.


oh man... me joining that thread = GG for them.

I have a whole cascade of pics i use over at Anand, to fight against these guys. IT usually shuts them up after 1 post. Or there in there back room trying to shove thre koolance in a fridge to pull lower ambient, and load temps on there exos system.

Either is fine... because all that work they needed to go though to match my temps, is all worth it. Usually they dont come back with another koolance post for a very long time.


Also there experience question to you... I have been h2o cooling for 3 yrs. Not a long time, but long enough to know whats right and whats wrong. I made a sticky on watercooling over at anand. I left parts names out of it for reasons like this. Also, who knows if the D-tek or ApogeeGTX will still be king in the next couple years. I would hate recomending a block thats been out dated for its time.

Ummm i think i worked on a total of 20 watercooled computers. I own 4 of them. My main rig is most likely the top apex in watercooling, while my NAS is most likely near the apex of quiet cooling. I played with multi pump, multi radiator design, as well as dual loop, single loop. At one point i even tried a triple loop... "looks at my poor armor" she couldnt hold it all. So i had to ditch that.

So i guess im still not qualified for that thread huh? because that guy has been building computers back when they were atari? Im sorry ive been working with lesuire suit larry series back when he was building original 80286's. My dad was most likely doing the same thing, playing with original scsi, and using dual 5 1/4 floppies.

But guess who he comes to now when he has a computer question, or needs a new rig?


That guy needs to learn technology consistantly changes. If his AMD XP style cooling is adaquit, then by gods so be it. While he's happy crusing though his stuff, its people like me that get the ghost round in CS:Source, and end up getting extra cash at start. :D

And you guys wonder how the hell some people have colts on the first round. :P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Also, If we look back at the storm, we can tell it performs absolutely terribly on a quadcore. The CoolplexXT which is a storm knockoff, will not be adaqut for a quad. The Double Impact has a much larger cooling zone, however, i would assume the recycled water on the second jets would hurt the second cooling area.

---

HEY! MY SToRM WORKS WELL ON MY QUAD!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

LOL ranker... my waterloop would blow the aquapc in price and performance.
Uhh.. lets see...
270 dollar RD-30 + MeanWell
140 dollar PA120.3
70 dollar GTX
40 dollar DD 680i
30 dollar MCW30
60 dollars EK 250
610 dollars just on loop 1!!

I dont think i need to get onto loop 2.
So now that we got both price and performance out of the equation... Why is the aquaPC setup still better?? im still waiting for an answer from anyone that can answer this question.

---

300 RD-30+Meanwell
140 PA120.3
100 MCW60X2 w/ MC14s
30$ MCW30
40$ EK150

not to mention barbs etc

I can feel your pain :-P

WOW! This is crazy that this Ranker guy is quoting people off another forum and answering it here...


I'm surprised that you guys let Ranker spout off like this. From a professional perspective I would say he has some pent up emotions that are expressing themselves in a very poor manner. However, we usually just ignore this kind of behavior and hope it blows itself out. If it doesn't he might want to consider taking a light sedative.

P.S. Do you guys have a twit list switch?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by phelan1777

HEY! MY SToRM WORKS WELL ON MY QUAD!



300 RD-30+Meanwell
140 PA120.3
100 MCW60X2 w/ MC14s
30$ MCW30
40$ EK150

not to mention barbs etc

I can feel your pain :-P

---

Damn, you guys could get phase for the same price. $400+ is starting to get stupid for water.

Used 50z - $40
Used MCR220 - $25
Used MCW6002 w/939 Hold Down - $15
New LGA775 MCW6002 Kit - $15
Tube, tline, fans, misc - $30

$125, and it pwns for CPU only lol.

Top Nurse,

Ma'am, he just presents a differing viewpoint, that's all. We have different objectives that we would like to accomplish with water cooling systems. Some view it as a hobby, to be taken to extremes, while others water cool out of necessity to maintain their sanity.




