Forceware 185 and GT215

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01-01-2009, 07:20 AM
trinibwoy

Forceware 185 and GT215

Anybody brave enough to try these out?

Code:

DriverVer = 12/26/2008, 7.15.11.8520 NVIDIA_DEV.06A0.01 = "NVIDIA GT214" NVIDIA_DEV.06B0.01 = "NVIDIA GT214 " NVIDIA_DEV.0A00.01 = "NVIDIA GT212" NVIDIA_DEV.0A10.01 = "NVIDIA GT212 " NVIDIA_DEV.0A30.01 = "NVIDIA GT216" NVIDIA_DEV.0A60.01 = "NVIDIA GT218" NVIDIA_DEV.0A70.01 = "NVIDIA GT218 " NVIDIA_DEV.0A7D.01 = "NVIDIA GT218 " NVIDIA_DEV.0A7F.01 = "NVIDIA GT218 " NVIDIA_DEV.0CA0.01 = "NVIDIA GT215" NVIDIA_DEV.0CB0.01 = "NVIDIA GT215 "

http://www.xfastest.com/viewthread.p...extra=page%3D1

Quote:

Originally Posted by Translator

Warning:

NVIDIA ForceWare 185.20 version of this there is no accident, then, will allow the "current" on hand have GTX 285 and GTX 295 (SLI) of the User to more violent!!
Careful you do a good job of nVIDIA graphics cards, or may be too violent and difficult to master!!

:confused:

Chinese friend of mine translated that and came up with something a bit different to Google. She said it means that if Forceware 185 has no problems owners of GTX 285 and 295 will go crazy. Whatever that means.
01-01-2009, 07:27 AM
Macadamia

Probably the near-launch drivers of the 295. But I see no reason for 285 improvements from the simulated ones we have now.
01-01-2009, 07:34 AM
trinibwoy

Yeah me either. There's a new setting for ambient occlusion in these though.

From this thread at [H] - http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1380556

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/144...clusionxo1.png
01-01-2009, 07:42 AM
Macadamia

I'd like to see performance hit though. So far ENBSeries isn't that rosy after providing SSAO on a shader basis.

EDIT: Boo, after seeing the screenshots it seems like dynamic contrast applied to certain object IDs in the RT.
01-01-2009, 07:48 AM
Marduk_25

Some extra download links:

GeForce 185.20 beta (Windows XP 32bit)
GeForce 185.20 beta (Windows XP 64bit)
GeForce 185.20 beta (Windows Vista 32bit)
GeForce 185.20 beta (Windows Vista 64bit) :)
01-01-2009, 08:11 AM
trinibwoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macadamia

Boo, after seeing the screenshots it seems like dynamic contrast applied to certain object IDs in the RT.

I think AO is a per-pixel effect, not per object.
01-01-2009, 08:12 AM
vmsein

This is quite a jump from the existing 181 series up to 185. Are these real?
01-01-2009, 08:19 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

Chinese friend of mine translated that and came up with something a bit different to Google. She said it means that if Forceware 185 has no problems owners of GTX 285 and 295 will go crazy. Whatever that means.

Translated it says: (taiwanese chinese translated by mainland.)

Quote:

----> if nothing happens on this nVIDIA ForceWare 185.2 version, then urser who has GTX285 and GTX295 at the present can be more powerful....

I guess in terms of bugs etc. Then this will boost the speed.

Second part says:

Quote:

Be careful of your nVIDIA card, or else, it becomes difficult to control because of too powerful

This is just strange...
01-01-2009, 08:32 AM
krogen

Quote:

Be careful of your nVIDIA card, or else, it becomes difficult to control because of too powerful

lol, now that's just too funny. :rofl:
01-01-2009, 09:02 AM
soundood

wow this is very odd, they still havent listed the 184.84 on the nvidia site yet, talking about the 184.84 drivers, i seen a 5 -8 degree C, drop in temps on my card over the 184.48 drivers, it wouold seem the 184.48 drivers where driving my card hard.

maybe thats what these new ones will do if you use them?

downloading now, but wont be trying them till tommorow, till i get home, would be nice to get some feedback from others first too

good luck :up:
01-01-2009, 10:03 AM
eternal_fantasy

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

Chinese friend of mine translated that and came up with something a bit different to Google. She said it means that if Forceware 185 has no problems owners of GTX 285 and 295 will go crazy. Whatever that means.

