Crawl Space Cooler Build

thought i best make a thread on this build .i have the pump sys figured out . here the build of a subfloor/crawl space cooler usein' 2 GTX 480's each on it's own loop and a squirriel cage blower ,getting the water up/down is whole other topic
A BIG thank you goes to Waterlogged for his suggestions


componets delt with today > 10"wheel X 8" wide squirrel cage blower made by Dayton $15.00 yard sale ( new one about the same size & CFM $129.00)
this puppy pushes near 1000 CFM > 1 each 8 foot X 3/4" pine board . about a 1/3 of a sheet of 1/4' plywood > wood screws > 2 each GTX480's the pix will tell most of the rest

My crawl space is big enuff to situp in & stays 50F all summer winter it's even colder but I have never froze a water pipe down there yet lived here 12 years what every water cooler wants cool moist air
the house heats up into the upper 90's F 5 months of the year or more Ya gotta love California !

Holy crap 1000CFM:shocked:

That things gonna swallow those GTX's whole.:D

cant wait to see what you do with this. Subscribed

the last post shows the assy of the box this is important that the box is ennuff volume to create static pressure which will push air evenly thru all part of the rads IE:no dead spots (like when you place a 120mm right on the surface of a rad )
these on this post show pix > fitting blower & rads to holes cut in plywood , tighter the better as that makes sealing them easy & then show fitting & bracing

these pix show the 1st test > to see if i was getting an even flow from both rad holes>>> that's it for today The rest of the day spent amassing hardware > gasket materials > finding a way to hold rads from blowing off ! what i got today at the hardware store is amazingly strong & simple way to hold the rads with out damaging them in anyway say tuned more pix tomorrow

Xtreme

wow thats xtreme!

If you have an amp meter you should check the amp draw vs the nameplate on the motor. Most squirrel cage blowers are designed to operate in a box with restriction. Your amp draw could go sky high without the restriction.

If the amp draw is too high put a piece of sheet metal partially across both openings to dial in the "Full Load Amps". ie. if it is rated for 3.5 FLA then set to 3 FLA. just my $.015

Oh, and rigging up a couple of filter tracks would also be a good idea.

That nucking futs

Sweet!

I was thinking of a crawlspace cooler too, but never though of the squirrel cage fan, that's intense!!!!

you get that fan off of a Commercial VAV box or Fan Coil?

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Originally Posted by skinnee

you get that fan off of a Commercial VAV box or Fan Coil?

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No I think that blower is off a HVAC sys .. they are very easy to find with alot of ppl upgrading forced air furnaces to the more high effecent furnaces . check with furnace installers about older furnaces replaced & get one off them on the cheap as they have to pay to dump the older models ... the indoor pot growers use these also .. google shows alot of hits for the hydroponic shops having these if you want a new one
Grainger is priced way too high stay away from them . Remember to build the box to size that will FIT the access to the crawl space .... more pix later today !

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Originally Posted by SiGfever

If you have an amp meter you should check the amp draw vs the nameplate on the motor. Most squirrel cage blowers are designed to operate in a box with restriction. Your amp draw could go sky high without the restriction.

If the amp draw is too high put a piece of sheet metal partially across both openings to dial in the "Full Load Amps". ie. if it is rated for 3.5 FLA then set to 3 FLA. just my $.015

Oh, and rigging up a couple of filter tracks would also be a good idea.

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the restriction will be the rads themselves , the motor is rated 1/5 hp @5 amp max Soo not much of a draw there & the pumps are a/c as well ,soo i'll run a service line with an out let to plug them all in .. i wanted all a/c power with a circit braker off the main house panel down there & not mess with power & voltage converters

wow - this is definatly a cool project. cant wait to read more

OK this day went SLOW tring to figure out how to hold the rads in place , I wanted a bullet proof way & no way that any damage is done to the rads . tried fabrecating my own steel tabs that would screw into the rads stock hole , had a great way but counld not reproduce them 16 times with any consitantcy Soo it back to the hard ware store & i got some aluminium angle stock that mached up the exact depth of the rad but had to rivet them together . This is gonna work Great as it also helps seal the sides of the rads to the box all this took most of all of the day just to get one side the way i wanted it , But i set up a Jig some the others will only take a very short time
Here the pix

here's the rest of the pix these show how i got the the 2 rails together(pop rivets) & show how i tightning them down .. had to be real careful in selecting screw lenths as too long then hole on rad
the rail hold together will look cleaner on the next fabrication as i found some better plates to hold the rails together & be stronger . notice that washer will hold the rail in place with stock hole .. each rad screw hole will have on it