Having said that, any of you guys like to see my water cooling bill consolidated ? :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Top Nurse

WOW! This is crazy that this Ranker guy is quoting people off another forum and answering it here...


I'm surprised that you guys let Ranker spout off like this. From a professional perspective I would say he has some pent up emotions that are expressing themselves in a very poor manner. However, we usually just ignore this kind of behavior and hope it blows itself out. If it doesn't he might want to consider taking a light sedative.

P.S. Do you guys have a twit list switch?

---

Your last post was made in November of 2005. Now you have 5 posts in this thread today. There is no need to stir an already problematic thread.

Another mental giant from [H] has appeared.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Top Nurse

WOW! This is crazy that this Ranker guy is quoting people off another forum and answering it here...


I'm surprised that you guys let Ranker spout off like this. From a professional perspective I would say he has some pent up emotions that are expressing themselves in a very poor manner. However, we usually just ignore this kind of behavior and hope it blows itself out. If it doesn't he might want to consider taking a light sedative.

P.S. Do you guys have a twit list switch?

---

this ist he only way i can particpate in that thread. I cant post in it, so im basically stating things i will be reposting in that thread in hopes you will read it.

I aint bashing the coolplex XT DI until i see results on it. I actually want a silver one if they do come out on G1/4 to play with on my loop. But you havent answered any of my questions i asked here.

1. I can afford a AquaComputer setup. IRC, my setup is MORE EXPENSIVE then a aquacomputer setup.

2. My setup performs on a exponential scale compared to a Aqua Computer setup.

3. It did allow me to gain a greater overclock. Not to mention a larger headroom in cooling. IE. Summer is coming up, i DONT need to throttle her down.

4. My experience is listed carefully, and so are my qualifications. Do you want Proof of all my watercooled computers? Id be more then happy to post those pics up as well. But i think the people in this forum are already kind of sick of it.

5. Are you saying your statements out of vain itself? Because you own a aquacomputer, and its expensive, is that all your proud about? Because if thats the case, I own a RD-30! OH YEAH! unfortunately, it wont perform better then my dual DDC-2 <--- looking at nikhsub for this statement.

Its expensive, its shiny! its made of metal! Do i get a cookie?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NickS

Damn, you guys could get phase for the same price. $400+ is starting to get stupid for water.

Used 50z - $40
Used MCR220 - $25
Used MCW6002 w/939 Hold Down - $15
New LGA775 MCW6002 Kit - $15
Tube, tline, fans, misc - $30

$125, and it pwns for CPU only lol.

---

I am getting a small phase, for a 7900GTX so HA!

AND getting a naked X6800...........so i will be having more fun soon enough.................might actually get some decent Over clocks as well........


errr okay back OT...............ummm what was the Topic again?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

5. Are you saying your statements out of vain itself? Because you own a aquacomputer, and its expensive, is that all your proud about? Because if thats the case, I own a RD-30! OH YEAH! unfortunately, it wont perform better then my dual DDC-2 <--- looking at nikhsub for this statement.

Its expensive, its shiny! its made of metal! Do i get a cookie?

---

NO SIR, No cookie for you :p

Excuse me, the RD30 performs VERY WELL thank you................<<<is waiting for Nikhsub as well.

Ranker, I think you are being the hypocrite here. All this BS talk demanding proof and stuff and you are the one bashing WITHOUT real data. And no, that little chart doesn't say anything, it's comparing a very small subset of beginner kits, and there isn't even a decent US kit in there. You don't even own AC. You are boldly attacking AC without direct data! After reading 15+ pages, I still haven’t seen decent data favoring either side, it’s getting tiresome.

Even if you come up with real data of a AC block being outperformed by, say, a Fuzion, you would still not prove anything. A lot of people at HF acknowledge that they are aware that AC may be outperformed by 2-3C however they value the overall value of a AC system.

And you aren’t even reading the chart right. The 3/8” AC system performs very well per noise output when compared to the other kits, including and surprisingly the Alphacool XP-120 at 7V.

