Ryzen - Return of the Jedi

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ACD

Let's see 32m :D

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Working through imc coldbug and i have better times saved on usb stick but gives you a general idea....

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...ps8no0l5ab.jpg

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psezeilei1.jpg

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psvlgkqauj.jpg

Bench session went very smooth ch6 cooperated 100%.

As long as your aware that 95% of chips are going to have imc coldbug and avoid high mem speeds it just works.

I had ln2 mode enabled for entire session. Never had a boot issue till i tried cas 9...my sticks are not good enough for c9 it seems.

Big :up: to runmc (ron mcall) if he still lurks the forums. 5 years plus the phase units he built just continue to work flawlessly....never even needed a recharge.

Bios was stuck @ 5c,ryzen master 0c. Even under cinebench lowest it hit was -34c, under pi -38 and idling @ -44c with 1.6v

Are you running AGESA 1.0.0.4 or the latest AGESA 1.0.0.4a?

I am running the fastest possible PI config.

This chip is flaky i took screens to show.

Typical ryzen dramatic black screen in cinebench when not stable..
This a a 3.9 stable air chip....
Just testing stability not bothering with score...its w10 anyway so does not count...

1.4v

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5cru8ou4.jpg

1.4 still
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pscxfshuep.jpg

1.45
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psc8zf6orn.jpg

Where i left off on pi. Tuning diff strap and speed currently..
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pshjgvyedv.jpg

At the above effeciency...im 7:30s @ 4.8....
Its far from effecient for 4.6 but very fast for these memory speeds...

these quick blacks I got today several times. But how to fix it? I can run 4100 MHz R15 with 1.42V in BIOS + LLC3. So I tried 4150 MHz in steps 1.44V to 1.47V and the same, after few seconds of rendering black window and code simply 8 :).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FlanK3r

these quick blacks I got today several times. But how to fix it? I can run 4100 MHz R15 with 1.42V in BIOS + LLC3. So I tried 4150 MHz in steps 1.44V to 1.47V and the same, after few seconds of rendering black window and code simply 8 :).

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Bin to win......no way to fix black screen. its the limit of your chip at x volts and x temps.........

Anyway I just wanted to show there is a ton of room on the table still.

this run was not tuned properly and with just a slight increase in memory speed completely smashed my above run......

busy week again and its certainly killing my ability to tune around the imc bug.....phone is ringing non stop......I do best with 0 distractions....

7:3x is more than possible at 4.6......that's why I am running 4.6...

Of course you need an imc that will cooperate for that 7:3x range but I am 100% certain without a good cold imc I can pull this down to 7:4x range

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psisosw1tq.jpg

Any tips for LN2 and IMC coldbug? I will test 1500X and maybe also 1700X this weekend with LN2...

Start off with a profile 2666Mhz CL14, ignore cpu fan, and see what the cores can do.

Fighting with ram and LN2 is fun, I had the luxury of the cascade @ -120c to see what the IMC wont do. In the guide Elmor has a graph that is pretty accurate to all chips and how they respond cold, just factor in he is basing that graph upon the 1800X and the lesser bins are in fact lesser bins thus lower frequencies to be expected.

Dropping SMT will get you a little extra speed if you are seeking 5Ghz without threading.

Like I said 7:4x definitely possible even fighting a wicked bad cold bug.

I'm really stretching it running this chip @ 4.6 so yet to get an actually tuned run to complete.

I think but not positive 7:3x might be a reality if I can get it to cooperate for a tuned run.

If you notice I pulled 3 secs off time with considerably less memory speed without software tweaking ;)

Think I am going to break the rig down for the meantime however as I just picked up a K7 to test.

32g testing is top priority so give me a few days to work through it and see if its possible.....

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pswgsrkkeh.jpg

Thank you guys for few tips :) Keep fingers cross :) After I will lost my nervoues, I will have second PC for LN2 benhcing (Phenom II x6 1090T BE)

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Originally Posted by FlanK3r

Thank you guys for few tips :) Keep fingers cross :) After I will lost my nervoues, I will have second PC for LN2 benhcing (Phenom II x6 1090T BE)

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To Late
My best X6 is sold
Would have been a good processor to bench under LN2

https://abload.de/img/42ghz1456fertigyxssn.png

Most good air = bad ln2.

Was that last run from 1866 divider?

Chew:not always true. I tested x6 1100T, this chip was good on AIR and good at LN2 too :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Johan45

Was that last run from 1866 divider?

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Trc gives away what divider is used

Or you can just see the FSB : DRAM ratio on the screen. (FSB:DRAM - damn smiley...)

Use whats fast...not what you think is fast ;)

My initial thrill of Ryzens performance for a workstation is now being scarred by random instabilities and crashes when running long-term, on NVMe storage, virtual machines, encoding and BOINC projects when not in use. My feelings from trying to use Ryzen for a workstation - it's not production-ready. Hopefully AMD irons out the kinks in a better BIOS/AGESA/chip revision. There are definitely some I/O issues.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Most good air = bad ln2.

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Was wathercooling
Don't know How the X6 perform at higher clocks under ln2
My cooling was only enough for 4.2ghz @ Prime
But Need realy less v-Core for 4.2

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aerou

My initial thrill of Ryzens performance for a workstation is now being scarred by random instabilities and crashes when running long-term, on NVMe storage, virtual machines, encoding and BOINC projects when not in use. My feelings from trying to use Ryzen for a workstation - it's not production-ready. Hopefully AMD irons out the kinks in a better BIOS/AGESA/chip revision. There are definitely some I/O issues.

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what is you SOC voltage?

SOC preety much effects usb pci etc etc.

Ok so gigabyte K7........board can be a chore to OC ref clock wise.....

The basic stuff is easy with 2x8g......but it ends there.

BUG
ref clock is rendered useless at least with this chip once you deviate from stock multi ( auto setting )

Pretty much anything over 33.50x multi unless you have a golden 4.1g chip is going to be near impossible to use refclock on.

Will post e6 if you change multi when using ref clock.

I found a workaround to get my 1700 up to 3.9 using auto via ryzen master.....great if you need to clock up....not so great if you need to boot a 1800x that can not do 4.3gig with 36x ( auto )

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...ps3sntd6nw.jpg

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pss2ezxkdy.jpg

It can do over 3600 after about 2 minutes of boot looping.

Ok maybe a slight exaggeration but yah at least 5 boot loops I would guess for each timing and AM4 training...

Basically it has potential but bios needs some serious polishing.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psqnr1qd0q.jpg

32g operation in its current state at optimal timings is not happening.

I honestly will not bother with super slacked timings, I find it a rather pointless sacrifice when the competition can do it...hopefully its possible after a few updates.

good news is it is actual capable of stability at 120 ref clock......

The other good news is that this is the chip I have been running at 1.6v for 3 days on phase change......looks like its not degrading....yet.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pse07yqlct.jpg

Ok got a little time in on the R5 1400.

did 4150 cine air @ 1.4

does 4.4 phase 1.4 not much scaling only tried 1.45....

whooping that 4770Ks azz though.....

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psii5hgnuj.jpg

fooled around with 32m on it diff strap diff tune faster time ;)

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...ps7eubmssp.jpg

How much does the R5 1400 @ 24/7 usable Voltage and 24/7 Memory in Cinebench?

High 800s @ 4050 @ 1.4v 24/7 3200 memory....even works with 32g..

Of course that is this chip...seems r5 is quite the lottery as far as overclocking goes..

Thx
With My FX i am around 740 with My 24/7 Setting
~4.7GHz & 930 @ CL11
Think will wait for Ryzen+

since the thread got quite long I am cleaning up usefull info and sticking it on page 1 for easy reference :)

will be adding K7 info soon

Shut my ringer off blew off about 12 phone calls.

Amazing what I can do when I force people to leave me alone...........

Closing in on the 7:3x range fast......

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psjajv3li0.jpg

Wow

How much v-dimm?

