Check this out :)
http://www.abload.de/img/img_2250s9sp.jpg
http://www.abload.de/img/img_2249ixgm.jpg
http://www.abload.de/img/img_2257w93t.jpg
:shocked:
Printable View
lul wut
Would that even scale?
Heatdump FTW!
By the looks of it it would be like adding another 4 90's to your loop. Pass...
Lol . . .
Looking forward for some reviews =)
Wow, there is extreme, then there is just why.
It would be interesting to see if it does scale though.
I'll pass, saving my money for the quad ddc.. :cool:
yeaaaahhhh 54w of heatdump in my loop rofl :D
120.1 rad just for pumps. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett
Isn't this going just a tiny bit far? lol...
But then again, I'm glad things that push the envelope like this are available. Rather have the option to be xtreme and choose not to then to never have had the option at all :P.
Does seem a bit excessive. The design looks inefficient, but I remember Skinnee testing the dual version which used the same design and scaled very well. Maybe running 3 undervolted MCP350's would be nice and quiet while still giving good head.
bundymania your photoshopping skills are outstanding
just joking :p:
Dayam...
And i thought it would be a cold day in hell the day an RD-30 looked small.
I know Vapor is drolling somewhere going i must have....
He's the only one i can think of that uses more then 2 DDC's in a series.
Why is it that the outlet sections of each pump in this setup have to go through two 90 degree turns? Couldn't they just shoot straight from the outlet area from one pump to the inlet of the next pump?
This picture should dictate what I'm talkin about...
http://home.comcast.net/~jefftrexler/newflow.jpg
Its a good question, I'm willing to guess it is the design of the impeller. The 90s didn't hurt the dual version that Skinnee tested though. :shrug:
I'm sorry, but that is so bad as$ :D
It would be hard to manufacture like that, as well, XSPC have done tests and it performers great how it is. Bundy will have data soon, and i'm sure Skinnee will do some at a later date.
does this even have any benefit over, say, the twin top?
to be honest i cant think of many people who would use it.
70 each ddc x 3 = 210 dollars on the pumps alone.
Then the top is probably gonna cost somewhere near 60 dollars for that much acrylic + cutting.. so your looking at almost a 300 dollar package.
Theres only a hand few of people i can think of that even have more then 3 ddc's in there current systems.
Meh... time to go bug john and have him rsvp me this top, so i can go bug eric about it later on. :)
:wasntme:
wait..Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
do you even have 3 unused DDC's? :rofl:
I thought u only had 2, and my cache of D5's :P
^^^Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Can i seriously kill you one day?Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
If i say Please will it increase my chances? :rofl:
This is some serious pump power...
Cute, but once you've got 2 DDC 3.2's in series, the third one really doesn't do much for your performance. My own testing saw a degree improvement... maybe. And this one doesn't conveniently fit into a 5 1/4" bay like the dual-version does. If you were hard-core about silence, perhaps using 3.1's might be useful? In a very limited, expensive sort of way?
Jesus, I don't think I'd ever need that kind of GPM... it's neat, though, if you want to be the cool guy with 3 pumps. :)
i think it's for people with massive amounts of hardware to be cooled more so then better flow for a small loop.Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG
man i really wish i went with ddc pumps... dam d5's. anyone want 2 plus a d4?? only asking 150!
lol.
in 6-year months i will buy 4 swiftech MCR420's and keep my triple triple's and run that pump setup:)
Damn, just buy a RD-30. A little overkill! :ROTF:
I laughed when I saw this - I just ordered the dual top yesterday after reading skinnee's review. Was torn between the XSPC dual and the Water Cool dual, but went for the cheaper, simpler look of the XSPC.
Happy to see new products coming out, even if I'm not sure it's something I'd use, it will be fun to read the test reports.
I like my pump tops the same way I like my women I guess :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by alacheesu
That's what she said? :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by tool_462
I actually rolled around on my bed laughing at that "can I kill you" comment.
This top is awesome, if excessive. If I wasn't so convinced I need to go dual loop, I'd be looking at something like this or the dual to go through all of my blocks.
We're still talking about the pump, right??Quote:
would be nice and quiet while still giving good head.
But seriously, waterprOn though it is, it wont even go in a drive bay!
Would'nt it have made more sense to have mounted the outer 2 pumps vetically, so you end up with a cube of perspex, with a pump on each of 3 of its sides.....
IOI
......If that makes sense.....??!!