I know how you feel about HF loving AC, maybe undeservingly. But the same thing happens here in XS, people are biased towards a narrow subset of products and trash the rest, many times undeservingly. So either be fair, or choose your camp and stay with it. EDIT: and shut up. :P

hey.. my water cooling equipment alone is more expensive than most Core2Duo computers :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Its expensive, its shiny! its made of metal! Do i get a cookie?

---

Post of the day. That's funny right there, I don't care who you are.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by migueld

Ranker, I think you are being the hypocrite here. All this BS talk demanding proof and stuff and you are the one bashing WITHOUT real data. And no, that little chart doesn't say anything, it's comparing a very small subset of beginner kits, and there isn't even a decent US kit in there. You don't even own AC. You are boldly attacking AC without direct data! After reading 15+ pages, I still haven’t seen decent data favoring either side, it’s getting tiresome.

Even if you come up with real data of a AC block being outperformed by, say, a Fuzion, you would still not prove anything. A lot of people at HF acknowledge that they are aware that AC may be outperformed by 2-3C however they value the overall value of a AC system.

And you aren’t even reading the chart right. The 3/8” AC system performs very well per noise output when compared to the other kits, including and surprisingly the Alphacool XP-120 at 7V.

I know how you feel about HF loving AC, maybe undeservingly. But the same thing happens here in XS, people are biased towards a narrow subset of products and trash the rest, many times undeservingly. So either be fair, or choose your camp and stay with it.

---

what kind of real data do you need to prove that a thermochill PA120.3 would crush the AC?

Want us to pm marci, aka the owner of thermochill, to add in his comments about the radiator? Or maybe we should get cathar to list out why the coolplex XT wont work on todays quads, because its a storm design.

Even better yet, can cathar tell us his reponse to the Double Impact? Im sure he thought about this, but gave up because he thought realistically, no one will have dual DDC-2 or RD-30's in there system except extremist like me.

To be honest, i think cathar is either laughing his head off in some corner after seeing the double impact, or he's got a new inspiration for a new line which will be less restrictive then the double impact, yet cool more effiently.

Oh wait... thats called the G5!

And it would still come out a bit less for a PA120.3 + G5 + DDC-2.

about 140 + 250? thats the price i saw it when it was on sale. + 75.


hmmmmmm prestige... i think the G5 is more of a head turner to the watercooling world then a AC system is.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hard H20

Post of the day. That's funny right there, I don't care who you are.

---

AHAHAHAHAHA i always use this line on my clients. Sometimes i'll do stuff as a feduciary and not expect commission. Usually my large clients who i made a ton off commission. But when i do a free transfer, or i readjust there account to mirror market performance, sometimes as a thank you, i will say i did the exchange for you. My commission a MS. Fields While chocolate macadamein nut cookie!

One of my clients always has a box waiting for me when i see him after i said this. It was on a pun tho, but its funny to see some of my clients having a good sense of humor. And yes i love those cookies.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IanY

hey.. my water cooling equipment alone is more expensive than most Core2Duo computers :)

---

Will you adopt me, Ian? I want leet water too. :p: :rofl:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

what kind of real data do you need to prove that a thermochill PA120.3 would crush the AC?

Want us to pm marci, aka the owner of thermochill, to add in his comments about the radiator? Or maybe we should get cathar to list out why the coolplex XT wont work on todays quads, because its a storm design.

Even better yet, can cathar tell us his reponse to the Double Impact? Im sure he thought about this, but gave up because he thought realistically, no one will have dual DDC-2 or RD-30's in there system except extremist like me.

To be honest, i think cathar is either laughing his head off in some corner after seeing the double impact, or he's got a new inspiration for a new line which will be less restrictive then the double impact, yet cool more effiently.

Oh wait... thats called the G5!