Here's the Taiwanese Chinese translated by a Taiwanese... :D

Quote:

此nVIDIA ForceWare 185.20版本沒有意外的話，將可讓"目前"手頭上有GTX 285與GTX 295(SLI)的User能夠更狂暴!!
小心抓好各位的nVIDIA顯卡，不然可能會因為太狂暴而很難駕馭!!

If there's no mistake, this driver will let those that "currently" have the GTX 285 and GTX 295 (SLI) 's user even more aggresive (hardware speed wise).

Everyone carefully hold on to your nVIDIA GFX card, or it may get out of control from it's aggresiveness.

I guess we just like to make words sound more.... emotional :D
01-01-2009, 10:09 AM
Blacky

Wow nice feature, tho which games are compatible with this feature?
01-01-2009, 10:13 AM
mele

SLOOWWWWWWWWWW Download..................
01-01-2009, 10:27 AM
soundood

this is the second time i have had a corupt download from Marduk_25 links, the 64 bit vista driver link seems to have issues, ill try once more before i give up, winrar error im getting
01-01-2009, 10:27 AM
largon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blacky

Wow nice feature, tho which games are compatible with this feature?

"Ambient Occlusion" is a DX feature that has being used for long already. The driver just has an option to disable it.
Looks like it's just a performance hack that once enabled sacrifices LOD.
01-01-2009, 10:33 AM
trinibwoy

Sigh, no it isn't. AO was first used in Crysis. This control panel setting allows you to apply it to other games as well.

And it's not a feature of any API. You have to code your own pixel shader to do it - http://ja.pastebin.ca/953523
01-01-2009, 10:45 AM
Luka_Aveiro

According to another forum's user, these are the games currently supported by Ambient Occlusion:

Assassin Creed
Bioshock
COD4
COD:WAW
CS:Source
Company of heroes
crysis (warhead not suported)
Devil may cry 4
Fallout 3
Far Cry 2
Half-life 2: Episode Two (only!!)
Left 4 Dead
Lost Planet
Mirror's Edge
The Call of Juarez
World in conflit
World Of Warcraft
01-01-2009, 11:06 AM
T_Flight

Ambient occlusion FTW!!!! :rofl:
01-01-2009, 11:15 AM
largon

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

Sigh, no it isn't. AO was first used in Crysis. This control panel setting allows you to apply it to other games as well.

And it's not a feature of any API. You have to code your own pixel shader to do it - http://ja.pastebin.ca/953523

So, how does a driver add support for AO in games that dont have that proverbial AO pixel shader in them?
:confused:

And, yes, AO is an old feature.
01-01-2009, 11:24 AM
[XC] hipno650

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundood

this is the second time i have had a corupt download from Marduk_25 links, the 64 bit vista driver link seems to have issues, ill try once more before i give up, winrar error im getting

got the same issue with the vista 64bit version looks like a no go. i'll just wait until it comes from nvidia directly.
01-01-2009, 11:35 AM
K404

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundood

i seen a 5 -8 degree C, drop in temps on my card over the 184.48 drivers, it wouold seem the 184.48 drivers where driving my card hard.

How are you measung temps?
01-01-2009, 11:38 AM
T_Flight

I haven't been having much luck with Beta or modded drivers lately. I don't know why. It seems like every non-WHQL driver I run caused freezes on CoH and lower performance with F@H GPU2. I would like to see this option enebled because I have 2 of those titles and would like to see this Occlusion enabled like it should be.

