"8800GT effect" not with GTX 460, but with GTX 465

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05-04-2010, 07:01 AM
RaV[666]

Quote:

he is right though. 5830 is a broken 5850 that needs more power just to run.

Nope, it eats more power because reference cards were built on a 5870 PCB.Not because of the chip.
And there will (or are now) cards with custom pcbs and lower consumption.
05-04-2010, 07:32 AM
ElSel10

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaV[666]

Nope, it eats more power because reference cards were built on a 5870 PCB.

Proof? And how does that explain the 5850? Either way, both ATI and Nvidia salvage chips that won't run at full spec for the lower cards.

That isn't bad, it's good business.
05-04-2010, 07:49 AM
aintz

what good is it if the price is that high.
05-04-2010, 09:02 AM
Olivon

VR-Zone

http://tof.canardpc.com/view/018c236...650c85aca8.jpg

352 CC ??? It seems really weird ...

Quote:

we heard the current batch of GTX 465 cores are essentially GTX 470 with just some CUDA cores turned off so there could be some possibilities of unlocking it if that remains the case. With an estimated price target of $249, it could prove to be quite attractive for some.
05-04-2010, 09:06 AM
highoctane

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivon

352 CC ??? It seems really weird ...

Yeah it looks weird but it falls in line with the 32 core clusters or whatever they call it.
05-04-2010, 09:09 AM
Olivon

Quote:

Originally Posted by highoctane

Yeah it looks weird but it falls in line with the 32 core clusters or whatever they call it.

Right Highoctane but that will be a big gap between GTX 470 and GTX 465 :shrug:
05-04-2010, 09:22 AM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olivon

Right Highoctane but that will be a big gap between GTX 470 and GTX 465 :shrug:

i agree, they should call that the 460, cause they have room for a 475 and 465 later to be right between, or much closer to the next model up, as those go EOL.

or they expect some super oced 465s to help fill in space
05-04-2010, 09:34 AM
annihilat0r

Quote:

Originally Posted by cegras

Did any common sense alarms go off in your head when you typed that out?

Why bother looking at actual reviews and seeing actual numbers when you have your terrific "common sense alarms" in your head, right :rofl:
05-04-2010, 09:48 AM
freeloader

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElSel10

It's Nvidia. What else is there to know?

Ah, that's for clearing that up. So what are your views on the 5850 and 5830 then?

The 5850 is a great card for it's price. The 5830 would be a great card if it was at the $200 price point. Either way, they're broken 5870's. If you can make a $ selling them, then by all means, do it. :up:
05-04-2010, 09:54 AM
-Sweeper_

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaV[666]

Nope, it eats more power because reference cards were built on a 5870 PCB.Not because of the chip.
And there will (or are now) cards with custom pcbs and lower consumption.

there is no 5830 reference PCB
05-04-2010, 09:57 AM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by freeloader

The 5850 is a great card for it's price. The 5830 would be a great card if it was at the $200 price point. Either way, they're broken 5870's. If you can make a $ selling them, then by all means, do it. :up:

they're not broken, they're "special"
05-04-2010, 09:58 AM
saaya

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam_oslo

The 5 in GTX 465 indicates a double-GPU to me. Maybe nVidia is trying to cut the power/heat by cutting the number of cores to make a 460x2 ?

right, like the 285 and 275 :P
-5 only means updated and higher performance than -0 in nvidia branding

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam_oslo

I don't know either, just guessing like you. But 2 single-GPU that apparently are very close to each other at the same time, doesn't sounds like a logical move (for nVidia's sales numbers), unless something really fishy is going on. Something like maybe nVidia is replacing both 480 and 470 with these?

right, but launching a single and dual gpu card with barely any difference in the branding number makes sense?
so the dualgpu card will be only slightly faster compared to a single gpu card? and the dualgpu card will be slower than a 470? and what about the 211W tdp? that CANT be a dualgpu card... and if its a single gpu card that is slower than the dualgpu card, then how high will the dualgpu cards tdp be? 300W+ but itll be slower than a 470?

there isnt going to be 2 cards, im pretty sure about it...
some call it a 460 and some a 465, who knows what nvidia will actually call it when they launch it... either way, we are talking about ONE new card here... thats it...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vardant

Like in the case of 9600GT vs 8800GT? Theory is one thing, but it doesn't always work like that.

what do you mean?

note how a theoretical breakdown of the 470s and 480s performance matches 99%... at least in tpus benchmark row a 470 is exactly 75% of a 480 at 1920x1200... how relevant their choice of benchmarks is doesnt matter... in tpus review a 460 should perform about as fast as a 260... and thats ouch... big ouch... :S

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vardant

GTX 470 3% faster on average? Isn't it more like 10-15%? :rolleyes:

read my post and check the link...
if you dont trust tpu, fair enough... i do...
it probably has a lot to do with what settings and benchmarks you use in a review... some games favor ati, some favor nvidia... and some cards run certain aa levels better than others etc etc...

anyhow, even if you think the choice of benchmarks and settings on tpu is done poorly and doesnt reflect actual nvidia vs ati performance, that dosnt really impact the relative performance from one nvidia card to another by a lot. so a 460/465 still ends up as fast as a 260...