And it would still come out a bit less for a PA120.3 + G5 + DDC-2.

about 140 + 250? thats the price i saw it when it was on sale. + 75.


hmmmmmm prestige... i think the G5 is more of a head turner to the watercooling world then a AC system is.

---

To really lay down the STFU on AC lovers, we need to get..

MaxxxRacer, Petra (FTW), Cathar, marci.. and a few others in here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NickS

To really lay down the STFU on AC lovers, we need to get..

MaxxxRacer, Petra (FTW), Cathar, marci.. and a few others in here.

---

NAh... after MAX read this thread.. he probably went OH HELLZ NO...

I'll leave the little people to this..

:ROTF:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Uhh.. lets see...
270 dollar RD-30 + MeanWell
140 dollar PA120.3
70 dollar GTX
40 dollar DD 680i
30 dollar MCW30
60 dollars EK 250

610 dollars just on loop 1!!

I dont think i need to get onto loop 2.

---

Naekuh,

Its sad, but I think I have you by $510 on loop one :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IanY

Naekuh,

Its sad, but I think I have you by $510 on loop one :)

---

EYEHAYCHOO!!!

:yepp:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

NAh... after MAX read this thread.. he probably went OH HELLZ NO...

I'll leave the little people to this..

:ROTF:

---

:rofl:


NaeKuh, you got sigged!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by migueld

Ranker, I think you are being the hypocrite here. All this BS talk demanding proof and stuff and you are the one bashing WITHOUT real data. And no, that little chart doesn't say anything, it's comparing a very small subset of beginner kits, and there isn't even a decent US kit in there.

---

That proves my point exactly. A < B, B < C, therefore A < C. Those beginner kits either beat or give an AC setup a run for its money. Most us here know that a performance based build including DDC/Iwaki's/Swift/D-Tek/Thermochill will absolutely destroy any "noob" level kit in performance. Through logic itself, it reveals that AC is an inferior product on not only the performance level but the price/performance level as well. That's an actual review with actual real data. I'm not sure how you can discount a solid review done by Robo Tech at System Cooling. Especially when some of the AC fan boys even recognize him and his procedures as valid and objective.

Quote:

---

You don't even own AC. You are boldly attacking AC without direct data! After reading 15+ pages, I still haven’t seen decent data favoring either side, it’s getting tiresome.

---

Do I need to walk/swim around the world to accept the fact that it's flat. No. The case stands as even AC users will grudgingly admit that their products will be 2-3C behind (and we all know its a helluva lot more) a performance based build. Upon that fact alone, my point is made that they can't recommend AC products on a price/performance platform and neither on a performance platform either. Are my argumentative techniques learned through law school confusing? I'm using their own claims and logically reasoning them to prove that they are wrong. I'm not using advanced level logic here nor astrophysics based formulas.

Quote:

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Even if you come up with real data of a AC block being outperformed by, say, a Fuzion, you would still not prove anything.

---

I have already proven the most crucial point. That AC products are not competitive at the performance level nor at the price/performance level and that their FUD/misinformation about AC being superior is unethical, especially when being suggested to uninformed people seeking advice.

Quote:

---

A lot of people at HF acknowledge that they are aware that AC may be outperformed by 2-3C however they value the overall value of a AC system.

---

It's much larger than 2-3C. A person can value whatever they want. However it's unethical for them to spread misinformation, persuade others to make ill informed decisions based on what they own, support, or use.

Quote:

---

And you aren’t even reading the chart right. The 3/8” AC system performs very well per noise output when compared to the other kits, including and surprisingly the Alphacool XP-120 at 7V.

---

Surprisingly well? I guess if you have low expectations. That chart alone shows that other kits can beat them in performance and match them in the silence department. This is something that be extrapolated towards the performance based equipment which would destroy AC in performance.