Great, and I just ordered 2 more MPC-655, wish I have hold off the order
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noisy
Would be nice a top like this or the dual for d5 too :up:
D5 have lost attention lately :(
would probably perform on the level of about 1.5 times of a single DDC in terms of pressure/head
In series each DDC will add about 30% increase in head pressure. so roughly 1.7x the performance of a single DDC.
this is of course not at all respecting the 90s and heat dump.
Hey guys ... just a reminder - we've got minors reading these threads so let's keep everything family friendly. Thanks!
oh really...Quote:
Originally Posted by Senater_Cache
http://skinneelabs.com/Pumps/DDC/XSP...ual_pq-psi.jpg
I think you meant to say 30% more flow.... :yepp:
I think the math works out to be 30% more flow..
:OQuote:
Originally Posted by shazza
I promise to play nice... *crossing my fingers*
:rofl:
Quote:
I promise to play nice... *crossing my fingers*
Just trying to keep you boys out of trouble ;)
The approximation I use is as follows:
When going from single pump to dual pump (identical pumps), you can expect roughly (X * sqrt(2)) for flowrate, where X is your flowrate with single pump. Works out to a ~40% increase in flowrate.
You can apply this when going from dual to triple as well as single to triple, either (X * sqrt(1.5)) or (X * sqrt(3)), depending on what your starting point is. From a single pump, that works out to a ~73% increase in flowrate; from a dual, that works out to be a ~22% increase in flowrate. What those flowrates mean for you thermally varies on your setup....usually the gains past dual DDC are almost non-existent, heck, going to dual DDC can hurt if you don't have enough radiator or if you block is blind to flowrates (some have a pretty flat response curve).
This is simply one of the most moronic things I've seen as of late. :shakes:
I pick on Naekuh...but no need to call him a moron in public. :ROTF:Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
I'm sick of working the day job for the day, it will be there later. I'll finally reply with more than an emoticon since I can put a little thought behind it now. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
You already have my death in motion, look at all the cursed parts you send. :ROTF:
Yes, I have 3 DDC's and your D5's haven't even tasted a drop of the high quality Roundy's Steam distilled... they've been sitting in a box since they arrived. I did get a production sample of the Dual and Triple tops, I thought Paul was just joking around about the triple until I opened the box last week and there she was.
From the preview of the XSPC Dual top, I wasn't happy about not having the power data and needed a new bench power supply. Well, I finally found her or her sister... Mastech HY3020D or HY3020E. I can't decide between switching and linear, because I really don't know the difference or what it means for the bench. I have a linear now, but could I save the $40 on the switching 0-30V, 0-20A?
Anyhow, yeah I'll have full PQ's with power consumption on the XSPC dual and triple tops with individual tops in series. Eric has the EK Dual which he will be sending out, but I only have one EK V2 so I can't compare that to its individual top equivalent. Like normal, the comparison page will be the eye chart plots. The only other top I have is an XSPC Res top, which I have the PQ just never released it. Almost done with the large radiator update, and CPU block photos are being imported and saved for the round-up.
At least, thats what I have planned for now and what the hold up is. :p:
seriously, that's just ridiculous now. i can see a reason for two pumps connected, but with 3? might as well make a top that connects 10 of them. we all know how doubling on the pump does not double the flow or head. and on top of that, we've all seen how increase in flow after a certain point hardly does anything to the overall temperature.
and autobot's picture looks dead on. makes me think they were too lazy to even try to think of this or redesign the water routing. 90's certainly don't help the flow, but someone mentioned that it didn't do much to the performance? well duh... that's because there's TWO pumps on there when it was tested in dual pump. if they had designed it like how autobot drew, the WORST that can happen is that performance is the same as if those 90's were there. most likely taking out four 90's will only benefit.
i really wonder if having 3 pumps will actually raise your overall temperature and give you even worst performance. there's a lot more heat dump from the pumps, while flow will not even triple. even if it does triple, flow hardly affects temperature like mentioned earlier.
just to get this straight without starting anything... are you sure?Quote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
how can there be more flow if the pumps are in series and all impellers are moving at the same speed?
now if they were in parallel, then there would be more flow as the water path get divided into three, with each third being "moved along" individually (as individual as it can get in a closed loop:p:
am I misunderstanding this?
:ROTF::ROTF:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
That poor soapbox:ROTF:
would this give you much benefit over just hooking up 3 pumps in series with tubing?
If I wanted this kind of flow, I would go with an Iwaki.
Its pretty much the same thing. You may get a little better flow as you could get rid of all those 90s before and after each pump. Seems Skinnee is going to try testing it though.Quote:
Originally Posted by kyleboy77
edit:Why does everyone have to pick on Naekuh's soapbox. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
Yes im fairly sure... the last number we talked about tho was near 30% i think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Senater_Cache
I got bit in the butt when i challenged scott to this statement, and he showed it to me.