I hope you're using an iwaki to pump through your 20feet of tubing and all those rads :)

when I read the title I really thought you were going to some how fill your crawl space with water.....glad to see that isn't the case. NICE WORK.

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Originally Posted by KaptCrunch

:up: BigSlappy
you gonna need some screen bug on the intake of the blower to keep out the bugs from plugging rad fins ;) also silicone the holes on blower sides

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good catch on the bug screens !!! (I think i'll use some big kitchen strainers the bowl shaped ones that are reinforced with S/S wire ) & what i use on these blowers is that metal duct tape on all the open holes & seams

can't work on this till the weekend stay tuned

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Originally Posted by bigslappy

No I think that blower is off a HVAC sys .. they are very easy to find with alot of ppl upgrading forced air furnaces to the more high effecent furnaces . check with furnace installers about older furnaces replaced & get one off them on the cheap as they have to pay to dump the older models ... the indoor pot growers use these also .. google shows alot of hits for the hydroponic shops having these if you want a new one
Grainger is priced way too high stay away from them . Remember to build the box to size that will FIT the access to the crawl space .... more pix later today !

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Yeah, VAV's and Fan Coil's are part of a commercial HVAC system. I work for Trane, our equipment guys (I'm just an IT guy) have squirrel cage or forward curve fans laying all over the place.

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Originally Posted by skinnee

Yeah, VAV's and Fan Coil's are part of a commercial HVAC system. I work for Trane, our equipment guys (I'm just an IT guy) have squirrel cage or forward curve fans laying all over the place.

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Hey bigslappy, this is lookin great!! :up:
Can't wait for the finished product!

Oh, and I'm sure that when your done building this, that "skinnee" here will install it for you :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :ROTF: :ROTF:

JK!!!! :D :D

Ah, so thats what I can use my spare squirel cage fan for. How about fitting it in a chimney breast?

Looking good bigslappy. Nice avatar btw.

u win.

even CD's 3 PA120.3 cant top this.

I conceede, you are one extreme whore.

:worship:

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Originally Posted by Lu523

Looking good bigslappy. Nice avatar btw.

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LOL i know that model but forgot her name.
She's japanese, and she looks a lot prettier up close. :up:

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Originally Posted by initialised

Ah, so thats what I can use my spare squirel cage fan for. How about fitting it in a chimney breast?

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that'll work (by chimney breast you mean the space between the sheet rock room walls & the bricks if the chimney tower ) mine is about a foot all the way around the tower = attic to crawl space in other words i can see the dirt floor of the crawl space from the attic by looking down the space where the chimney is


I got a chimney breast behide the wall of the room that the PC will be in
thats where i'll be running the pipe work up/down & the service line for the 30 amp service down as that will come from the service box in the gagrage then up into a run in the attic to the chimney breast an quad outlet at the PC level & an quad outlet at the blower & pumps in the crawl space


planning on a huge resevior on the loops out lines of the PC on that same level as the PC = I'll get a 7 foot drop',,,,
planning on PVC pipe about 10 t0 8 inches wide & then just keep reducing down the size with reducers to 1 1/2 pipe then tee it back into two loops agin reduce agin into the rads that way i'll get water pressure to the rads in the crawlspace by gravity :D & by reducing the pipe size in incurments that increases the water pressure with no pump , then it's into a pair of pumps straight outaa the rads up & 2 more pumps at the PC into the water block loops for MAX flow

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Originally Posted by smee

Hey bigslappy, this is lookin great!! :up:
Can't wait for the finished product!

