kur¡,
Go here.
Look for "VDDC measure" in the pic...
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kur¡,
Go here.
Look for "VDDC measure" in the pic...
Hi, at last I've voltmoded my 4870. Thirst of all GPU OC potential strictly depends on Memory clock. Here are some interesting results I've got:
1.283v (default), possible variants:
(GPU-MEM 3DMark Vantage GPU Score)
875-1200 9976
1.300v, possible variants:
880-1200 10005
1.305v, possible variants:
890-1150 10099
880-1200 10007
1.325v, possible variants:
895-1000 9839
890-1050 9983
885-1100 10015
875-1200 9976
1.350v, possible variants:
910-900 9827
905-1000 9967
895-1050 10004
885-1100 10020
880-1150 9998
870-1200 9914
What does it looks like? Right, it's no other then over current protection and 90% that it's located in BIOS (by the way you can check current in gpu-z 0.2.7). So here's Power Play II AMD has been talking about. Well AMD did a good job on failing our OC. :D
I hope in future versions of RBE we could heal this anti OC protection. Until it's done, no WR on this adapter would be possible. :/
By the way, it was certainly not because of the over hitting (using 1.35V):
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/163056.jpg
Could that be what causes my problem which is as followed:
My Powercolor 4870 is under water with the new EK FC block. Before vGPU mod I ran it at 850/1000.
Today I did the vGPU mod, and where ATI Tool would artifact above 850 before, I was now able to run ATI tool artifact free at 940MHz. (See picture).
My problem is, that eventhough ATI tool runs flawless, no game will run for more than a few secounds. Everything above aprox 1.37v will make the screen go black or the displaydriver to stop working.
It dosent matter if I only uses the same 850mhz as I did before the mod.
Lowering mem speed dosent do anything for me either..
Would it make any sense to try another BIOS?
Really hope you guys are able to help me out here :shrug:
http://www.solveig-iver.dk/jakob/Capture.JPG
Søndergård
How far does your adapter go with furemark?
Furmark gave me the :shocked: after a few sec.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirton
^ Yeah, that's the same thing I got as I turned up the volts. Does your D601 diagnostic LED ever turn on when stuff crashes? I got it to turn on from time to time, indicated "critical core power failure". Only happens if you set voltages higher than 1.35V-1.37V on idle. It was very strange behavior indeed. I noticed that at this point VRM temps are also extremely high. Either way, it will not really matter what your clocks are in this case. The card will crash no matter what. If you lower the volts you will be fine. It must be that some OCP or OVP thing is kicking in...
Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
I think you just saved my day :D I tryed lowering the voltage to 1.35 and now Furmark dosent crash imidiatly. I was not ablo to run 900MHz core at that voltage, but at 1.375 I am running Furmark at 900Mhz. So far 5 min..
Now I just need to make some finer adjustments and find out how high I can go without the "problem" is kicking in.
Thanks again.
^ No worries. Glad I could help. :D
Which brand is your card (e.g., HIS, PowerColor, Diamond, Sapphire)?
Also, are you able to run the memory at least 1100 at that core speed? I found that the highest stable I could achieve with the Diamond 4870 XOC BE on air was 875/1125 at 1.358V core, 1.501V memory and 850/1150 at slightly different voltages. Either way, I did not notice almost any performance gain when compared to say 825/1125...
Thanks :)Quote:
Originally Posted by largon
Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
Well I have been using the Diamond 4870 XOC BE and ASUS TOP BIOS. No real difference here..
Hmm, the 900MHz core I can't get stable. I can get Furmark stable but then Crysis will fail, or the opposit.
Looks like the best possible all stable is about 880mhz.
The mem I havent messed with yet. Stock/water is only accepts about 1025, but I am considering modding the mem as well.
Quite dissapointet that the vmod only gave me about 30 Mhz from the non mod 850mhz oc I had before :( Though I am quite sure it is possible to bench much higher, as I was able to run ati tool artifact free at 940Mhz.. Maybe not..
Is my problem normal or? Is it possible that a mod will remove the OVP (If thats what causing my problem?)