That's why i know...
And vapor said it best...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
thats sick!
so you think all the 18 watts of power is wasted as heat, and then dumps it all in the water...?Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett
then what is turning the impeller? if all heat/energy is absorbed by the water, why is the outside of the pump hot then?
Its like going out on a street and seeing a chrome gallardo..Quote:
Originally Posted by millertime359
No matter how pretty it is, you just want to get a sledge hammer to it and ding it. :(
Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
Quote:
Originally Posted by millertime359
Waterlogged, you can call him whatever you like in public. Anyone who compares themselves to a chrome gallardo needs to be heckled in public.Quote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
:rofl:
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
:up: :cool:
ohhh u are the first i will definitely PWN when i get my gulftown.Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
For sure.... make it feel like im rubbing salt on an open wound.. :rofl:
*sigh* my avatar is serious.. i think i need more rads... :\
Now we know how to motivate Naekuh to finish a build. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
Ha! Finish a build, this is a chip and maybe a board swap... how many have been in that case now?
Blah, Gulftown blah... I have DDC tops on the brain now. And radiators and CPU blocks. :D
There would be no such thing as a small leak with this setup. As soon as there is an opening all the fluid in the system will be pumped out in less then a second. :ROTF:
i assume there will be a dual/triple top round up some time? can we through in some single tops in series in the mix?
List off the ones you have in mind, only promise I can make is that I will try to acquire the tops. I can't guarantee anything unless I have them in hand.
But where are the quad tops?!?!
:ROTF:
OOoohhhh, can't wait. More pics of naked CPUs!Quote:
ohhh u are the first i will definitely PWN when i get my gulftown.
(***runs and hides***)
It doesn't seem like the idea of the triple top is going over real strong here. I have to admit, I did think it was a photoshop when I first saw it, but will be interested to see the results (if no one gets one to skinnee, I'll get him one for Christmas :) )
This is TOPS! not CORES!Quote:
Originally Posted by jcool
Your in the wrong subsection!
:rofl:
He has one...Quote:
Originally Posted by shazza
However i was talking it over with people... we dont think this will be great... why?
Because the PSI chart is nice.. however the flow isnt...
I imagine that at a certain point, the Q/P curve is so skewed that you'd see better results from a 2x2 pump setup than you would with four pumps in series. Not to mention that you have to start asking yourself if the components are all rated to hold that kind of pressure...
+1 :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG
kl-350 in loop..Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG
problem solved.. :rofl:
Naw, NaeKuh.. we are at 6 cores already, try to keep up will ya :p: :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
:ROTF:
I'm trying to keep up...I have 5 pumps in my testbed loop :cool:
+ 2 more D5's :rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
yes yes??
I think so too. One of the things the curves don't come out and say is what you can expect in flow rates, we have several reviews of one or the other but not both. I'm going to pick some components (I only have one available GPU block) and start keeping track of a "test loop" or two flow rates along with the PQ curves like normal.Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG
@ shazza, thanks for the offer but I have the XSPC dual and triples.
There are many things at play with multiple pumps... if you double the pumps (same spec) in series you double the head, this is true. However, in loops like ours, it is a general rule of thumb that you need to quadruple the pumping power (head) to double the flowrate. Vapor says 40% more with 2 pumps in series, IMO that is too generous, it is more like 33%. 3 pumps in series would be 66% and 4 pumps would DOUBLE the flowrate of 1 pump. If you look at Petra's pump testing of his tops in series you will see exactly what I'm saying... he does a low restriction loop and a medium/high restriction loop, look to the latter for a more real world example of what you can expect.Quote:
Originally Posted by Senater_Cache
I guess you have a good memory :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by NaeKuh
now im waiting for the X4 and X6 sandwiches. on the bright side, i dont think you will notice when one of your pumps dies... or 3 of them, in the X6 version.
I think you guys are a bit off the point here: this triple top is really made for somebody who needs (wants?) triple the head pressure of a single DDC, and is not really for somebody who just wants to increase flow rate. Now you ask: "Who on Earth needs to treble his head pressure?" I have no idea, but it would have to be somebody with A LOT of restriction in his loop (8 quad rads maybe?), or somebody pumping up a rather large vertical height. Maybe DB can think of a super tall custom monstrosity (like 10 feet tall!) that would require treble head pressure, but otherwise, I don't know who really "needs" it in a normal sized case with normal parts. However, if you want the awesome pumping power of a 280 pound linebacker in your loop, this will do it.