Oh, and I'm sure that when your done building this, that "skinnee" here will install it for you :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :ROTF: :ROTF:

JK!!!! :D :D

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I could easily fit in a crawl space...:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

...but I don't know jack about FC fans and blower motors.

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Originally Posted by NaeKuh

u win.

even CD's 3 PA120.3 cant top this.

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What if...

they combined their work...

CD's 3 PA's...

plus this huge ass blower...

that avatar makes me wanna get all slappy and.... :slap:

/wife intervention... again...

wow... that is eXtreme dude...

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What if...

they combined their work...

CD's 3 PA's...

plus this huge ass blower...

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ha ha ha... that would make someone take the challenge and go out and build a friggin windtunnel or something...

Is there any chance you'll warp the Rads fins with this blower? I mean the cavity that your blower will make might collapse your rad fins. Anyhow, this is definitely Xtreme. Good luck.

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Originally Posted by Bad213Boy

Is there any chance you'll warp the Rads fins with this blower? I mean the cavity that your blower will make might collapse your rad fins. Anyhow, this is definitely Xtreme. Good luck.

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I'll find out this weekend when seal up & do another test

Are you planning to leave it outside the house and run longer tubing? Maybe you could tune the fan speed with a reosthat and keep the noise lower enough for keeping it in your room.

He wouldn't be able to take advantage of the 50 degree temps in the crawlspace then.

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Originally Posted by leo_bsb

Are you planning to leave it outside the house and run longer tubing? Maybe you could tune the fan speed with a reosthat and keep the noise lower enough for keeping it in your room.

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the rad & blower will be under the floor where the air temp is 50f my room gets into the 90's F in the summer
noise is not the issue
Lower air temp is what i need / there by water temps will be lower into the PC

Are you going to do something about dust? I'd think that being under the house, you'd have to clean that sucker out every week at least..

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Originally Posted by Big_Daddy

Are you going to do something about dust? I'd think that being under the house, you'd have to clean that sucker out every week at least..

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the floor of the crawl space has a vapor barrior (plastic sheeting that keeps the moisture from traveling up thru the floor and humidifing the house, before i put in the vapor b the windows in the house would sweat really bad in the winter now they do not at all no matter how cold the outside air temps are
Soo there is no exposed dirt at all in the crawl space soo dust will not be a problem
spider webs that's the worry & as Capt Crunch said put some screens on the blower intakes . More pix when i get up in the morning as i'm back to work on this

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bigslappy

planning on a huge resevior on the loops out lines of the PC on that same level as the PC = I'll get a 7 foot drop',,,,
planning on PVC pipe about 10 t0 8 inches wide & then just keep reducing down the size with reducers to 1 1/2 pipe then tee it back into two loops agin reduce agin into the rads that way i'll get water pressure to the rads in the crawlspace by gravity :D & by reducing the pipe size in incurments that increases the water pressure with no pump , then it's into a pair of pumps straight outaa the rads up & 2 more pumps at the PC into the water block loops for MAX flow

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It does not matter (from a pressure perspective) how wide the pipes are. Pressure only depends on height (it is a measure of Force pre Unit AREA) and as the RAD will be relatively restrictive, compared to 1/2" pipe, you will not see a noticeable difference in flow due to larger tubing.

Just use the same size pipe for the whole thing, should be a lot easier.

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Originally Posted by desertstalker

It does not matter (from a pressure perspective) how wide the pipes are. Pressure only depends on height (it is a measure of Force pre Unit AREA) and as the RAD will be relatively restrictive, compared to 1/2" pipe, you will not see a noticeable difference in flow due to larger tubing.

Just use the same size pipe for the whole thing, should be a lot easier.