What do you cool your card with? And how musk can I expect to gain in mem mhz when max stock is about 1025? (Know its hard to predict, but if it is just 25Mhz, I wont even bother). To me 24/7 and stability is nr.1
My cooling is a HR-03GT with a 92mm fan on top with stock HR-03 sinks on memory and VRM. I am looking to install this guy http://www.thermalright.com/new_a_pa...50aHVzaWFzdA== (an HR-09 Type 4) onto the VRMs. I already tried the HR-09 Type 2 but its wider 15.5mm base is too wide and cannot fit properly onto the VRMs. The Type 4 guy has a 12mm wide base so it should fit. I found that the card is extremely sensitive to upping the voltage on the core and the memory. When you do both you get BS much faster. I think in this case it is some kind of OCP kicking in. You will see that yourself if you try to voltmod the memory in addition to the core. With such a high core at 880MHz or 900MHz you will not be able to OC the memory much from your 1000MHz, or at all. I would say that you will get artifacts as soon as you hit over 1050MHz so if 50MHz is worth it for you to mod things go ahead. Unfortunately the 4870 XOC BE does not OC that well. I am not sure about other cards but I think most 4870 have a problem getting over 850MHz core and about 1125MHz - 1150MHz memory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Søndergård
I also found the same thing you did in terms of ATITool/FurMark and games. If I stabilize ATITool can be artifact free with high voltage at high core clocks with good cooling. However, FurMark crashes at those voltages so it forces you to go with lower voltages if you want higher clocks for FurMark. These higher clocks at lower voltages however cause instability in games as your lower volts now are not sufficient for stable operation in games so you need to lower your clocks as well. It is a really stupid cycle that I found. Hence the reason why I had to stabilize at the clocks I mentioned before. I have worked on this card for > 12 days straight with constantly the same results using three different cooling systems and several cards. All were with same results.
To summarize, what you will find is that if you up the memory voltage and memory clock you will have to lower your core clock and potentially core voltage, and vice versa. The highest stable overall combination will be something in between 850/1150 and 875/1125 (notice the trade-off between core and memory clocks :p:). Ironically, I found that in games the best performance was at 825/1125 clocks and that anything higher did not yield anything significant in terms of FPS (some higher clocks even yield less :rolleyes:) as well as that the performance at higher clocks did not justify the added heat output and power consumption of the board.
Edit: One other thing to note is that the Qimonda memory chips are 40X, so they are rated for max 4000MHz with critical maximum voltage being 2.0V (stock is 1.501V). Running them at 4400MHz or higher is already 10%+ OC on the memory so it is not that strange that it would be causing problem when trying to push it very high. Some people can run very high since they do not care about 100% stability and they do not even notice some artifacts in games so for them going 4600MHz - 4800MHz with high core clocks (> 850MHz) is okay.
Edit 2: I would not hold my breath on the OVP/OCP being disabled in the future using any BIOS or other hard-mod method really. I found in the past that there is usually just too much work involved in doing this with mixed results at the end. If anything, it severely increases your risk of blowing up the board.
Well, hmm I think I will sleep on it. But I guess I will remove the hardmod and flash back to 850/1000 with std. voltage on everything.Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
No regreds though, it was my first hardmod, and it was fun as hell! Now I am just hoping I can remove the solderings and keep my waranty intact.
:shrug:
Use a solder wick and it comes of like a charm :p: I did that already a bunch of times. Then after you are done clean the board with some alcohol or (my favorite) acetone :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Søndergård
How do you guys solder? Do you place the tinned wire to the pad/leg and then heat the wire? Or do you heat the pad and the wire at the same time? I know I want to avoid cold joints, but I don't think I can hit the pad and the wire at the same time. When I solder, it seems that the tip of the tinned wire becomes like the iron and heats the solder on the pad well.
Sorry, I'm new to this and trying to avoid failure. I've been practicing a lot though. This is hella fun!
BTW I'm trying to mod my 4850's.
Im only a beginner, but I put a small amount of solder on the tip og the wire. Then I touch both the solderingpoint and the wire until they mix.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rickpatbrown
So, what are you guys final results with the MVDDC og MVDDQ mods? What did they before and after, and what amount af voltage do you think I can use for 24/7 on water?
Stock volts on MVDDC/Q are 1.501V. If you OC, the maximum voltage tolerance for the Qimonda chips is 2.00V. They will fail at this voltage however if ran constantly. Because of the issues with OCP/OVP however you will not be able to run the core and memory volts very high together. Expect that if your core voltage is set anywhere between 1.35V - 1.37V you will not be able to get more than 1.65V to the memory without starting to experience the same issues as you did before. I'd say your most stable voltages will be about 1.37V core and about 1.6V memory.
I am personally finding that 4870s are proving to be very finicky for OCing.
The memory controller (obviously inside the core) will start to crap out when using too high core speed & voltage. At core 850MHz @ 1.350-1.375V (whatever I used) it becomes really fluky and my card (HD4850) will no longer pass FurMark stability test. 1.400V core doesn't help, neither does 1.450V, neither does 1.500V . :shrug:
However the card is perfectly bench & game stable in other bench app's & games. Now the question is;
How smart is it to squeeze the core for the last 50MHz when the card & its performance is already held back by the "low" clocked GDDR3 mem?