More than 1.35v :D

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Originally Posted by chew*

Shut my ringer off blew off about 12 phone calls.

Amazing what I can do when I force people to leave me alone...........

Closing in on the 7:3x range fast......

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psjajv3li0.jpg

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Did you need to do anything tricky to get the board to boot at 145MHz refclk? Are there any specific voltages that need to be massaged? Just looking for some guidance to manage a high refclk. Cheers.

Stay with 120 for 24/7. Video on page 1 shows settings for that with 32g ram.

Benching well...ymmv and yrmv.

Never shared bench settings in the past nor am I about to start doing so.

Its competition...lets keep it that way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Stay with 120 for 24/7. Video on page 1 shows settings for that with 32g ram.

Benching well...ymmv and yrmv.

Never shared bench settings in the past nor am I about to start doing so.

Its competition...lets keep it that way.

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Yeah, OK thanks for your general help as is evidenced by this thread, it is appreciated. My specific question, well, yes alrighty then. PS I'm not an extreme overclocker so it's not like I'll be challenging any of the extreme guys at all, ever...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cbjaust

Yeah, OK thanks for your general help as is evidenced by this thread, it is appreciated. My specific question, well, yes alrighty then. PS I'm not an extreme overclocker so it's not like I'll be challenging any of the extreme guys at all, ever...

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Yah thats not the issue. Thread has 55k views.

So i tell you i told all. Im more than happy and willing to share anything i find for 24/7 users however.

1 of those being 118-120 is the sweet spot for 24/7 real stability if you plan on using refclock at the cost of a very very small hit in frames per second in games and or a hit in m2 hd performance.

145 and higher is barely stable and tricky at least on the bios i prefer.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

More than 1.35v :D

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And How much?
And on Air? :p

Cpu -40 cold ram on air.

Updated a lot of info....Bought more motherboards to test...

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...=1#post5254425

Thx for the info chew*, and for you`r videos.

I am too old"lazy" to do alpha testing, so I am waiting.

Long time since DDR1 .)

Been out of the loop for quite a while....that said no clue whats decent on the psu front.

Thinking about grabbing a new power supply. The 90s called and wants the OCZ pc power and cooling back...

Anyway seen thermaltake has a 1200 watt platinum certified. I still have a 1200 watt TT that was cwt internals..other than fan clicking...no problems ever with it.

Evga has a 1k watt platinum although im kind of a 1200+ or bust guy.

Corsair has the ax1200i but i have heard spotty reports about there (i) models.

Maybe i should just go all out and get the evga 1600 watt unit?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Been out of the loop for quite a while....that said no clue whats decent on the psu front.

Thinking about grabbing a new power supply. The 90s called and wants the OCZ pc power and cooling back...

Anyway seen thermaltake has a 1200 watt platinum certified. I still have a 1200 watt TT that was cwt internals..other than fan clicking...no problems ever with it.

Evga has a 1k watt platinum although im kind of a 1200+ or bust guy.

Corsair has the ax1200i but i have heard spotty reports about there (i) models.

Maybe i should just go all out and get the evga 1600 watt unit?

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Or maybe a new psu won't make a bit of difference ;)

Sure it will. Have you heard a turbocool 1200w running all day long...my ears...lol

Seasonic Prime Titaniums, Chew. The 1kw unit is probably the best psu out there.

Corsair is all I've used for several years now. Not one has failed. clean, strong and Single 12v Rail.

Single rail is absolutely the only choice. I have 2 multi rails already I can fall back on.

This is just a replacement single rail PSU I would like to grab for noise and sanity reasons.

My turbo cool works fine except it's name describes it perfectly....Turbo cooling = loud

Hopefully I can find some decent reviews from real reviewers on PSU's still and not some I got for free it looks pretty it has RGB 10/10 review sites....

R5 1600x over clocking.
https://youtu.be/WL7Qy9G22MI

R5 1600 over clocking.
https://youtu.be/wsY6XbVPMa4

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Single rail is absolutely the only choice. I have 2 multi rails already I can fall back on.

This is just a replacement single rail PSU I would like to grab for noise and sanity reasons.

My turbo cool works fine except it's name describes it perfectly....Turbo cooling = loud

Hopefully I can find some decent reviews from real reviewers on PSU's still and not some I got for free it looks pretty it has RGB 10/10 review sites....

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http://www.jonnyguru.com/ is still smashing out comprehensive power supply reviews...

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Originally Posted by cbjaust

http://www.jonnyguru.com/ is still smashing out comprehensive power supply reviews...

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:up: thanks. Always liked reading his stuff.

evga psu's are single rail and pretty silent some have the option to disable fan to certain temp point. the 1300w and 1600T2 are solid

They sort out the "soldering" and ripple in the retail release variants?

Noticed seasonics using thin wire.

Corsair has quite a few refurb ax1200i models @ various retailers.

I hate shopping for psu's...

I am to picky.

I have pretty much switched 100% to EVGA for PSUs. I have a 1300W G2 and 750W P2 plugging away. My only "bad" PSU ever was my recent acquisition of a Seasonic X-1250 which had to be RMAd. The RMA unit is . . . kind of flaky. I'm hesitant to use it on anything serious or sell it to anyone else either, so it runs 3 290s and a 270 in a mining rig, all underclocked since the system locks up really easy at higher GPU clocks. The only thing I can implicate is the PSU.

Sandybridge vs Ryzen 5 Round 1 multitasking

https://youtu.be/YRIRaJXyBS4

My thoughts and final conclusion concerning B350 boards in general.

https://youtu.be/ZAm-2NX_3mU

MSI has now 2 B350 boards with 8+2 PWM (probably some less stellar (2x4)+2), similar to their X370 counterparts. One is the B350 KRAIT GAMING, which is quite cheap with 4 internal SATA ports, and the B350 PRO CARBON with 6 internal SATA ports that sits a bit too close to their entry X370 pricewise. I guess these are finally decent for a budget 1600 build under air OC/stress testing.

The issue is not phase count but the fets used on 90% of b350 have poor reliability and poor effeciency @ higher temps.

I did try SOC voltage in the range of 0.9-1.2V. No change. The issue, or at least the only thing which affects the problem is memory multiplier. 3200 is unstable - applications / computation-scripts crash or produce errors within hours. On 2933 they produce errors within days. (Last time it borked my VM snapshots. Thank god for backups.) So far highest reliable multi was 2666. I am on Gskill 3600C16 B-die memory.

ahh I don't have that bin in gskill but I do have it in geil. That XMP or SPD needs some bios love imo on ryzen still.

This is a very very usefull overclocking guide for Ryzen users. The only thing I noticed that may have been understated is the benefit of using VDDP....however the board used in this demo lacked vddp adjustment and in fact i have the board and can not find vddp @ the socket...

https://youtu.be/vZgpHTaQ10k

So other than the lack of vddp which a useable safe range imo is .900-1.2v for 24/7...awesome video.

I will go on to state....for extreme overclockers...more than 1.45 vddr can be used for "benching" but....pay attention to your chips behavior.

Your cpu will tell you when it is unhappy. 54/55 post code = I am not happy...push harder and break IMC....look in mirror say i am an idiot and blame yourself.

Don't RMA chip and blame AMD.

Maybe things will get interesting now......

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psmzspxlx5.png

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pshxca4wr6.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Maybe things will get interesting now......

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psmzspxlx5.png

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pshxca4wr6.png

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looks like dfi boards can rest now.:eek:

screwed around with the 1800x on phase.

improved my 4.6 fixed speed 32m time.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...pstob1bunw.jpg

ran cinebench real quick bias was "off" just testing stability on phase...

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...ps7v4mrazv.jpg

Updated front page motherboard section with Biostar GT7 testing etc etc etc......

Been busy with work and 32m pi and not really much else new info to discuss except new asus bios has higher straps added.....

The C6H supports up to DDR4-4000 now I'm told. Here's hoping the Taichi gets a similar UEFI update!