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by reducing the diameter in increments (the largest diameter would be the longest piece ) I get a larger volume of water in the overall vertical drop , more volume, more wieght, move gravititational pull = more pressure at the smallest diameter which would be at the the rad inlet where i need it most :cool:

here's the setup of the hold downs for the rads ,where the rads get attached , blower gets attached, TESTING !!!

here's the seal I put on under the rads ,door weather stripping , the use of 2 washers as a sandwich to grasp the rails & attach to the stock screw holes on rads , I used one each washer on each side of the rail hold flange to get a better grip while not disorting the rad flange

detail of washer hold down

attaching the rads

last three pix show the other side of the rads & how the seal looks with the rads on
now on to TESTING ! these next pix show the test .. when i attached the blower i'd didn't place it where it blew straight out & the top rad had slightly more air flow ... & i was getting on both rads more air flow at the center than across the rads evenly (i was getting a huge amount of flow every where but more at the centers )
Now this tells me i need to place a baffle inside the box to spread the blast of air out of the blower to even up the coverage to the rads & make sure that the air flow is perpendicular to the rads ,then the baffle . I was getting alot of flow/leaks from all the seam edges of the box as expexted by me as i didn't use any gasket materials on those parts yet as i wanted to test before going any further,BUT the seals around the rads did not leak at all
as for noise it's NOT loud at all . Bedroom A/C's are 4 times as loud as this thing.. no roar or anything a hum from the motor & that's about it !!

Thats too crazy :D

that could probably cool 30 PCs :p

put a baffel in & now the air flow is way more even across both rads

Hmm... what about putting more radiators and one of those uber pumps all inside a nice box with a squirrel cage blower?

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Originally Posted by jspace

Hmm... what about putting more radiators and one of those uber pumps all inside a nice box with a squirrel cage blower?

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Dat's the Idea but gonna see on the cheap if it's gonna work as i need the cold air under the house

Gonna flush the rads (the Rads are New black ice GTX480's ) with hot water from the tap / hook them up to a hose & run thru hot water the rad with checking the intake temp of the hot water & then checking the output water temp while flushing,this whole while I'll have the blower running , that way i'll get an idea of what the temp drop will be of each rad . be doing this come Saturday morning stay tuned ..

Yeah I RMA the 4 eheim 1250 pumps back to where they came from..
And scored a couple of Iwaki RD-30's from Petra's as they have them on SALE Now & i got them the next day >> THANX Petra's !

gives me more head room, 33 feet with the Iwaki's VS 6 feet for the eheim's (as all here at Xtreme have told me that the Eheim's are out of favor & add alot of heat also) & i'm gonna do all copper piping under the floor 1 inch stuff with gental 6" diameter bends with a conduat bender

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Originally Posted by bigslappy

by reducing the diameter in increments (the largest diameter would be the longest piece ) I get a larger volume of water in the overall vertical drop , more volume, more wieght, move gravititational pull = more pressure at the smallest diameter which would be at the the rad inlet where i need it most :cool:

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Now, I admit complete ignorance of fluid dynamics and other physical sciences, so forgive me if I'm wrong. But wouldn't the small volume in the tube going up have an increased rate of flow (causing more resistance and requiring more energy), thereby offsetting any gains you would see? It just seems to me that because it's a closed system, any energy gained from gravity on the way down would also be used by fighting gravity on the way back up. Again, not really sure what I'm talking about so sorry if I'm completely off base.

it depends on the volume of the fall. For it to work properly there needs to be more volume of water being pushed down by gravity than the volumne of water that needs to be pushed back up.

[QUOTE=mike8913;2969357]it depends on the volume of the fall. For it to work properly there needs to be more volume of water being pushed down by gravity than the volumne of water that needs to be pushed back up.[/QUOTE

Yes !

i'm talking the two loops flow out of the PC into a 8 inch pipe just at the level of the PC then a straight drop of 7 feet (5 feet of that drop 8" pipe) reducing down in diameter(THE LAST 2 feet of the drop ) every 3 to 4 inches till the diameter is a 1 inch pipe that tee's at that point back into the two loops
then both loops run into a rad , one on each loop (Black Ice GTX-480's) & is pushed back up by a iwaki rd-30 pump on each loop back into the PC