These will not run safely beyond 1200-1250MHz.
How smart is it to create an even bigger memory bottleneck? :shakes:
However, getting the core speed up to max on the HD4870 is a different story. The GDDR5 memory allows this card to scale properly with core speed up to at least 1000MHz (I'd think). :yepp:
//
I don't know, but I think I'll keep my HD4850 at ~800MHz core, 1150MHz mem (give or take 50MHz on both! :D).
Hi guys , I just ran some tests on my new 4870x2 and fitted a 4870 for tri-fire but my pc will not boot with the 4870 installed , I get cmos error code shown on the lcd poster , has anyone else seen anything like this ? I have had this vid card in this pc before , and the pc will boot with either vid card on its own.
This vid card has been flashed with the modded bios , could this be upsetting things ? Or would they just dislike cf if that was the case ?
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
:up:
you don't mention what kind of power supply you have.Quote:
Originally Posted by aussie-revhead
This is only in theory. In practice there is no way that you will come even close to 1GHz core. 900MHz stable would be very lucky. Granted, one thing is true, the added mem bandwidth does kind of push one to try to push the core as high as possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by OnLine
I was just re-reading something and I noticed this...
You are saying you are not failing due to over heating at 1.35V, but you are running your GPU at 1.263V which is the default voltage (not 1.283V). Try actually running FurMark with 1.35V and high clocks. Otherwise, good observations, there is a definite link between maximum core and maximum memory :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirton
Someone made a pencil vmod for the 4870?
no, its not possible. there is not resistor to pencilQuote:
Originally Posted by MonsterMash
God damn'it, so the only way to make a vmod on a 4870 is soldering a vr?Quote:
Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG
yes. for that matter it is a fairly easy voltmod the vddc point is very isolated. if your not good at soldering its hard though because the point is very smallQuote:
Originally Posted by MonsterMash
hello i was wondering if anyone else is getting ATI Crossfire Disabled (crossfire available) in gpu-z, ive set it already in CCC to use overdrive and enable crossfire with a clock of 800/1100 for both cards, and when i test games and furmark and 3dmark06 i see first 4870 go to 800 core but the 2nd card is always at its idle 500/1100, only the first card goes to overdrive, i might be thinking that my crossfire is not enabled but when i use the overdrive core adjustments and test it it goes up to 800, anyone can shed light to this? thanks
OK, I've got a problem measuring, probably cos of my incompetence, but wanted to recheck with you guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by largon
I did use the above URL, and picture that is shown there. But I couldn't get any numbers from my multimeter, though it could be that I've missed the point somehow, even though I've tried 5-6x..
So let's take it step by step, as I don't use MM usually, and I've borrowed this one just for the occasion ;)
1) I take multimeter and turn it on
2) I have a switch and a dial to set up the desired range
a) little switch that selects amps/ohms/and two types of voltages. One is V http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-isto.jpg (that's DC right? or not?) and the other is V~ http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-izmj.jpg (AC?). I'm not certain which of the two is right (that's why I've included pictures, I hope they are shown right in post), as I'm not sure if GPU voltage is AC or DC.. Though I was just struck with the VDDC markings, but it could mean anything as I still don't know what MVDDQ means either except that it's some memory voltage :D So I guess it's DC, but tell me anyway, is it this one http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-isto.jpg or this one http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-izmj.jpg ?
b) next I have a dial that's similar to this one http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h.../th_V-dial.jpg; it lets me select 2/20/200 for whatever I've selected on the switch (ohms, amps, volts). Should it be better to select 2V or 20V, since VGPU is <2V actually, I guess 2V is better and more precise, right?
3) I take those black and red umm "cables", and I put one on the VDDC measurement point on the VGA card, and other one where? As much as I know, it's just important that circle is closed, so I've just put the other side on the PC case.. It worked fine when I've tried to measure current on peripheral/molex plugs, showed 5V and 12V no problem.. But if VGPU is DC than what? And I guess than there is difference between using red or black one.. So a bit more info in here as well..
There are few things I could have missed, I'm no longer sure, but maybe I've switched to wrong voltage type (step 2-a). Also, maybe my PC case is not good for closing the circle when measuring VDDC on GPU (step 3), or i've just placed wrong red/black cable on the measurment point. Also, I could have missed the measurment point completely, so I didn't have good enough contact. Anyway, please, step-by-step instructions would be real nice, so I can do some measurments today or tomorrow when I should also have IR thermometer and power consumption meter, so I can check what are the effects of voltage/clock changes in BIOS, and how will it all affect stock cooler vs aftermarket cooler..
Thanks in advance :D
EDIT:
OK, solved. Not sure what I was doing yesterday, but today it works.