I was hoping you would come in here and clear that up. thanks nikshub1:yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by nikhsub1
I remember the testing done that revealed ~30-40% increase back when people started popping second pumps in their loops.
just wasn't sure if I remembered things correctly or not.
This is for people who have their computer on the 2nd floor, and their rads in the basement :)Quote:
Originally Posted by eth0s
I could be wrong, but I don't think it matters if you're pumping 20 feet straight up or 20 feet horizontally as long as it's a closed loop.Quote:
Originally Posted by veedubfreak
You're not wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by alacheesu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4g6Ofc5bJzE
:D :eek: :ROTF: :cool: :shocked:
dude i still wish i had my video...Quote:
Originally Posted by bundymania
But i actually connected my RD-30 to a bucket and then let it rip on full to see how high the steam went.
It went in a nice pretty arc to my neighbors yard... lol..
He was wondering WTF i was doing that shot water up that high.
My neighbor was cool about it, and then he started to play with it...
sounds funny :) a buddy did a test with a sanso pump outside on a housewall - it pumps 8 meters high
http://www.abload.de/img/img_2310h3vu.jpg
LOL! The water in the reservoir sounds like someone frying bacon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alacheesu
Alacheesu is right, height difference does not matter in a closed loop. The pressure you loose on the way up you get back on the way down so to say.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeathWalking
But it would likely be a hell to get a loop started if the internal height difference where larger then the pump head. And you would possibly get cavitation problems on the highest part due to low absolute pressure.
I was making a joke, a poor one, but still a joke because of the amount of head this thing would have. Also, for the love of god people, please learn to type "lose"
no, not at that length.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jah
The raw length of tubing would add to restrictions.
So its not going to be a perfect cancel out of kinetic vs potential.
Because the friction constant of the tubing @ that length will be significant.
LOOSEQuote:
Originally Posted by veedubfreak
OOps i mean Lose...
:rofl:
This moronic top is now available. :rolleyes:
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/98...ment_Top_.html
The only reasonable application for the triple top might be if you are using a load of Koolance quick disconnects.
Though why you would be using so many is beyond me.
Either that or 2 EK supreme's in series
kek
Eh, i have 2 sets of v4 quick disconnects in each of my loops and there is very little difference in flow compared to before.
Do you have a flow meter?Quote:
Originally Posted by veedubfreak
Because Hondacity measured .25 gpm flow loss for each pair. On the average restriction loop (GFX FC, Apogee GTZ) two DDC's wouldn't even reach 2 gpm.
CoughQuote:
Originally Posted by CedricFP
That was the VL3s. The VL4s should be better than that, although I can't say how much better.
The VL4's simply have a wider ID - to use it with one half tubing with a converter to use standard G1/4 barbs (not G3/8 which they are) kind of wipes out the difference the wider ID makes.Quote:
Originally Posted by faster3200
I'd bet that restriction is similar to what Hondacity tested in the VL3's.
QDC's... :wasntme:
hmmm.... ;)
As for the DDC testing, new power supply should arrive on Saturday (silly FedEx Domestic). I moved a work outage to friday night so I could start testing on Saturday. :)
Did you just get that up, Skinee?
Still working on the review and test summary, finished the testing last night... there is a little something ore than just PQ data. :)
Am seriously looking forward since I have VL4's lying around here :)Quote:
Originally Posted by skinnee
Are there any waterblocks to use on the pumps? :ROTF::cool::p:
Hey everyone, I'm kinda new here on xtremesystems and just had something to say about the XSPC Triple Acrylic Top. Many people argue that 3 MCP355's will add a lot of heat into the system but what if you were to undervolt the pumps for maximum flow vs. noise?Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteFireDragon
I myself am doing my first watercooling setup using three MCP355's because my setup will be very restrictive. I'll post a thread with my setup and am hoping for lots of suggestions xD
3 MCP355: 3 x 18W (max power consumption) = 54W.
The maximum heat dump can never exceed the maximum power consumption. A lot of the energy gets converted into kinetic energy, the rest gets dumped into the water as heat. I'm not sure what the actual heatdump of a MCP355 is, but I don't think it's nowhere near 18W. So even if it would dump 18W, it still isn't that much (CPU and GPU usually dump double that when under load).
This is Sparta!Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexandr0s
Nope. It's just madness. Maybe close to blasphemy, but it's definitely not SPARTA.
I just wish I had 3 DDC3.25's to get PQ. Only have two so the triple top won't be included in the upcoming round-up, only DDC3.2 info will be available on the triple top.