Bored so I fired up the race car today.....even no boost she is a handful....( boost to atmosphere ) watch the tires and counter steer.

Neighbor let off with a 9 in his backyard other night off white house in background ...set the two step and wot box low....can't let him show me up..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ilU0_WtY_-I

Took a break from futzing, wasn't anything interesting happening BIOS wise with my Titanium, besides more problems. :P BUT that's all changed, as you saw with your Gigabyte BIOS! MSI rolled out 1.72 BETA a couple days ago for the Titanium and it also has DDR4-4000, SubTiming control, and an interestingly-named "CLDO_VDDP" option (dunno if it was available by default, I mod the BIOS right out of the gate so I made sure it was unhidden). Not only that, but it fixed my Cold/Warm boot issues at 3200 that had been present since BIOS v1.2 (worked fine on shipping v1.10), so I'm very happy! :D

I played around a bit yesterday to see what I could get my TridentZ 2x8 3200 15-15-15-35 B-Die kit to do.
Things of Note: they fixed the odd-numbered tCL issue, so I can finally run 3200 at 15-15-15! Also there seems to be little or no memory bandwidth impact from using CR 2T, not like there was back with DDR1 and Athlon X2's (back then I gained 1000mb/s running at 1T!). Whether or not real world usage sees any impact, I dunno... AIDA tests all appear normal though, even the Latency.
As far as managing more speed, beings I have absolutely no clue what to set timings at in order to squeeze more out of stuff (my past DDR3 system had only the basic 10 timings to adjust), so everything has been on Auto (and set to the 3200 XMP profile won't even POST anymore heh) :\ I just used MSI's built-in preset "Memory Try It !" settings to see what would work, which they apply the main timings and DRAM voltage.

- (Preset) 3333 at 16-18-18-36 1T 1.36V (1.376V actual) worked fine, and even works at non-preset "Auto Everything" of 16-15-15-35 2T (its set to 1T, but isn't using it according to CPUz)
- (Non Preset) 3466 at 17-17-17-38 2T 1.4V (1.408V) worked...... once. For the life of me I'm unable to get it to POST again. Weird, since everything was on Auto the first time...

- Preset-3466 did not work, since it sets CR 1T, but the two preset's timings are 16-18-18-38 and 18-20-20-39, 1.4V. Even if set to 2T and/or 1.45V, it still won't POST.
- Preset 3600 did not work either, same reasons and timings as above.

The CPU-NB(SoC) voltage auto-adjusts to 1.15V when selecting higher DDR speeds, and I assume that's either how the AGESA is programmed or is a recommendation by AMD, as an ASUS user reported the same thing happening to him.

I DID have enough sense to take screenshots of the timings pages, so I could try applying the sub-timings manually from that single successful 3466 boot; however, I doubt it'll help any. So here they are, in case someone else can use them as reference to try getting their systems working at higher speeds by setting their own relaxed timings based on these:
DDR4-3200 @ 15-15-15-35 1T 1.35V (1.36V actual):
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130680 http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130679

DDR4-3333 @ 16-15-15-35 1T? 1.36V (1.375V actual):
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130676 http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130675

DDR4-3466 @ 17-17-17-38 2T 1.4V (1.408V actual):
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130678 http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...php?fid=130677

I worked on it...boards a tad slow for my taste in certain benchmarks.

Before
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psxvmzz8be.jpg

It really gave me a hard time today....i definitely did not feel like i was in a state of ZEN.
After
3200
http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psc7ten8va.jpg

3333 i had to edit cpu-z...blank no clue, don't care.

http://i1253.photobucket.com/albums/...psquqr8sjn.jpg

Least it got faster...some went backwards in performance

8m 26s, wow, very nice!

8:26 is slow for 4.0 I have a video @ 8:18 zen posted a 8:19 and...we are sandbaggers :D

U must need to get under 7min as first man :) I got 7m 5s, but not much good run at 5100 MHz. I think, 6m 30s is doable with Ryzens

I know 6:46 is possible @ 5.0....i have done 7:29 @ 4.6 with a really bad imc.

Sub 6:00 is possible.

I am supposed to be retired....but old habits die hard.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

I am supposed to be retired....but old habits die hard.

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heh I had to look at your profile to find out. Definitely wouldn't have pegged you for being 42 :) For what it's worth, I figured you were more my age! (34)

Now that we have timing adjustments, I decided to do some comparing to what software reads out. AIDA64's "DRAM Timings" output (under Tools>) is.... somewhat accurate. The RAS to RAS delays (both L and S) are WAY off on mine. However, amazingly, MemTweakIt's values seem to be right. I'm just amazed at that, beings the platforms it was more aimed at heh Shame the newer versions don't work, or I should even say it's too bad that you can't apply anything in the version that DOES work! :P

Oh speaking of programs... I'm not entirely sure how useful it is, or will be after it is developed further, but while looking into the various MSR programs and seeing if anyone has made anything for Ryzen PStates, I came across one for 15h Family chips called K15TK, make by a Japanese guy (thankfully Google Translate does way better with Japanese than it does with most other languages... like Chinese :S). Thought that was handy, given I've been wanting something to fiddle with my Carrizo laptop... BUT WAIT, while on his page I noticed... he has cranked out one for Ryzen as well, aptly named K17TK! And just within the last few days has released a public Alpha. I offered myself for "human sacrifice" (hilarious translation derp) and can confirm it works :D
The up-side is: It works! The interface is in English. It provides functional FID, DID, VID adjustments, as well as CPB, C6Pkg and C6Core toggling, all from Windows. Granted, Ryzen Master (RM) can do most of that as well (pretty sure it can adjust voltage w/o a restart?) and I'm sure motherboard maker's have similar stuff... But what's great here is it's a tiny program that has none of the BS overhead of all the other ones. RM, at least on my system, is a friggen CPU Cycle and memory hog. This thing uses a measly 10MB and ZERO CPU time :clap:
The down-side is: There seem to be some kinks that still need ironing out. Also I don't know if this is a platform issue, a Ryzen issue, or a software issue... but adjusting P0 causes you to lose Boost. Which I suppose most won't care about, but would still be nice. CnQ still seems to work though, so the "0C" register isn't triggered, meaning voltage still raises and lowers as needed, keeping temps down overall.

Here's a link to his blog, and specifically, the post the contains the download link (bottom of post, just below the comments. Ignore all the other linked "AdWords" text)
http://hbkim.blog.so-net.ne.jp/2017-05-14
You will ALSO need the WinRing0 files, as mentioned. You can find the latest ones (which are the ones I'm using) here:
https://github.com/QCute/WinRing0/releases


That being said... Since you have a Titanium now, I can share my modded BIOS with ya and KNOW it'll work. :rocker:
[OBLIGATORY DISCLAIMER: This is a USER MODIFIED BIOS based off the official MSI v1.72 Beta. I have personally tested it, and am currently running it. I've modded every version released thus far with no issues when flashing! I first reset everything to Defaults, Save and Exit, re-enter BIOS and use the MFlash method by placing this file on a FAT32 USB thumb drive. *However*, there is the very real potential that this could "brick" your system. Just like with MSI's betas, you flash at your own risk! In the event of a failure, follow the BIOS RECOVERY methods as outlined in the manual and use any of the Titanium's RELEASE version of BIOS found on MSI's site. Good luck!]