Btw, steps go as followed, just in case someone as confused as me tries later on :)
1) Take multimeter and turn it on
2a) select part of multimeter which shows http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-isto.jpg
2b) with dial select 2V; in case you use same dial to select range and type, make sure, it says "2http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/h...xZg/V-isto.jpg"
3) Take the red probe (cable) and put it on "VDDC measure" point marked in picture, while putting black probe to ground (meaning electrical ground, not on the floor :D -> black wires in molex/peripheral connector should be fine, just stick it into one of the two middle molex holes, so you have black on black, can't go wrong.. unless you're ME :D )
Interesting enough, I got 1.271V idle on 160/225 clocks, while 1.288V when overclocked to 790/1100 but still in 2D. Under load under overclock I get 1.305V measured. Is this ok? I don't have any mods yet on this card, neither BIOS or hardmods.. I'll go restart, and try again, as I haven't written it down right away..
DC, 2V, red lead on voltage measuring point, black lead on ground (e.g., side of your case).Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
Thanks man, I just figured it out few minutes ago. Could you tell me if I got right measurments before I go to restart and try once more on a "clean" system (I've had ATT running while measuring, maybe that scewed results a bit)Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
Ok, checked:
stock clocks 750/900
1.281V 2D idle, 1,294-1,298V under Crysis bench
overclocked 790/1100
1.284V 2D idle, 1,297-1,300V under Crysis bench
Weird how I got bit different than when I had ATT running :D But sounds correct enough.. Now time to do some modding ;)
Cya!
Yeah, those voltages sound about right.Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
here's my E7200+4850 :
AC S1 38 idle 52 full load, 1.33VGPU + 2.1V for DDR3
E7200 should work on lower V but i didn't have to much time so i made it the safe way...
http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/3883/15423dg9.jpg
Way to hide the desktop pr0n :p:
j/k, nice clocks :up:
Why? I made 15500 using a E8400 @ 4.5Ghz 530MHz FSB and much highr clocks in mine 4850 (900/2200) and u have about the same score?Quote:
Originally Posted by stingush
what driver or tweaker are u using? Is that all caused by Vista 64?
i dont know, im using Cat 8.7 and thats it, simple overdrive OC with good cooling on gpu and memories of the card, thats all. guess it is vista x64.. :(
also, my winxp sp2 is full of **** so i guess if i had a clean installation of the windows i whould get something like 157XX or so...
Info for everyone!
LINK TO THE POST with some new BIOS from ATi, with some interesting stuff in it. I'm at work so can't test it, but read the post text and it will sound interesting. Specialy if this is really from ATI and not from Diamond (guy did say ATI explicitly, so should be official).
It has unlocked CCC overdrive, and seems they did something to voltages as well. You'll get exe file that auto-flashes the card, but you can extract it (I've done it with PowerArchiver, but probably WinRAR will work too), and you'll get the files. "4870-128Kb512MBOC795-1100MHz.sb" can be opened in RBE no problem and shows this:
BIOS DATE: 08/13/08 13:01
VERSION: 113-BA0701-100
ATOMBIOS VERSION: ATOMBIOSBK-ATI VER011.003.000.001.029254
500/1100/1,276V 2D
795/1100/1,276V 3D
Note - higher voltage! As soon as I get home I'll flash it, try it, and see if it really ups the volts, and if you can use lower volts as well.
Also, 990/1250 is upper OC limit in CCC.
This should be official ATI driver for boards based on reference design, so start flashing ppl! :)
Btw, I have posted or will be posting this in other threads too, as it is VERY interesting info, and I guess as many people know about it and test it - the better ;)
Cya all!
EDIT: note - this is for 4870 cards
In the newer version of RBE it has the option to increase the clocks for CCC as well if nto mistaken.
It does, but no BIOS so far managed to push voltages up for 4870 cards.
I'm home now and I've tested few things.
By flashing this bios you really do get more juice, even if by a small ammount. Earlier under load I've measured 1,307-1,312 V
(overclocked to 790/1100) and now I get 1,331-1,334 V on 795/1100.. so this is 0,02V more. And no it's not cos of additional 5 MHz, since even 50MHz hardly pushed it for 0,002V :)
Other than this, I've tried if this BIOS allows lowering voltages, but as much as I've tested - nothing happens. I've tried by new Ati tray tools, by RBE low voltage tweak, by entering values manualy in bios - nothing helped.
I did NOT try rising voltage in BIOS, but with ATT it apparently doesn't move. I believe this BIOS has same voltage-changing limitations that the reference one had, only now it's fixed to 1,276V instead of earlier 1,263V. You can try it yourselves, and good luck :)
I'll keep playing with the low-volt BIOS cos I'm mostly limited by the CPU anyway...