I do have to say that nVidia has been pretty good with drivers. They are really on top of things with these drivers. Especially getting the performance out of these new titles. 2009 is gonna be a good year for nVidia I bet. I can feel it. They are coiled and ready to strike with a barage of new cards.
01-01-2009, 11:46 AM
mele

Vista 64bit installed fine here.....
01-01-2009, 12:40 PM
Blacky

Quote:

Originally Posted by mele

Vista 64bit installed fine here.....

any improvements on performance? careful hold your card can go berzerk mode :D :D :D
01-01-2009, 12:51 PM
yaddam205

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blacky

any improvements on performance? careful hold your card can go berzerk mode :D :D :D

I tested in Vantage and got tiny bumb nothing to write home about.
01-01-2009, 01:03 PM
soundood

Quote:

Originally Posted by [XC] hipno650

got the same issue with the vista 64bit version looks like a no go. i'll just wait until it comes from nvidia directly.

yeah just tried again, and same winrar issues

Quote:

Originally Posted by K404

How are you measung temps?

i water cool my GTX260, and when i was attaching the Razor block i attached a thermal sensor, i take reading from this straight from GPU

Quote:

Originally Posted by mele

Vista 64bit installed fine here.....

did you download it from the links above? or another source? if so can you post a link?

edit: i am such a nana, maybe i should have downloaded from the OP's original link,

im getting the 64 bit driver from here, vista 64 bit 185.20
01-01-2009, 01:06 PM
yaddam205

Quote:

Originally Posted by soundood

did you download it from the links above? or another source? if so can you post a link?

Vista 64 worked for me , got mine from Xfastest: http://pic.xfastest.com/z/NVIDIA%20%...%20Vista64.exe
01-01-2009, 01:38 PM
trinibwoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by largon

So, how does a driver add support for AO in games that dont have that proverbial AO pixel shader in them?
:confused:

That's a good question. Maybe they just apply their own AO shader to all pixels in the scene. Unless you have evidence of Source games supporting AO natively.

Quote:

And, yes, AO is an old feature.

In off-line rendering yes. Real-time in games? Ummm, no.
01-01-2009, 02:19 PM
mele

Downloaded form xfast, link above.
AO screwed COD4 all up....very jerky. Turned it off.
01-01-2009, 02:19 PM
Eastcoasthandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

That's a good question. Maybe they just apply their own AO shader to all pixels in the scene. Unless you have evidence of Source games supporting AO natively.

In off-line rendering yes. Real-time in games? Ummm, no.

It is my understanding that screen space ambient occlusion mods have been out for HL2 for some time now. Here is one example specifically for G80 (according to the author) but there are plenty more. Also, I recall that this can be implemented without having to alter .dll info.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mele

Downloaded form xfast, link above.
AO screwed COD4 all up....very jerky. Turned it off.

This confirms my inital opinion. This option appears to be similar to having the option to enable EATM in some games using a radeon video card (foilage, etc). My only question is if this has any negative impact to IQ and/or increase in frame rates if AO is disabled for games that use AO by default?
01-01-2009, 02:49 PM
zerotol

god i hope these drivers fix flat panel scaling for me in vista 64:shrug:
01-01-2009, 04:20 PM
trinibwoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eastcoasthandle

It is my understanding that screen space ambient occlusion mods have been out for HL2 for some time now. Here is one example specifically for G80 (according to the author) but there are plenty more. Also, I recall that this can be implemented without having to alter .dll info.

Yeah I saw that. My copy of HL2 is not modded however so it seems the drivers are doing something similiar to what the mod did.

Quote:

This confirms my inital opinion. This option appears to be similar to having the option to enable EATM in some games using a radeon video card (foilage, etc). My only question is if this has any negative impact to IQ and/or increase in frame rates if AO is disabled for games that use AO by default?

Don't think it works like that. AO isn't an API or hardware feature. It's just a pixel shader. Don't think the driver can "disable" a shader submitted by the application. And even then, how would it know which shader to disable?
01-01-2009, 04:22 PM
trinibwoy

Quote:

Originally Posted by zerotol

god i hope these drivers fix flat panel scaling for me in vista 64:shrug:

What's not working for you with fat planel scaling in vista 64? Been working fine for me without a hitch - I usually have it set to "do not scale" but the default scaling works fine and scaling with fixed aspect is good too.
01-01-2009, 04:24 PM
Sr7

Quote:

Originally Posted by largon

"Ambient Occlusion" is a DX feature that has being used for long already. The driver just has an option to disable it.
Looks like it's just a performance hack that once enabled sacrifices LOD.

This takes the cake. You're just plain wrong here. There is no "feature" for this in DX. The control panel has an option to enable a proprietary AO implementation in the NVIDIA driver.

It's not a "performance hack", it's adding workload for better IQ, not taking away.