Here's my MODDED MSI X370 Titanium v1.72 BETA BIOS

***HIGH PROBABILITY THAT YOUR OC PROFILES WILL NOT APPLY IN THIS VERSION*** (Not the end of the world, but worth mentioning. They'll still work if you roll-back to the official version)

Menu Changes:

• [Overclocking] Enabled "CPU Base Clock (MHz)" option. Choices: Auto, 100, 101, 102, 103 [Green = Stable, Red = Unstable (probably Promontory related)]
• [Overclocking] Enabled(?) ALL DRAM Timing options in the "Advanced DRAM Configuration" menu. Note: The sections are force-expanded as a result.
• [Overclocking] Enabled "CLDO_VDDP voltage" option. Speculation: CPU Low Drop Out setting (has a Help Menu tooltip)
• [Overclocking] Enabled "CPU VDDP Voltage" option. Note: Non-functional on my system, PCB test point reads 0.00V; including for completness sake.
• [Overclocking] Enabled "DRAM Voltage(BIOS)" option. -- See Notes --
• [Overclocking] Enabled "DRAM Voltage(Training)" option. -- Below --
• [Overclocking] Enabled "Cool 'n' Quiet" option in CPU Features
• [Settings>Advanced>Integrated Peripherals] Enabled "HPET Configuration" option. (In case you want to turn it off for whatever reason)
• [Settings>Advanced>Windows OS Configuration] Enabled "MSI Fast Boot"
• [Settings>Advanced>Windows OS Configuration] Enabled "Fast Boot"
• [Settings>Advanced>Windows OS Configuration] Enabled "PS2 Devices Support"

So the "Notes Below"... These two options are new, and a bit quirky. They have no Help tip, and generally read "0". Furthermore, they cannot take Decimal values, only whole numbers. I had just typed into the entry box a few numbers to see what it'd take, since for example the BCLK, if you punch in 104, it'll force 103. Long story short, after going back and forth on a number of settings, I managed to get values to show up in both (BIOS) and (Training) options... They are, from what I can tell, in mV! When you select one of the higher speed "Memory Try It!" presets, it changes the DRAM Voltage to 1.36, in the (BIOS) will show 1360. The (Training) receives 1400. If you select an even higher memory speed (I believe 3466 is the first) It'll set DRAM V to 1.4, (BIOS) to 1400 and (Training) to 1500. Now, as to if they actually work, that I have no idea, because in my experience so far I'm not having any luck with 3466, nevermind higher. (Though I've not tried SubTimings, as I'm trying to learn the DDR4 tips and tricks still)







(Ugh, can't believe XS BBCode... so many lacking features. What I'd give for the Spoiler tag) Additional Settings that can be adjusted (whether it functions, I don't know), but have no BIOS Menu access; thus, by request only... (Bold = Default)

• Int. Clk Differential Spread [Auto|Enabled|Disabled]
• SATA CLK Mode Option [Auto|EXT 25MHz|INT 48MHz|INT100MHz]
• Chipset Power Saving Features [Enabled|Disabled]
• SB Clock Spread Spectrum [Auto|Enabled|Disabled]
• SB Clock Spread Spectrum Option [-0.362%|-0.375%|-0.400%|-0.425%|-0.450%|-0.475%]
• SB C1E Support [Auto|Enabled|Disabled]
• [Memory]Channel Interleaving [Enabled|Disabled]
• [Memory]Bank Interleaving [Enabled|Disabled]
• [Memory]Memory Clear [Enabled|Disabled]
• SATA SGPIO #0/#1 (two options, two ports) [Enabled|Disabled]
• [PCIe]Unpopulated Links [Keep Links ON|Disabled]
• [PCIe]ASPM Mode Control [Enabled|Disabled] Each port has its own setting.
• [PCIe]Hotplug Mode Control [Auto|Hotplug Basic|Hotplug Server|Hotplug Enhanced|Hotplug Inboard|Disabled] Each port has its own setting.

... and that's about it as far as what I figure to be of interest. (There's a crap ton of various things relating to those, though)

Lol formula. Retired as in retired overclocker.

Im a doe and a go getter...i wont retire from real work till im completely crippled or paralyzed which is far more likely to happen due to some injuries.

Needed a low resource tool to work around a bug on my K7. Big thanks for that. :up:

In the last list of options many are usefull for overclocling.

Spread spectrum you would want disabled for example.

Sata clock mode...interesting may be a gen 1,2,3 thing.

Power saving chipset disabled.

The 103-104 bclk bug is well ehh. Biostar same deal.

A way around it is try Auto multiplier.

Bug on my K7 causes E6 post code with bclk if not auto multi. But 105 ish is doable in baby steps manual multi...of course performance plummets @ 103 so...interesting and i do not believe in "coincidence"

Ive used enough am4 boards to see a pattern across all per agesa.

Try odt 43 ohm for 3200...if that works try 48 @ 3333 then 53 @ 3400 etc etc...bump together.

If you need 48ohm on msi to post @ 3200....you basically have a pretty weak imc..like mine.

Cldo_vddp is default .900. Basic rule is .100 from SOC although...i have seen chips benefit more from vddp than soc...so its sort of more like a guideline...

Its usually one of the last things i dial in especially when trying to stabilize 32g.

Think of it as the finisher move of DDP...do not lead with it...use it after you have almost beaten cpu into submission.

AGESA 1.0.0.6 UEFI is available for the X370 Taichi! I'm posting at stock settings running rev. 2.34 as we speak. So many new DRAM settings, so little time.

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/th...760683/page-28

LOL No no, I knew you meant "retired from the scene" :P Definitely younger at heart, which is how you come across! heh

You're welcome on the tool. I figured it'd be of use, simply for the fact it lets you adjust multi w/o any other BS lurking (services, etc). MSI's ControlCenter has like 8 services that fire when you load it up and 3 that lurk even when it's not used :|

*sigh* God damn what I wouldn't give for A64Info to make a return (or even the... IMO... slightly less advanced A64Tweaker, heck even CPUTweaker to gain Ryzen support... may they all R.I.P.). I miss being able to adjust memory timings from INSIDE Windows. Reason being, for me, it's a lot more friendly and informative... Firstly, because you have realtime results. If it's stable enough to continue running, we can benchmark. If it crashes well we know that one is touchy. If it makes it through, now we have results on if it helped or hindered! From there I would make changes in the BIOS once I've determined which settings can be tightened and result in performance gains. Then the cycle repeats and I make more little tweaks.

Honestly, my interest in system/memory tweaking (I can't say "overclocking, since that was easy in comparison) all stems from my A64 X2 3800+. I actually still have the forum sig I made for that rig lol
http://maxpain.lackeydom.net/dragonsig.jpg
The HT (IMC back then) was 1000MHz, but I had managed to crank it's multi up and get 1200MHz out of it (actually I think it was only 1198). I still have my RAM, 2x1GB of Corsair Platinium. Funny as I had to RMA them and they were 2x512MB so I had gotten a free upgrade. The newer sticks have some lesser brand of memory manufacturer (no surprise) but performed way better, netting me that DDR500. That's in addition to the tight-tight subtimings.

But anyways, if anyone has tips and tricks for potentially getting 3466 or higher to work on Single Rank B-Die sticks, or what sub-timings I should start looking at first... That'd be appreciated :)

As for that BClk I was referring to Chew, the Titaniums have no external clock gen apparently. So what's hidden there I am sure is likely there for a later version that'll come out that does have the hardware bits. And so all this one is able to tap into is probably the fine tuning headroom AMD provided the motherboard makers to get whatever behind the scenes stuff working. So when I say 104 doesn't work, I mean 104, 105, 106, 107, etc... When you type that value in, it jumps back to 103 as being the highest input value.

Lastly, did you want a modded one with any of those settings you mentioned changed?

As long as they are available to change that is all i need.

Only via modding, unfortunately. Of all the actual options inside the BIOS, we only can access around 30% of them. Granted, around 25% of the ones we can' are of virtually no use, but it'd sure be nice to have access.

Well the 1600X was only good for ~ 5230 MHz or less but it could run 32-3300 on the memory which really helped me in CB11.5 ( .02 shy of Roman) and GB multi


http://hwbot.org/submission/3561220_
http://hwbot.org/submission/3562142_

Yah johan i have an idea that less cache helps the imc clock higher. Just a theory so far however.

Im thinking...Who get as first 6m or less in Superpi32M, he will get from my budget 200 dollars as fan bonus. Its crazy challenge, but I wish to see this score at AMD CPUs

So, big challenge can start :)

I already killed a $200 board lol. K7 is dead 46 post code...no clue...