What we can expect now, is that someone will compare original BIOS and this one, and maybe will figure out WHICH bits exactly change voltages either to higher or lower values.. I hope RBE will be able to do it in a release or two :)
Try and measure it for yourself under load, it's 1.283v.Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
http://img93.imageshack.us/img93/607...loadfk4.th.jpg
I can actually hit pretty high at 1.35v with water, but unfortunately when I try OC memory a bit it goes down fast. For example I can pass Vantage with maxed memory only on 890/1200 (gpu/mem), and with no vmod and stock cooling I can do it on 875/1200. Don't seem normal to me.
What I was trying to say, there is no improvement after upping the voltage and that's abnormal. Well there is if I OC only GPU in furmark:
default voltage - 860MHz
1.35v - 940MHz
1.4V - 965MHz
And another thin, when I try to pass Vantage on default voltage with maxed MEM clock, I actually can do it 15MHz higher then furmark can allow. With 1.35v it already becomes 50MHz lower! Now, that's what worries me.
Well, it does, but it isn't working. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by deathman20
Well, it's working now, cos RBE 1.14 is out :)
Hello everyone,
there is my result.
Gigabyte HD4850 + fv1000led(i'm planning to mod that sink).
Core-1.33V/812mhz;
Mem-2.25V/1125mhz.
Stable.
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/179/mineyz9.th.jpg
My plan is to get ~900mhz on core .. :\
Don't even think to try that whith this terrible cooler.Quote:
Originally Posted by 0maro
nice gpu clocks barr3l rid3r , could you tell us what's your gpu voltage? Are you 100% stable there or just for beches. What's you max stable?
And the saga of failed non-reference 4870s continues (definitely worth a read as what they are seeing is an ongoing issue with all 4870, especially with after market cooling)...
http://en.expreview.com/2008/08/23/p...-issues-check/
850 @ 1.34v fora daily useQuote:
Originally Posted by eddieobscurant
For 4870 users who want to use fixed resistors for the vmem mods, 4.7K Ohm resistor will yield 1.61v.
@dejanh and powercolor card
Well, I've had no problems with my 4870 even on 800/1100 and stock cooler, I just modified BIOS fan tables so I have low fan in 2D and high in 3D and that's it.. And I stay away from Furmark, cos if it runs all games just fine for hours and under 90C VRMs, why the hell would I want to run furmark for over 126C after 30 seconds?
Now I've mounted Accelero S1, and I have to say that manufacturers will have a hard time keeping this card cool with inferior cooling as this Powercolor had. I had S1 and two 120mm fans, and it was still no better under very high load than stock cooler was on 60% fans (except that it was quiet). So I had to mount a higher powered 120mm fan which is not noisy but can be heared even when it's not complete silence in the room, and only now do I have very good temps when not overclocked, and just about the same as stock @60% fan when OCed to 800/1100 and under heay load for an hour or so..
So I don't think that any manufacturer will get this one right. And the reason is not even in GPU speeds but in memory. This GDDR5 draws a lot of current, and it's the number one reason why both VRMs and even GPU heat up. Cos when I clock memory up, "MEMIO" sensor on GPU goes sky-high even with a good cooler like S1+dual fans, and that heats up whole GPU chip a bit.. Also, amps go up a lot, and that heats VRMs. So they can clock the GPUs but I wouldn't recommend anyone clocking memory after everything that I've tried. One more point for that is - this card is really not held back by memory. I'd say it's held by CPU (for anything not clocked over 3.5GHz), than GPU, and only than memory..
So people - for 24/7, just don't clock memory.. no need, and just a bunch of potential problems. Potential, but almost certain..
Agree completely. It is not the stock cards that tend to be problematic, it is the "factory OC" ones that do. Clearly the manufacturers do not really have a good idea of the cooling needed on these cards, especially the VRMs. That's basically what kills them all and exactly what I stated. Indeed, I found that it is the two memory VRMs that get ultra-hot. GPU VRMs get hot as well, but not as much as the memory ones. Keeping memory lower is a good idea. The memory is not a bottleneck for this card and only real benefit from OC comes when you OC the core. The minimum CPU to not cause bottleneck on this card is about 3.6GHz Core 2 (AMDs just are not going to do this ATM). The only thing I disagree on is that in my opinion the card should be able to run anything (including FurMark) without any risk of the card experiencing problems or worse yet frying. Maybe ATI engineering team and their manufacturers should use FurMark to stress their cards :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
:D @ Furmark testing in ATi :D ;)
Ok, I agree there shouldn't be any problems, with whichever software.. But ATi solved it, right? Tried Cat's 8.8? They halve the Furmark score, and that's it :D ;) :D
:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
New ATI motto - "If you can't fix it, break it!":ROTF:
is there anybody know where to adjust the 2d settings in ATi 4850? i already tried adjusting almost all the values in RBE but it seems no improvement in 2dbench in pcmark05 :(
thanks in advance :)
You can do it with RBE or ATT automatic 3D/2D profiles, if your goal is to lower clocks. If now, then you can simple edit CCC profile settings manually.