The volume of water in a 8" pipe 5 feet long straight down will supply alot of positive pressure to the inlet of the rads & the RD-30 will create a negative pressure / suction at the outlet of the rad
the up loops will be the diameter of the outlet of the Iwaki's
the pipe between the rad & Iwaki will copper pipe to keep the Iwaki from crushing the tubing with suction
does that make sense ? Opinions are welcome ! :cool:

I found a heating / ac contractor that has a sheet metal shop that makes duct work about the same height / width as my wood box ..SOO if this works then i'll move on to that instead of the woodbox & also use a brand new blower but only after this thing is up & running correctly

QUESTION .. should i put the the Iwaki's before the rads ?

or as I was thinking after the rads for the push up to the PC

pump placement shouldn't matter. Some people suggest after the rad for velocity but common sense would dictate that the same force being pressured out the pump has to also be sucked into the pump. And, since your pump has quite a large heat load i would personally suggest putting in before the rad. Now granted, even though common sense does dictate the previously stated it could still be that there is a performance drop in that alignment. However, I hardly think that any performance drop (if there is one) would be noticeable.

very interesting build you have there:cool:
i would put the iwaki before the rad to account for the larger heat dump

*edit: mike beat me to it xD

See http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/Wi..._pressure.html

The Pressure of a fluid is determined by density and depth, the volume has nothing to do with it.

This is because a fluid exerts pressure equally in all directions.

Or are you going to make be dig up my Fluid Mechanics notes to find the derivation for the formula :) : P = Pa + roe*g*h (notice the absence of any dimension other than height)

I believe you may be confusing force and pressure.

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Originally Posted by desertstalker

See http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/Wi..._pressure.html

The Pressure of a fluid is determined by density and depth, the volume has nothing to do with it.

This is because a fluid exerts pressure equally in all directions.

Or are you going to make be dig up my Fluid Mechanics notes to find the derivation for the formula :) : P = Pa + roe*g*h (notice the absence of any dimension other than height)

I believe you may be confusing force and pressure.

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in other words you're saying i'm wasting my effort placing a large volume to use as a down ward pressure to the rads ?, if that is the case then i would want the Iwaki's above the floor so i could monitor them as well as the PSU's that supply the 24Volts to the Iwaki's ?


Then how about this Two loops in PC > Iwaki's > down to the rad's /blower > up to the resevoir's > PC

with this setup the heat dump of the Iwaki's is before the rads & after the heat dump of the PC water blocks >

>> the Iwaki's should have enuff headroom to pull this off ?

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Originally Posted by desertstalker

See http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/Wi..._pressure.html

The Pressure of a fluid is determined by density and depth, the volume has nothing to do with it.

This is because a fluid exerts pressure equally in all directions.

Or are you going to make be dig up my Fluid Mechanics notes to find the derivation for the formula :) : P = Pa + roe*g*h (notice the absence of any dimension other than height)

I believe you may be confusing force and pressure.

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I had a feeling was I was right, but just didn't know enough about it to defend my thinking. I've always had a good understanding of the physical world, but don't know any of the math to back it up.

In theory you should place the pumps intake near (at the same level or below) the RES, they run better with less restriction on the intake and it will be easier to prime them.
It will make very little difference where you put the components as there will likely only be a small temperature increase through the whole loop (as water has a high specific heat)

I expect the Iwaki's will have plenty of power for what you want.

You may want to run it; RES -> PUMP -> RADS -> System -> RES but it makes little difference.
Just make sure you have the pumps below the RES so you can fill the system.

Absolute beast of a project! Thanks slappy for building this unit. I will be monitoring this thread!:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by desertstalker

See http://www.lerc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/Wi..._pressure.html

The Pressure of a fluid is determined by density and depth, the volume has nothing to do with it.

This is because a fluid exerts pressure equally in all directions.

Or are you going to make be dig up my Fluid Mechanics notes to find the derivation for the formula :) : P = Pa + roe*g*h (notice the absence of any dimension other than height)

I believe you may be confusing force and pressure.

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Isn't pressure just the amount of force per unit area?

I think what people are trying to explain here is the potential energy contained in the column of water due the the gravity effecting it and its weight, so the thinking is big volume is more energy down.