Give it the ol' "Chuck it in the Oven and Re-Flow" I say. Though I'm sure it's not that heh

Oddly, I've gotten code d2 a couple times when attempting 3466, which to me doesn't make sense (to me *shrug) as it pertains to "PCH Initialization Error"
Usually it's F9 for a second and a half before its power-off-wait3sec-power-on cycle. Thinking I need to download the updated manual, because F9 is "Recovery capsule is not found" :shrug: (Unless this Recovery Capsule is supposed to be an AMI Module that attempts to correct whatever's problematic to establish stability?)

I tried your suggestion of higher ODT, even tried using all the timings in that ONE time 3466 worked, then tried relaxing all the Sub-Timings by one tick. Then gave 20-20-20-42 a shot, still no dice :( lol

Not sure if you're willing to comment (as per your previous statement regarding competition and this being a popular thread), or if you perhaps have a good resource to refer me to (like a guide someone has written), but this is such new territory for me that I basically have tons of questions :bows: haha Granted, I'm not against trial-and-error, to learn myself, but with how slow systems take to POST now... that method takes roughly 8 to 10 times longer than in the past :gamer: :yawn:
-Not sure if I should be trying a higher "Training" voltage or not? Currently it's automatic amount for (I think) speeds >3200, is 1.5V. No clue is 1.55V would make a difference, or if your past advice of "sometime less voltage" would apply to this...
-Or maybe manually set the DRAM VREF to 1/2 of the DRAM Voltage? I've been reluctant to touch that option because on the Titanium, and Ryzen Master, they both trigger there warning colors after only like 20mV (so .600V being default, .620V being red, and I'd need to set .680V for 1.36V, or .700V for 1.4V :eh:)
-For all I know, I need to raise tRC (though yours was an XMP profile level of low at 50, in the one SuperPi shot, but your main timings were also very tight), or maybe the tREF. There's a tRCPAGE option as well, with a range of 0~1028T, but it always reads 0 and nothing else seems to be able to report a value for it; thus, wouldn't even know where to start! heh
-Someone else has suggested to me (on [H]|Forums) "Since you are using single row modules, try disabling BankGroupSwap", which is a present option on the Titanium, at least in my modded 1.72 Beta.

I put a request out in the Memory Speed thread on there for BIOS shots from two guys, both I think who have CH6's, but one is running at 3466 and the other at 3600. Am hoping that, maybe, just through comparison I'll be able to glean a bit of info that'll point me in the right direction.
Thankfully, I find this enjoyable (at least when the BIOS is behaving), so will just have to keep my fingers crossed! :rocker: :toast:

I had something really odd with the CHVI on the weekend. Started benching saturday and things were going well. I have learned that this board is bad for the mem lifting after it gets cold. Second time I have froze it and both times about 30 minutes in I have to re-seat the ram. I was pushing it pretty hard trying to get .03 more pts in CB 11.5 really wanted to beat out Roman for first and while idle it just up and quit. Pushing power gave me zero activity. I figured it must be wet and I stopped for the day tore it down to dry. Sunday I put things back together, made sure it was dry but still getting the same thing. No activity when hitting power. That's when I noticed the USB BIOS flashback light blinking. That was the weird part I didn't have a thumb drive in while benching or when I re-assembled it. But the board was stuck in a loop. Putting a proper USB in the FB slot it would go through the flasback cycle but right when it's supposed to stop it had like a hiccup and the slow "searching" light started again.
I was not a happy camper, this board has no serial #s so RMA isn't possible and I wasn't done benching the 1600x. So after a bunch of messing around I found it would start if I held the power button down while switching on the PSU. Got into BIOS and flashed it to one of the new versions. Reboot and nothing stuck no restart just a blinking FB light. Then I used the flasbak to revert to ver 902 it did work. I restarted using the same trick and verified BIOS version. Set defaults, F10 and no reboot. I needed to do a few errands so I pulled all the power and CMOS battery and let it sit. When I returned it was fully functional and the FB light had gone out. Spent the next few hours benching LN2 and not one hiccup after that.
I'm just glad it sorted out

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Formula350

Give it the ol' "Chuck it in the Oven and Re-Flow" I say. Though I'm sure it's not that heh

Oddly, I've gotten code d2 a couple times when attempting 3466, which to me doesn't make sense (to me *shrug) as it pertains to "PCH Initialization Error"
Usually it's F9 for a second and a half before its power-off-wait3sec-power-on cycle. Thinking I need to download the updated manual, because F9 is "Recovery capsule is not found" :shrug: (Unless this Recovery Capsule is supposed to be an AMI Module that attempts to correct whatever's problematic to establish stability?)

I tried your suggestion of higher ODT, even tried using all the timings in that ONE time 3466 worked, then tried relaxing all the Sub-Timings by one tick. Then gave 20-20-20-42 a shot, still no dice :( lol

Not sure if you're willing to comment (as per your previous statement regarding competition and this being a popular thread), or if you perhaps have a good resource to refer me to (like a guide someone has written), but this is such new territory for me that I basically have tons of questions :bows: haha Granted, I'm not against trial-and-error, to learn myself, but with how slow systems take to POST now... that method takes roughly 8 to 10 times longer than in the past :gamer: :yawn:
-Not sure if I should be trying a higher "Training" voltage or not? Currently it's automatic amount for (I think) speeds >3200, is 1.5V. No clue is 1.55V would make a difference, or if your past advice of "sometime less voltage" would apply to this...
-Or maybe manually set the DRAM VREF to 1/2 of the DRAM Voltage? I've been reluctant to touch that option because on the Titanium, and Ryzen Master, they both trigger there warning colors after only like 20mV (so .600V being default, .620V being red, and I'd need to set .680V for 1.36V, or .700V for 1.4V :eh:)
-For all I know, I need to raise tRC (though yours was an XMP profile level of low at 50, in the one SuperPi shot, but your main timings were also very tight), or maybe the tREF. There's a tRCPAGE option as well, with a range of 0~1028T, but it always reads 0 and nothing else seems to be able to report a value for it; thus, wouldn't even know where to start! heh
-Someone else has suggested to me (on [H]|Forums) "Since you are using single row modules, try disabling BankGroupSwap", which is a present option on the Titanium, at least in my modded 1.72 Beta.

I put a request out in the Memory Speed thread on there for BIOS shots from two guys, both I think who have CH6's, but one is running at 3466 and the other at 3600. Am hoping that, maybe, just through comparison I'll be able to glean a bit of info that'll point me in the right direction.
Thankfully, I find this enjoyable (at least when the BIOS is behaving), so will just have to keep my fingers crossed! :rocker: :toast:

---

Disabling BGS helped me get above 3200mhz on my Titanium. Not much of a blip but I got to 3333mhz stable at 14-14-14-14-35 CR T2 with SOC 1.075 and dram voltage 1.39 volts

Me personally and i may video it have found that ODT is huge and very very chip dependant. Good chips can post @ 40 ohm over 3200 ram...bad chips need 48 ohm to post @ 3200.. Normal chips need 43 ohm to post @ 3200.

I can actually swap chips on video live and pop one chip after another showing chips post/not post at a fixed odt setting.

My 1800x for example posts @ 3200 like a normal chip should...but to exceed 3200 require 48 ohm for 3333,3466 and needs to step up to 53 ohm for 3600-3733.

This is all on taichi...but i doubt boards will vary much.

Basically if you can boot @ 40 ohm over 3200 you have a damn good imc...

Msi is still or was still on 1004. Fairly certain without a unicorn imc...3466 and up...not happening at least not stable.