Here we go gents (and maybe some ladies)...time to stir up some s*** :)
I've been posting for weeks now how it looks like there are major issues with 4870 VRM cooling and/or the overall power design...some listened, some did not...
Finally, here is some official confirmation of VRM issues...sadly ATI just "glazes" over this by hacking the driver and not fixing a problem...
http://en.expreview.com/2008/08/26/a...it-run-slower/
Now again, I will care to reiterate over all of the threads that I have been posting in related to this...
This thread is a pretty good collection of all the places I have posted about this already (see first post)... http://forums.tweaktown.com/f31/diam...edition-27348/
Let's hear some opinions!
I have three of these cards and don't experience any of the problems you have have. Furthermore ATI Tool is not current software, W1zzard himself has said you cannot use it for current gen card testing so that part of your 'info' isn't valid.
Dejanh, don't spam the entire forum with that same post. pick one thread and leave it there.
Thanks so much for your help guys. I got my 4850 at the point I wanted it at. I will have to push it to the limits when the time comes, right now no need as I don't play crysis any more and max resolution 1920x1080.
850/1125 - Not maximum, but daily clocks
1.4V Hardmod (It took me about 45 minutes, I know I am a hard mod rookie.)
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/7498/img1916jo9.jpg
good stuff. your 4850 clocks higher than my unmodded 4870's :D
And it works in furmark also :DQuote:
Originally Posted by xMrBunglex
:rofl: So TrueQuote:
Originally Posted by Barr3l Rid3r
Enough already.... It's clear that you're not happy with Ati's HD4870 , but man, please stop spamming you opinion about Ati in this and other forums. You're just bashing them and that has nothing to with overclocking or voltmodding in this case.Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
We all know how you feel about Ati's 'vrm problems' (how could we not, after so many posts )
If you're so unhappy with them, sell your card get a NVidia card and send you rants at them directly by mail or by phone , i don't care. But stop posting this nonsense here. Now back on-topic....pleaseee
Most of the people here are gonna take off the stock cooling on the HD4870,and heating the VRM won't be a problem.And we're gonna mod it too..
Who gives a crap that on stock cooler u have artifacts with some Diamond Black edition junk....:shrug: ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by h3x0r_1984
It follows the reference design... so it shouldn't happen only w/ diamond.
Anyway, even u got better cooling u won't made the VRM stronger, and that's the point, u will still having to choose if u wanna clock the gpu or the memory, u still worried that u got a weak overloaded noisy digital VRM w/ only 3 phases...
Exception to the new Gainward Goldensample 4870, it have the same analog 4 phases vrm as the 4850 but w/ better and bigger ferrite chokes and mosfets, better and all solids capacitors, 8pin PCI-e conector and a plus of DDR5.
Sorry, I got carried away when I saw that somebody actually brought this thing to light in a more official manner :)Quote:
Originally Posted by xMrBunglex
Thank you Barr3l. Clearly some of these guys do not get the point at all...not my problem I guess. Thanks :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Barr3l Rid3r
Speaking of which, the details of the Gainward card look promising for the Palit Sonic Dual Edition as it seems to be the same card :) Can't wait to see how high I can push this one. The XOC BE capped out at about 860/1160 with maximum stable voltage of about 1.35-1.37V. Not much gain considering the card is voltmodded :rolleyes:
Edit: Oh yeah, looks like the Palit card is the same as the Gainward. A review is up, it's in Thai but at least you can see the card nicely. No more digital VRMs baby! The custom designed sink looks sweet too, full coverage of the PCB, front to back :D See here...
http://www.unlimitpc.com/index.php?n...pid=111&page=1
Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
woow it sux heavily, vmodded 4870 and only 860Mhz? w/ 1.42V i can hit 920Mhz in my air cooled 4850...
Yeah, you can't get the 4870 that high. You can't even get the voltage that high. Peak core is 1.35V - 1.37V. At least that seems to be the consensus to date. Nobody reported being able to go higher and stay stable. Even at those volts it is a juggling act between your core volts and memory volts. It really seems the 4850s have a superior power design to the 4870s. I can't wait to try that new sonic dual edition 4870 with a different power design :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Barr3l Rid3r
i think it's just that the 4850 uses GDDR3, which uses a lot less energy and creates less heat.