I don't think this will stand true as it is a closed loop. No water is able to go down until it returns to the res. (finger on straw = lift from drink) 1 cc of water pumped in to the res = 1cc allowed out of the res. The res water will be "held up" with surface tension, ie defeating gravity.

I think there will be a point where it all gets messy with large enough and long enough res's that enable the surface tension not to be strong enough.

For all intents and purposes though, res volume works as a buffer for temps and not much else. Correct me if I'm wrong here. I'm getting old and rusty.

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Originally Posted by F1ZZY

Isn't pressure just the amount of force per unit area?

I think what people are trying to explain here is the potential energy contained in the column of water due the the gravity effecting it and its weight, so the thinking is big volume is more energy down.

I don't think this will stand true as it is a closed loop. No water is able to go down until it returns to the res. (finger on straw = lift from drink) 1 cc of water pumped in to the res = 1cc allowed out of the res. The res water will be "held up" with surface tension, ie defeating gravity.

I think there will be a point where it all gets messy with large enough and long enough res's that enable the surface tension not to be strong enough.

For all intents and purposes though, res volume works as a buffer for temps and not much else. Correct me if I'm wrong here. I'm getting old and rusty.

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My understanding is the same. The more water in the loop the longer it takes to saturate. The guys here refer to it as "heat dump" I believe.

1st off thanx to you ALL for all the feed back it has helped Very Much ! & thanx also to Quoc from Petra's Tech Shop for all the help (those guy's are great!)

i'm not trying to re-invent the wheel here & i'm no expert on fluid mechanics , i just know that I got a huge volume of cool stable air just under my feet & i get free power from a solar photo array on the roof ... soo why not use the free cool air ,free power to my advantage (solar units in place now 6 yaers & i have hit the break even point on costs for them )

I'm going with a set-up thus ... pc > Rad (GTX480 BlkIce){this will be the under floor/crawl space blower unit } > Res-(EK-RES400 Rev.2) > PUMP-( Iwaki RD-30 )> PC

2 loops of each .. loops having it's own rad /pump/res

the reseviors,pumps & PSU's for the pumps will be housed in a sound box much like CyberDriud's build with this box on the floor with the rad/blower directly below about a foot (the width of the floor/subfloor/joists--- with the pc directly above both units at desk level
up/down is about 6 feet or less each way .. blower/rad unit to PC

I'm on to testing /flushing rads right now, will use hot tap water straight outta the hot water heater > garden hose > rad will take a reading of water temps at the inlet of rad & another reading of temps at the outlet of the rads all the while with the blower unit running to see what temp drop i get
pix to follow in a few hours

couldnt you add a Y to the big down pvc tube to add a air vent so you can get the down force your looking for? it wouldnt be a closed loop any more, could add some sort of air filter to it so you wouldnt get gunk in your lines. either way tho you sure do have a really cool idea and build going on. cant wait to see pics of everything when your done!

That's a novel idea, but as long as there is a return water pipe, height is everything and volume means nothing. (while static at least)

OK, I have thought of a way to simplify explaining this.

Imagine a simple U shaped pipe with one arm twice the diameter as the other. The water would still settle evenly in both, regardless of water volume.

But potentially it could be easier to lift the water up the thin tube than the thick one. This is making my head hurt!!

Too be honest, with the amount of air and water flow available, I wouldn't really worry about res design at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by F1ZZY

Imagine a simple U shaped pipe with one arm twice the diameter as the other. The water would still settle evenly in both, regardless of water volume.

But potentially it could be easier to lift the water up the thin tube than the thick one. This is making my head hurt!!