Well speaking of Titanium... new 1.73 Beta went up. I grabbed it. Paged through...
New setting in CPU Features called "Relaxed EDC throttling".
Help string reads:

Disable - Part-specific EDC throttling protection enabled.
Enable - Reduce the amount of time the processor will throttle.
Auto - AMD's recommendation (Disable)​

(It's actually one long line, so I'm interpreting the line breaks)

New RAM Timing options...
MISC ITEM

BankGroupSwapAlt (this is in addition to the other BankGroupSwap option; no help string)​

CAD BUS TIMING CONFIGURATION:

AddCmdSetup - Setup time on CAD bus signals Range 0~63
CsOdtSetup - (same help string)
CkeSetup - (same help string)​

CAD BUS DRIVE STRENGTH CONFIG:

ClkDrvStrength - 120Ohm/60/40/30/24/20 - (no help string)
AddrCmdDrvStren- 120Ohm/60/40/30/24/20 - (no help string)
CsOdtDrvStren- 120Ohm/60/40/30/24/20 - (no help string)
CkeDrvStren- 120Ohm/60/40/30/24/20 - (no help string)​

I made a very special chew* version with the "SB Spread Spectrum" and "Chipset Power Saving Features" options set to Disabled :) (There seems to be an HPET for the SB as well, but I didn't touch that)
̶W̶i̶l̶l̶ ̶e̶d̶i̶t̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶D̶L̶ ̶l̶i̶n̶k̶s̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶u̶n̶h̶i̶d̶d̶e̶n̶-̶o̶p̶t̶i̶o̶n̶s̶ ̶m̶o̶d̶d̶e̶d̶ ̶(̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶b̶e̶f̶o̶r̶e̶)̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶a̶l̶s̶o̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶"̶c̶h̶e̶w̶*̶ ̶e̶d̶i̶t̶i̶o̶n̶"̶ ̶m̶o̶d̶d̶e̶d̶.̶
"Standard" Modded v1.73 Beta (TITANIUM ONLY!)
"Chew* Edition" Modded v1.73 Beta (Same, but with the above two additional changes)
[Same disclaimer as previous post. I hold no liability for anything that happens to your motherboard after using this, yadda yadda.]
(I do use my own modded BIOSes, so you can take solace in that, at least)

Thanks man. Are they on 1006 yet or still fooling around on 1004?

Heres your help string on drive strength. Weaker usually gives better compatibility.

Based on higher odt ohms offering compatibility weaker could be "higher" but that is a better question for the stilt as i am not sure . previous gen chips bios just said weaker, normal, medium, stronger etc etc...

Bank group swap sounds like a "compatibility" option...i would compare bandwidth before/after....compatibility is just in simple terms...we turned your performance down so it "works"

So you gain "speed" but probably perform identical to your slower speed...dirty tricks is a term i like to use...but hey its a bigger number so it must be faster lol.

I am pretty anal when it comes to performance...tony from ocz once said use whats fast not what you think is fast...if tight as a virgin but lower speeed beats omg over 9000 then screw over 9000.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chew*

Thanks man. Are they on 1006 yet or still fooling around on 1004?

Heres your help string on drive strength. Weaker usually gives better compatibility.

Based on higher odt ohms offering compatibility weaker could be "higher" but that is a better question for the stilt as i am not sure . previous gen chips bios just said weaker, normal, medium, stronger etc etc...

Bank group swap sounds like a "compatibility" option...i would compare bandwidth before/after....compatibility is just in simple terms...we turned your performance down so it "works"

So you gain "speed" but probably perform identical to your slower speed...dirty tricks is a term i like to use...but hey its a bigger number so it must be faster lol.

I am pretty anal when it comes to performance...tony from ocz once said use whats fast not what you think is fast...if tight as a virgin but lower speeed beats omg over 9000 then screw over 9000.

---

According to the Stilt the bank group swap "should" be disabled for single side 1DPC you will see a drop of ~ 2k in bandwidth but ~ 4% decrease in latency. I tried it and he was spot o. Any SW that benefits from latency will show slight improvement.

Thanks for that info, Chew! :D I'm always happy to have more RAM knowledge! Sucks, especially, since AMD had fallen so far out of favor that no one wants to write up any tutorials or tips articles. As such, and I mean no offense since I do understand your reasoning, those that do know are really tight lipped about what settings to run or where to start when getting things working, as it means giving the competition a leg up. It's a shame that a fun hobby with free-flowing info has turned into this industry, where competitions are won and lost by sharing the knowledge :( Granted, it's meant the delivery of systems capable of SO much more than once upon a time, where we used to have to rely on awesome user-made programs like WPCREDIT or SetFSB. While that's all in the BIOS now, we're still lacking the knowledge to utilize it all. At least in plain english lol Datasheets are obtainable at least, provided you can make sense of them :P

Anyways, "ranting" aside, I had no luck with BGS set to Disabled when it came to getting 3446 running. Went so far as to try the timings I got that ONE time, and increased them. Tried ODT's up to 60Ohm, but since MSI doesn't provide what things are at while running on Auto, I have no clue what some of those settings were during that magic moment lol After Thought: Would changing the CPU NB's LLC or Switching Frequency, or the DRAM Switching Frequency make any difference, in the DigitALL Pwoer menu?

Alas, I think I'll try to get my 3200 tighter instead. However, I tried that yesterday, and ended up hitting some weird issue. Posting, it'd pause at 99 for quite awhile, during USB I assume since keyboard would flash, but my mouse connected via keyboard wouldn't, untill it picked up after maybe 10 seconds (which is when code 64 displays). IF I let it boot, Windows would take eons to load. The one time it was stuck at the Login Screen... more like the screen you get with C+A+D but minus the options in the middle... but wouldn't do anything further. The Power options worked at least :P So I dunno what that was all about. Thought it was my timings, but even resetting defaults didn't resolve it, so I shut down. It's fine today though *shrug* Back to the grind I guess heh

Have you, when using that K17TK program, noticed any performance quirks? The FIRST time I used it, things worked fine, performance increased like expected, but now it seems to cause a DEcrease in performance after changing just the P0 multi a quarter higher than default. I almost feel like it, somehow, has something to do with me having messed around with CPB and C6 options, despite seeing no reason why this should persist beyond a restart. I'm not utilizing the Save Profile feature, but I'm wondering if it's wrote something in the registry... I unno.

As far as Microcode, I don't know. BIOS reads 8001126, which I don't know how to decipher the Patch ID into a verison number heh I'll have to check with something next time I'm in Windows.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chew*

Me personally and i may video it have found that ODT is huge and very very chip dependant. Good chips can post @ 40 ohm over 3200 ram...bad chips need 48 ohm to post @ 3200.. Normal chips need 43 ohm to post @ 3200.

I can actually swap chips on video live and pop one chip after another showing chips post/not post at a fixed odt setting.

My 1800x for example posts @ 3200 like a normal chip should...but to exceed 3200 require 48 ohm for 3333,3466 and needs to step up to 53 ohm for 3600-3733.

This is all on taichi...but i doubt boards will vary much.

Basically if you can boot @ 40 ohm over 3200 you have a damn good imc...

Msi is still or was still on 1004. Fairly certain without a unicorn imc...3466 and up...not happening at least not stable.

---

Chew, have you seen bios 1.73? It has an additional 8 or 9 memory settings. As you said I can not get over 3333mhz. On 1.73 bios I got there without disabling BGS. Of course that was on 2 dimms. I have yet to figure a way to get above 2667 on my 4 dimms of Flares X DDR4 3200. I think it is time for me two put the second 16GB dimm kit on sale on Ebay. At least I'll have a down payment on my Vega card that I'll buy in 2 months.

How much you want for them?

Btw i just did some SPD profile snooping...I need to do some testing to verify but....they look like they were flashed with a very "loose" profile.

I just compared vs Trident -z 3200,3600 bins vets flare X....plug and play load xmp...3200 tridents should be fastest if you set 3200 14-14-14-34 and just go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by os2wiz

Chew, have you seen bios 1.73? It has an additional 8 or 9 memory settings. As you said I can not get over 3333mhz. On 1.73 bios I got there without disabling BGS. Of course that was on 2 dimms. I have yet to figure a way to get above 2667 on my 4 dimms of Flares X DDR4 3200. I think it is time for me two put the second 16GB dimm kit on sale on Ebay. At least I'll have a down payment on my Vega card that I'll buy in 2 months.