I did not verify this, but is GDDR5 not supposed to have an advantage of requiring less power and being cooler running when compared to GDDR3/4? The stock voltage is 1.501V too which is quite low and sort of supports this claim...Quote:
Originally Posted by xMrBunglex
i don't know for sure. i know it uses less energy if it's clocked at the same speed, but the GDDR5 runs twice as fast.Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
that makes sense. indeed, clockspeed is about the same (900mhz) but it has to push double the data. so this MUST consume energy due to the laws of thermodynamics..
Of course it makes no sense at all...does DDR2 consume more power than the DDR? No.Quote:
that makes sense. indeed, clockspeed is about the same (900mhz) but it has to push double the data. so this MUST consume energy due to the laws of thermodynamics..
Without voldmodding the memory on the 4870..would u get to a 900 with 1.4V ?
Well, actually I am pretty sure I am right. The memory runs at 1.5V and power consumption (W) is directly related to the supply voltage through amperage (A) so I'd say its power consumption is certainly lower than that of GDDR3/4. This is also supported by information provided by Qimonda in their spec and data sheets, as well as through information available online based on AMD's comments one of which can be found here...Quote:
Originally Posted by xMrBunglex
http://www.allbusiness.com/electroni...1412683-1.html
there has to be a reason for the 4870's beefy VRM's though. i doubt it's because of its modest core clock speed advantage.
I think its rather a lack of beefy VRMs. I have a feeling they cheaped out on the voltage controllers on the 4870. The PCB even has one empty slot for a fourth VRM to feed the GPU but it is unused. 3 phase power + 3 phase inductor for the GPU, 2 and 2 for the memory. It's the GPU asking for a lot of juice when you are running at or near 100% GPU utlization that causes the VRMs to overheat, at least that is my obervation to date and it's supported even by thermal images taken to date on the card (http://www.forumdeluxx.de/forum/show...93#post9575293). The memory VRMs get very hot too, for which I have no explanation other than the GPU VRMs cause the memory VRMs to heat up more because of proximity.Quote:
Originally Posted by xMrBunglex
Also, the surface area of the VRMs is so damn tiny it is very difficult to cool them efficiently. All the heat gets concentrated on such a small area...
where do you guys buy all your vr's for these?
Digikey or Mouser, these two have a huge inventory and shipment is fast.Quote:
Originally Posted by exhausted mule
excellent. ty
I flashed my Asus HD4870 with the Asus TOP bios. Runs 850 core 24/7 but no problems up to 890Mhz (highest the ASUS TOP allows) core stock, no vmods done at all.
Cooled with MP-01 and some VRM sinks with a 120mm blowing over them.
Here was a run at 850 mhz,
http://3dxtreme.net/other/ASUS%20HD4...870flashed.jpg
http://3dxtreme.net/other/ASUS%20HD4870/img0353tz1.jpg
dnottis - aren't those memory heatsinks a bit too low-profile? And what are the top clocks that you get on memory with those 850GPU? Just those 1000 or can you play with 850/1100 or something like that?
Also, those black heatsinks on VRMs, are those 3 pieces of these put one by the other -> http://www.swiftnets.com/products/mc21.asp
Seems like a lot of people that do water cooling use these for VRMs, so can you post your VRM temperatures during some heavy load (like Crysis benching, AtiTool, or something similar - I won't say Furmark on purpose :D )
what are you using to test stability besides 3DMark? if that is truly stable, you have a special little GPU.Quote:
Originally Posted by dnottis
I can do 1100, but the extra memory bandwidth does nothing in benchmarks. Why kill DDR5 when there is already more than enough memory bandwidth. choose 1000 to make it a nice even 4gb/sec memory bandwidth.Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
Yea, those are the Swiftech mosfet sinks from the 8800 series. I thermal taped them together and installed them as a whole one piece heat sink over the VRMs. A low speed yate sits over the top.
My VRM temps during Furmark hit tops of 84c and thats at 860mhz. I can game and benchmark at 890mhz including COD4, Crysis, Stalker, Grid, etc, haven't tried Furmark at 890 mhz though yet. I will just to see. With my setup the core doesn't break ~38deg c. Using Cats 8.8 Furmark doesnt push the VRM past 85deg c.
As for stability, I ran 3dmark but as everyone else gaming is the real stability test. Yes, its completely game / bench stable at 890, but I run 850 or lately 860 24/7. I flashed this card (Asus non TOP) with the Asus TOP bios and this thing has proven to be a monster. The first HIS HD4870 I had died at stock settings after about 2 weeks. But the Asus has proven to be a crazy overclocker.