Quote:

Originally Posted by largon

So, how does a driver add support for AO in games that dont have that proverbial AO pixel shader in them?
:confused:

And, yes, AO is an old feature.

Driver has final say prior to the hardware on what is rendered. It is the last step in the chain before hardware does processing. Of course anything can be injected at this point ..

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

In off-line rendering yes. Real-time in games? Ummm, no.

You're right. In realtime graphics this isn't really utilized yet, so a blanket method in the CP would be cool.

Crysis is one of the only games to use AO in realtime, where it is NOT pre-baked into the textures. This gives it the ability to be dynamic (when light sources change position/size, or are added/taken away, etc).
01-01-2009, 04:35 PM
mikeyakame

i'll do some benchmarks between 181.00 and the 185.20s when I boot back over to my Vista SP2 partition, kinda playing around with the newest wddm 1.1 drivers from NV on Windows 7 B1. 179.xx set, but seems performance level/clock domain switching for power saving isn't working on these drivers. Wasn't completely broken on the initial 178.16 release from August.
01-01-2009, 04:52 PM
Eastcoasthandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

Yeah I saw that. My copy of HL2 is not modded however so it seems the drivers are doing something similiar to what the mod did.

Don't think it works like that. AO isn't an API or hardware feature. It's just a pixel shader. Don't think the driver can "disable" a shader submitted by the application. And even then, how would it know which shader to disable?

When I noticed this post showing what it "suppose" to do or doesn't is when I have to ask the question. In all a review of this feature would benefit all of us as so it's clear how this feature functions in AO games.
01-01-2009, 05:25 PM
Eastcoasthandle

If anyone is interested in how AO works watch this video
01-01-2009, 05:26 PM
trinibwoy

I think those images are just showing Crysis' native AO implementation which is turned on at High/Very High settings. Haven't seen any screenies of AO being forced by the driver. I tried HL2 and my framerate tanked but I didn't notice any striking difference in IQ. Either it's not working but still killing performance or it's working and I didn't have a good scene or don't know what to look for.
01-01-2009, 05:35 PM
Eastcoasthandle

If you look at photos 3 & 4 they appear to be pics of HL2: Ep 2. Photo 3 looks like there is no AO. Photo 4 (looking in the corners) appears to use AO. However, how the AO is implemented doesn't look right to me. I've read that this does tank frame rates for whatever reason.
01-01-2009, 05:54 PM
Cybercat

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eastcoasthandle

If you look at photos 3 & 4 they appear to be pics of HL2: Ep 2. Photo 3 looks like there is no AO. Photo 4 (looking in the corners) appears to use AO. However, how the AO is implemented doesn't look right to me. I've read that this does tank frame rates for whatever reason.

I actually think that looks really good. This is a very cool feature NVIDIA is adding and I'd like to see ATI do similar quality additions to their drivers.
01-01-2009, 05:56 PM
Eastcoasthandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybercat

I actually think that looks really good. This is a very cool feature NVIDIA is adding and I'd like to see ATI do similar quality additions to their drivers.

To me it makes the scene look different. As to it being good, that's subjective. What I take noticed to is how AO is being applied and to me it detracts from the developer's intent. In all I hope that AMD doesn't use this type of technique.
01-01-2009, 06:03 PM
Cybercat

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eastcoasthandle

To me it makes the scene look different. As to it being good, that's subjective. What I take noticed to is how OA is being applied and to me it detracts from the developer's intent. In all I hope that AMD doesn't use this type of technique.

Well I wouldn't fret too much about AMD doing something similar. Right now they've got their hands full just optimizing performance and swatting bugs, let alone actually adding anything new. :p:

I'd agree with you in TF2. It adds next to nothing in those shots and can even create artifacts, such as the pixelation under the pipe.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7..._artifacts.jpg

But in the other two games where the art direction leans towards more realism, it's my opinion that the addition is a positive one.
01-01-2009, 06:06 PM
Eastcoasthandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybercat

Well I wouldn't fret too much about AMD doing something similar. Right now they've got their hands full just optimizing performance and swatting bugs, let alone actually adding anything new. :p:

I'd agree with you in TF2. It adds next to nothing in those shots and can even create artifacts, such as the pixelation under the pipe.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7..._artifacts.jpg

But in the other two games where the art direction leans towards more realism, it's my opinion that the addition is a positive one.