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAbenson

its been already more than half a year since the radeon 5xxx release,so it wont be a science fiction theory that ATI reduces prices across board to like :
5830 <= 150euro ;
5850 <= 200euro;
5870 <= 250euro;

i still dont understand why ATI is not doing this right now,it would basically kill nVidia just like Intel used to do to AMD whenever similiar situation arised.

why should they? nvidia cant fulfill demand right now, it doesnt matter how many cards they actually sell... nvidia cards are in low supply and its a textbook example of a market situation in which you keep your prices up and throw excessive parties with hot chics and lots of free booze :D

if those numbers from vrzone are true then OOOUUUUCHHHH
even less blocks and lower clocks... it might end up slower than a 260... it supports dx11, yay, but how useful is that when even a 480 is brought to its knees playing metro2033? even at this terrible performance, these cards might actually be fun to play with... but for 250$ i wont touch them... no way...
199$ or lower with those 352sp specs and we are talking... im pretty sure those cards will be good for 100% overclocks on ln2 with mods :D
its been a while that weve seen that from a card... and while it might suck perf wise... it should be fun to play with... kinda like those netburst 65nm chips or celerons :D
05-04-2010, 10:02 AM
aussie-revhead

When is this vid card coming out?
05-04-2010, 10:09 AM
rogueagent6

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

:confused:

The 5850 is only a few dollars cheaper than the 470 here in the states. What are you talking about?

On average the 5850 is $60 dollars cheaper than the 470, I'd call that more than a few.
05-04-2010, 10:14 AM
highoctane

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogueagent6

On average the 5850 is $60 dollars cheaper than the 470, I'd call that more than a few.

Not sure where you're looking for avg prices but the cheapest 5850 stock at NE is $310 and the 470 is $350.
05-04-2010, 10:18 AM
aussie-revhead

Here the cheapest 5850 is au$345 and the cheapest 470 is au$485 !!
05-04-2010, 11:03 AM
Sam_oslo

Quote:

Originally Posted by saaya

right, like the 285 and 275 :P
-5 only means updated and higher performance than -0 in nvidia branding

right, but launching a single and dual gpu card with barely any difference in the branding number makes sense?
so the dualgpu card will be only slightly faster compared to a single gpu card? and the dualgpu card will be slower than a 470? and what about the 211W tdp? that CANT be a dualgpu card... and if its a single gpu card that is slower than the dualgpu card, then how high will the dualgpu cards tdp be? 300W+ but itll be slower than a 470?

there isnt going to be 2 cards, im pretty sure about it...
some call it a 460 and some a 465, who knows what nvidia will actually call it when they launch it... either way, we are talking about ONE new card here... thats it...

There was 280 before the 285, and there was a 260 before 275, but 295 is the only one without a presider to upgrade from.

If those leaked spec holds true, a single-GPU with 352 CC is too little to do anything good at high-end or middle-range for nVidia, but 2 x 352 CC could change the game. If it is a double-GPU tho, we have to wait and see what this actually is.

Yeah, one card makes more scenes. I think the 460 is just another name for the same card, too.
05-04-2010, 11:38 AM
turtletrax

I am going to hold off for the GTFO 453.6

You laugh now, but you know it is coming :)
05-04-2010, 11:51 AM
Dainas

Nothing like when retard markeeters get thrown into the mix, nomatter what industry selling what we all end up feeling alittle insulted.
05-04-2010, 12:15 PM
rogueagent6

Quote:

Originally Posted by highoctane

Not sure where you're looking for avg prices but the cheapest 5850 stock at NE is $310 and the 470 is $350.

Your point?

I'm not willing to pay that much more for ONLY a 3% performance increase. I'll take the the 5850, overclock it, and keep the $40. That's not including what you'd save on your electricity bill to power and cool the 470.

:rolleyes:
05-04-2010, 12:27 PM
highoctane

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogueagent6

Your point?

I'm not willing to pay that much more for ONLY a 3% performance increase. I'll take the the 5850, overclock it, and keep the $40. That's not including what you'd save on your electricity bill to power and cool the 470.

:rolleyes:

Its irrelevant to me what hardware you spend your money on nor what you may or may not save on your electric bill I was merely pointing out that your self proclaimed avg price difference was incorrect. :rolleyes::rolleyes: :up:
05-04-2010, 12:34 PM
cegras

Quote:

Originally Posted by annihilat0r

Why bother looking at actual reviews and seeing actual numbers when you have your terrific "common sense alarms" in your head, right :rofl:

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/M...ozr_II/27.html

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/A...rectCu/26.html

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...review-23.html

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...review-23.html

It's logically impossible for a 5830 to overtake a 5850 per GPU consumption, with the large qualifier being how the VRM is designed.
05-04-2010, 12:41 PM
Manicdan

Quote:

Originally Posted by highoctane

Its irrelevant to me what hardware you spend your money on nor what you may or may not save on your electric bill I was merely pointing out that your self proclaimed avg price difference was incorrect. :rolleyes::rolleyes: :up:

average does not mean minimum, saphire had a 5850 for 290$ and another for 310$, the only thing the 310$ one came with was a free game.
05-04-2010, 01:03 PM
GoldenTiger

Quote:

Originally Posted by trinibwoy

:confused:

The 5850 is only a few dollars cheaper than the 470 here in the states. What are you talking about?

Yeah it is around 320 vs 350 with the gtx coming out ahead well especially especially once overclocked by a large margin then.
05-04-2010, 01:13 PM
[XC] Oj101

At that price point I can't see myself picking the green team. I'd either jump onto the ATI ship or spend a bit more, the 465 doesn't look anything like a new 8800 to me.

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