Thanks for the details, it seems I'll have to find me a way to get to those Swiftechs somehow :(
Are you volt modding at all 'cause it does not look like you are...Quote:
Originally Posted by dnottis
nope, stock in that respect.Quote:
Originally Posted by dejanh
Here is a few mins at 900mhz, again no vmod just flashed to Asus TOP bios. That is the max of the CCC with this bios.
http://3dxtreme.net/other/ASUS%20HD4870/900core.jpg
that's awesome. i'm jealous.
crazy!
I can do 850mhz stock volts, stock bios, using the Ati traytools. Temp around 47º.
Powercolor hd4870
dnottis - you've said "Using Cats 8.8 Furmark doesnt push the VRM past 85deg c." Have you renamed furmark.exe to something else? YOu do know that new driver cuts the load on Furmark for roughly 40-50% ?
Doesn't matter anymore. As of yesterday the card will no longer boot, just up and died one morning. SDS (sudden death syndrome) hits another HD4870. These cards are garbage, first one was bad off the bat, this one died 3 weeks later.Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
I'm going to an Nvidia GTX 260 this time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dnottis
u should go for a 4850 gainward golden sample
dnottis - sorry to hear that another one went dead :( Seems like watercooling is not a good idea on these cards, unless you've got a water block with complete card coverage..
And this is just one more reason for me to stay away from Furmark in general, I'd say it is just not healthy for these cards.
Already have another solution...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...02&postcount=5
Why..no Furmark? :D
my memio is 15c higher than the other gpu sensors..... The 4870 pcb is so weak that the Ek full cover block never sits right. It bends a lot.
I ran Furmark, VRMs get about 80c on the GTX 260. RTHDRIBL is more on par with the temps I see in games though.Quote:
Originally Posted by LuxZg
Can someone, with Sapphire HD4850, post their max core and mem OC with no hardmod but air cooled? Mine was 760mhz core and 1160mhz memory when i passed Vantage Performance run. Vantage gave graphics driver errors on 770 mhz core speed. I haven't tried out the max memory OC. I have AS1 as a heatsink with 2x120mm@800rpm. Temps dont go over 45C in Vantage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viilutaja
30ºC IDLE / 39ºC Load @ Furmark
@840Mhz/2000Mhz
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/1909/vga1rr1.jpg
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/9203/vgatempfp3.jpg
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=879319
This VMOD is for red PCB, but I have blue one. Two pictures of the problem:
http://shrani.si/t/39/10u/kg0SaKK/vddcsolder.jpg http://shrani.si/t/37/1n/4yNWBI53/img5012.jpg
Is there VMOD for blue PCB? Or does anyone know the bios who would raise GPU voltage?
someone how much voltage the 4850 Core can handle ? i got one and in 1.5 she got sic forever :p
I've got my reference sapphire at 820Mhz with 1.44vcore 24/7 for several months without a problem. I have tried up to 1.6 vcore for benches without a problem. I couldn't get it 100% stable at 840Mhz no matter what voltage i used, even at 1.6 it wasn't 100% stable. The only problem that i have found is that at high voltage during furmark, when i'm not stable (for example when i was trying for 840) and i got artifacts, these artifacts wouldn't leave until i shut down my computer. After that everything was normal. With just a reboot the issue wasn't resolving and i don't know why.
Well, I just picked up a brand new Palid HD 4870 Sonic Dual Edition and I am trying to volt mod it. The voltage seems to be determined through a VID table and is controlled by NCP5388 (http://www.onsemi.com/pub_link/Collateral/NCP5388-D.PDF). The phase controller is located on the top side of the card, but it is connected to resistors on the back side arranged in two rows. The rows have 3+4 1k Ohm resistors soldered on in the top and bottom row respectively. These look to be pullup resistors however so I have no idea how VID is determined currently. Nothing seems to match the tables. Anyway, I took the DMM and measured the voltages to be 1.245V idle and 1.263V load. And that's about as far as I got. I managed to map connections on the bottom to the pins of the NCP5388 and they map as follows (I'm using the word bridge here to indicate the small section where two connected or unconnected solder points are where resistors could be added or are already present):
Pin 2 (VID0) maps to 1st set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 3 (VID1) maps to 2nd set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 4 (VID2) maps to 3rd set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 5 (VID3) maps to 4th set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 6 (VID4) maps to 5th set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 7 (VID5) maps to 6th set of bridges in both rows.
Pin 8 (VID6) maps to 7th bridge in the lower row.
Pin 9 (VID7) maps to the complete set of bridges in the lower row.
The pics of the card from the front and from the back are attached to this post (I took these from the web as my camera sucks for closeup shots)...
Help please :)