---

Hey bud, fancy seeing you here! LOL
Yea I posted and told him about all the new mem settings on the previous page and linked him one of my modded BIOSes with the SB SpreadSpectrum and PowerSaving disabled :P

I hate to see folks struggling with RAM, since at this point (in the industry, not Ryzen's lifecycle) you'd expect things to be working far better. However, as people have pointed out, even Intel had teething issues with their first DDR4 :\ I'm on the fence about what I'd do in your shoes. Part of me thinks that yea, might be better to offload the other kit.... But, part of me thinks that kit prices may only go up due to demand once more Ryzens get into consumer hands, nevermind when Threadripper lands on the market. As such, perhaps it'd be better to hold onto them? I dunno <_>

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chew*

Btw i just did some SPD profile snooping...I need to do some testing to verify but....they look like they were flashed with a very "loose" profile.

I just compared vs Trident -z 3200,3600 bins vets flare X....plug and play load xmp...3200 tridents should be fastest if you set 3200 14-14-14-34 and just go.

---

Here's something I've been wondering about SPD and memory on these systems, and had actually asked os2wiz about on [H] forum heh
If you take a TridentZ CL14 B-Die kit, and a FlareX CL14 B-Die kit, ran them both on the same system with all timings set to Auto, not running any profiles at all, would their timings differ at all?

I ask because when I set 3200 manually all the subtimings etc, are the exact same as what they are if I apply A-XMP. Even the tRC, which on my CL15 TridentZ kit's XMP SPD it's tRC 50 and tFAW 39, but Auto still shows the usual of 75 and 34 (respectively). So is the BIOS actually calculating timings based on timing tabled in the DIMM, or is it all pre-programmed?
If it'd help, I can upload another BIOS with the DRAM Patch ID option unhidden, but I just figured it wasn't of much use and leave it off.

Also I feel like L3 speed in AIDA is an indicator of RAM instability. No background task is running but Read speed is wwwwway low at 257gb/s...
EDIT: and maybe Latency? The usual for me lately has been 71ns, but this run it's been consistently 75ns +-0.3, which I'm running 3200 at 14-14-14, timings I've already wondered the stability at.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Formula350

Thanks for that info, Chew! :D I'm always happy to have more RAM knowledge! Sucks, especially, since AMD had fallen so far out of favor that no one wants to write up any tutorials or tips articles. As such, and I mean no offense since I do understand your reasoning, those that do know are really tight lipped about what settings to run or where to start when getting things working, as it means giving the competition a leg up. It's a shame that a fun hobby with free-flowing info has turned into this industry, where competitions are won and lost by sharing the knowledge :( Granted, it's meant the delivery of systems capable of SO much more than once upon a time, where we used to have to rely on awesome user-made programs like WPCREDIT or SetFSB. While that's all in the BIOS now, we're still lacking the knowledge to utilize it all. At least in plain english lol Datasheets are obtainable at least, provided you can make sense of them :P

Anyways, "ranting" aside, I had no luck with BGS set to Disabled when it came to getting 3446 running. Went so far as to try the timings I got that ONE time, and increased them. Tried ODT's up to 60Ohm, but since MSI doesn't provide what things are at while running on Auto, I have no clue what some of those settings were during that magic moment lol After Thought: Would changing the CPU NB's LLC or Switching Frequency, or the DRAM Switching Frequency make any difference, in the DigitALL Pwoer menu?

Alas, I think I'll try to get my 3200 tighter instead. However, I tried that yesterday, and ended up hitting some weird issue. Posting, it'd pause at 99 for quite awhile, during USB I assume since keyboard would flash, but my mouse connected via keyboard wouldn't, untill it picked up after maybe 10 seconds (which is when code 64 displays). IF I let it boot, Windows would take eons to load. The one time it was stuck at the Login Screen... more like the screen you get with C+A+D but minus the options in the middle... but wouldn't do anything further. The Power options worked at least :P So I dunno what that was all about. Thought it was my timings, but even resetting defaults didn't resolve it, so I shut down. It's fine today though *shrug* Back to the grind I guess heh

Have you, when using that K17TK program, noticed any performance quirks? The FIRST time I used it, things worked fine, performance increased like expected, but now it seems to cause a DEcrease in performance after changing just the P0 multi a quarter higher than default. I almost feel like it, somehow, has something to do with me having messed around with CPB and C6 options, despite seeing no reason why this should persist beyond a restart. I'm not utilizing the Save Profile feature, but I'm wondering if it's wrote something in the registry... I unno.

As far as Microcode, I don't know. BIOS reads 8001126, which I don't know how to decipher the Patch ID into a verison number heh I'll have to check with something next time I'm in Windows.

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Anyone that f-d up to not share info when so many are struggling is prima facia a-hole

The info i do not share will benefit you none at all 99% of the time for 24/7 use anyway ;)

Unless of course you want to run 1.8v+ to your memory while sub 0 which if your doing that you are competing which btw cost me a set of ram last week.

Should i teach you how to kill ram like me? Probably not ;)

Hey guys!
I will be joining Ryzen club with my new R7 1700 on Asus Prime X370 and some RipJaws 3200 CL14-14-14 2x8GB sets. Hope to get system up and running over this weekend. Any initial suggestions as to RAM settings? Should I start from XMP auto and then make my way up?
My target is to either run them above 3333Mhz or stick to 3200 and go low on CL. BTW can't wait to bench my first 8 core build :)

Have not used pro on latest bios but previous bios spec was hard enough.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

The info i do not share will benefit you none at all 99% of the time for 24/7 use anyway ;)

Unless of course you want to run 1.8v+ to your memory while sub 0 which if your doing that you are competing which btw cost me a set of ram last week.

Should i teach you how to kill ram like me? Probably not ;)

---

Yes, I've been torturing my ram since day 0 and no degredation. Show me how to kill a trident lol :D

You know I won't mind

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chew*

Have not used pro on latest bios but previous bios spec was hard enough.

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Well, at least there now is unofficial BETA BIOS with AGESA 1006 support bringing more RAM options to this board. I had to choose between Gigabyte Gaming 5 PWM or Prime's weaker BIOS support and concluded that I have better chance of ASUS slowly fixing BIOS than PWM circuit miraculously upgrading itself :)
This is a stopgap setup to play with and enjoy without too much of a serious overclocking, before I can jump to Threadripper late this year.
Tomorrow starts the fun, so don't be surprised if I come up with some stupid question :D (to any helpful XS member here!)

Np ask away. Yep pwm sinks can not be fixxed with a bios. The asus run a tad warm to full load but not as warm but bios should be able to fix it...did wonders for my b350 and that is not even on 1006 yet.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by chew*

The info i do not share will benefit you none at all 99% of the time for 24/7 use anyway ;)

Unless of course you want to run 1.8v+ to your memory while sub 0 which if your doing that you are competing which btw cost me a set of ram last week.

Should i teach you how to kill ram like me? Probably not ;)

---

While that is definitely understandable, since you're running your phase change setup, the issue I have with it is I learn better by examples and pictures. My brain is just wired to better figure out how to accomplish something by seeing the end result and working backwards from there with the explanation of why it is that way or works like that. In a sense I guess my brain "decompiles" in order to understand, rather than compiling the answer from the text.