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That's an interesting explanation, really gets the mind thinking. If you were to put your mouth on either end and blow, I imagine it would be "easier" to blow the pipe empty from the larger diameter end. All this theorycraft makes me wish I had ambition and a college education lol. : (

temp test went as follows ; Blower on at all times
rad #1 house hot water inlet temp 120F outlet temp 98F air temp 72F

rad #2 inlet temp 120F outlet temp 102 air temp 75F

then was dis-assembling the test hose & this happened went to remove the temp tubing setup & was useing sissors (I know 1st dumb thing it did) to cut off the tubing on the barbs > stabbed the rad "Holey S**T " but it looked as if i missed the tubes just fin damage
SOO I ran house water thru unrestricked & counldn't tell for sure if it was leaking
SOO >>> I think >> I'll plug the outlet & then I'll know for sure . Soo I hook it all up & place a plug on the outlet hose Then I run in the house turn the water back on >> by the time i got 1/2 WAY back i could hear the fins popping ..


>>Everyone Laff now ! >>

>> GTXBlkIce 480 shot to Sh**

it is now > leaking ... but NOT at the site of the damage !


link to the post I did with the pix of damage ....>>>>> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=187491

OH well $140 down the toilet & a valuable lesson learned

NOTE to myself Never agin test anything & I do mean anything on house water pressure !

That sucks, so when are you ordering another one? lol

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Originally Posted by Elusid

That sucks, so when are you ordering another one? lol

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TOMORROW !:up:

the cooling on this thing should be ridiculousness. 1000CFM on a huge high flow designed rad. just might have to do that for my window :)

love this radiatorbox :)

Why not use 4 x 220 CFM deltas on the rad...

That would eliminate all that construction work, and take up alot less space.

And you would have 880 CFM per rad...

Im assuming that sound is not a concern in this build....

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Originally Posted by [ShowMe!]

Why not use 4 x 220 CFM deltas on the rad...

That would eliminate all that construction work, and take up alot less space.

And you would have 880 CFM per rad...

Im assuming that sound is not a concern in this build....

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amazmingly low noise comes from this blower a slight hum is all that is heard & the rads made no noise & the fact that i can run it on 110 a/c & not have a PSU just for the fans as all this under the floor to get the cool 50F air

got the replacement rad !
back to building this weekend

this was posted on another thread
Quote:____________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________
Originally Posted by Soulwind
There's another thread about setting up a crawl-space cooling loop on here.

One thing that's bugged me about the idea (in both threads now), is this:

If the crawl-space ambient temp is really that much cooler than the ambient temp in the room the computer is housed in,
and the loop works to bring temps down closer to the crawl-space ambient, then wouldn't you have to worry about
condensation just like the chilled-water/phase-change cooling setups do?????? I don't think I've seen anyone mention that before.
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Humm!
we'll see when i get to that point but I'm in California & the humidty is not a problem like in other areas but i am addressing that issue with the next stage
as the cooler is a mock up stage right now ( works great) & have now plans of going forward with a sheet metal version BUT 1st i'll do testing on my test bed
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you shouldnt have to worry about condensation since your change in temperature is so minimal.

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Originally Posted by [ShowMe!]

Why not use 4 x 220 CFM deltas on the rad...

That would eliminate all that construction work, and take up alot less space.

And you would have 880 CFM per rad...

Im assuming that sound is not a concern in this build....

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with the blower it's gonna be easy to put a airfilter on the thing & doing that with the 4 fans EHH i'd don't know how easy that'd be

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [ShowMe!]

Why not use 4 x 220 CFM deltas on the rad...

That would eliminate all that construction work, and take up alot less space.

And you would have 880 CFM per rad...

Im assuming that sound is not a concern in this build....

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Remember, the PQ curve of those individual Deltas isn't going to be anywhere near as strong as that blower (think of it like a bunch of low pressure, high flow pond pumps in parallel pitted against a couple RD-30's in series). As a result, the Deltas wouldn't be close moving 220CFM each through those GTX480's... that blower would, well, blow their socks off.

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Originally Posted by mike8913

you shouldnt have to worry about condensation since your change in temperature is so minimal.