Driver improvement is not something found from just one competing company. So that comment is a bit skewed. AO isn't really something new and it's best left with the developer as to how it should be implemented in a game.
01-01-2009, 06:10 PM
Cybercat

As you said, that's subjective.
01-01-2009, 06:12 PM
Eastcoasthandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybercat

As you said, that's subjective.

Actually I said, "As to it being good, that's subjective". But to each his own. :up:
01-01-2009, 06:45 PM
Sr7

Crysis isn't such a good example unless you disable the screen space AO built into Crysis first. Otherwise the NV control panel AO is layering on top of the existing AO in Crysis. It would be better to compare the techniques instead of comparing Crysis' technique with Crysis + NVIDIA's technique lol.
01-01-2009, 07:22 PM
T_Flight

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cybercat

Well I wouldn't fret too much about AMD doing something similar. Right now they've got their hands full just optimizing performance and swatting bugs, let alone actually adding anything new. :p:

I agree, and would add they seem to be adding new more efficient bugs. I've got a buddy down the raod selling off two of his 4870x2's. He said he's had it fighting them. That and the e-mail he got telling him the driver issues he was having was a game issue and he needed to contact the game developer. "Ummmm, heeeellloooooo, Bethesda and Fallout 3 is a brand new title that needs driver support, and it's not a game issue...please try again." That's what I told him to tell them. Like that wasn't already obvious. Swat one add two kinda thing going on there.

That's the area that has kept me using Nvidia for years is driver development. It's going on 12 years. That's a long time. They do it right. Nvidia just keeps them coming, and they always seem to keep improved drivers flowing. It's good to see that I got my money's worth and the little bit extra I put into my purchase is actually being used. Nvidia definitely has it together with their driver development.
01-01-2009, 08:37 PM
revenant

these made FO3 crash on loading a saved game no matter what I did every time.. hard crash with system reboot. rolled back to 181.00 for now..
01-01-2009, 09:16 PM
BababooeyHTJ

Quote:

Originally Posted by T_Flight

I agree, and would add they seem to be adding new more efficient bugs. I've got a buddy down the raod selling off two of his 4870x2's. He said he's had it fighting them. That and the e-mail he got telling him the driver issues he was having was a game issue and he needed to contact the game developer. "Ummmm, heeeellloooooo, Bethesda and Fallout 3 is a brand new title that needs driver support, and it's not a game issue...please try again." That's what I told him to tell them. Like that wasn't already obvious. Swat one add two kinda thing going on there.

That's the area that has kept me using Nvidia for years is driver development. It's going on 12 years. That's a long time. They do it right. Nvidia just keeps them coming, and they always seem to keep improved drivers flowing. It's good to see that I got my money's worth and the little bit extra I put into my purchase is actually being used. Nvidia definitely has it together with their driver development.

Um, Fallout 3 just crashed to desktop twice on me today. I have a GTX280. The drivers were a nightmare for the first few monthes that I had a GTX260 as well. Nvidia could use some improvement with their drivers too. Although their drivers are much better than ATI's drivers at the moment. I just sold off my 4870s because of that.
01-01-2009, 11:43 PM
largon

Looking at what AO does in Crysis I can tell it makes the scene look less realistic. Deep, dark shadow under every patch of grass & shrub? Come on.

AO off is totally looking best.
01-01-2009, 11:44 PM
AuDioFreaK39

Windows Vista Ultimate 64-bit
GeForce 185.20
Nvidia PhysX 8.11.18
Crysis: WARHEAD
DirectX 10

2048 x 1152 (16:9)

Core i7 965 Extreme @ 3.74GHz
GeForce GTX 280 @ 685/2240

AO OFF (19fps)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8...ff19fpsme6.jpg

AO LOW (17.8fps)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/4...w178fpsye0.jpg

AO MEDIUM (16.6fps)

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/7...m166fpsut7.jpg

AO HIGH (13.1fps)

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/6...h131fpshg7.jpg
01-05-2009, 02:11 AM
CQSTELUSH

The new driver is indeed a hit, almost better than the last versions in any way, even for mobile versions of GeForce GPUs.

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