As an example... You've explained to me what quite a few settings do and how they help. The ProcODT being one of them, but for the longest time I wasn't really able to make any use of that because I had no idea where to start, so it wasn't until you offered the baseline of "for 3200 use 43.3Ohm, and for 3333 use 48Ohm" that I was able to make some sense of it all. Same goes for those Drive Strengths. While, granted, you also said you're not entirely sure yourself how they'll function on this platform, your understanding of it as a concept is way more understood due to your experience. You've relayed that to me, but it's a generalization, which while I find helpful, I don't really know where to start with my tinkering heh

While typing that I realized it basically goes back to what I've said earlier (a post from the last couple days), that it's tough for me to get started because on my Titanium it doesn't tell me what Auto is applying. I have no baseline to work from, and that's what the examples from you experienced users are providing me with. That way I'll at least have a data point to base everything on, so I know that I'm not ultimately working against myself if I set one drive strength and things work, then set another to various other points which all fail... Have I actually set the first one wrong (non-ideal) or are the other ones not working because of some other setting that isn't being set as it should due to whatever Auto is applying?

That's also where even other user's auto-settings at higher speeds help me out a bit. Sure, I might not be able to run at their speeds with their timings, but now I have a direction and more importantly a distance. If (arbitrary, unrealistic example) at 3333 my tRDRD is 10 and at 3466 someone's is 14, now I know that it's going to likely take more than just setting mine to 11 in order for there to be a chance.

Lastly, but equally important, the fact that I have no clue what settings carry the greatest impact on stability. Admittedly, I know it sounds like hand holding, but gone are the days of quickly being able to tell if a setting is working or not. This all went way way wwwaaayyyy faster back when we had A64Info with the ability to adjust all the timings IMC's from within Windows :P Set an overclock, if you get into Windows, run a test. Test fails? Adjust a timing, test again. Pass? Try tightening something else, repeat tests. Etc etc. Even ignoring that, before, we'd press the power button and instantly be at the POST screen. Now we have to wait 8 seconds, or 20 should a setting fail multiple times and enter failsafe mode. On mine, the first restart after saving a change might post an F9, but the second attempt passes. So even tweaking via BIOS has became slow and arduous... but painfully so when you don't know what you're doing, like some folk! *raises hand* lol I love doing it, I accept the risks, but not having a clue is a buzzkill :(

Well heres a tip..

Xmp is intel specific and "unsupported" by AMD officially.

Jedec is industry standard and supported by all and 2666 is the highest officially supported speed by amd.

Drop to 2666 @ auto on all but primary timings....look at the subs 2666 strap sets...start from there as a guide line.

As far as the bclk question previous guy asked...

There was a rookie "rumble" comp at hwbot. One part of it was highest ref clock...money prizes etc...if i narrowed it down to which board and exact settings to use...it might have well been me doing the result.

If i did tell that one guy and he got the leg up on everyone with my info....think he would share info with competitors with cash or prizes on the line?

Anyway that said outside interference has compromised comps in past....be it legal or illegal. I will not partake in influencing outcomes.

If i influence an outcome in a comp it will be with my own result.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Formula350

While that is definitely understandable, since you're running your phase change setup, the issue I have with it is I learn better by examples and pictures. My brain is just wired to better figure out how to accomplish something by seeing the end result and working backwards from there with the explanation of why it is that way or works like that. In a sense I guess my brain "decompiles" in order to understand, rather than compiling the answer from the text.

As an example... You've explained to me what quite a few settings do and how they help. The ProcODT being one of them, but for the longest time I wasn't really able to make any use of that because I had no idea where to start, so it wasn't until you offered the baseline of "for 3200 use 43.3Ohm, and for 3333 use 48Ohm" that I was able to make some sense of it all. Same goes for those Drive Strengths. While, granted, you also said you're not entirely sure yourself how they'll function on this platform, your understanding of it as a concept is way more understood due to your experience. You've relayed that to me, but it's a generalization, which while I find helpful, I don't really know where to start with my tinkering heh

While typing that I realized it basically goes back to what I've said earlier (a post from the last couple days), that it's tough for me to get started because on my Titanium it doesn't tell me what Auto is applying. I have no baseline to work from, and that's what the examples from you experienced users are providing me with. That way I'll at least have a data point to base everything on, so I know that I'm not ultimately working against myself if I set one drive strength and things work, then set another to various other points which all fail... Have I actually set the first one wrong (non-ideal) or are the other ones not working because of some other setting that isn't being set as it should due to whatever Auto is applying?

That's also where even other user's auto-settings at higher speeds help me out a bit. Sure, I might not be able to run at their speeds with their timings, but now I have a direction and more importantly a distance. If (arbitrary, unrealistic example) at 3333 my tRDRD is 10 and at 3466 someone's is 14, now I know that it's going to likely take more than just setting mine to 11 in order for there to be a chance.

Lastly, but equally important, the fact that I have no clue what settings carry the greatest impact on stability. Admittedly, I know it sounds like hand holding, but gone are the days of quickly being able to tell if a setting is working or not. This all went way way wwwaaayyyy faster back when we had A64Info with the ability to adjust all the timings IMC's from within Windows :P Set an overclock, if you get into Windows, run a test. Test fails? Adjust a timing, test again. Pass? Try tightening something else, repeat tests. Etc etc. Even ignoring that, before, we'd press the power button and instantly be at the POST screen. Now we have to wait 8 seconds, or 20 should a setting fail multiple times and enter failsafe mode. On mine, the first restart after saving a change might post an F9, but the second attempt passes. So even tweaking via BIOS has became slow and arduous... but painfully so when you don't know what you're doing, like some folk! *raises hand* lol I love doing it, I accept the risks, but not having a clue is a buzzkill :(

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I have some good news to report on 4dimm 32GB memory overclock on my FlareX DDR4 3200 memory on Titanium bios 1.73. With CL14-14-14-48 at 2800mhz with SOC 1.15v Proc 60ohm, dram voltage 1.40 v. at 3.875GHZ at 1.40 v cpu voltage. I have booted successfully and run several benchmarks. I will run stability test later and I plan on saving the oc profile. I will attempt to refine voltages later. Here are attached benchmarks.

I have an AIDA64 benchmark on this memory overclock but it is 235kb and the attachment loader indicates there is a 200kb maximum.

That was a general statement about some people who are so competitive that they have forgotten their humanity. Not applicable to you. You go out of your way to help.

New progress on 2 dimm overclocking. 3466mhz achieved at 3.875 GHZ . I am uploading Attachment 132343Attachment 132344Attachment 132345 validations. I have screen shots of the bios but they a re too large a file to upload the image. I just added AIDA64 memory report only.

Bios settings core voltage 1.3625 LLC profie 1 actual 1.408 v. , SOC voltage 1.152 actual CLDO_VDDP .99 v , dram voltage 1.44 v actual
memory timings 2T CR CL 16-16-16-16 42 tRC 72 BGS disabled ProcODT 63.3 OHMS. BIOS 1.73 beta MSI Titanium


Adding AIDA64 to the mix. Only memory benchmark ATTACH]132346[/ATTACH]

Aster several hours of use I had to abandon 3466mhz. I had 2 incidents where the system blanked out on me. My temps are great that is not an issue. Since I had soc voltage at 1.175 and dram voltage at 1.43 I did not feel comfortable jacking them up higher for stability. I see now why that bclock generator comes in handy. So I am back down to 3333mhz where I am completely stable. I played a little bit with my timings there. II noticed at default it sets trow cycle at 76 with cr2. I felt it was a bit too high and it did affect frame rates. I i dropped it to 64 cycles and it booted fne but performance in FPS was not what I expected. I played until I set it at 67 and my FPS jumped over 3 frames per second on cinebench 15, so I left it at 67. Ny CL is 14-14-14-36 CR2 and t row cycle 67.

Quick update from me - Asus Prime X370 with BIOS 0801 booted without a problem with DOCP profile for 3200MHz CL14-14-14 RAM. So far in my limited time I've been able to get my R7 1700 up to 3.8GHz with 1.3Vcore on boxed cooler stable. Don't want to push much more as I need to wait for my AM4 mounting bracket to be able to fit my AIO :(
Regardless, I'm pleased with how easy it was to get the baseline up where I wanted, once decent cooler is in place, I can start my journey to 24/7 stable settings. I target realistic 4GHz all cores and some fun runs above that :)

BTW Ryzen feels really fast, especially in productivity applications!