Quote:

---

I know how you feel about HF loving AC, maybe undeservingly. But the same thing happens here in XS, people are biased towards a narrow subset of products and trash the rest, many times undeservingly. So either be fair, or choose your camp and stay with it. EDIT: and shut up. :P

---

You can choose to love whatever it is that you like. It's another thing to channel your love into convincing others that one thing is superior over another based upon false claims, lack of facts & data supporting your claims and make them take ill advised actions. I don't know about you, but Id be pissed off if I started off in [H], had an AC Mafia fanboy convince me to purchase an AC kit believing it was the best performing, only to come to XS and have people politely tell me that I was misled.

where's creidiki when we need him? I have not seen him on here in a long time...*-(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ranker

Are my argumentative techniques learned through law school confusing?

---

this line, alone is all that needed to be said. My gf just graduated Law School, and well, arguing with her, is damn near pointless..........


JD aka Law Degree is a degree in Arguing...........well that is how I see it anway.:up:

Remind me never to get into an argument with you ranker :-p.

I think ranker has been getting Aquacomputer door preachers instead of Jehovah Witnesses. :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grinch

where's creidiki when we need him? I have not seen him on here in a long time...*-(

---

He has been busy with life and alcohol, talked to him briefly in IM, but yeah, if he pops up again I will have some cake for him ;)

LOL....ok

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mekrel

I think ranker has been getting Aquacomputer door preachers instead of Jehovah Witnesses. :D

---

LMAO

Now that's sig worthy!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mekrel

I think ranker has been getting Aquacomputer door preachers instead of Jehovah Witnesses. :D

---

:rofl: That one had me on the floor.

thuderstruck!,

YHPM. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by afireinside

The only thing that needs to be beaten are AC owners. Everyone who owns aquacomputer watercooling (especially that 560 dollar monstrosity that probably performs worse than a single BIP /w yate) should be rounded up and bashed over the head with whiffle bats for as many hours as it takes for them to come to their senses.

---

No this is what all of you DON'T get! Let them buy AC gear! How does this affect YOUR life? Seriously? WTF are all of you arguing over? It is crap like this that will ruin a forum. Look at procooling. nuff said.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mekrel

I think ranker has been getting Aquacomputer door preachers instead of Jehovah Witnesses. :D

---

You know. I just got back from Wahoo's down at the pier. I'm here eating my fish taco's and took a swig from the Corona. Unfortunately all of that is now half up my nose and sprayed across the screen.

LOL.

You know, that Aquacomptuter stuff may prove very wife worthy. Aesthetically pleasing. I think I may give it a try... *not* :D

HF is just jealous that our e-penises are larger tenfold.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaze06

HF is just jealous that our e-penises are larger tenfold.

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Hey, don't sell me short !! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IanY

Hey, don't sell me short !! :D

---

ROFL....

I still havent been validated.

Ugh whats up with no Yahoo, hotmail, Gmail.

Thats basically all the free email providers. I had to use my AOL addy i kept for sentimental value.


But there being really slow.


And no way im using my corporate email account. That gets monitored. My BTM already complains that im not suposed to mod dells.

So what if i lapped the cpu, added 1 more additional gig, and moved the image off old hard drive to a raptor 150.


My BTM wishes my machine was his. But then he keeps scratching his head on how i moved the image from the old to the raptor.


Shows you how smart my BTM is.

Are you all quite finished? :confused:

Im with Nikhsub on this:

Quote:

---

No this is what all of you DON'T get! Let them buy AC gear! How does this affect YOUR life? Seriously? WTF are all of you arguing over? It is crap like this that will ruin a forum.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cyprio

Are you all quite finished? :confused:

Im with Nikhsub on this:

---

yeah... i just had too much free time at work. That all changed now tho.

Dont know if i will have time to type out all that was said over there.



Maybe if i get bored tonight. :shrug:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

No this is what all of you DON'T get! Let them buy AC gear! How does this affect YOUR life? Seriously? WTF are all of you arguing over? It is crap like this that will ruin a forum. Look at procooling. nuff said.

---

:up:

Thread has more than served its purpose :rolleyes: