Tony, would you say there's any chance of getting 2xTCCD + 2x5B -D to run at DDR400 1T at 2.5-2-2?
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Tony, would you say there's any chance of getting 2xTCCD + 2x5B -D to run at DDR400 1T at 2.5-2-2?
I don't think many enthusiasts would bother unless you can run nVidia SLI on this board (which you can, but the ATi drivers won't let you). The NF4 expert should be the same in terms of memory compatability and OCability, right?
WOW!Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
I guess a lot of people who run single card would buy this.Quote:
Originally Posted by HKPolice
And all the ones who wants to run CF of course..
here I am....go Tony...;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony
i like to learn but not from 0 every time :)
As I feared they made it with the 8 pin CPU 12V connector, preventing many from using it unless they buy an adaptor... if it exists...
the 8 pin really doesnt do much if your PSU can handle the load on each wire, all the 8 pin does is make it so the psu supplies less power through each wire... but if you have a quality psu with thick wires its not realy an issue using the 4 pin.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813136165 :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :clap: :clap: !!!!!
musta sold outQuote:
Originally Posted by Brock911
what was price?
Price was $239. It should still show as out of stick. I wonder if it was posted by mistake. You could order them though.
Tony !!
Just for kicks, have you tried running 2x Nvidia cards in SLI ??
Won't work dude, you need a bios flash on the cards and a hacked vid card driverQuote:
Originally Posted by Major
Either ATI/DFI is smoking silicon or whoever buys this mobo for that price is smoking some stuff. No reason why the buyers should be penalized cause ATI blew the budget with this chipset cause it can't do it right. Nvidia's gonna have a party when they see these prices yet xfire underperforms.
I think that was a mistake.
Agreed...
LOL well said :clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by situman
i think that's probably the intial price and it will eventually go down. How come dfi didn't use the ULI southbridge? The Ati southbridge doesn't handle usb that well and it has some other kinks and issues with it as well.
Quite true, but the DFI nF4 expert board is going to be right around this price bracket as well... :(Quote:
Originally Posted by situman
Why you "fight" about the 4 x dimms and 1T?........To do what?........200MHz?.......That's NOT for us!......That's for a "simple" user right?.....We want 250MHz+ to do something......For that, forget the 4 x dimms and 1T........Am I right?....... ;) :)
P.S. I'll buy one of those beauties...... ;)
Now, Tony could you please tell me if the SMD chips with the 8 legs near the DDR Slots are Winbond chips?.......Coz IF they are Winbond chips for the VTT, they rock up to 2A load.......And please tell me if they are 2 of them?........Thanks....... :)
EDIT: Those in the red circles...... :)
http://www.thelab.gr/images/Hipro5/Temp/CIMG1128.JPG
here you go hipro, best i can do upto now.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...id=38740&stc=1
Nvidia made their money already. Now they just want to sink ATI's boat further by offering something ATI doesnt such as 2*16x PCI-e even if its for show purposes. Nvidia wants to tell people "look we have something at the top end that's better than ATI's, yet our mid end products are untouchable by ATI..."Quote:
Originally Posted by Lood007
Now im not an ATI fan boy here, im a motherboard fanboy....nvidia does not know what ATI is coming with next, if you think the dual 16X is good from NV then you will love the ATI offerings that should be coming soon.Quote:
Originally Posted by situman
I got that from an interview with John Bruno, he doesn't say much but he is very confident we will like what we see.
Subscribed. Waiting on expert news as well =)
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Originally Posted by MickeyMouse
The issue Jason is the NV option is not true 16x X2, if you read how they implememnted the technology you will see its actually a compromise. Then to move on they do not run the chipsets at actual LDT speeds so you have a performance drop there also.
Im not taking any sides but im waiting to see what ATI do with their 16x X2 before i go buy an NV board...as the ATI just may be a little better.
Now, to comment about NV are doing it and ATI are just talking the good talk you are partially correct, ATI are behind, but the fact is they also have been looking at whats there already and seeing if they can do it better.
Rememeber i get board here to test and to show you guys, they are retail boards, nothing special, nothing cherry picked and from now on they will have either ATI or NV chipsets, which can only be good for the consumer.
Expert is 8x8 not 16x16 as far as i know....Quote:
Originally Posted by Weee
bah who cares......most people run single cards anyways.....we are interested in that mobo and what it does :D....are you under some sort of NDA (you are disclosing some info but you're not posting much OCing) heheh :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony
AG mentioned something about Anandtech having exclusive rights to review this thing....they better be quick cause you've covered a lot of ground already heheh
I promised Anandtech he would have the benchmarks, he has the exclusive off DFI and I respect that.
I will step up with more info once the review is launched
I have no preference, its all marketing to me. I prefer ATI anyways only cause the waterblock I have only fits an ATI. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Tony
so have you found anything yet?? you are looking to see if this board will have the vtt issue you found on the dfi nforce 4 boards outnow right?? do tell if you find the answear as i really need a rock solid board and my dfi right now well it isnt rock solid. its fine for gaming but at full oc it is never rock solid only flakey in very strange times like outlined in your mobo mods thread!Quote:
Originally Posted by hipro5
keep us updated!
also tony do you know of an nvidia based dfi board with 1 16x pci-e slot but with the same volt regulation and power circutry of these boards??? that is what im looking for this board but with only one pci-e16 slot and a lower price point because of it!!!!!!!
________
FIX PS3
Let's clear the air of the B.S. and focus on facts pertaining to the chipset side of things which is what I am involved in and can speak with certainty.
First of all, on Nvidia doing and ATI not. B.S. plain and simple. That's what Nvidia wants you to believe. Let's look at the bigger picture.
Nvidia has been around in the AMD channel market for a while now and is most well known there. But what about anywhere else? ATI specifically focused on the OEM market and hit that first on both the AMD and Intel fronts at the PCI-E market transition. This was the plan and it worked very well. But don't let me try to convince you of that, just check the Mercury numbers ;) Our market share has increased rapidly and this will only continue. ATI has pumped out more chips in the last year than anyone else; namely RS480, RX480, RS482, RD480, RS400, RC410, RD400, SB400, SB450 and a few unannounced ones are pending. The fact that channel motherboards are appearing later on is a simple result of the motherboard vendors' design cycle. Remember that the whole Xpress 200G family of products has been shipping in droves for a very long time to OEMs. The channel will follow. It was never and still isn't a chipset issue.
On the flip side, where are the green guys in the Intel IGP market? Nothing there. What about the AMD IGP market? Nothing there neither except a in any significant way (speaking of paper launches, where is the C51G?). So when you ask the question "who's doing?", look at the whole picture, not just a portion of it.
As for the green guys' dual x16 implementation, anyone who knows anything about computer architecture will tell you it's a hack job. It's an amalgamation of existing chips to get dual graphics ports and nothing more. True dual x16 bandwidth is not achieved even on paper. Secondly, what happens when an I/O device (like a SATA drive) needs data? Even more bandwidth is stolen from the lower graphics port. Is there anyone that can demonstrate that dual x16 actually improves performance in any way? In fact, what happens to I/O performance of southbridge devices when 2 cards are being used and active? Has anyone measured that? ;) The flaws are numerous.
Our policy is to not comment on unannounced products, but there is something coming. Overclockers, get ready. Gamers, get ready. Now back to the topic at hand...RDX200.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony
overclockers get ready bit cought my eye :fact: .....you got something superspecial coming up?......damn once i get the expert i really don't want to be tempted until M2 damn itQuote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
on the current mobo.....why in the world would ATI not include Sata2 controller with it or is this DFI's call?
DFI recognized a good thing when they saw it and duplicated the memory power delivery section of ATI Grouper/Halibut. The component selections are a little different based on what I can see on the DFI board but the components used are equivalent. There is over 5 A VTT drive capability at 100C.
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Originally Posted by brandinb
Motherboard vendors dictate onboard features, not the chipset suppliers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dinos22
that was a dumb decision whoever made the callQuote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
We talk about DFI board build with ATI chipset here...not ATI board. Let them work out some data and you can find out yourself if you got the board :)Quote:
Originally Posted by dinos22
I'll post results later today with -90s C performance on this board...without any real benchs its hard to tell. Imo, it will surpass SLI-DR with BH/UTT...
One thing about SLI-DR....it survived 2 months straight run..6/7 hours daily with cascade...
I would agree with you if this is going to be their topline ATI chipset mthbrd, but somehow I dont believe it will be. If it does end up being their topline mthbrd then that was a dumb decision!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by dinos22
Why put old tech on a new mobo? To save costs! I see this mobo becoming something like the cheaper varients of NF4, over a period of time ofcourse!
[OFFTOPIC...sortof]
umm, during the whole however many months that ati hasnt released a gfx chip, hasnt released the ATI chipset as quickly as it wanted, they know nVidia is in a position to one up them, and they are probably planning ahead, doing something to show up nvidia, and this is more a mobo thread im sure, so nVidia with their nForce range is a performance chipset, ati's shipsets have been aimed squarely @ the OEM market...so they gotta start from ground up. and in all possibility, could have a next generation ready to come out to show up nVidia, when they do release the generation after nF4 expert (i think thats what it is anyway...)
because btw, Expert or whatever it is, is only using a hacked 8x2, not 16x2, so im pretty sure, that this generation is designed to top off nF4 sli/possibly expert. and then nVidia could already be hard at work, trying to release something which is fully 16x2
and as greyskull has saidseems to me, ati has definitly been hard at work...Quote:
overclockers get ready
as greyskull has said, nVidia has probably just done a hackjob on the 16x2 slots, and even if the next generation of ati's performance chipset turns out to be a dud, they have been growing steadily and are fairly well known in the OEM market, and have also (i think) signed a deal not too long ago with intel so that they can include their integrated gfx chipsets in their motherboards, ati, doesnt need to release any overclocking boards to keep themselves in business, some business is almost entirely based on it :p: but i think more than anything, they want to show up nVidia, which is why they are putting out these motherboards...
soz if it doesnt make sense, have to go
Whilst im probably not going to get an answer to this its worth asking anyway. :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
how long is the new stuff likely to be? are we talking couple of weeks/a month/ a couple of months?
id honestly rather have not known about this... as when i jump on halibut, i was planning on riding it all the way to M2, or at least i wanted to think thats what i was doing for a minute... its pretty sweet to hear this, but id avoid talking more about it just for sake of avoiding competition with the boards that still arent availableQuote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
All that sounds dandy, but the bottomline fact is more than likely you'll have to wait to buy ATI products. ATI has put out lots of products I can read about on the internet, but I can't buy it until months later. So much so that by the time they are available its time to move on to something else. I have been using ATI cards for more than 4 years now and have been satisfied. But the reality is ATI is about as dependable for launching a product in reasonable time as me going out and buying a Unicorn horse. I read about grouper back in July or May, lets just say a long time ago, its darn near Christmas time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Grayskull
I actually think half the issues with Grouper and Halibut were that they are built without compromise and in reality are NOT cheap to manufacture. Remember Taiwanese companies are all about making nice profits and to make a board like Grouper and be competitive would eat into their margins....so they design their own instead.
We saw Sapphire downgrading components on grouper, this was all due to board manufacturing costs.
What we need is a small manufacturer to make boards without compromise, issue is would you guys be willing to pay the price or would you just complain that $200 or so is just to much?
If there really was a difference in end performance, I'd do it.
if you mean an OCZ mobo tony, then im all ears hehe
no but seriously, if a board like that were released, it would need to justify its price with better performance then the cheaper mobo's, or at least helluva lot better features, I.E. no using the sil3114.
you know us here at XS don't mind paying more for the good stuff, but itll really need to be the good stuff, i mean, abit's boards all have quality components, but they cant clock nearly as good as dfi's offerings that use lower quality components.
and if you used all of the good stuff but only equaled that of a CF-BT or whatever, then it wont do well, people wont pay a premium for brand name caps when generic ones are working fine.
Totally agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Revv23
Paying more is OK, but we want better results. Otherwise it doesn't make sense
You guys shouldn't be complaining about 200$.
CF-DR is on preorder in Denmark. About 300.
I thought along a similar line, luckily it's only about $250 in the UK so i get off slightly better.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackeR
$200 for me would have me dancing around the room lol.
G
yeah i've noticed that UK guys get ripped off pretty badly.......but we are not too far behind either hehehQuote:
Originally Posted by Master_G
We waiting for your results :woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by Dumo
http://anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=2572
anandtech's article
Don't the ~90k AQ3 screens look familiar? They were posted here, a different CPU was used IIRC.
There's no mass consipiracy here, this was a fairly collaborative review, not the typical AT style (from what we know at least). More results in the coming days....
EDIT: between all the AQ3 runs the settings were left the same (other than the RAM configs).
:shakes:Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyMouse
They are so much fun, well lets the board in the handds of us mere mortals.
For the 1t runs we were using an FX57 at its stock speed, for the review a 4000+ was used.Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyMouse
That is why the scores are lower in the review than the 4x1dimm 1t results.
No conspiracy here, please just ask the correct questions and we will give you the answers.
I'm backing out of it right now....I don't want to get in trouble :nono:Quote:
Originally Posted by Troman
Anyway, at the price of $240+~$30 of shipping, Americans can get the board and use it tomorrow....in fact, you could have ordered yesterday and have had it today!
It should be any day now before we get more reports and results :toast:
And thank you Tony for explaining the details....:up:
I had an 2 hrs IM conversation with Oskar yessterday, cas1.5 is a TCCD tweak, 4 dimms 1t is also more of a TCCD tweak, this is because the samsung IC is obviosly more stable running huge drive strengths and creates less crosstalk.Quote:
Originally Posted by MickeyMouse
Oskar also mentioned he had good performance with a micron 1gig based dimm and i will be testing 4000EB 4 dimms also.
Jason
Go buy the board and play with it, im getting sick of you slamming what we try and say to you. I fully expect to see users with 4xTCCD or 4Xballistix or 4x4000EB running 200fsb 1t in the next day or so...whether they think this is worth it is just for them to decide.
We have not hidden anything here, and not conspired to make the board better than it is....lets not forget the features it does not have.
NCQ
SATA2
good USB
So take from the review what you want,nothing was hidden and nothing was conspired here....
What about using the CAS1.5 setting on UTT? Will it be a slightly more stable yet equally fast setting like it was with the NF4 series?
Well we know tomorrow, one of us will have it in our hands and test the hell out of it, and then return it, hahahahahahaha.
Where is dumo results this should be fun
The review looks good, but the lack of SATA 2 support is very unattractive to me.
deception``