Official AMD Barcelona Thread

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05-08-2007, 08:34 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by VulgarHandle

sAM2 - Supports all chips that have 940pins and use DDR2

sAM2+ - Supports all chips that have 950pins and use DDR2. It also supports split power planes(allows you to set different voltages, 1 setting for the cores, 1 for the IMC), and HT3.0. K10's will utilize these 2 extra features, K8's will not.

s1207 - supports all lga1207 chips

sG - supports all lga1207 chips, as well as the split power planes and HT3.0

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39445
now, the inq seems to think AM2+ wasn't supposed to have HT3.0 but now will, but I always thought it would

also, they say the new server socket is called "g", instead of s1207+

either way, as has been known for quite some time now, the sockets are both forward and backward compatible. It's also thought that sAM3 chips will work in AM2/+ sockets because the memory controller supports both DDR2 and DDR3, but AM2/+ chips WON'T work in sAM3 since they don't have a DDR3 controller

AM3 seems to be DDR3 only.

Also its extremely unlikely for any AM2+ and AM3 mix. Since AM2+ got parallel VIDs and AM3 serial VIDs. So unless they drop serial VIDs it will basicly be impossible.
05-08-2007, 10:55 AM
SEA

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

AM3 seems to be DDR3 only.

I think it was not exactly:

Board AM3 supports DDR3
Boards AM2, AM2+ support DDR2.

Processors AM2, AM2+ have DDR2 controller
Processor AM3 has BOTH DDR2 & DDR3 controllers.
So, there is picture explaining everything:
05-08-2007, 11:17 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by SEA

I think it was not exactly:

Board AM3 supports DDR3
Boards AM2, AM2+ support DDR2.

Processors AM2, AM2+ have DDR2 controller
Processor AM3 has BOTH DDR2 & DDR3 controllers.
So, there is picture explaining everything:

Is there actually any confirmed AM3 information for DDR2+DDR3 since jedec made sure DDR2 and DDR3 aint compatible for the same pins?
Sofar the AM3+DDR2 seems to be a old old rumour.

By the time we get AM3, DDR3 will be quite comon. I see a 939->AM2 situation again.
05-08-2007, 01:03 PM
_damien_

Quote:

Originally Posted by VulgarHandle

sAM2+ - Supports all chips that have 950pins and use DDR2. It also supports split power planes(allows you to set different voltages, 1 setting for the cores, 1 for the IMC), and HT3.0. K10's will utilize these 2 extra features, K8's will not.

...you forgot that AM2+ combined with K10 will support channel interleaving. Two indepenedent memory controllers will allow for better command efficiency, lower loaded latency, and concurrent reads and writes. See post # 99.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shintai

Is there actually any confirmed AM3 information for DDR2+DDR3 since jedec made sure DDR2 and DDR3 aint compatible for the same pins?

Just because the memory slots aren't pin compatible, doesn't mean the IMC cannot support both architectures. The lack of pin compatibility only means the supported memory standard would be determined by the motherboard.

But to answer your question, it no longer seems like AM3 CPUs will be backward compatible:

Quote:

Previous AMD documentation indicated that AM2 and AM3 would be forward/backward compatible -- yet AMD engineers claim the AM3 alluded to in 2006 is not the same AM3 referenced in the 2008 launch schedule.

"At the time AM3 was the likely candidate to become AM2+," claimed one field application engineer familiar with AMD's socket migration. "[AMD] wanted to keep the socket name associated with DDR2 memory and backwards compatibility, but AM3 emphasizes DDR3 support."

http://www.dailytech.com/AMD+45nm+DD...rticle7132.htm
05-08-2007, 03:19 PM
Syn.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VulgarHandle

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39445
now, the inq seems to think AM2+ wasn't supposed to have HT3.0 but now will, but I always thought it would

also, they say the new server socket is called "g", instead of s1207+

...

The INQ is confused because first K10, Barcelona, does not have HTT3.0. So if sockett AM2+ is meant for K10 and if K10 dosnt have HTT3.0 then maybe sockett AM2+ is not HTT3.0 only sockett. But as we all know INQ is easly confused. Barcelona is server chip and as the first K10 chip to help backwards compatablity its comes with HTT1.0, plus save time and money for AMD. I dont think i need to explain AM2+ sockett again.

Also Sockett G or should i call it Sockett S1G1 or just Sockett S1 (The Turion X2 sockett) is just just the mobile version of AM2+ not a replacement of S1207.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/cont...docs/41407.pdf

Quote:

Originally Posted by _damien_

Just because the memory slots aren't pin compatible, doesn't mean the IMC cannot support both architectures. The lack of pin compatibility only means the supported memory standard would be determined by the motherboard.

But to answer your question, it no longer seems like AM3 CPUs will be backward compatible:

http://www.dailytech.com/AMD+45nm+DD...rticle7132.htm

AM3 sockett will be physically differnt then AM2+ so that someone dosnt put AM2+ CPU into it. DDR3 has different pins to DDR2 so the motherboard will only support one memory type, seems pointless then for AMD to waste silicon on DDR2 support when it really is a waste.
05-08-2007, 04:17 PM
perkam

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syn.

The INQ is confused because first K10, Barcelona, does not have HTT3.0. So if sockett AM2+ is meant for K10 and if K10 dosnt have HTT3.0 then maybe sockett AM2+ is not HTT3.0 only sockett. But as we all know INQ is easly confused. Barcelona is server chip and as the first K10 chip to help backwards compatablity its comes with HTT1.0, plus save time and money for AMD. I dont think i need to explain AM2+ sockett again.