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Yeah that's what i was thinking !
as the reason for the build is to get cool air thru the rads instead of warm room temp air with the only power use would be the motor on the blower not some refer
Hey it's even Green sounding ! L O L

Got jacked around with the sheet metal guy
I hate that when people waste my time

SOO it was off to the industrial salvage yard to get some Goodies & found just what i need to replace the wood box ( some simple modding that all ) .. to make the airfilter mounts on the blower I also got some round metal duct (6 feet of it) leaves alot left over both for $10
the airfilters are gonna be the ones i use for Rig#1's "The WindTunnel " 250mm fans
10" pleted round sports car airfilters

Pix when Da sun comes up

here's what i got @ the salvage yard

here's the rework of the wood box Ver#1 makes a nice guide

cut for Da blower & blower in place & fit perfectly

blower in place & the cuts for the rads on the other end

this is gonna be a steel box with 12" X 24" X 24"

Gee I like to work with steel much better ! well after a little break then i'll post some more work !

Very happy with what i've got done

are you planing on sealing around the rads too keep the pressure up?? unless of course the box would explode b/c of the air preasure, lol.

here's where I rework how the rads will sit ,figured seeing how I lenthened the box & made the airblast longer i'll get a more even flow & not have to have as of a large baffle inside
I also need the rads to sit right next to each other as that surface is now smaller than Ver#1
also included a rad protection sheild from sharp UFO's (learned the hard way )
fab'ed up some strips to make the 2 rads a Unit & it's quite ridgid now
on to Da pix

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Originally Posted by Pedalmonkey

are you planing on sealing around the rads too keep the pressure up?? unless of course the box would explode b/c of the air preasure, lol.

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Yeah everything will be sealed quite tight to max the air pressure to the rads

rad protection mockup looks like it's gonna work on UFO's !

here's how the rads will sit "note blower hole at bottom" last pix the rads, inside up shot of the rad from the inside to show more how they fit ..some notching to do tomorrow soo they sit lower ,then making a neopren thick seal/gasket to seall every thing up around the rads ...
all seams will be sealed with silicone & metal duct tape
the 2nd last last pix is side view of the rads & the one rad I killed with stupity

last shot was this was at the hardware store today look sharp !

GET THIS THING UP AND RUNNING!! then u should start mass producing. lol.

I wouldn't rule out the possibility of condensation completely. Like you mentioned earlier, all it takes for condensation to occur is a surface being cooler than the air around it. There's a build where some guy ran copper pipe through the ground under his property and basically used the cool ground beneath the surface as his heat exchanger. Naturally the ground temperature is lower than the air temp above ground, so condensation was a legitimate concern. It may or may not be for you, but for safety's sake I'd keep it on your mind.


P.S. This build is my current favorite project. Keep it up man : )

As long as the temp difference isn't immense and he has a decent amount of airflow through the case he should have a problem with it.

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Originally Posted by KaptCrunch

need to worry after 5 degress of change and high % humidity of the area.

note he's put heat in the crawl space and heat from MB will eat the sweat provided still using case fans

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Yeah i plan at least 3 12o's mm fans

or even a pair of 250mm's fans blowing at the MoBo & drives as they run silent


WELL back to work on this ! more pix later today of what i get done

Well i got a UFO sheild up
useful
kinda over kill but i want it easy removeable & tuff

as i have to haul this thing into the crawl space without damageing the rads

here's the pix

notch work to get the rads sitting in opening well

gonna seal Rads with silicone easiet way
the way they sit on the box useing weather stripping as seals would be a PIA

this the rad hold down single bar across the center will use screws/washers from the inside to attach futher. u will see that in later pix

here's the overkill rad protection system i used
it as all so uses the hold down bar for the rads

more detail on hold down & sheild

these shots show the inside of the rad fitting & where i'll attach the rads futher to the box this will help pull the seam tight ..then it time for silicone all the contact points

as i tested the VER#1 for flow & water temp dump & figured out the baffle AND everything worked very well
i'm not gonna test this till every thing is ready for assy .
now all i got left is mount the blower & seal up on this
I now have to do the plumbing work & build the PC
I have a test bed & will test the MobO . pull the stock cooling off ,put all EK blocks on everything but a V2 on the CPU all will be tested on the Bed then installed in Case testing agin then testing once more
all loops & blocks will get a 24 hour test all by themselves with EK res's & Iwaki pumps
then it's under the house for hook up & another round of testing