Oh, i see. But that would require someting like 2x 38mm fans in thicknes between the rads. Well no biggy if you have room for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruschef
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Oh, i see. But that would require someting like 2x 38mm fans in thicknes between the rads. Well no biggy if you have room for it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chruschef
Quote:
Originally Posted by CyberDruid
well if you are able to feed both rad fresh air it is less ideal to stack them instead.
This idea is great because often you dont have any place to put a second rad, but you have quite alot of room behind the one rad you already have.
see the premafrost worklog, I have pics of the sandwich and its ~150mm thickQuote:
Originally Posted by eXa
What kind of fans would you want sandwiched between these?
Edit: Also, how would two of these stack (ha!) up to a thicker rad like the Feser?
Yeah, running them sandwiched in parallel as this setup is doing is really no different than every single double thickness radiator out there with the exception of the very minor additional losses at the fittings. They all run two rows of tubes at the same time in parallel. Series has just become the standard because parallel requires more detailed planning around restriction of components and generally not necessary when pumps are strong enough to run in series anyhow.Quote:
Originally Posted by CyberDruid
The problem with parallel lies when someone might want to run a highly restrictive CPU block and something with very low restriction in parallel loops. There are combinations out there where you could potentially have 10X more restriction on one route than the other. In that case the CPU block could only see 10% of the system flow rate. Even at a high/strong system flow rate at something like 2GPM, the CPU block may only see .2GPM, that's entering flow rate loss territory (Below .7gpm)...and that's what you need to be careful with on parallel systems. Then there is the fact that we're generally spoiled now with overly powerful pressure oriented pumps. It's becoming pretty hard to run too much in series to a point where flow rates are below 1GPM with today's DDC/MCP type pumps. The old weak on pressure pond style pumps were much more critical in the pumping power and pressure drop specs. Who knows though, blocks continue to become more and more restrictive, so times may change again to where pumping power becomes more of an issue again..:shrug:
I think the "Run it in series only" standard is just what's proven to work over the past couple of years, it requires no real planning or understanding of pressure drop difference between components or the net end resulting flow rate. Generally you can buy a Laing DDC or D5, string up your heart's desire in series and call it good.
In this case, it's stacked rads, equal pressure drop, 50% system flow rate provide to each radiator and the same as all double thickness radiators. Running them in series might make a laboratory test difference, but it's likely near immeasurable for us general use folk..:up:
Now this I like and just have one question: I have one MCR320. Can this be used and just add the "new" rad to it or is this something we need to buy both rads,etc?
You can just add it to the one you have :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Movieman
ooooh.. :woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
Sandwiches are fun, even primitive ones :cool:
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5247/thingside2.jpg
Looks like the ghostbuster backpack :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
No need to quote the poster above you tho ;)
Is it possible to use those variable SLi/crossfire fittings to link the 2 radiators together? I am thinking of getting one of this to go with my MCR320. Then use 38mm fans and connect rads in such a way that they are in series instead of parallel.
I suppose not everyone has seen mine so here are the pics:
zip ties work wonderfully to hold the 2 fan housings together, they are each screwed into their respective rads
I use 38mm SanAces and cutout 25mm yate loon housings as shrouds for the push side rad :)
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/795/perma50qn4.jpg
http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/2363/perma48zr2.jpg
http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/153/perma49xh2.jpg
That's just just a rad sandwich, that's a rad party sub. ;)
Sandwiched rads are a great idea on how to improve performance without a lot of cost involved. I'm glad to see swiftech picking up on it and making it happen.
So where do we get these short fittings to stack them? Need the second MCR320 for my core i7 build soon.
For someone clever enough, even these new rads can be run in series with the proper fittings if your super anal about things like that. ;)
does anyone know where online I can get one of the stackable rads in Canada? ive spent the weekend looking and emailed a few places asking them of availability, but cant find any...
hey are you calling me anal??? :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Waterlogged
Will be interesting to see the various difference between parallel and series (both inline flow and opposing flow). Probably minimal, but would still be interesting :)
AFAIK, retailers don't have these just yet. Give them a little more time. :up:Quote:
Originally Posted by MattZehr
Moi?:para:.....Never. :rofl: You don't have the new one in your picture anyways. :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG
Yeah, I'm not expecting much difference either. :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
A quick note for people wanting to sandwich:
19mm Yate Loons being cored out make perfect shrouds to use with 38mm fans and the fan screws included with the rads, though the screws take some effort to force 'into' the 38mm fan (San Aces, Ultra Kazes, Panaflos all seem to be good to go though :up: ).
heres my temps with the stack and mosfets and CPU in the loop. my cpu needs a lapping.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG
Temps are not bad but you also stated in the original post that your ambient temperature was about 12C so ideally adding about 10C to those temps would be more of a typical room temp, which is still good.Quote:
Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG
This seems like a great news because it adds choice and flexibility to the water cooling solutions.
On the other hand, the engineer in me is wondering about the flow paths, rates, pressure drops and flow characteristics of a sandwich setup...
I mean, I've toyed around with graphs and I just can't seem to justify a parallel flow design for such a large pressure drop vs going sandwich-series. This could become a big enough problem for users with multi-rads setups that are looking to add an extra block for example (ie, I own 2x mcr120-qp and 1x mcr220, 1 cpu block and 1 gpu block with a mcp665 pump and a micro-res v1 in a tj-09).
I've already bought an all-swiftech wc loop and I'd be interested in adding a fullcover 4870x2 to my current 4870+q9650 loop, that is why I consider this strange scenario :P
Anyway, any chance that you could release some more technical info so that I could do some back-of-the-envelope calculations? Better yet, a test setup running a single mcr220 vs a stack? That would be awesome because if I get that 4870x2, I'd be interested in adding an extra 220-stack :)
Is the stackable rad compatible with other wc rads ? (magicool, feser, etc)
Release date ?