Also Sockett G or should i call it Sockett S1G1 or just Sockett S1 (The Turion X2 sockett) is just just the mobile version of AM2+ not a replacement of S1207.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/cont...docs/41407.pdf

AM3+ sockett will be physically differnt then AM2+ so that someone dosnt put AM2+ CPU into it. DDR3 has different pins to DDR2 so the motherboard will only support one memory type, seems pointless then for AMD to waste silicon on DDR2 support when it really is a waste.

No such thing as AM3+...it's AM3.

I don't think we're too far off from dual ddr2/ddr3 solutions...but enthusiast platforms have almost always used one type of memory, which we'll see here.

Prolly a value board from Asrock will have both.

Perkam
05-08-2007, 04:36 PM
adamsleath

"agena" quad core at 125W? is this right? if it is dat's gonna git HOT.
05-08-2007, 06:04 PM
FghtinIrshNvrDi

early AMD X2 and dual core opterons operated at what..? 110. Not too far off. Some of the lower clocked chips are in 2 digits, no?

Ryan
05-08-2007, 10:35 PM
gOJDO

I heard somewhere that AMD are going to use Intel's measurements for TDP. If so, that explains the power draw from 120W to 98W.
05-09-2007, 01:02 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by gOJDO

I heard somewhere that AMD are going to use Intel's measurements for TDP. If so, that explains the power draw from 120W to 98W.

That makes no sense, since CD, C2D and C2Q is way below their TDP. Intel TDP thing is a rampart fanboy thing from the P4 days. Before and after the P4 its a whole different game.
05-09-2007, 01:59 AM
alayashu

depends on the load state and application used. They can easily surpass their TDP in certain conditions while they can aswell dissipate less than their TDP, both under full load.

I'm eagerily waiting for these CPU's to pop out, as i heard they'll get a huge, incredible, boost in rendering apps over current top CPUs. Finger crossed :)
05-09-2007, 04:55 AM
_damien_

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syn.

AM3 sockett will be physically differnt then AM2

We don't know that for sure, but ATM I agree that incompatibility seems to be the most likely scenario. But yeah, if the CPUs will be incompatible, they'll almost certainly make the sockets physically different as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syn.

DDR3 has different pins to DDR2 so the motherboard will only support one memory type, seems pointless then for AMD to waste silicon on DDR2 support when it really is a waste.

Not necessarily. Once again, if the IMC of AM3 CPUs were to support both memory standards, a possibility which we cannot rule out, the rest would only depend on the motherboard's DIMM slots. So provided AM3 CPUs will be compatible with both socket AM2 and AM3, support for both memory standards wouldn't be a waste, but a must.
05-10-2007, 05:59 PM
XeRo

http://dailytech.com/AMD+Claims+Quad...rticle7232.htm

Late Quarter 4
05-10-2007, 06:16 PM
VulgarHandle

Quote:

Originally Posted by XeRo

http://dailytech.com/AMD+Claims+Quad...rticle7232.htm

Late Quarter 4

Quote:

Originally Posted by DailyTech

AMD will also announce its dual-core Agena bins, codenamed Kuma, shortly after Agena.

so, the dual-cores will really be quad-cores with 2 cores disabled? hehe, anyone thinking what i'm thinking?...connect a bridge here, cut one there....
05-10-2007, 07:27 PM
breakfromyou

Quote:

Originally Posted by VulgarHandle

so, the dual-cores will really be quad-cores with 2 cores disabled? hehe, anyone thinking what i'm thinking?...connect a bridge here, cut one there....

No bridges. It's all hidden.
05-11-2007, 12:46 AM
gOJDO

Quote:

Originally Posted by VulgarHandle

so, the dual-cores will really be quad-cores with 2 cores disabled? hehe, anyone thinking what i'm thinking?...connect a bridge here, cut one there....

The cores will be laser cut like the pixel/vertex shaders on nVidia G7x GPUs.
05-11-2007, 03:46 AM
VulgarHandle

ok, fine, pin mod then :D lol
05-11-2007, 04:00 AM
informal

56K Warning!

More pretty pictures of mobos used in the demo:

http://babelfish.altavista.com/babel...e%2F37143.html

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...2c44501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...dda4501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...b854501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...a6c4501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...50c4501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...e634501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...66c4501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...9414501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...9bc4501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...0214501200.jpg

http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...9414501200.jpg
http://www.hardspell.com/pic/2007/5/...d494501200.jpg
45nm wafer!^^
05-11-2007, 04:21 AM
Shintai

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOE

it is good to see that "AMD CHIPSET" doesn't require 1 KG of cooper to cool

Uhmm..just like almost all other chipsets? (Cept nVidia perhaps).

However if you wanna OC or the board is made for OC. Then you gonna get your 1kg copper anyway.
05-11-2007, 04:38 AM
XS Janus

mmm those boards look pretty nice!
Except the dual socket one: chipset is in the worst place possible if you wanna use 1st pcie16x!
05-11-2007, 04:42 AM
madcho

Quote:

Originally Posted by XS Janus

mmm those boards look pretty nice!
Except the dual socket one: chipset is in the worst place possible if you wanna use 1st pcie16x!

hope E-ATX one here :D
05-11-2007, 05:32 AM
Frodin

Wow, those are some tiny chipset coolers! I really love the power efficiency of the ATI/AMD chipsets, I wouldn't be surprised if the AMD quadfather chpiset draws more than 100w less power than the stupid Nvidia Asus one (it uses two northbridges, no?)

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